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 Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:38 am
BeXlieXve Pick_A_Song f_a_i_t_h_l_e_s_s Ladygaura For this next comment I am imagining speaking through my first boyfriend, and yes this is part of the reason why he's an ex, although a lot more had to do with a lack of responsibility. He was however very much into Operation Life and marched on Washington for that. "The woman above did not just have a little too much fun. She disobeyed the absolute word of God and is a whore by having sex outside of a sanctified marriage. " Eww glad that part's over. Personally I'm not Christian and don't ascribe to that stuff. (I don't have a problem with whores/ sex workers/ prostitutes/ courtesans either). However a lot of Christians do think that anyone who has sex outside marriage (and in some particularly conservative groups, even kissing or holding hands, any intimate contact whatsoever) is a whore. Nevermind that there is a definite double standard involved that is gender specific and that it's widely violated anyhow... but that is their official thought at least. I personally believe that any one who thinks that all women that get abortions or pregnant outside of a marriage are whores have no respect for any woman at all. What really pisses me off is that whenever a pregnancy or an abortion happens it is always the girls fault. It’s like it’s acceptable for the guy to not be able to keep his d*ck in his pants but the fact that the girl let herself be wooed by him is unspeakable. I’m sorry normally I’m more passive aggressive but this really, really pisses me off just playing devil's advocate here(and partly because im a guy), but the girl did accept the request to have sex and well keep the guys out of yer pants. But I believe her point was that the girl is the one who has to deal with most of the consequences. Let's say Amy and Allen like each other a lot. So they have (consented) sex. Now Allen can go brag about it to all of his friends and get high-fives and laughs out of it. Meanwhile, once everyone finds out that Amy had sex with Allen, she's automatically labelled as a slut. No cheers. No high-fives. No laughs. It's one of the many double-standards we've got to work to get rid of as a society. ANYWAY My opinion on this is that a woman shouldn't have an abortion unless she's in a dire situation. Not the "in college with a job lined up" thing that someone mentioned earlier. I mean like, if she has the baby, she has a high chance of dying during birth. Or rape. Rape is... completely not the girl's fault. It's not the baby's fault either, but the mother should be able to decide, because she may not be mentally or emotionally stable enough to deal with the pregnancy. The "in college with a job lined up" situation is one in which a woman would not want to have a child. I understand that. But she could always give the baby up for adoption after it's born. There are infertile couples, gay couples, etc. that will take care of children. That happened 2 times at my school last year......but 2 different endings 1.Girl 1 and boy 1 had sex and the next day, she was ostracized by virtually everyone in the school, guy 1, pimp......man.....didnt last very long as you can guess... 2.girl 2 and boy 1 have sex and she comes off clean because girls 1 and 2 stated that he was trying to impregnate them...guy 1, ostracized, the point being that so significant circumstances have to happen to get the guy in trouble....madness
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Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 8:30 pm
BeXlieXve Pick_A_Song f_a_i_t_h_l_e_s_s Ladygaura For this next comment I am imagining speaking through my first boyfriend, and yes this is part of the reason why he's an ex, although a lot more had to do with a lack of responsibility. He was however very much into Operation Life and marched on Washington for that. "The woman above did not just have a little too much fun. She disobeyed the absolute word of God and is a whore by having sex outside of a sanctified marriage. " Eww glad that part's over. Personally I'm not Christian and don't ascribe to that stuff. (I don't have a problem with whores/ sex workers/ prostitutes/ courtesans either). However a lot of Christians do think that anyone who has sex outside marriage (and in some particularly conservative groups, even kissing or holding hands, any intimate contact whatsoever) is a whore. Nevermind that there is a definite double standard involved that is gender specific and that it's widely violated anyhow... but that is their official thought at least. I personally believe that any one who thinks that all women that get abortions or pregnant outside of a marriage are whores have no respect for any woman at all. What really pisses me off is that whenever a pregnancy or an abortion happens it is always the girls fault. It’s like it’s acceptable for the guy to not be able to keep his d*ck in his pants but the fact that the girl let herself be wooed by him is unspeakable. I’m sorry normally I’m more passive aggressive but this really, really pisses me off just playing devil's advocate here(and partly because im a guy), but the girl did accept the request to have sex and well keep the guys out of yer pants. But I believe her point was that the girl is the one who has to deal with most of the consequences. Let's say Amy and Allen like each other a lot. So they have (consented) sex. Now Allen can go brag about it to all of his friends and get high-fives and laughs out of it. Meanwhile, once everyone finds out that Amy had sex with Allen, she's automatically labelled as a slut. No cheers. No high-fives. No laughs. It's one of the many double-standards we've got to work to get rid of as a society. ANYWAY My opinion on this is that a woman shouldn't have an abortion unless she's in a dire situation. Not the "in college with a job lined up" thing that someone mentioned earlier. I mean like, if she has the baby, she has a high chance of dying during birth. Or rape. Rape is... completely not the girl's fault. It's not the baby's fault either, but the mother should be able to decide, because she may not be mentally or emotionally stable enough to deal with the pregnancy. The "in college with a job lined up" situation is one in which a woman would not want to have a child. I understand that. But she could always give the baby up for adoption after it's born. There are infertile couples, gay couples, etc. that will take care of children. A women should be able to have an abortion when ever she wants. What is needed is to teache women, and me about their bodies, and contraceptives so that they don't end up using abortion as a birth control, they need to be taught about things not just thrown out in to the world with no help or advice.
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Posted: Thu Jul 24, 2008 8:45 pm
Let me just say: any debate that you will ever be in will come back to "we need to teach our kids everything." Usually, the difference between right and wrong.
('Course, we have different ideas of where the lines are...)
If we could teach our children that abortions are a complete last resort, then it wouldn't a problem.
But where is that line? For me, it's only a "last resort" when you'll otherwise die. So I think abortions are only okay when a woman has a high chance of being killed during childbirth, and also if the woman was raped, because she could be too emotionally unstable to deal with the pregnancy and end up hurting herself.
But for others, like the girl who mentioned it before, it's acceptable when you're young and trying to live a successful life. You're in college, you have a job ready... You don't have the time or resources to be a mom. So an abortion is okay?
I still don't agree with that. You could put the kid up for adoption.
But my point is that we all have different definitions of right and wrong. Is it right to abort a fetus because you're in college? In my opinion, no. In some others', yes. Until we can find a compromise and make clearly-defined rules on the subject, we'll be arguing about it.
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Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 3:37 pm
Well yeah everyone has different opinions and there's always going to be arguments over them, I believe a women has the right to do what ever she wants to do when it comes to the choice of an abortion.
Also the way we can teach the children that abortion is not to be used as birth control is by teaching them more about it in schools because the majority of parents sure as hell wont talk to their kids about it.
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Posted: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:42 pm
If you guys can get a hold of it, you should read chapter 3 of Ronald Dworkin's 1993 book Life's Dominion. It was in my Book of Readings for my Religious studies course and it's a really interesting way of viewing the abortion debate. I dunno what the rest of the book is like though.
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