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 Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:14 am
'Dark Eldar armor is weak, but their firepower and close combat skills are fearsome. They cannot last in a sustained slug-fest, so the Dark Eldar strive to attack both quickly and hard. In the hands of an experienced Warhammer 40,000 tactician, the Dark Eldar are almost unbeatable.'- Quote from GW website. what are the thoughts on this statement? does it ring true to you?
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Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:31 am
In the current edition this statement is all but true.
Sure, for a mere 5 points they get a weapon that's like a double-up Storm Bolter, but their normal weapons lack this "hit and run" game-term, I mean come on, they have S3 Ap5 (or is it 6?) Rpid Fire Weapons, what Dark Eldar need is more Assault Weapons and better unit entries.
If played right I'm sure they can be a force to reckon with, but with the current rules and all other new codexes they don't really stand a chance, they're 2 points more expensive than an ork boy/Imperial Guardsman, and they're not even half as good.
Oh yes, WS/BS 4 and I5, but bwah, they are too expensive for what they come with!
And I think they'd decline that statement untill they release the upcomming DE codex that's planned for next summer.
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Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:34 am
most of the stuff, like "cannot last in a slug fest" is true, but the bit about being almost unbeatable is out of date, they arn't made for 5th ed. they are made for 3rd, which is where they were a good army, and until the end of 2009, when they get their new 'dex, they will stay as a crap army. here's hoping that they get a GOOD codex author, as the most recent codex's (marine and Chaos marines) were poorly made and included some really stupid stuff (legion of the damned as a unit? what the hell GW!?). GW has gone backwards, it seems. although the Ork codex was pretty good.
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Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:53 am
Legion of the damned started out as a unit in the first place (as far as I know atleast) that could be hired, so I don't see the bad thing of them being that now either, since they have always come to help their brothers in battle when the odds are against them, and they still are.
And Chaos/Marine Codexes aren't poorly made, I only see potential with them, they have pros and cons, they have carefully tested wargear, entries, stuff etc, the only codex that is poorly made is: Codex Daemons.
It's the wrong thread for this kind of talk I know, but I can't link one discussion to another all of the time.
I don't see what kind of stupid stuff you're reffering to, do you want a codex or not? If Marines/Chaos would get rules for all chapters/legions then the books would be atleast 50% thicker and would have taken us another 2-3 years to be made (this is why GW is working on special Legion codexes for Chaos, with World Eaters comming up next).
As long as the comming Dark Eldar codex fits in with the game as well as fluff it's ok by me, and that they get a better sculptor for the minis, the current ones were rushed completely because they had a deadline to hold, I mean, look on those warp beasts... I'd rather use Chaos Warhounds instead of those! D':
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Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:24 am
i apologise for my slight outburst there. i just think that GW has made the marine and chaos codex's too powerful, as it seems that out fo everyone i know that plays, only the power gamers use them, me and the other guys who play for fun dont like them for some reason though.
still, as you say, this isnt the place.
so back on topic, the dark eldar. as i said before, they were made for 3rd ed. so when the new dex comes, we should see some improvement there. and i agree with shin when he says about the mini's, they need some improvement, although the currect d.eldar minis are cool for making dark elves!
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Posted: Mon Nov 03, 2008 9:27 pm
Lets see... Both Marines and Chaos Marines are expensive etc, that weights up for their powerful units, all codexes (apart from Dark Eldar that is) can "powergame", you just need to know how to do it, I've seen plenty of Imperial Guard powergaming forces, hell, even Daemonhunters (and my lord they're hard to powergame).
There's only 2 sets of minis of the Dark Eldar Range (ok, make that 3) that I like, Incubis, Wyches and Draazar.
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Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:28 am
i agree, they don't have any muscle or big guns they can wheel out. it would be very hard if not impossible to make a 'power house' army. Though a skilled tactition could still make great use of them I think its highly unlikely any one could win a tournament with them. Though i have to say, i don't think it would take much to make them better.
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Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 8:33 am
New special rules, better weapon upgrades, better weapons at all, come on, an assault force using rapid fire, that's just wrong, 24" Assault 1 or 18" Assault 2 as a basic weapon.
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Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 10:41 am
These are all things that I've been discussing in depth with a friend for a while. He's a Dark Eldar player and still manages to wipe the floor when he runs 'em properly and can drop his Webway Portal properly. The Talos needs to be made into a skimmer vehicle with AV 10-10-10 OR it needs to be given higher toughness and a 2+ save. At current, it doesn't fit into the structure anywhere unless you have an Archon or a (jump unit) Sybarite shoot ahead with a Webway portal.
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Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:42 am
The Talos is still good, because it gives the enemy something else to shoot at other than your warrior. I've never seen one take out more than a squad and hit something else because it's so cumbersome, large, and distinct looking.
I guess the Eldar equivalent is a Wraithlord, only the Wraithlord can instant-kill.
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Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 12:52 pm
The Talos can instakill Guard and equivalent. They have a huge bonus in that they can potentially pull off S13 attacks against armor with the special rules on their attacks.
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Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 2:30 pm
what i menat was the codex wouldn't need a complete overhaul just allot of tweaking to bring them in line with the latest edition, but thinking about it it should get one because the few DE players out there deserve a total beast of a codex.
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Posted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 3:18 pm
Their codex needs more than a few "tweaks." It's older than any of the other books. In fact, the "current" printing is mostly the same as their 2nd Edition codex. 2ND FETHING EDITION. Oh well.
Talking crazy tactics, my DE player friend rolled for some combat drugs the other day. He rolled for 6 drugs and passed every one of them without taking a single wound. That poor Chaplain...there wasn't much left...
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Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 9:07 pm
You mean 3rd edition codex, DE showed up during 3rd Edition~
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Posted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 10:43 pm
Shinobi_8745 You mean 3rd edition codex, DE showed up during 3rd Edition~
Yup, pretty much. My bad.
A nice upgrade for them would be an upgrade that can close the tops on the Ravagers. That way they can be at least a little bit more survivable.
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