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 Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:23 am
brainnsoup Aakosir brainnsoup Aakosir Okay. Now that I am skimming over some of the other sections a little red flag went up. They defined Wicca as a Neo-pagan, earth-centered religion. Does anyone else see what I do? Wicca is not earth-centered, but fertility-centered.
Let's see what else I can find that is wrong...
Also, isn't the Rede just advice? Because here they say "Their main rule of behavior is the Wiccan Rede which forbids them from harming people, including themselves, except in some cases of self-defense." like it is a law...
For example, you could read the page on Islam, but it would hardly prepare you for a pilgrimage to Mecca. And no matter how many links you follow on their page on Hinduism, it wouldn't teach you to identify all of the allegorical symbolism in the Ramayana, let alone pick it up. That said, the parts of the webpage that I read were reasonable enough.
Just like any religion, Wicca is hard to pin down or reduce to a list of absolutes. There are people who've educated themselves about Wicca but have taken the religion and made it their own. There's a difference between educated people who practice in a more casual way or without a coven and the misinformed teenagers who can barely spell "Wicca" and learned everything they know from Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
@rmcdra: Isn't it both though? If I ask, "What is Wicca?" and I get three answers:
Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility.
Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth.
Wicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles.
They're all right, just neither paints a full picture of what Wicca is about.
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Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 8:45 am
brainnsoup @rmcdra: Isn't it both though? If I ask, "What is Wicca?" and I get three answers: Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility. Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth. Wicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles. They're all right, just neither paints a full picture of what Wicca is about. Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility. Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth and and how it relates to fertilityWicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles and how it relates to fertility.Everything in Wicca goes back to fertility. I sometimes wonder if Gardner made the religion just so he could get laid, i.e. Males can only initiate females and vice versa. If he had a coven of 13 that means he "initiated" 13 chicks. Damn talk about an interesting way to lots of sex. Edit: "Hey baby, want the secrets of the Universe. Let me put it inside you. twisted " XD
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Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 9:53 am
rmcdra brainnsoup @rmcdra: Isn't it both though? If I ask, "What is Wicca?" and I get three answers: Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility. Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth. Wicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles. They're all right, just neither paints a full picture of what Wicca is about. Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility. Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth and and how it relates to fertilityWicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles and how it relates to fertility.Everything in Wicca goes back to fertility. I sometimes wonder if Gardner made the religion just so he could get laid, i.e. Males can only initiate females and vice versa. If he had a coven of 13 that means he "initiated" 13 chicks. Damn talk about an interesting way to lots of sex. Edit: "Hey baby, want the secrets of the Universe. Let me put it inside you. twisted " XD
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Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 10:37 am
Aakosir rmcdra brainnsoup @rmcdra: Isn't it both though? If I ask, "What is Wicca?" and I get three answers: Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility. Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth. Wicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles. They're all right, just neither paints a full picture of what Wicca is about. Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility. Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth and and how it relates to fertilityWicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles and how it relates to fertility.Everything in Wicca goes back to fertility. I sometimes wonder if Gardner made the religion just so he could get laid, i.e. Males can only initiate females and vice versa. If he had a coven of 13 that means he "initiated" 13 chicks. Damn talk about an interesting way to lots of sex. Edit: "Hey baby, want the secrets of the Universe. Let me put it inside you. twisted " XD I think that there is since I can see how sexual acts could convey certain mysteries (he drew from a variety of sources to put Wicca together) but as an outsider I'm probably ignorant of it and I have my own methodologies in my tradition that don't require sex.
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Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 2:02 pm
Aakosir brainnsoup Aakosir brainnsoup Aakosir Okay. Now that I am skimming over some of the other sections a little red flag went up. They defined Wicca as a Neo-pagan, earth-centered religion. Does anyone else see what I do? Wicca is not earth-centered, but fertility-centered.
Let's see what else I can find that is wrong...
Also, isn't the Rede just advice? Because here they say "Their main rule of behavior is the Wiccan Rede which forbids them from harming people, including themselves, except in some cases of self-defense." like it is a law...
For example, you could read the page on Islam, but it would hardly prepare you for a pilgrimage to Mecca. And no matter how many links you follow on their page on Hinduism, it wouldn't teach you to identify all of the allegorical symbolism in the Ramayana, let alone pick it up. That said, the parts of the webpage that I read were reasonable enough.
Just like any religion, Wicca is hard to pin down or reduce to a list of absolutes. There are people who've educated themselves about Wicca but have taken the religion and made it their own. There's a difference between educated people who practice in a more casual way or without a coven and the misinformed teenagers who can barely spell "Wicca" and learned everything they know from Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
@rmcdra: Isn't it both though? If I ask, "What is Wicca?" and I get three answers:
Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility.
Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth.
Wicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles.
They're all right, just neither paints a full picture of what Wicca is about.
But if I'm not mistaken, there's no central authority on these things. There's no, for example, Church of Wicca, right? Just individual covens. (I'm seriously asking. I don't know very much about Wicca in practice, just theory.)
@rmcdra: But they're all important to understanding Wicca. You can't learn about Wicca without the theme of fertility, but you also can't learn about it without understanding the symbolism/meaning of the earth, the moon, and the sun and their significance to the God and Goddess. It's a fault if they don't mention it at all, but it's not untrue to say that religion is earth-based. It doesn't mean that it isn't fertility-based as well.
It's not that I find absolutely no fault with the website. From the pages I did read, it seems like they aren't written by experts. They were most likely written by people who've learned a little about the religions, but have'nt actually practiced or studied them in depth. And they capitalize "atheist" and treat it like a religion, which are both personal pet peeves of mine.
I just don't think what was written about Wicca (at least the parts quoted in the thread) are totally untrue. Obviously a person couldn't read the article on Wicca with no prior knowledge and expect to really know anything about Wicca. But from what I read, it seems like a good place to start. It does a good job of giving a broad summary that one might use as a launching pad for someone interested in learning about Wicca. And it's especially useful considering that Wicca isn't exactly newb-friendly.
And hey, people have exploited regligion for money, power, status, etc. I wouldn't be surprised if "lots and lots of sex" made its way onto the list once or twice.
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Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:13 pm
If memory serves, it's a fairly reliable site. I don't think it's GREAT though. I remember being slightly disappointed with it when I was taking my religious pluralism class.
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Posted: Mon Jan 24, 2011 4:23 pm
brainnsoup @rmcdra: But they're all important to understanding Wicca. You can't learn about Wicca without the theme of fertility, but you also can't learn about it without understanding the symbolism/meaning of the earth, the moon, and the sun and their significance to the God and Goddess. It's a fault if they don't mention it at all, but it's not untrue to say that religion is earth-based. It doesn't mean that it isn't fertility-based as well. It's not that I find absolutely no fault with the website. From the pages I did read, it seems like they aren't written by experts. They were most likely written by people who've learned a little about the religions, but have'nt actually practiced or studied them in depth. And they capitalize "atheist" and treat it like a religion, which are both personal pet peeves of mine. I just don't think what was written about Wicca (at least the parts quoted in the thread) are totally untrue. Alright while I'll concede that it could be classified as an earth-based religion, it is highly inaccurate to describe as such because "earth-based" is too broad of a meaning since the focus of Wicca is fertility, not nature worship. If someone was expecting to just worship trees and birds and stuff directing this person to Wicca wouldn't be helpful since the rituals aren't about worshiping trees and birds, it's about fertility. Quote: Obviously a person couldn't read the article on Wicca with no prior knowledge and expect to really know anything about Wicca. But from what I read, it seems like a good place to start. It does a good job of giving a broad summary that one might use as a launching pad for someone interested in learning about Wicca. And it's especially useful considering that Wicca isn't exactly newb-friendly. You'd be surprised at those that do. Just go hop into the supernatural forum. There's hundreds of "experts" cause they read it on a website. Except the summary is so broad to the point of ignoring the main focus of the religion to begin with and probably relies on books that misappropriate the title of Wicca either out of ignorance or marketing. Quote: And hey, people have exploited regligion for money, power, status, etc. I wouldn't be surprised if "lots and lots of sex" made its way onto the list once or twice. Just kinda joking there about Gardner, but yeah I get you.
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Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2011 4:04 pm
rmcdra brainnsoup @rmcdra: But they're all important to understanding Wicca. You can't learn about Wicca without the theme of fertility, but you also can't learn about it without understanding the symbolism/meaning of the earth, the moon, and the sun and their significance to the God and Goddess. It's a fault if they don't mention it at all, but it's not untrue to say that religion is earth-based. It doesn't mean that it isn't fertility-based as well. It's not that I find absolutely no fault with the website. From the pages I did read, it seems like they aren't written by experts. They were most likely written by people who've learned a little about the religions, but have'nt actually practiced or studied them in depth. And they capitalize "atheist" and treat it like a religion, which are both personal pet peeves of mine. I just don't think what was written about Wicca (at least the parts quoted in the thread) are totally untrue. Alright while I'll concede that it could be classified as an earth-based religion, it is highly inaccurate to describe as such because "earth-based" is too broad of a meaning since the focus of Wicca is fertility, not nature worship. If someone was expecting to just worship trees and birds and stuff directing this person to Wicca wouldn't be helpful since the rituals aren't about worshiping trees and birds, it's about fertility. Quote: Obviously a person couldn't read the article on Wicca with no prior knowledge and expect to really know anything about Wicca. But from what I read, it seems like a good place to start. It does a good job of giving a broad summary that one might use as a launching pad for someone interested in learning about Wicca. And it's especially useful considering that Wicca isn't exactly newb-friendly. You'd be surprised at those that do. Just go hop into the supernatural forum. There's hundreds of "experts" cause they read it on a website. Except the summary is so broad to the point of ignoring the main focus of the religion to begin with and probably relies on books that misappropriate the title of Wicca either out of ignorance or marketing. Quote: And hey, people have exploited regligion for money, power, status, etc. I wouldn't be surprised if "lots and lots of sex" made its way onto the list once or twice. Just kinda joking there about Gardner, but yeah I get you.
But I've taken entire classes about religion, and still my professors made it absolutely clear that at the end of the course we still wouldn't really know the religion. We would just be a little less ignorant.
It's like, studying religion is like having an emotionally abusive boyfriend. Every time you think you get close, you realize you barely know him at all.
Now that I think of it, maybe I'll give up this studying business and focus my energy on getting a boyfriend. I mean, you can't snuggle with religion. Though I have used a textbook as a pillow before...
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Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 1:44 pm
i believe they try to be honest and reliable.
at least they try to talk about Wicca and paganism; many sites such as msnbc just ignore everything but the big time world religions.
they operate on a shoestring, i think they are mostly Canadians and not very commercial, so maybe they would just agree to let you handle the Wiccan topic for them?
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Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 9:13 am
Funnily enough, because of the way wikipedia works, it actually is a very good place to learn about Buddhism as a whole. Because it is 'policed', in effect, by a community of Buddhists and scholars who leave sources they cite at the bottom of the articles, it more often than not comes out both making sense and being spot on for Buddhist articles.
Failing that, however, you could try accesstoinsight.org for the basis of all schools (it's an online translation of the Tripitaka, with specific commentary from the Theravadan school of thought), or buddhanet.net. Both are good sites. 3nodding
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Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 5:38 pm
Byaggha Funnily enough, because of the way wikipedia works, it actually is a very good place to learn about Buddhism as a whole. Because it is 'policed', in effect, by a community of Buddhists and scholars who leave sources they cite at the bottom of the articles, it more often than not comes out both making sense and being spot on for Buddhist articles. Failing that, however, you could try accesstoinsight.org for the basis of all schools (it's an online translation of the Tripitaka, with specific commentary from the Theravadan school of thought), or buddhanet.net. Both are good sites. 3nodding
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Posted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 5:41 pm
brainnsoup Aakosir brainnsoup Aakosir brainnsoup Aakosir Okay. Now that I am skimming over some of the other sections a little red flag went up. They defined Wicca as a Neo-pagan, earth-centered religion. Does anyone else see what I do? Wicca is not earth-centered, but fertility-centered.
Let's see what else I can find that is wrong...
Also, isn't the Rede just advice? Because here they say "Their main rule of behavior is the Wiccan Rede which forbids them from harming people, including themselves, except in some cases of self-defense." like it is a law...
For example, you could read the page on Islam, but it would hardly prepare you for a pilgrimage to Mecca. And no matter how many links you follow on their page on Hinduism, it wouldn't teach you to identify all of the allegorical symbolism in the Ramayana, let alone pick it up. That said, the parts of the webpage that I read were reasonable enough.
Just like any religion, Wicca is hard to pin down or reduce to a list of absolutes. There are people who've educated themselves about Wicca but have taken the religion and made it their own. There's a difference between educated people who practice in a more casual way or without a coven and the misinformed teenagers who can barely spell "Wicca" and learned everything they know from Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
@rmcdra: Isn't it both though? If I ask, "What is Wicca?" and I get three answers:
Wicca is a neopagan religion about fertility.
Wicca is a neopagan religion about the earth.
Wicca is a neopagan religion that observes the lunar cycles.
They're all right, just neither paints a full picture of what Wicca is about.
But if I'm not mistaken, there's no central authority on these things. There's no, for example, Church of Wicca, right? Just individual covens. (I'm seriously asking. I don't know very much about Wicca in practice, just theory.)
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Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2011 10:13 am
Aakosir I could have used these sites last night XP I was away from home and forgot my text book. I asked my husband to read off a few things over the phone XD I hope my assignment turns out good. But it was just a summary of ancient China and Japan. Doh! A day late and a dollar short. Typical for me. >.<
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Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2011 10:22 am
Byaggha Aakosir I could have used these sites last night XP I was away from home and forgot my text book. I asked my husband to read off a few things over the phone XD I hope my assignment turns out good. But it was just a summary of ancient China and Japan. Doh! A day late and a dollar short. Typical for me. >.<
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Posted: Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:03 pm
brainnsoup Aren't there mixed views on solitary practitioners and eclectics? Of course some traditional Wiccans will disagree, but strictly traditional Wicca itself is so ridiculously elitist in nature. Maybe I'm biased, because I think Wicca is a beautiful religion except for the sense of elitism and stodgy adherence to strict traditions. There's not a great deal that's Wicca outside of those traditions, really. That's really the thing - the religion is taught by participating in those traditions. It's not stodginess if that's the only way the religion is imparted... that's like saying Christianity has a stodgy adherence to religious text, or something. Quote: I think it's Wicca's greatest hindrance. The reason so much misinformation is out there is because everything is so secretive. I agree with you there - and it's a shame, because it means Wicca can be so easily exploited. But there's not much that can really be done about that. Quote: But if I'm not mistaken, there's no central authority on these things. There's no, for example, Church of Wicca, right? Just individual covens. (I'm seriously asking. I don't know very much about Wicca in practice, just theory.) Yep, each coven is autonomous. There's no central authority. But the degree of separation within Wicca is pretty small - like, one or two - so it's pretty easy to check up on a particular coven's lineage and reputation if you're interested in joining one.
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