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 Posted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 12:49 pm
Still, I must ask, why would God create humans only to let them fight so bitterly against one another? We fight and kill for petty reason such as skin color and different religions, and a piece of measly land. Why would he want to watch us kill and degrade one another like that? It just doesn't make much sense to me.
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Posted: Fri Oct 15, 2010 1:05 pm
CelestialRavenna Still, I must ask, why would God create humans only to let them fight so bitterly against one another? We fight and kill for petty reason such as skin color and different religions, and a piece of measly land. Why would he want to watch us kill and degrade one another like that? It just doesn't make much sense to me. Dunno still trying to find that one out. One answer I've heard is that it has something to do with it being more loving to give us freedom than make us puppets. While I have leanings toward this answer it seems kinda incomplete and lacking. I was having a discussion about this in my group and the conclusion we started going toward is that it's a lack of perspective, in that we are all the main characters in our story but forget that there are other people who are the main characters in their story too and their stories interact with our stories and vice versa. This isn't anything definite but it's the answer I am more leaning toward for now.
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Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:02 am
rmcdra Aakosir Artto rmcdra While they are free to believe what they are doing is right, I am free to despise what they believe. I never said you weren't. My point is, they're not exploiting religion, that IS their religion. Related - if an atheist finds some aspect of Christianity immoral and despises it, he's labelled as intolerant and close-minded. Of course we are. We "blindly" follow an old book and never ever question it's meaning nor interpretations of those meanings. Nope not at all. rolleyes All us Christians want to burn you filthy pagans while singing praise to our might god the Bible..., Jesus, yes Jesus. ninja We're just a bunch of unthinking sheep xp
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Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:04 am
CelestialRavenna Still, I must ask, why would God create humans only to let them fight so bitterly against one another? We fight and kill for petty reason such as skin color and different religions, and a piece of measly land. Why would he want to watch us kill and degrade one another like that? It just doesn't make much sense to me.
The religious creatures preaching this violence are supposed to serve their God. But it's really the other way around. Rather than being faced with a moral dilemma and finding the (Biblical) right path through study of the Bible, they determine what action they'll take based on their own fears and anger and then dig through their Bible for little snippets to justify their hate, even though they never do, except to any like-minded followers who put more faith in their own hatred than their God.
It doesn't have to be conscious, and it doesn't only apply to extremists. It's part of why I have my own ethics on purpose. (:
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Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:05 am
rmcdra Aakosir rmcdra Aakosir rmcdra Yeah they are a "Christian" organization. They aren't accepted as part of the Christian community by most Christians much like how the WBC isn't accepted. And they are rightfully not accepted as part of the Christian community despite classifying as Christians. Their organization takes scripture out of context to encourage others and themselves to be unsaintly people. This just illustrates the problems with defining what Christianity is. If we go with the Catholic definition, we exclude Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses from being classified as Christians. If we accept the "5 fundamentals" as the definition of Christianity any Christian who takes a liberal examination of Christianity is automatically not Christian. Also it was designed to exclude Mormons and Jehovah Witnesses as well. To put it bluntly it's hard to define a group so it includes everyone you like but excludes those you don't like.
But Skinheads are also Christian extremists. And possibly even Hells Angels. I'll have to look that one up though.Because they still classify as Christians since they adhere to what is referred to as the five fundamentals. * The inerrancy of the Bible * The literal nature of the Biblical accounts, especially regarding Christ's miracles. * The Virgin Birth of Christ * The bodily resurrection of Christ * The substitutionary atonement of Christ on the cross Since they adhere to this they still classify as Christian, at least according to most Protestants, which just goes to show when saying anything about Christianity you have to talk about specific denominations if you want to convey anything meaningful. It's a big ******** when you start digging because each group holds to different doctrines. It also sometimes makes me wonder if they aren't all worshiping different gods with how widely they differ.
Hm... So you can follow there "rules" and preach of hate and death to gays and be considered Christian because you believe in the same basic principles... Sounds like some low standards if you ask me.The more inclusive you are, the lower the standards are going to be. Especially if all Christians are supposed to be somehow instant priests just because they believe in Jesus.
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Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:09 am
brainnsoup CelestialRavenna Still, I must ask, why would God create humans only to let them fight so bitterly against one another? We fight and kill for petty reason such as skin color and different religions, and a piece of measly land. Why would he want to watch us kill and degrade one another like that? It just doesn't make much sense to me.
The religious creatures preaching this violence are supposed to serve their God. But it's really the other way around. Rather than being faced with a moral dilemma and finding the (Biblical) right path through study of the Bible, they determine what action they'll take based on their own fears and anger and then dig through their Bible for little snippets to justify their hate, even though they never do, except to any like-minded followers who put more faith in their own hatred than their God.
It doesn't have to be conscious, and it doesn't only apply to extremists. It's part of why I have my own ethics on purpose. (:
Now that makes me think about many incidents.
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Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 10:50 am
Aakosir And that leads us back to that "everyone can be a priest" idea that we were discussing somewhere else. I just don't understand how they are able to call themselves Christian, Baptists! I always though Baptists were more mellow and respectful. Guess I'll have to go to one of the hundred churchs around here, now that I'm in the south. I know where you are coming from regarding that. Grew up in Southeast Louisiana and all that. The cultural attitude makes it out like all churches are exactly the same and in some of the smaller communities it can be just like that. In the larger cities, churches tend to be more diverse.
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Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2010 11:15 am
Aakosir Well some of you are. Most of the ones that I have met. Fair enough. Just remember there's about 2,000,000,000 of us worldwide. It's damn hard to say anything universal about them especially when one is only thinking about the 252,666,391 Christians in the US or the 12.6% of the entire Christian community world wide. The percentage get's smaller as you zoom in on Christians in specific states, and even smaller when you just examine a few towns.
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Posted: Mon Nov 08, 2010 3:32 pm
I'm not sure that the KKK is religion based O_o
I believe that were all like, "Ordo Dracul" styled and went off an ancient Latin ritual based around dragons and witchraft. I'm being honest when I say that. Those KKK hats are originally pagan symbols, and people still wear them (not being racist) in areas of Spain even today on certain marches.
It's possible that a few were Christians or self proclaimed Christians, but most people in the KKK were pro "White Anglo Saxon Protestant", I.E. protestant versus Catholic, rather than Christianity as a whole. xp
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 4:19 pm
The KKK, Westboro Baptist Church (and all other Southern Baptists), Dove World Outreach Centre, and the Roman Catholic Church (just to name a few of the most visible hate/extremist/fundamentalist groups) should be outlawed, eradicated, and put up as an example to all other existing religions that intolerance, hatred, and pious zealotry will not be tolerated in the 21st century civilised world. Christianity was outlawed in several parts of the world throughout history for a reason and the actions and absurd beliefs of these groups are why. Fundamentalism breeds the foolishness that will stop the Human Race form further evolving and getting better.
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 4:31 pm
Major Logica The KKK, Westboro Baptist Church (and all other Southern Baptists), Dove World Outreach Centre, and the Roman Catholic Church (just to name a few of the most visible hate/extremist/fundamentalist groups) should be outlawed, eradicated, and put up as an example to all other existing religions that intolerance, hatred, and pious zealotry will not be tolerated in the 21st century civilised world. Christianity was outlawed in several parts of the world throughout history for a reason and the actions and absurd beliefs of these groups are why. Fundamentalism breeds the foolishness that will stop the Human Race form further evolving and getting better. You're aware that you just advocated outlawing particular religious groups on the basis that they are intolerant, right? "Intolerance will not be tolerated"? I'm not sure whether or not you're being intentionally ironic here. Regardless, outlawing religious groups because they don't conform to your or the prevailing worldview is pretty nasty.
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 4:52 pm
Sanguina Cruenta Major Logica The KKK, Westboro Baptist Church (and all other Southern Baptists), Dove World Outreach Centre, and the Roman Catholic Church (just to name a few of the most visible hate/extremist/fundamentalist groups) should be outlawed, eradicated, and put up as an example to all other existing religions that intolerance, hatred, and pious zealotry will not be tolerated in the 21st century civilised world. Christianity was outlawed in several parts of the world throughout history for a reason and the actions and absurd beliefs of these groups are why. Fundamentalism breeds the foolishness that will stop the Human Race form further evolving and getting better. You're aware that you just advocated outlawing particular religious groups on the basis that they are intolerant, right? "Intolerance will not be tolerated"? I'm not sure whether or not you're being intentionally ironic here. Regardless, outlawing religious groups because they don't conform to your or the prevailing worldview is pretty nasty. Also despite the rights gay issues and woman's priesthood thing, Roman Catholicism is far from being extremist and fundamentalist.
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 5:03 pm
Sanguina Cruenta Major Logica The KKK, Westboro Baptist Church (and all other Southern Baptists), Dove World Outreach Centre, and the Roman Catholic Church (just to name a few of the most visible hate/extremist/fundamentalist groups) should be outlawed, eradicated, and put up as an example to all other existing religions that intolerance, hatred, and pious zealotry will not be tolerated in the 21st century civilised world. Christianity was outlawed in several parts of the world throughout history for a reason and the actions and absurd beliefs of these groups are why. Fundamentalism breeds the foolishness that will stop the Human Race form further evolving and getting better. You're aware that you just advocated outlawing particular religious groups on the basis that they are intolerant, right? "Intolerance will not be tolerated"? I'm not sure whether or not you're being intentionally ironic here. Regardless, outlawing religious groups because they don't conform to your or the prevailing worldview is pretty nasty. Oh yeah, i KNOW it's ironic, but is a necessary Irony. You see, Christian hate groups are not "christian"... Christ taught tolerance. Therefore, only the sects of Christianity who don't go out of their way to condemn anyone who isn't with them can be legally allowed to practice. Legally, religion is protected as long as it isn't hurting people... and well, those groups I named are hurting people. They offend, they persecute, and kill, and they hate. They do not deserve legal status and tax exemption. Quite frankly, the Bible (if read and interpreted literally) encourages and condones alot of practices that are considered barbaric and downright wrong in this day and age. The God of the Bible is seen time and time again as a God of hatred and a God of judgement. Therefore, I personally believe that even if this God were indeed real, it would be necessary to abolish him unless he reforms. There are few individual Christian churches I am aware of that are non-judgmental and do not condone hatred, exclusion, separatism, nor racism/supremacy. These churches I do not have a problem with.
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 5:06 pm
rmcdra Also despite the rights gay issues and woman's priesthood thing, Roman Catholicism is far from being extremist and fundamentalist. Plus, the catechism clearly states that gay people should be treated with love and so on. It's not like they're going around lynching them. Admittedly there's a lot of room for improvement.... this pope is fairly.... conservative. The priesthood thing I really can't comment on... all I can really say is that given some of the gnostic texts, it doesn't really make sense that women can't be priests. But it's not my religion, and I can't comment on their requirements for priesthood. (Except to say that they should make sure they aren't child abusers or something.)
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Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 5:07 pm
Furthermore, it IS important to note that NO religion WHATSOEVER should ahve the right to circumvent the standard democratic process via lobbying. It's unfair, immoral (except to them and anyone who happens to agree with them), and hurtful to those who don't agree... and those who disagree with common Christian morals (Abortion, stem-cell research, transhumanism, LGBT equality, etc) are increasing in number exponentially. Hell, I don't think corporation should be allowed to lobby, either, but religions are far more dangerous when they are allowed to "buy their will into law".
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