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So I take it Artto, since you think something can be inherently bad, you're a moral objectivist, not a moral subjectivist? "Inherent" implies its an intrinsic property of something rather than personal interpretation to me, so I'm just curious if I'm understanding you correctly here.



Personally, I see both. A number who "discuss" religion don't do so in a way that is respectful, though admittedly it is also complicated by the recipient who often will take any criticism of something so core to their worldview as an offense. It takes someone very secure in their beliefs not to take offense. Or someone like me who doesn't believe in absolute truth to begin with, ergo I really don't give a damn if you disagree with my truths. xd

evolution has declared that humans are religious.

you might as well revolt against needing iron in your diet

http://www.hup.harvard.edu/catalog/BURCRE.html

that does tend to get a rise out of people!
razz

the author, Austrian anthropologist Walter Burkert, declares that religion is an evolutionary trait.

he says it preserves the tribe by encouraging self sacrifice for the greater good, and encourages respect for authority which helps make primitive societies more stable.

i am not fond of authority myself but i do like to see how people react to this guy's ideas.

i have heard that the reason why we need a daily dose of iron as part of out diet is because
our ancestors cooked for centuries in iron pots and so it passed into our system, becoming an inherited need.

so that was by way of analogy, biologically speaking

yet if we were to concede that religion is somehow part of our evolutionary history

which i do not necessarily do,

how much of our evolution can we safely discard?

i would not miss my little toe, but what if it turned out i needed it, for reasons unknown?

Hmmm... interesting question. I think the problem here falls on the people and not on God. Have you ever had a conversation with someone who's too stubborn to even consider your point of view? Have you ever been stubborn yourself?

I think when it comes to religion critical thinking skills may die. I will always take in your views and relate them to my own, but some religious people see an atheist and instantly think they're ignorant and disregard them.

I once heard a saying "It doesn't matter who said something, all that matters is what was being said." Sure the devil may try and damage your faith, but that doesn't mean you should shelter yourself and close your mind. You need to consider everything, because that one person you ignored may give you a revelation and a further understanding of your god.

Yes religion IS a virus of the mind. For those of you not familiar with Richard Dawkins's meme theory I will elaborate on it. The theory goes that the unit of the mind is the meme just as the unit of the body is the cell. The meme is the transfer unit that can jump from one person to another through communication in the form of ideas. Religion is a group of memes put together. It behaves like a biological virus in that it's sole purpose is survival and reproduction. It is a group because there are several ideas in religion. If it was just one, like that there is a being floating around in the clouds that we can't see, than it would be easily taken out by the "antibodies" of the mind, the logic memes. The logic memes are what protect the mind from any harmful memes that try to come in. It is possible to have a weak logic support because of the mind viruses.

Anyway, the memes come in and sit there and stay there. It's very hard to get rid of them, because they are viruses. Their goal is survival so they will block or denounce any logic that shows that believing this or that is illogical because it is trying to survive. They also use tools to make you keep the virus such as promises of reward and punishment, heaven and hell. The main goal of a virus is to reproduce and spread, which religion does through the form of "sharing faith" with other people, particularly children who do not have any antibodies, logic, developed yet. Children are programed to believe anything mommy and daddy say because if mommy says not to run out in front of the road, the child will listen because it is good for self preservation. However if the mommy says that there is a heaven where you will go when you die, the child's mind has no way of discerning that that is illogical because he has no logic memes yet and just accepts what mommy tells him. The axiom that children are gullible and the fact that most people who become religious do so at a young age is true. They just don't have the logic memes to discern.

That's the thing. It's harder for a religious person to be open minded and use critical thinking because they have that virus. I know that there are religious people who have done it and I know people who have, it's just harder. The thing about the more critical thinking religion though is that it provides the breeding ground for fundamentalist religion, which provides the breeding ground for literal interpretation religion, which provides the breeding ground for religious fanaticism, which is not what we would like to see because of the harm that it brings.