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Desert_Fox_Rommel

PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 1:34 am


ArmasTermin
Requiem in Mortis
Desert_Fox_Rommel
Requiem in Mortis
I'd suggest an inch-to-millimeter conversion chart for caliber, and vise-versa.
I've heard that 5.56 NATO is the metric equivalent of the .223 rifle round, but I've also heard the two are still different. I don't know if it's worth making a mention of.
5.56mm is the military version of .223. Any gun that can fire one can (as far as I know) fire the other.


Not quite. A rifle chambered in 5.56 can safely fire .223, but don't ever fire 5.56 in a .223-chambered rifle. The higher pressures can, simply put, ******** things up. You know, hot gas shooting out of places, metal pieces flying off, etc. That's not to say it will every time, or the first time, but it's like firing .357 in a gun rated for .38 +P, not that that's possible.
Well I'm sure the metric to standard conversion isn't necessary. It will give people a better understanding of how big the metric calibers are, but that's probably no big deal.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 3:31 am


ArmasTermin
Requiem in Mortis
Desert_Fox_Rommel
Requiem in Mortis
I'd suggest an inch-to-millimeter conversion chart for caliber, and vise-versa.
I've heard that 5.56 NATO is the metric equivalent of the .223 rifle round, but I've also heard the two are still different. I don't know if it's worth making a mention of.
5.56mm is the military version of .223. Any gun that can fire one can (as far as I know) fire the other.


Not quite. A rifle chambered in 5.56 can safely fire .223, but don't ever fire 5.56 in a .223-chambered rifle. The higher pressures can, simply put, ******** things up. You know, hot gas shooting out of places, metal pieces flying off, etc. That's not to say it will every time, or the first time, but it's like firing .357 in a gun rated for .38 +P, not that that's possible.
5.56 has a longer neck than .223, so putting .223 in a 5.56mm chamber will work and it won't kB!, but it won't be as accurate, because it has to 'jump the gap' to catch the rifling.

Fresnel
Crew

Citizen


Requiem ex Inferni

Eloquent Streaker

PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 11:45 am


Fresnel
ArmasTermin
Requiem in Mortis
Desert_Fox_Rommel
Requiem in Mortis
I'd suggest an inch-to-millimeter conversion chart for caliber, and vise-versa.
I've heard that 5.56 NATO is the metric equivalent of the .223 rifle round, but I've also heard the two are still different. I don't know if it's worth making a mention of.
5.56mm is the military version of .223. Any gun that can fire one can (as far as I know) fire the other.


Not quite. A rifle chambered in 5.56 can safely fire .223, but don't ever fire 5.56 in a .223-chambered rifle. The higher pressures can, simply put, ******** things up. You know, hot gas shooting out of places, metal pieces flying off, etc. That's not to say it will every time, or the first time, but it's like firing .357 in a gun rated for .38 +P, not that that's possible.
5.56 has a longer neck than .223, so putting .223 in a 5.56mm chamber will work and it won't kB!, but it won't be as accurate, because it has to 'jump the gap' to catch the rifling.
I wasn't sure, so I wanted to make sure. Like I said, don't ever quote me on ballistics info, because I'm never 100% positive.

Is that the same for 7.62mm NATO and .308?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 12:29 pm


American standard calibers, and metric. Such as .223 and 7.62X39mm.

And also, any gun can be a sniper's weapon.

Inquisitor Brock


Fresnel
Crew

Citizen

PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 3:38 pm


Requiem in Mortis
Fresnel
ArmasTermin
Requiem in Mortis
Desert_Fox_Rommel
Requiem in Mortis
I'd suggest an inch-to-millimeter conversion chart for caliber, and vise-versa.
I've heard that 5.56 NATO is the metric equivalent of the .223 rifle round, but I've also heard the two are still different. I don't know if it's worth making a mention of.
5.56mm is the military version of .223. Any gun that can fire one can (as far as I know) fire the other.


Not quite. A rifle chambered in 5.56 can safely fire .223, but don't ever fire 5.56 in a .223-chambered rifle. The higher pressures can, simply put, ******** things up. You know, hot gas shooting out of places, metal pieces flying off, etc. That's not to say it will every time, or the first time, but it's like firing .357 in a gun rated for .38 +P, not that that's possible.
5.56 has a longer neck than .223, so putting .223 in a 5.56mm chamber will work and it won't kB!, but it won't be as accurate, because it has to 'jump the gap' to catch the rifling.
I wasn't sure, so I wanted to make sure. Like I said, don't ever quote me on ballistics info, because I'm never 100% positive.

Is that the same for 7.62mm NATO and .308?
TBH, I'm not sure. I think it's the same pressure-wise, but they have the same neck, so no loss in accuracy.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 6:54 pm


Ok here is how it works, as I understand it.

.223 can be fired safely in a 5.56NATO chamber but not vis-versa due to vast pressure differences.

7.62NATO can be safely fired out of a .308win but not vis-versa because of head spacing differences. For more on that check here

Freak_090
Captain


Desert_Fox_Rommel

PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 8:06 pm


Freak_090
Ok here is how it works, as I understand it.

.223 can be fired safely in a 5.56NATO chamber but not vis-versa due to vast pressure differences.

7.62NATO can be safely fired out of a .308win but not vis-versa because of head spacing differences. For more on that check here
See this is just what I was talking about. This is being tossed back and forth so much. I want something that takes less argument. For all the discussion involved it's not really going to help the reader much except for telling them a 7.62mm is pretty much a .30 cal. I mostly want to cover more basic stuff with guns before bothering with more advanced stuff like how 5.56 can fire .223 and not the other way around.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 9:34 pm


Sgt Buckner
Also, clips vs. mags
And you can't forget cartridge/round vs. bullet.

Ms Truffle


Desert_Fox_Rommel

PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 10:27 pm


Shrantics Pretentious Ego
Sgt Buckner
Also, clips vs. mags
And you can't forget cartridge/round vs. bullet.
I guess that could be added.


Also I've added LTL ammo in case anyone was going to suggest it.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 10:29 pm


Shrantics Pretentious Ego
Sgt Buckner
Also, clips vs. mags
And you can't forget cartridge/round vs. bullet.
Pretty good point, actually. My brothers found a .223 bullet outside (some dipshit was firing his Stoner in the air), and their friend didn't believe it was a bullet. He assumes the whole thing leaves the barrel when fired.

This guy's also in JAFROTC, so I'm a little concerned.

Requiem ex Inferni

Eloquent Streaker


Desert_Fox_Rommel

PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:34 am


Ok feedback would be appreciated.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:04 am


Desert_Fox_Rommel
Shrantics Pretentious Ego
Sgt Buckner
Also, clips vs. mags
And you can't forget cartridge/round vs. bullet.
I guess that could be added.


Also I've added LTL ammo in case anyone was going to suggest it.
Difference between less-than-lethal and less-lethal.

I.E., LTL cannot kill unless some freak accident occurs (shot in the eye, heart attack, etc), LL can, if the subject is too close to the gun.

Fresnel
Crew

Citizen


Fresnel
Crew

Citizen

PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:33 am


Notes and corrections in red. 3nodding

Desert_Fox_Rommel
It seems weapons, especially firearms, get really hyped up in the media. Various rifles are called assault rifles, hunting rifles are classified as sniper rifles, semi and fully automatic are thrown around and said in such a way to make it sound scary. I'm just going to throw out what I know. If someone reading this doesn't know much about firearms I hope they can learn from it. Some details might be fuzzy, but I will try to be as accurate as possible.

First off Future Weapons is a show meant for entertainment purposes. I've heard they can be total idiots when it comes to getting their facts right. I can't verify or deny that so all I have to say is don't take it too seriously. Especially when it comes to them telling a "big secret". I remember one episode they were talking about a rocket mounted laser system designed to stop missiles. They made a big hype about security. The research facility is in California. Supposedly the facility security is so tight even the governor could not get in because you have to be born in America to get in. Supposedly it's extremely tight security, but the host walks in with a camera crew no problem. If it was as big of a secret as they claim then it would have been censored by the government so that the wrong people don't get the information. That's not to say the show is total garbage. I find it to be amusing since I love learning about weapon technology. Just don't follow it religiously "Take everything with a grain of salt"?. Also if you would like to learn about the history of certain breeds of weaponry Weaponology is pretty cool.

The Four Rules of safety are often the cornerstone of weapons safety. The order often varies. The order Wording? "Order" is redundant. may vary, but essentially these are the rules.
1. A gun is always loaded.
2. Never point a gun at anything you aren't willing to destroy
3. Always keep your finger off the trigger until you are ready to fire
4. Always be aware of your target and what lies beyond.

The first rule pretty much covers everything, but the other rules are still pretty much [repetitive] there to clarify for those who don't figure out the safety tips. Some times the rule is stated as "treat" the gun as if it were loaded. I prefer to just say the gun is always loaded. You need the frame of mind that the gun is loaded. If you fool around and play with guns like it's a toy that's when people get shot. The second rule is pretty self explanatory [spelling error]. Some people think the safety will save them. I wouldn't trust the safety to work. If you fool around with the gun because the safety is on some time the safety might not be on or broken and someone could be hurt. The third rule is to help prevent you firing when you are not ready. If you keep the finger on the trigger while you are still aiming you might fire off a shot prematurely. If you're hunting you might wound the target without killing it. or if you're just screwing around, you could accidentally shoot someoneThe 4th rule is vitally important. If you're hunting and you see a bush shaking you better be 100% positive what you are shooting at. If you accidentally shoot a hunter instead no matter how sorry you are or how much you pray God won't bring them back. There is also a thing known as over penetration where your bullet goes in one side of the target and out the other. Anything on the other side of your target could be hit so be careful. There are various other safety procedures, but the four rules are the big ones.

Clips and Magazines are ammo holding items used for loading weapons. Usually when someone talks about a clip they are really talking about a magazine. Some people make a big difference between the two. I think if you know what is meant that is good enough. Still I might as well cover it. A magazine is what loads the ammunition into the gun itself. It is the ammo belt for a machine gun, a cylinder for a revolver, or the banana shaped box in an AK47. A clip is used to load a magazine. Many older weapons had a magazine permanently [spelling error] attached to the gun itself. A "stripper clip" was used to slide several rounds into the magazine at once rather than having to put in 1 round at a time. If you are in doubt refer to the picture below.

User Image - Blocked by "Display Image" Settings. Click to show.

Bullets are the projectiles fired from guns. Yes I know any idiot can figure that out. The thing is the bullet is sometimes mistaken as being the entire ammunition unit. A single ammunition unit is often called a round or cartridge. A cartridge consists of a projectile (the bullet), propellant (the gunpowder), the primer (the thing that sets off the gunpowder) and the casing (the metal tube that holds everything together.

Buying Advice Ammo availability [spelling] is a very important thing to consider if you want to buy a gun. You will probably want something that is easy to get ammo for. The FN P90 looks nice and handles nice in video games, but the 5.7mm ammo is pretty rare in the U.S. so even if you could get one the ammunition will be hard to get and expensive. If you plan to do a lot of target practice without the intent of using the gun for self defense a .22 is good to get. The ammo is the cheapest available so you get more for your money.

Choose a weapon that suits you. It's good to have friends with weapon experience. It's a good idea to try various calibers before buying. Guns and ammo can be expensive so it's good to get a feel for what works best for you rather than just buying something that feels too awkward.

Storing Firearmsis somewhat controversial [spelling]. It's widely accepted you need to secure your guns, but to what degree is the issue. Some people think you need to lock your guns in one safe, your ammo in another safe, and have each safe on opposite sides of the house. This makes your guns most inconvenient for an intruder to use against you, but is also inconvenient for you to use against intruders. What can be agreed on is that weapons should be locked up especially when you are not directly using them. If you leave it in an unlocked drawer a thief can find it when you're not home. Even worse if you have kids one might find it and if they are not smart with guns that can end in disaster. Personally I like the idea of having it either in a holster at home or locked somewhere you can easily access. At night located in a holster behind the bed or locked in a drawer or something where you can easily access it if needed, but the kids can't. When you are not at home keep it locked in a safe or something. That's my personal opinion. If you own a gun it's your call how you secure it. But also your responsibility if you screw that up. razz

Automatic Weapons are a big hot button for the media. An automatic weapon is a weapon that automatically reloads itself after it fires. There is
Semi Automatic and Fully Automatic. Semi automatic weapons are a weapon that will fire once and then reload when you squeeze the trigger. If you squeeze the trigger and hold it down it still only shoots one time. If you keep pulling the trigger it will keep firing until you run out of ammo. Fully automatic weapons are weapons that can keep firing and reloading. If you hold down the trigger it will fire then reload then fire and reload again. It will keep firing and reloading until you release the trigger or you run out of ammo.Should note that they've been illegal for civilian-oriented manufacture or import since '69, they cost upwards of $15,000 each, and they're heavily regulated.

Silencers are a common name used for a sound suppressor. Sound suppressor is the official term used. They are popular in video games and movies. When you use them in video games and in movies it should be noticed that you almost always hear the guns going off anyway. It is much quieter, but it still makes noise. For some reason there is a misconception that they make the gun completely silent. Such is not the case. A sound suppressor is a chamber on the end of the gun for expanding gasses to expand into. It works exactly the same as a car muffler.

Sniper Rifles and Hunting Rifles are similar weapons. Hunting rifles are sometimes identified as sniper rifles. The two are more or less the same. The main difference is how the name sounds. A hunting rifle to the average joe is an average weapon while a sniper rifle is a high powered weapon that can easily kill in one shot. Sniping tactics were based on hunting tactics. A person does their best to remain undetected while they search for the animal they want to kill. When they find the animal they carefully place an accurate shot to a place on the animal to kill them in one hit. Actually the term "Sniper" refers to a marksman who was accurate enough to shoot a snipe. The same is the principal behind sniping. Since hunting relies on accuracy the weapon is designed to shoot accurately. An actual military sniper rifle isn't as easy to get ahold of.I believe military snipers load their own ammo, but I could be wrong.

Caliber refers to the diameter of the ammo. It is sometimes measured in standard Imperial? and other times in metric. Standard is in hundredths of an inch, or in some cases even thousandths such as .45 and .223. Metric is in millimeters [spelling] such as 9mm and 7.62mm. If you're just talking about guns that's all you need to know, but if you actually want to own a gun you will want to learn the specifics. For example there is .22 short, .22 long, and .22 magnum. All three of them are .22, but they aren't necessarily the same. A .22 short won't hold a '22 long or magnum. The same with 9mm. There is 9mm parabellum is 9x19mm while 9mm Makarov is 9x18mm. If you were to try and use a Parabellum round in a gun that takes a Makarov round you would find the round is too long. One millimeter doesn't seem like a big deal, but it can make a big difference.

Less than Lethal weapons are weapons designed to stop a target without killing them. These are tasers, stun guns, sticky shockers, beanbag shotgun shells, rubber bullets, and many more weapons. They are sometimes called non lethal weapons, but that is a misleading title. If improperly used it can still kill a target.
Not too shabby, overall.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:59 am


The spelling errors were due to this being written in notepad then laziness of not checking firefox spellcheck before submitting it here. I was going to check that before submitting the final guide to my journal.

Yeah I will take care of redundancy. I wrote most of this stuff really late at night when I'm sleep deprived, but not tired enough to go to bed.

As for everything else I'll tweak it later. It's 1 am and I'm likely to screw it up even more. Thanks for the help Fres.

Desert_Fox_Rommel


Fresnel
Crew

Citizen

PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:49 pm


Desert_Fox_Rommel
The spelling errors were due to this being written in notepad then laziness of not checking firefox spellcheck before submitting it here. I was going to check that before submitting the final guide to my journal.
That's how I caught them. xd

Quote:
Yeah I will take care of redundancy. I wrote most of this stuff really late at night when I'm sleep deprived, but not tired enough to go to bed.

As for everything else I'll tweak it later. It's 1 am and I'm likely to screw it up even more. Thanks for the help Fres.
Fair enough.

Just so you all know, I secretly do this in my head to everything I read, but I never say anything. xd
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