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 Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:11 pm
-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 On the one hand, I'm thinking, "She couldn't have waited another year?" On the other, I'm thinking, "What if the parents are just saying that to look good for the media?" I doubt they're saying it to look good, Nines. Think about where we are. I mean honestly, they can't really do any harm to her. Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible.
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Posted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:26 pm
Nines19 -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 On the one hand, I'm thinking, "She couldn't have waited another year?" On the other, I'm thinking, "What if the parents are just saying that to look good for the media?" I doubt they're saying it to look good, Nines. Think about where we are. I mean honestly, they can't really do any harm to her. Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:29 am
-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 On the one hand, I'm thinking, "She couldn't have waited another year?" On the other, I'm thinking, "What if the parents are just saying that to look good for the media?" I doubt they're saying it to look good, Nines. Think about where we are. I mean honestly, they can't really do any harm to her. Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral That's what the Qur'an says should happen.
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 9:56 am
Voldemort point two -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 On the one hand, I'm thinking, "She couldn't have waited another year?" On the other, I'm thinking, "What if the parents are just saying that to look good for the media?" I doubt they're saying it to look good, Nines. Think about where we are. I mean honestly, they can't really do any harm to her. Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral That's what the Qur'an says should happen. So? The bible says to stone children who are disobedient. What's your point?
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 11:45 am
-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 On the one hand, I'm thinking, "She couldn't have waited another year?" On the other, I'm thinking, "What if the parents are just saying that to look good for the media?" I doubt they're saying it to look good, Nines. Think about where we are. I mean honestly, they can't really do any harm to her. Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral That was what the parents claimed. This is something that needs to be looked at very carefully because we don't want the girl going back to her parents if she's going to be at risk with them. Some of the claims that Rifqa has made are very unnerving.
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 11:59 am
-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Voldemort point two -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 On the one hand, I'm thinking, "She couldn't have waited another year?" On the other, I'm thinking, "What if the parents are just saying that to look good for the media?" I doubt they're saying it to look good, Nines. Think about where we are. I mean honestly, they can't really do any harm to her. Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral That's what the Qur'an says should happen. So? The bible says to stone children who are disobedient. What's your point? In either case if they are extremists, be they Christian or Muslim there is the potential for murder. Its not so long ago that I recall several honour killings taking place in Britain, against muslim girls that 'dishonoured' their families.
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:03 pm
Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 On the one hand, I'm thinking, "She couldn't have waited another year?" On the other, I'm thinking, "What if the parents are just saying that to look good for the media?" I doubt they're saying it to look good, Nines. Think about where we are. I mean honestly, they can't really do any harm to her. Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral That was what the parents claimed. This is something that needs to be looked at very carefully because we don't want the girl going back to her parents if she's going to be at risk with them. Some of the claims that Rifqa has made are very unnerving. In all honesty I think she's more at risk staying with the pastor. Why can't she stay with family members, her grandparents or her aunt or uncle? Why can't she be with people she can trust instead of some pastor she met online?
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:08 pm
-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 On the one hand, I'm thinking, "She couldn't have waited another year?" On the other, I'm thinking, "What if the parents are just saying that to look good for the media?" I doubt they're saying it to look good, Nines. Think about where we are. I mean honestly, they can't really do any harm to her. Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral That was what the parents claimed. This is something that needs to be looked at very carefully because we don't want the girl going back to her parents if she's going to be at risk with them. Some of the claims that Rifqa has made are very unnerving. In all honesty I think she's more at risk staying with the pastor. Why can't she stay with family members, her grandparents or her aunt or uncle? Why can't she be with people she can trust instead of some pastor she met online? She's not with the pastor, she's in the states care.
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:09 pm
Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral That was what the parents claimed. This is something that needs to be looked at very carefully because we don't want the girl going back to her parents if she's going to be at risk with them. Some of the claims that Rifqa has made are very unnerving. In all honesty I think she's more at risk staying with the pastor. Why can't she stay with family members, her grandparents or her aunt or uncle? Why can't she be with people she can trust instead of some pastor she met online? She's not with the pastor, she's in the states care. That's not really any much better.
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:12 pm
Honestly, she's not even American. Since she's not yet an adult, wouldn't even America keeping her in their custody be kidnapping and against some sort of international policy?
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:15 pm
-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Nines19 Not legally, but yes they can, Rai. Some parents abuse their children. It happens. I know. I've been there. To be honest, that kind of personal bias is probably why the thought came into my head in the first place. It's just a thought. But it's not nearly impossible. They can do abuse whether it be verbal, psychological, emotional, physical or otherwise. What I'm talking about is murder though. From what I read about this, this pastor put the idea that her parents would kill her for converting because he thinks/believes that people who convert to a different religion outside of Islam are going to be killed. neutral That was what the parents claimed. This is something that needs to be looked at very carefully because we don't want the girl going back to her parents if she's going to be at risk with them. Some of the claims that Rifqa has made are very unnerving. In all honesty I think she's more at risk staying with the pastor. Why can't she stay with family members, her grandparents or her aunt or uncle? Why can't she be with people she can trust instead of some pastor she met online? She's not with the pastor, she's in the states care. That's not really any much better. It's a hell of a lot better than turning her back prematurely into the hands of those who might kill her.
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:18 pm
Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis That was what the parents claimed. This is something that needs to be looked at very carefully because we don't want the girl going back to her parents if she's going to be at risk with them. Some of the claims that Rifqa has made are very unnerving. In all honesty I think she's more at risk staying with the pastor. Why can't she stay with family members, her grandparents or her aunt or uncle? Why can't she be with people she can trust instead of some pastor she met online? She's not with the pastor, she's in the states care. That's not really any much better. It's a hell of a lot better than turning her back prematurely into the hands of those who might kill her. That's circumstantial. We don't even know if they will actually do it though. @Neko: No. Her parents came here to America. She could've taken the citizenship test and is an American citizen. We honestly don't know. She could have a green card.
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 1:27 pm
-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis That was what the parents claimed. This is something that needs to be looked at very carefully because we don't want the girl going back to her parents if she's going to be at risk with them. Some of the claims that Rifqa has made are very unnerving. In all honesty I think she's more at risk staying with the pastor. Why can't she stay with family members, her grandparents or her aunt or uncle? Why can't she be with people she can trust instead of some pastor she met online? She's not with the pastor, she's in the states care. That's not really any much better. It's a hell of a lot better than turning her back prematurely into the hands of those who might kill her. That's circumstantial. We don't even know if they will actually do it though. @Neko: No. Her parents came here to America. She could've taken the citizenship test and is an American citizen. We honestly don't know. She could have a green card. The girl saying that her father told her that he was going to kill and disavow her is circumstantial? You would send her back after she told you she fled because her father threatened to kill her (which is eyewitness testimony)? We all want to believe the best in others but in cases like this you can't turn a kid back to her family because you'd rather believe that Christians brainwashed her then that her parents might be a danger to her. I hope this gets settled soon for the sake of all who are involved but it needs to be done right. Better to be safe then sorry.
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Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2009 2:46 pm
Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis She's not with the pastor, she's in the states care. That's not really any much better. It's a hell of a lot better than turning her back prematurely into the hands of those who might kill her. That's circumstantial. We don't even know if they will actually do it though. @Neko: No. Her parents came here to America. She could've taken the citizenship test and is an American citizen. We honestly don't know. She could have a green card. The girl saying that her father told her that he was going to kill and disavow her is circumstantial? You would send her back after she told you she fled because her father threatened to kill her (which is eyewitness testimony)? We all want to believe the best in others but in cases like this you can't turn a kid back to her family because you'd rather believe that Christians brainwashed her then that her parents might be a danger to her. I hope this gets settled soon for the sake of all who are involved but it needs to be done right. Better to be safe then sorry. It is circumstantial. http://www.lectlaw.com/def/c342.htmWe don't know if the parents will do her any harm. And it's pretty foolish and ignorant to even say that her parents will harm her in any way shape or form. I think the pastor did more harm to her by trying to brainwash her into thinking that her parents, who brought her into the world, would wish to do harm to her. If they wanted to do harm to her then why would they bring her to America in the first place? Try putting yourself in their shoes. How do you think they would feel learning about these allegations? If your child made these allegations against you, would you want to harm them or would you be upset, that the not only would say such horrid things about you but about the religion you brought them up in? Yes you have Muslim killing members of their family, but need I remind you that here in America, you have people butchering their children, stoning them, drowning them and even eating their brains all because they're supposedly possessed by the Devil or that God told the mothers to do it. Let me ask you this: If you think that a Muslim family killing their family is so ghastly, then why is it okay for a Christian mother to dismember their children because God told them so? Aren't they both equally ghastly?
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Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:51 pm
-Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis -Tsukiyo-Moon Maiden Semiremis She's not with the pastor, she's in the states care. That's not really any much better. It's a hell of a lot better than turning her back prematurely into the hands of those who might kill her. That's circumstantial. We don't even know if they will actually do it though. @Neko: No. Her parents came here to America. She could've taken the citizenship test and is an American citizen. We honestly don't know. She could have a green card. The girl saying that her father told her that he was going to kill and disavow her is circumstantial? You would send her back after she told you she fled because her father threatened to kill her (which is eyewitness testimony)? We all want to believe the best in others but in cases like this you can't turn a kid back to her family because you'd rather believe that Christians brainwashed her then that her parents might be a danger to her. I hope this gets settled soon for the sake of all who are involved but it needs to be done right. Better to be safe then sorry. It is circumstantial. http://www.lectlaw.com/def/c342.htmWe don't know if the parents will do her any harm. And it's pretty foolish and ignorant to even say that her parents will harm her in any way shape or form. I think the pastor did more harm to her by trying to brainwash her into thinking that her parents, who brought her into the world, would wish to do harm to her. If they wanted to do harm to her then why would they bring her to America in the first place? Try putting yourself in their shoes. How do you think they would feel learning about these allegations? If your child made these allegations against you, would you want to harm them or would you be upset, that the not only would say such horrid things about you but about the religion you brought them up in? Yes you have Muslim killing members of their family, but need I remind you that here in America, you have people butchering their children, stoning them, drowning them and even eating their brains all because they're supposedly possessed by the Devil or that God told the mothers to do it. Let me ask you this: If you think that a Muslim family killing their family is so ghastly, then why is it okay for a Christian mother to dismember their children because God told them so? Aren't they both equally ghastly?
That's the very first line from the source that you sited. Right now I'm putting myself in the kids shoes and the fact that she directly said that her father threatened to kill her, she said she didn't feel safe, that's enough to draw up some serious concerns. I don't care if the family seems kind and loving, some people are quite good at manipulating others and putting on a show. I'm not saying that the girl should be kept from her parents indefinitely, all I'm saying is that they need to look into the allegations made. The girl was in contact over the internet, it can't be that difficult to pull up some chat logs from those she was in contact with. Why are you bringing abuse by Christians into this, it has no relevancy to the case unless your only issue is that you assume that this is all about religious discrimination, although in that case you would be the one who was discriminating based on religion. We can't let that blind us. The kid said that she was in danger of being killed, there's no evidence to suggest that she's lying, she could have possibly been brainwashed and before any further action is taken that's what needs to be found out. Assumptions either way aren't very useful and could be potentially damaging. If the family are really kind and loving then yes, I feel horrible for them and I think they should look into taking action against the pastor she ran off to. But I don't know that and neither do you and when someone feels their life is in danger, when someone claims that another has threatened to harm or kill them, then as a society we cannot just look the other way before checking it out.
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