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James628
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Sun Aug 30, 2009 2:14 pm


mr_zoot
and yet still, higher life expectancy and overall health.

and where are you reading that the kids and elderly get the shaft in the UK/Canada?
from what I read that is propaganda put out by the American conservatives and their masters in the insurance industry. Ive never heard of this in the UK. as a matter of fact, in the UK, the elderly get free pharmaceuticals, while everyone else has to pay a flat rate of like $10.00
one could just as easly conclude that liberal politicians praise socialized medicen because of their far left labor union masters tell them too. as far as the pharamceuticals go they may have a flate rate of $10.00 well the people for the most part still pay for it threw taxes, what they dont pay the goverment prints more money for, that devaluates the currency, which in turn raises prices, and that leads you to present day england a place where the people are fed up with the socialst majority so much so that brown canceld an election out of fear that they would lose. it is a place that the IMF and the EU has claimed to be the worst of the G20 in the recession because of their economic policies. individuals may like the NHS but look at the larger picture it ruined their economy. ours isint perfect but when looking at other systems lets pick one that doesent have a track record of total failure.
PostPosted: Mon Sep 07, 2009 8:14 am


Im still not swayed. A g20, even the last still has a rather high standard of living. People still eat, get jobs, go to university, live their lives...more healthily than us...and for longer.

Plus...there is kind of a global crisis, man

most NHS people seem to think that they will have the budget balanced again by 2010

All in all the NHS enjoys popular support. No matter how much it is criticized by a few vocal nay sayers, a solid and consistent majority is satisfied with the system.

mr_zoot


James628
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 3:43 pm


mr_zoot
Im still not swayed. A g20, even the last still has a rather high standard of living. People still eat, get jobs, go to university, live their lives...more healthily than us...and for longer.

Plus...there is kind of a global crisis, man

most NHS people seem to think that they will have the budget balanced again by 2010

All in all the NHS enjoys popular support. No matter how much it is criticized by a few vocal nay sayers, a solid and consistent majority is satisfied with the system.
But that is just it, what majority? most every poll shows the people who champion those oh so "popular" economic policies are about to lose big with the economy being number one issue
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:17 pm


im not talking about political parties, im talking about the population of which the majority is satisfied with NHS care.

mr_zoot


James628
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Wed Sep 09, 2009 6:26 pm


the labour party's popularity should be a fair messure of the people's opinion being that it is the labour party that brought in most of englands socialist programs that trashed their economy and the people are finaly going to boot them out of office for it
PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 10:08 pm


the labor party's popularity and general public satisfaction with NHS are two seperate statistics.

mr_zoot


James628
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Fri Sep 11, 2009 10:23 pm


mr_zoot
the labor party's popularity and general public satisfaction with NHS are two seperate statistics.
so their policies that shape a nation have nothing to do with their approval?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 12, 2009 6:34 am


In this case, no. You are trying to make an argument out of nothing. NHS has support, the labour party has support. Doesn't prove that people like the labour party because of NHS. Both crime and ice cream sales go up in the summer, does ice cream cause crime?

Kaim Arouet
Captain

Tipsy Loiterer


James628
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Sat Sep 12, 2009 9:46 am


Kaim Arounet
In this case, no. You are trying to make an argument out of nothing. NHS has support, the labour party has support. Doesn't prove that people like the labour party because of NHS. Both crime and ice cream sales go up in the summer, does ice cream cause crime?
no but depending on the crime ice cream and other crime's arnt run by the same group. and its not just the NHS, that along with trying socialize the country has ruined their economy somthing that most citizens might not bee to crazy about.
If I was a british citizen and I had to wait month just to get a check up or in some cases actualy winning the lottery to see them, I wouldent get mad at the doctors I would take it out on the management who happens to be the goverment. How the NHS and other organaztions are run is goverment policy, a goverments support is most often a messur of how well the people agree with their policy.
PostPosted: Sun Sep 13, 2009 12:23 am


Public healthcare is no more socialistic than public education.

DanskiWolf


James628
Vice Captain

PostPosted: Sun Sep 13, 2009 9:29 am


DanskiWolf
Public healthcare is no more socialistic than public education.
yes and look at the result after throwing money at the problem ($11,000 per student per year) we have acheived lower and lower results especialy in the more important area's of science and math. then with the goverments no child left behind the schooles have to give a stanardized test each year and has to show progress from the year befor, the result is instead of teaching the curriculum they focus on preparing for the tests most the year and in my case in texas the test's writting section teaches a low quality of writing that would fail in college.
another ex. look at our USPS, I like them but the private companies are undoutably more effecient, they have to be or they lose business. They are more accountable becuase its their money to lose. the post office could do a terrible jod and still get completly funded.
lessons to learn fom other areas already socialized would be they cost more and lower quality
PostPosted: Sun Sep 13, 2009 9:54 pm


I am satisfied with the postal service. It provides good basic service and is an excellent way to communicate via letter. The private companies are somewhat efficient, though the "oops" pronunciation of UPS is still quite apt.

second, I think that the existence of the postal service as a base line provides important competition for the others, and keeps them efficient.

also, James, you continue to talk about "the lines" without actually addressing the arguments about them above.


The "lottery" is an artifact of the British system due to the capacity for a hospital to perform a certain procedure or not. Thus the "geographic lottery." The proposed system here in the US is a public insurance scheme that will make use of currently existing hospitals, so any "lottery" problem will be one that already exists within the status quo.

mr_zoot

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