Welcome to Gaia! ::

i know ur not saying all that to be mean....
wow...sounds like u went through alot D=......i went through something kinda like that.....but when i asked out the 1st girl i liked, she just said "no" which i was fine with, but after that she started spreading rumors about me and then ppl started thinking i was a loser and stuff like that....

And what would you have me do differently? I tried making friends and getting accepted in high school and the more I tried, the farther down I sunk. I tried again when I came to college and guess what happened?

The assumptions I make are based wholly on the daily experiences that I have, and it's not like I actively shun other people in my daily activities. I'm actually quite cordial and, pardon if this sounds like bragging, fairly articulate and well-spoken, should someone choose to speak with me. And yet, people will still avoid me like the plague. Even in college, where people are supposed to be more mature, I walk down the sidewalk and people will look at their friends and grimace or make some snide comment. I've sat down in class and had others get up and move to the other side of the room. I've even had 3 people now who adamantly refused to sit next to me on the bus - they chose to wait 20 minutes for another bus rather than sit next to me for a 3 minute bus ride. And to counter balance this, the best regard I could hope to get from someone that isn't well over 30-some-odd years of age (i.e. not my peer group) is benign neglect.

You say that sticking to the background is only hurting myself, but it's actually quite the opposite. Sticking to the background is what I hope and strive for - sticking to the background is the one chance I have at getting through the day without feeling as if I'm a socially worthless wretch because everyone around me spurns me for no good reason (see above: I act quite cordial when I interact with someone; it's not like I go around giving off some "I hate the world" vibe - in quite the ironic twist, the people who DO give off that vibe are generally more accepted in my peer group than I am).

And no, it is not my advice to expect nothing out of life. My advice is simply to know who you are, know how people respond to you, and make realistic expectations. It would be entirely unrealistic of me to expect social acceptance; it is a daily event in my life to be treated as a socially worthless individual - that precludes social acceptance. By contrast, though, I am quite good at intellectual matters, so it is entirely realistic of me to expect to have a good career in academia and to be treated with some level of respect in that field (specifically: physics and/or psychology). Simply because the majority of people would rather see me dead than be friends with me does not negate my focus in other facets of life where I am not so worthless.

And my point in calling your method of advice naive was not to insinuate that it doesn't work at all. My point was that you're just assuming it will work without leaving any concession to the fact that there are people for whom the "go out and make friends!!!!" advice just doesn't work. If I were to follow your advice, right now, I would get laughed out of the room and I'm completely certain that it would actually do more harm than good. Why? Because I am a socially worthless person; my peers have spoken, that is what they have declared, and due to the wonderful nature of opinion-holding I can't really do much to change people's thoughts on the matter. If I were here asking for advice and that is the advice you gave me, you would effectively be sending someone to the slaughter. So in response, I attempted to temper that (with, admittedly, no small amount of exasperation over the fact that I always seem to be the only person without my head in the clouds and who acknowledges the existence of social undesirables) with a dose of reality. My apologies if that came off too negative for you, but unless someone wishes to present evidence to the contrary (I have yet to ever hear or read the words "No, Inune, I think you're a worthwhile person," I've only heard what you're saying now: "No, Inune, you can't think that because it's your fault you're not a worthwhile person!"), I can see it no other way.

You're assuming you know quite a lot about my personality from a few forum posts. I wasn't lying when I said I was cordial and friendly; some small talk here and there is a lot different from a serious discussion about something like this - and if you met me in person, it would probably take a relatively long time before anything this serious came up. As a general rule, I would act more along the lines of what you see when I post non-serious things in the GD. A person that worked with me in a lab, for instance, would never even get a hint of the serious nature I'm presenting here because in casual conversation I'm far more prone to joke than I am to make serious philosophical discussion.

I'm not blindly accepting anything; like I said, what I think extends directly from the evidence I'm given in daily life. If even one person my own age treated me in a positive manner on a day-to-day basis, it would be cause to rethink my philosophy; if even one person decided that they actually wanted to be around me and hear what I have to say sometimes, that would be cause to rethink my philosophy. However, no one wants to do that - even before encountering my "snobbish air of intellect." I don't bury myself in theory or books; I pay stark attention to the reality around me - that's why I think the things I do.

You talk as if what I think about myself matters at all. I have a shocker for you: what I think about myself doesn't matter for jack. Why? Because I'm not the one deciding whether or not I'm worthwhile socially. Other people decide that when they decide whether or not they want to be around me. I actually think I'm quite the guy - but that's meaningless because I'm not the one deciding whether or not I have social value. Thinking your opinion matters most and just ignoring what anyone else has to say because you don't like their opinion is one of the most conceited and arrogant paradigms someone can possess.

Of course I'm stubborn on this issue. Do you even understand the magnitude of what you're asking me to do? You're asking me to seek acceptance from people who have, time and time again, proven that they don't want me around. You're ignoring the fact that I have flat out said that people do not like me and you're demanding that I simply prostrate myself before them in some floundering attempt to be accepted. Why wouldn't I react badly to that? Here's another shocker: I don't like being hurt. It's been impressed upon me since I was about ******** old that any and all attempts to make friends gets me hurt. Why the ******** would I listen to someone telling me to just go make friends when they, themselves, are completely unwilling to BE that friend in the first place, or else acknowledge the fact that maybe I'm right?

You act like your advice is so new and fresh; here's a third shocker: I'VE HEARD IT BEFORE. Oh yeah, that's right! The exact advice you're acting like is a godsend, I've heard before - and even more to the point, I was foolish enough to follow it before. You want to know what it got me? It got me invited to parties that didn't exist, so I stood outside for 30 minutes in the freezing cold and everyone had a laugh about it the next day. It got me invited to parties that DID exist, just so a practical joke could be pulled on me and everyone could have a laugh about it. It got me surrounded by a group of jeering kids while one boisterous one told me I should kill myself and the rest laughed about it. But you know what your advice didn't get me? No matter how hard I tried, it didn't get me a friend, an ally, or even an acquaintance - and it sure as hell never got anyone to stand up for/with me when the others would come around. So you can take your self-righteousness and shove it.



Finally, I'm not trying to shoot people when they're down. I'm trying to help him by giving an alternative to the same ridiculous advice that got me tormented for the greater half of my life until I wisened up and stopped listening to it.

umm.....soooooo......any1 else have any advice???

be you and everything will work out fine.

Well for me, I have always had confidence issue. I am shy and often do not talk unless talked to. However, I have learned through experience and education how to work it around. Now also everyone has different ways to talk to them. I suggest before you talk to anyone that you watch them and how people interact some. However, raw experience works the best. Also, be honest and kind as well.

However, being yourself is something that comes later. First you have to be comfortable about yourself and believe yourself capable. At the same time don't be cocky or prideful, believe in yourself and others will see that. I don't know if this will help but also posture helps as well. For instance standing up straight and tall, shows confidence but don't stick out your chest as it makes it seem as if you are high on yourself. I'm not sure if this helps but...

The way you feel and think about yourself also matters, you know. If you believe that you're unworthy etc. it sorts of give out an... aura? Which makes people think you're exactly that kind of person. It's not always the same in every situations though, e.g: you might think that you're cool and smart and witty and stuff, but in fact you're not. Well, in that situation, your "aura" thingy won't help. =P
Being yourself is like... You know sometimes, when you want to know someone better, or just maybe make them more comfortable talking to you, sometimes, the tone of your voice changes, the way you talk changes, your attitude changes, stuff like that. If people knows what you're actually like, and you do that sorta thing, they might think you're a fake, a suck up. Being yourself is just... being yourself.

well, ive never really "accepted" that i was a loser because i know i am not and dont want to think of myself as what im not but as Inune also said the more and more i try to make new friends the more and more im rejected by society... because of what? a rumor that some b**ch started in like 7th grade....maybe it looks like we just accept our social rejection but you will never truly know 'till you experience it yourself...