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 Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:04 pm
kingpinsqeezels Iran is more sophisticated than we give them credit for. I think people believe that because it's in the middle east and isn't Israel, that Iran is just another Iraq. I mean, it's only one letter difference! I'm actually pretty aware of what Iran is capable of. I've been spending some time looking into getting a job as a diplomat to 'em. Still, the Iranians are in a bad situation. American allies flank them. Iraq, Afghanistan, Turkey. They can't directly reach Israel if Israel decides to strike, especially if we (America) allows Israeli jets to refuel at our air strips. Iran won't be able to launch a ground offensive at us, or at Israel, and thus Israel will have a free shot at destroying whatever part of the infrastructure they want.
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 2:34 pm
I really meant American people in general, at least the ones who are so excited to demolish Iran because they may or may not have nuclear capabilities in the next decade...or 2. Surely a war with Iran would be much different then a war on a thing. Ex: Flowers, over extensive use of emots, terror...whatever.
Another thing I can't understand is why there is this hypothetical situation in the first place. What does Israel care about Iran, besides all the misinterpreted b.s. the American media pretends Iran has said..?
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:05 pm
Israel cares because Iran financially supports Hezbollah and other enemies. The rockets fired on Israel during the Lebanon war were either purchased with Iranian money, or directly sent to Hezbollah. Similarly, the new rockets Hamas has been firing are of an Iranian style.
Edit: To go on, Iran cares about Israel because it is the most solid bastion of American influence in the Middle East. Iran wants to be top dog in the region, and is well on its way to doing so. While Saudi Arabia is also an American stronghold, the Sauds are unwilling to wage war against America's enemies in the same way that Israel is. For this reason Israel can be seen as a threat to Iranian hegemony.
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:17 pm
Dis Domnu Still, the Iranians are in a bad situation. American allies flank them. Iraq, Afghanistan, Turkey. They can't directly reach Israel if Israel decides to strike, especially if we (America) allows Israeli jets to refuel at our air strips. Iran won't be able to launch a ground offensive at us, or at Israel, and thus Israel will have a free shot at destroying whatever part of the infrastructure they want. If America and Israel get in a shooting match with Iran, then the Arab world will go absolutely, pardon my French, Ape s**t, and then come alliances, and entanglements, and then Europe gets involved and then... World War III is nothing anyone wants.
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:23 pm
LordNeuf Dis Domnu Still, the Iranians are in a bad situation. American allies flank them. Iraq, Afghanistan, Turkey. They can't directly reach Israel if Israel decides to strike, especially if we (America) allows Israeli jets to refuel at our air strips. Iran won't be able to launch a ground offensive at us, or at Israel, and thus Israel will have a free shot at destroying whatever part of the infrastructure they want. If America and Israel get in a shooting match with Iran, then the Arab world will go absolutely, pardon my French, Ape s**t, and then come alliances, and entanglements, and then Europe gets involved and then... World War III is nothing anyone wants. I'm curious why you think the Arabs will come to Iran's aid? Keep in mind, Iran is Persian, not Arab, and is in active competition with the Arab States.
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:47 pm
Perhaps because it's the Islamic Republic? I think all the Muslim countries that can't get their crap together look up to Iran. If it wasn't for the Ayatollah, which we put in power, they would be a democracy. They have a decent economy, and they're generally a well rounded country. Not to mention, Iran has some serious nationalists...the anti-Western kind.
I guess I can see why that would cause a problem. Israel is a mini, Jewish run America. That's like their two least favorite things in one.
Seriously, I can't wrap my mind around anyone who thinks war would solve anything. I think Israel and Iran and the United States are all to blame for this stuff...
Anyway, Hezbollah does have headquarters in Pakistan, which actually has nukes, why don't we make a big deal out of that?
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:54 pm
Because Pakistan is our ally, and they have nukes. Nuclear powers do NOT wage direct war against nuclear powers.
By the way, America put the former Shah in power, not the Ayatollah. He came to power in a revolution against the Shah.
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 3:56 pm
Speaking as a civilian, I don't really have anything useful to say about the military technology.
Speaking from the standpoint of a comparative government student, Iran is very different from Iraq Though none of that really matters since we're changing any system of government/regime they had before. (Though I will not state my views on if that's a good/bad things. Haven't quite decided yet since I'm not really sure what we're doing)
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darkphoenix1247 Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:03 pm
kingpinsqeezels Seriously, I can't wrap my mind around anyone who thinks war would solve anything. I think Israel and Iran and the United States are all to blame for this stuff...  How's that for a foreign policy. I would actually blame the Brits for this one. After the fall of the Ottoman Empire, in which most middle eastern countries lived with one flag and one goverment, and Persians and Arabs and Jews lived amongst one another in peace and happiness until the Ottoman Empire lost WWI... Then Britian got the briliant idea of drawing lines on the map and making separate countries for everyone, giving the Arab people something to fight amongst themselves about. In 1947, Britian decided to draw lines all over Palestine and rename areas Israel and Palestine. Which made the Arabs in Palestine go... "The ********?!" and then the Arabs decided to go after Israel, and Israel showed exactally what happens when do such things. And by that I mean, defeat 3 countries in less than a week. So I hate to say it... but the only way there is going to be peace in the middle east, is to have one big country take over all the other countries and rule with the iron fist of Sharia Law. Honestly, you can't give Democracy to the Middle East. It's been proven in Iraq and Palestine that giving people Democracy gives you the chance to have the people vote in the people you don't want running the country, and then they will start killing eachother with their new found freedoms.
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:10 pm
darkphoenix1247 Speaking as a civilian, I don't really have anything useful to say about the military technology. Speaking from the standpoint of a comparative government student, Iran is very different from Iraq Though none of that really matters since we're changing any system of government/regime they had before. (Though I will not state my views on if that's a good/bad things. Haven't quite decided yet since I'm not really sure what we're doing) Other than, Computers, Jet Engines, Scuba Gear and GPS systems... what has the Military given us? Yes Iran is different. The people, the culture, the ethnicity everything is very different from Iraq. The reason that Iran when Theocratic was because America helped bring a puppet regime to Iran to help, "even things out," and to have a friend over there who would be on our side incase Israel got blown off the map. Then Iran had a revolution, the Shah of Iran left the country and the Ayatollah Khomeni took over. Then the Ayatollah said something, as de facto Pope of Arabs. "If you die trying to kill and American or an Israeli or anyone else trying to force their western ways upon us... You will be put in Heaven with 72 Virgins." And Iran has been messing with us ever since.
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:28 pm
Ayatollah, Shah, whatev. It's obviously what Iranians want, so I think that means we can leave them alone.
And I wasn't necessarily saying that we should start a war with Pakistan, I was merely pointing out that we pick and choose who we bully. Pakistan is a really messed up country right now, what could we gain from that? The answer is: we can't gain from that, so we ignore it.
I can't talk about this without wanting to commit assault, but I haven't done it yet, so I think we're good. whee
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 4:43 pm
kingpinsqeezels Ayatollah, Shah, whatev. It's obviously what Iranians want, so I think that means we can leave them alone. And I wasn't necessarily saying that we should start a war with Pakistan, I was merely pointing out that we pick and choose who we bully. Pakistan is a really messed up country right now, what could we gain from that? The answer is: we can't gain from that, so we ignore it. I can't talk about this without wanting to commit assault, but I haven't done it yet, so I think we're good. whee The problem with Pakistan is not us, but India. India and Pakistan have about as good Foreign relations as North and South Korea have with each other. There's a reason India has Nuclear Weapons and a standing army of 11 Million. Anyrate, Pakistan is not the problem. And if we leave Iran alone to their own devices, they will eventually provoke Israel or the United States again. Then the UN gets involved and writes a harsh letter of condemnation And... life goes on.
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darkphoenix1247 Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:09 pm
LordNeuf Other than, Computers, Jet Engines, Scuba Gear and GPS systems... what has the Military given us? Definitely not saying the military hasn't been useful at times, but I just don't have anything useful or innovative to say about it. blaugh
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 7:03 pm
LordNeuf The problem with Pakistan is not us, but India. India and Pakistan have about as good Foreign relations as North and South Korea have with each other. There's a reason India has Nuclear Weapons and a standing army of 11 Million. Anyrate, Pakistan is not the problem. And if we leave Iran alone to their own devices, they will eventually provoke Israel or the United States again. Then the UN gets involved and writes a harsh letter of condemnation And... life goes on. Please, the UN is crap. It doesn't do anything anymore, they just drive around in Jeeps and pretend they're still important. So they provoke, who cares? Just because someone taunts you doesn't mean you should punch them in the face. Especially if punching them in the face could result in killing thousands...or millions.
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Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 7:21 pm
kingpinsqeezels So they provoke, who cares? Just because someone taunts you doesn't mean you should punch them in the face. Especially if punching them in the face could result in killing thousands...or millions. The thing is... with the Arab Israeli conflict... If the arabs put their guns down and leaves Israel alone... then the Arabs are left alone. If Israel puts it's guns down and leaves the Arabs alone.... then the Arabs push Israel into the Mediterranean. That's the long and the short of it.
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