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 Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:33 pm
divineseraph I.Am divineseraph lymelady Because of course, being against killing is cruel to the born people rolleyes i mean, it's not like that life was there because of anything they did... neutral and even if they had, there it wasn';t a choice, because there would be no way to prove that it was a choice except through some sort of universal and undeniable system, like mathematical formulas... oh wait... neutral Only problem is, that's an easily disprovable "formula:" Choice does not perfectly equal sex, sex even less perfectly equals pregnancy, so choice doesn't necessarily equal pregnancy. 2 is similar to 3, only slightly different. And 3 is similar to 5, only a bit different. But just because they are similar does not mean that 2 = 3 or 3 = 5 or 2 = 5. but, they are seperate numbers completely... how about, potential pregnancy? if you agree to all of them, than it is a true statement- if sex is a choice, and sex leads to possible pregnancy, then the possible pregnancy is a choice. yes, it excludes rape, but it does include the fact that sex does not always result in pregnancy But see, if you are going to dicker about that, then how about I dicker this way: Words and situations are much more complex then numbers. It's not, "Sex somewhat equals pregnancy," it's "Sex can lead to pregnancy." Sex and pregnancy aren't the same thing at all. They are related. But I'm related to my sister. That doesn't mean I am my sister, or am anything like my sister. There are definitely certain female parts that she has that I don't. And just because someone chooses to like me doesn't mean that they would choose to like my sister. Nor should they have to. You see? It's not that your point isn't valid, in a way, but it's too weak. Too easy to argue. I'm not even Pro-Choice, but I can easily see how it would be argued against.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:36 pm
divineseraph but, they are seperate numbers completely... how about, potential pregnancy? if you agree to all of them, than it is a true statement- if sex is a choice, and sex leads to possible pregnancy, then the possible pregnancy is a choice. yes, it excludes rape, but it does include the fact that sex does not always result in pregnancy the problem is this: Sex -leads- to possible pregnancy. Sex does not -equal- possible pregnancy.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:37 pm
I.Am divineseraph I.Am divineseraph lymelady Because of course, being against killing is cruel to the born people rolleyes i mean, it's not like that life was there because of anything they did... neutral and even if they had, there it wasn';t a choice, because there would be no way to prove that it was a choice except through some sort of universal and undeniable system, like mathematical formulas... oh wait... neutral Only problem is, that's an easily disprovable "formula:" Choice does not perfectly equal sex, sex even less perfectly equals pregnancy, so choice doesn't necessarily equal pregnancy. 2 is similar to 3, only slightly different. And 3 is similar to 5, only a bit different. But just because they are similar does not mean that 2 = 3 or 3 = 5 or 2 = 5. but, they are seperate numbers completely... how about, potential pregnancy? if you agree to all of them, than it is a true statement- if sex is a choice, and sex leads to possible pregnancy, then the possible pregnancy is a choice. yes, it excludes rape, but it does include the fact that sex does not always result in pregnancy But see, if you are going to dicker about that, then how about I dicker this way: Words and situations are much more complex then numbers. It's not, "Sex somewhat equals pregnancy," it's "Sex can lead to pregnancy." Sex and pregnancy aren't the same thing at all. They are related. But I'm related to my sister. That doesn't mean I am my sister, or am anything like my sister. There are definitely certain female parts that she has that I don't. And just because someone chooses to like me doesn't mean that they would choose to like my sister. Nor should they have to. You see? It's not that your point isn't valid, in a way, but it's too weak. Too easy to argue. I'm not even Pro-Choice, but I can easily see how it would be argued against. well yes, but that's not what was being debated- of course you are not your sister, and sex is not pregnancy. however, having sex leads to pregancy. and sex is a choice. so, the pregnancy is a choice as well. it's not saying that making a choice is pregnancy- it is not comparing two seperate things, but linking two connected things to another. like saying that you are related to your mother, and your sister is related to your mother, thus your mother is related to both you and your sister, and that through your mother, you and your sister are related. it's not saying that they ARE eachother, but it is expressing the link between them.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:43 pm
lymelady The next time I hear, "You're pushing your views!" I'm screaming. So are they. Seriously. Forcing a human to die is pretty much forcing the viewpoint that the human doesn't deserve to be alive to the point where the life is taken away completely without any choice. Like I said...if you have an opinion and are stubborn about it, you either know you're close minded or you're in denial. razz I was going to say something.... *finally remembers* During the anniversery of RvW, I was on another forum that had a very lengthy abortion "debate". ....okay okay I admit it...it was on Sean Hannity's website. Gosh...Gaia I can almost excuse because it's populated mostly by teens. Either the pro-choice population of Hannity's forum is also mostly made up of teens or there are some really immature adults. One guy posted saying that women should take some responsibility for their sex life and not spread they're legs open so easily. Fine...not the way I would have worded it but I can't argue with personal responsibility. This one...woman...I guess...all she could do was go on this guy about how sexist he was! What about men! Men should stop spreading their seed around like wild animals! Okay but women... No you sexist man pig! Stop spreading your sexist seed! On and on it goes about men and their seed spreading. I am just shaking my head in disbelief. Okay...fine... 1.) Men...stop spreading your seed. That will effectively put an end to all vaginal intercourse, thus ending pregnancies and the need for abortion with it. You may also put a damper on the sex lives of a large group of women in the process. 2.) A guy spreading his seed in itself does not result in a pregnancy. He has to actually get his seed into the woman's v****a. So to all you that blame pregnancy on the seed spreading man pigs...why don't you help stop men from spreading their seed...and close your legs? Otherwise...it's a freaking invitation!
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:45 pm
Cyanna lymelady The next time I hear, "You're pushing your views!" I'm screaming. So are they. Seriously. Forcing a human to die is pretty much forcing the viewpoint that the human doesn't deserve to be alive to the point where the life is taken away completely without any choice. Like I said...if you have an opinion and are stubborn about it, you either know you're close minded or you're in denial. razz I was going to say something.... *finally remembers* During the anniversery of RvW, I was on another forum that had a very lengthy abortion "debate". ....okay okay I admit it...it was on Sean Hannity's website. Gosh...Gaia I can almost excuse because it's populated mostly by teens. Either the pro-choice population of Hannity's forum is also mostly made up of teens or there are some really immature adults. One guy posted saying that women should take some responsibility for their sex life and not spread they're legs open so easily. Fine...not the way I would have worded it but I can't argue with personal responsibility. This one...woman...I guess...all she could do was go on this guy about how sexist he was! What about men! Men should stop spreading their seed around like wild animals! Okay but women... No you sexist man pig! Stop spreading your sexist seed! On and on it goes about men and their seed spreading. I am just shaking my head in disbelief. Okay...fine... 1.) Men...stop spreading your seed. That will effectively put an end to all vaginal intercourse, thus ending pregnancies and the need for abortion with it. You may also put a damper on the sex lives of a large group of women in the process. 2.) A guy spreading his seed in itself does not result in a pregnancy. He has to actually get his seed into the woman's v****a. So to all you that blame pregnancy on the seed spreading man pigs...why don't you help stop men from spreading their seed...and close your legs? abstinence! 4laugh
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:45 pm
I think what divine is saying is that when you accept sex, you accept the consequences of it too.
If A=sex and B=choice, Then A=x
x can be several things. If C=pregnancy, that's one solution. If D=STDs, that's another. Let's say E=nothing.
x can be equal to C, D, and/or E. If you add B into the mix, you are accepting the outcomes C, D, and E.
Of course, it doesn't really make much sense to do this in terms of a mathematic formula. There are too many variables, and formulas can be manipulated.
Let's also not forget that people who're prochoice don't deny the possibility of pregnancy and don't have a plan for dealing with it. Their plan just happens to involve killing another human. It's perfectly fine to them, since a fetus is a parasite to them. It's not like they aren't taking responsibility for sex. They're just doing it in a way that takes another human's life. Of course, I wouldn't really call it responsible to kill someone to solve my problems, but maybe that's just me...
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:47 pm
Cyanna lymelady The next time I hear, "You're pushing your views!" I'm screaming. So are they. Seriously. Forcing a human to die is pretty much forcing the viewpoint that the human doesn't deserve to be alive to the point where the life is taken away completely without any choice. Like I said...if you have an opinion and are stubborn about it, you either know you're close minded or you're in denial. razz I was going to say something.... *finally remembers* During the anniversery of RvW, I was on another forum that had a very lengthy abortion "debate". ....okay okay I admit it...it was on Sean Hannity's website. Gosh...Gaia I can almost excuse because it's populated mostly by teens. Either the pro-choice population of Hannity's forum is also mostly made up of teens or there are some really immature adults. One guy posted saying that women should take some responsibility for their sex life and not spread they're legs open so easily. Fine...not the way I would have worded it but I can't argue with personal responsibility. This one...woman...I guess...all she could do was go on this guy about how sexist he was! What about men! Men should stop spreading their seed around like wild animals! Okay but women... No you sexist man pig! Stop spreading your sexist seed! On and on it goes about men and their seed spreading. I am just shaking my head in disbelief. Okay...fine... 1.) Men...stop spreading your seed. That will effectively put an end to all vaginal intercourse, thus ending pregnancies and the need for abortion with it. You may also put a damper on the sex lives of a large group of women in the process. 2.) A guy spreading his seed in itself does not result in a pregnancy. He has to actually get his seed into the woman's v****a. So to all you that blame pregnancy on the seed spreading man pigs...why don't you help stop men from spreading their seed...and close your legs? Otherwise...it's a freaking invitation! Cyanna, have I ever said I love you? heart
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:48 pm
lymelady I think what divine is saying is that when you accept sex, you accept the consequences of it too. If A=sex and B=choice, Then A=x x can be several things. If C=pregnancy, that's one solution. If D=STDs, that's another. Let's say E=nothing. x can be equal to C, D, and/or E. If you add B into the mix, you are accepting the outcomes C, D, and E. Of course, it doesn't really make much sense to do this in terms of a mathematic formula. There are too many variables, and formulas can be manipulated. Let's also not forget that people who're prochoice don't deny the possibility of pregnancy and don't have a plan for dealing with it. Their plan just happens to involve killing another human. It's perfectly fine to them, since a fetus is a parasite to them. It's not like they aren't taking responsibility for sex. They're just doing it in a way that takes another human's life. Of course, I wouldn't really call it responsible to kill someone to solve my problems, but maybe that's just me... well, it wasn't really debating their idea that human life is parasitic. it was debating the idea that pregnancy is not a choice (they love to use the "oops, i left my 'concieve/don't concieve' switch on again lmaobbq" cliche)
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:55 pm
divineseraph lymelady I think what divine is saying is that when you accept sex, you accept the consequences of it too. If A=sex and B=choice, Then A=x x can be several things. If C=pregnancy, that's one solution. If D=STDs, that's another. Let's say E=nothing. x can be equal to C, D, and/or E. If you add B into the mix, you are accepting the outcomes C, D, and E. Of course, it doesn't really make much sense to do this in terms of a mathematic formula. There are too many variables, and formulas can be manipulated. Let's also not forget that people who're prochoice don't deny the possibility of pregnancy and don't have a plan for dealing with it. Their plan just happens to involve killing another human. It's perfectly fine to them, since a fetus is a parasite to them. It's not like they aren't taking responsibility for sex. They're just doing it in a way that takes another human's life. Of course, I wouldn't really call it responsible to kill someone to solve my problems, but maybe that's just me... well, it wasn't really debating their idea that human life is parasitic. it was debating the idea that pregnancy is not a choice (they love to use the "oops, i left my 'concieve/don't concieve' switch on again lmaobbq" cliche) Pregnancy itself isn't a choice. Just like if I get in a car, I might get hit by another one and die. I didn't choose to get in an accident, even though I knew there was a risk. I reduced my chances by practicing save driving skills, but even then there's no accounting for everything. What I did do was choose to get into my car and therefore accepted the responsibility of accepting and dealing with whatever resulted from those choices.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:04 pm
lymelady divineseraph lymelady I think what divine is saying is that when you accept sex, you accept the consequences of it too. If A=sex and B=choice, Then A=x x can be several things. If C=pregnancy, that's one solution. If D=STDs, that's another. Let's say E=nothing. x can be equal to C, D, and/or E. If you add B into the mix, you are accepting the outcomes C, D, and E. Of course, it doesn't really make much sense to do this in terms of a mathematic formula. There are too many variables, and formulas can be manipulated. Let's also not forget that people who're prochoice don't deny the possibility of pregnancy and don't have a plan for dealing with it. Their plan just happens to involve killing another human. It's perfectly fine to them, since a fetus is a parasite to them. It's not like they aren't taking responsibility for sex. They're just doing it in a way that takes another human's life. Of course, I wouldn't really call it responsible to kill someone to solve my problems, but maybe that's just me... well, it wasn't really debating their idea that human life is parasitic. it was debating the idea that pregnancy is not a choice (they love to use the "oops, i left my 'concieve/don't concieve' switch on again lmaobbq" cliche) Pregnancy itself isn't a choice. Just like if I get in a car, I might get hit by another one and die. I didn't choose to get in an accident, even though I knew there was a risk. I reduced my chances by practicing save driving skills, but even then there's no accounting for everything. What I did do was choose to get into my car and therefore accepted the responsibility of accepting and dealing with whatever resulted from those choices. no, not the physical act. however, the things leading up to it, and thus the result, are a choice.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:13 pm
so is the act of getting into a car.
Like I said, you choose to accept the responsibilities, but you don't choose to be in that condition. You just choose to accept that you might end up there.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:26 pm
lymelady so is the act of getting into a car. Like I said, you choose to accept the responsibilities, but you don't choose to be in that condition. You just choose to accept that you might end up there. meh, that doesn't sound strong enough... it sounds too easy to deny... they would likely say that they accepted it and don't care and it's still not anything like a choice and all that crap.
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Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 9:57 pm
if anyone else is still around, goodnight. heart
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Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 2:21 pm
Hahahahahahahaha.
No.June 24th. I can wait until June 24th.
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Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 3:33 pm
Beware the Jabberwock Hahahahahahahaha.
No.June 24th. I can wait until June 24th. Agrees. December 29th of last year
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