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 Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 6:51 pm
Hey guys. I am a pretty decent Lee player with my next being Steve. (opposite sides of the spectrum, huh?) Anyways, when I'm Lee, I start out with Acid Storm, which usually works out for me pretty well. Unless I'm facing Law. Sidestepping doesn't work, because of Law's sweeps, and I usually can't even try to back away because he is too quick. And I rarely punch with Lee, unless it's to surprise them. (they know i usually don't punch.) Any suggestions?
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Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:05 am
Alixraen Hey guys. I am a pretty decent Lee player with my next being Steve. (opposite sides of the spectrum, huh?) Anyways, when I'm Lee, I start out with Acid Storm, which usually works out for me pretty well. Unless I'm facing Law. Sidestepping doesn't work, because of Law's sweeps, and I usually can't even try to back away because he is too quick. And I rarely punch with Lee, unless it's to surprise them. (they know i usually don't punch.) Any suggestions? They know you're not punching, so start punching. neutral
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Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 5:38 pm
Alixraen Hey guys. I am a pretty decent Lee player with my next being Steve. (opposite sides of the spectrum, huh?) Anyways, when I'm Lee, I start out with Acid Storm, which usually works out for me pretty well. Unless I'm facing Law. Sidestepping doesn't work, because of Law's sweeps, and I usually can't even try to back away because he is too quick. And I rarely punch with Lee, unless it's to surprise them. (they know i usually don't punch.) Any suggestions? Sounds like you're playing against terrible competition. Starting off with Acid Storm is a horrible choice because the last high can be ducked, and if you stop the string before then, you can get punished. Sidestep right vs. Law. d/b+4,4 is slow as sin and should be blocked whenever it comes out. You're also missing out by not using LEe's punches. 1,2~f,N, SS+2, 1+2, b+1:1:2, b+1:1~f,N, d/f+2, d/f+1 are all great moves. In DR, you've got 2,1,1 as well. Then again, if what you're doing is working, don't stop until they do something about it, unless you really want to get better and probably scare them off.
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Posted: Fri Apr 27, 2007 7:47 pm
Thanks guys, I really didn't know Lee had all of those moves. Now my competition is really confused becaused I changed my strategy to incorporate the punches and getting they're getting owned by them too.
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Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:44 am
I can used some help with my Marduk. I've been playing him casually for about a month or so and thinking about getting serious with him.
Watched your vids and glad to see I'm not the only one who occassionally finishes df3d12. Though people around here know to just duck after the d1 and punish the wiffed 2.
Anyrate, I just know the basic stuff. 1d2 poke. But I'm just awkward with him now. I'm just comfortable with turtling and kicking out a df3d1 to catch them coming in or a quick df1. Every now and then I use db3+4 and I mix up tackles, FC,df4 and f2 out of that stance with the rare tackle~sidestep.
I've been trying to avoid using tackle because I didn't want it to become a crutch while I was learning Marduk. Wanted to learn to win without having to rely solely on spamming tackle. But yeah, my VTS is nothing to be feared, and I can use some pointers on making it more of a force in my game. Not only just for tackling but setting up other options and the like.
I also use 21 into a throw attempt or df1 if they are duckish, or even a crouch throw if I'm feeling fancy. I also double up on the 21,21 to see if I can get them to duck so I can set up a 21,2,d1+2.
That's about the depth of my game with Marduk. I'm basically good enough to punish the average player, but I tend to find myself over my head with high end competition when I use him.
And also I can use some advice for keeping my game at its peak, seeing as I only play at the arcade 1 to 2 days a week. And my only home competition is the computer AI in Tekken 5 on my PS2. Which I pick up bad habits if I play them too much but if I don't well I get to the arcade and feel like I'm learning to play all over again sometimes.
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Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 10:21 am
Alixraen Thanks guys, I really didn't know Lee had all of those moves. Now my competition is really confused becaused I changed my strategy to incorporate the punches and getting they're getting owned by them too. When they start to fear you, that's when you know you're really doing something. Watch out, though. One of them might actually get good on you.
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Posted: Sat Apr 28, 2007 10:32 am
Lyes I can used some help with my Marduk. I've been playing him casually for about a month or so and thinking about getting serious with him. Watched your vids and glad to see I'm not the only one who occassionally finishes df3d12. Though people around here know to just duck after the d1 and punish the wiffed 2. Anyrate, I just know the basic stuff. 1d2 poke. But I'm just awkward with him now. I'm just comfortable with turtling and kicking out a df3d1 to catch them coming in or a quick df1. Every now and then I use db3+4 and I mix up tackles, FC,df4 and f2 out of that stance with the rare tackle~sidestep. I've been trying to avoid using tackle because I didn't want it to become a crutch while I was learning Marduk. Wanted to learn to win without having to rely solely on spamming tackle. But yeah, my VTS is nothing to be feared, and I can use some pointers on making it more of a force in my game. Not only just for tackling but setting up other options and the like. I also use 21 into a throw attempt or df1 if they are duckish, or even a crouch throw if I'm feeling fancy. I also double up on the 21,21 to see if I can get them to duck so I can set up a 21,2,d1+2. That's about the depth of my game with Marduk. I'm basically good enough to punish the average player, but I tend to find myself over my head with high end competition when I use him. And also I can use some advice for keeping my game at its peak, seeing as I only play at the arcade 1 to 2 days a week. And my only home competition is the computer AI in Tekken 5 on my PS2. Which I pick up bad habits if I play them too much but if I don't well I get to the arcade and feel like I'm learning to play all over again sometimes. You should fight my King then...
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Posted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:24 pm
BlueHeartShinigami: Please refrain from vague and pointless comments that don't go in with the purpose of the thread, which is essentially improving your game.
Lyes: I finish it against people I know that won't duck/sidestep the last hit. Otherwise, I just stop at d+1.
Don't forget to use a lot of d+4. I also like d/b+4 a lot since it's the closest thing to a safe low that he has. You want to bait out whiffs with VTS BD. If you see them whiff anything the second you start VTS BDing, VTS 3 into combo of choice. I prefer 1, d/f+3,1,2,vts c, d/b+4 and 1, d/f+3,1,2,vts c, SSR, D/F+4. The second one is a bit of a tech trap/mix up. If they tech roll, the sweep hits off axis and gives them the long stun. From here, you've got a huge mix-up game. Against people that know how to get out of it, I just WS+4 for the free damage. If you have trouble with VTSc's, you can use 1, d/f+3,1, d+1.
Don't be afraid to tackle... because to be quite honest, that's the only way you're winning unless you have Tissuemon-like spacing. Tackling more would make your VTS game scary because now they have to guess whether or not you're going to tackle (even then, are you gonna sidestep out of it?), D/F+4, or use one of the many mids for it.
The reason I say tackle is one of the only ways you'll win is because... well... there's no reason to duck against Marduk. He doesn't exactly have any quick mids to poke and keep on them with, but he does have big mids that lead to big damage. These are punishable though, and good turtles will always do so. You've got d+4... but that's launch punishable and isn't anything like say... Feng SS+4 or Mishima Hellsweep. D/F+4 is good, but people that play against Marduk on the regular will see it a good chunk of the time.
2,1 is one of those play it as you see its. Some guys like to crouching jab afterwards to stop pretty much anything. I also like to use 1+2 to fish for CH 1+2, f+1+2. I also like SS+1+2... a lot biggrin
Use 1+2 liberally. It's one of his fastest moves, safe, limited tracking, and gets you decent rewards on CH.
If you've got 5.0, practice your throw breaking and VTSc. Punishment on big lows also of course. Once you've got yourself a solid defense, you're a monster with anybody in Tekken. Know what to punish and with what. VTSc's will open up your offensive game, but it will really open up your juggling game since your damage will be insane, along with the wall carry.
I'll have some more videos coming up in the next couple of days. I'm still rusty as sin... but it's something smile
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Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:19 pm
Icege BlueHeartShinigami: Please refrain from vague and pointless comments that don't go in with the purpose of the thread, which is essentially improving your game. Lyes: I finish it against people I know that won't duck/sidestep the last hit. Otherwise, I just stop at d+1. Don't forget to use a lot of d+4. I also like d/b+4 a lot since it's the closest thing to a safe low that he has. You want to bait out whiffs with VTS BD. If you see them whiff anything the second you start VTS BDing, VTS 3 into combo of choice. I prefer 1, d/f+3,1,2,vts c, d/b+4 and 1, d/f+3,1,2,vts c, SSR, D/F+4. The second one is a bit of a tech trap/mix up. If they tech roll, the sweep hits off axis and gives them the long stun. From here, you've got a huge mix-up game. Against people that know how to get out of it, I just WS+4 for the free damage. If you have trouble with VTSc's, you can use 1, d/f+3,1, d+1. Don't be afraid to tackle... because to be quite honest, that's the only way you're winning unless you have Tissuemon-like spacing. Tackling more would make your VTS game scary because now they have to guess whether or not you're going to tackle (even then, are you gonna sidestep out of it?), D/F+4, or use one of the many mids for it. The reason I say tackle is one of the only ways you'll win is because... well... there's no reason to duck against Marduk. He doesn't exactly have any quick mids to poke and keep on them with, but he does have big mids that lead to big damage. These are punishable though, and good turtles will always do so. You've got d+4... but that's launch punishable and isn't anything like say... Feng SS+4 or Mishima Hellsweep. D/F+4 is good, but people that play against Marduk on the regular will see it a good chunk of the time. 2,1 is one of those play it as you see its. Some guys like to crouching jab afterwards to stop pretty much anything. I also like to use 1+2 to fish for CH 1+2, f+1+2. I also like SS+1+2... a lot biggrin Use 1+2 liberally. It's one of his fastest moves, safe, limited tracking, and gets you decent rewards on CH. If you've got 5.0, practice your throw breaking and VTSc. Punishment on big lows also of course. Once you've got yourself a solid defense, you're a monster with anybody in Tekken. Know what to punish and with what. VTSc's will open up your offensive game, but it will really open up your juggling game since your damage will be insane, along with the wall carry. I'll have some more videos coming up in the next couple of days. I'm still rusty as sin... but it's something smile My fault, Ice
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Posted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 10:12 pm
When using Lee what would you say is the most effective thing to follow a silver whip with? I normally go with a mist wolf kick and try to juggle from there. Any suggestions would be appreciated because I tend to use the silver whip a lot as a quick way to stop attacks.
Also, do you know happen to have a good way to set up for a silver cyclone?
With Hwoarang when people get in too close I normally go with home surgery, what do you follow it with though? I tend to go w/ rejection, but if you've got something better let me know. I toss that chop he's got in too since it's a knockdown and allows me to get back in the driver seat. If you've got anything good to use w/ him when people get in too close I'd like to know.
I seem to get pretty good results with the stuff I use now, but it sounds like you have a much deeper knowledge of what does the most damage and what's most effective so I'd like to know what you think.
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Posted: Tue May 01, 2007 7:01 am
Hiroshima Jackson When using Lee what would you say is the most effective thing to follow a silver whip with? I normally go with a mist wolf kick and try to juggle from there. Any suggestions would be appreciated because I tend to use the silver whip a lot as a quick way to stop attacks. Also, do you know happen to have a good way to set up for a silver cyclone? With Hwoarang when people get in too close I normally go with home surgery, what do you follow it with though? I tend to go w/ rejection, but if you've got something better let me know. I toss that chop he's got in too since it's a knockdown and allows me to get back in the driver seat. If you've got anything good to use w/ him when people get in too close I'd like to know. I seem to get pretty good results with the stuff I use now, but it sounds like you have a much deeper knowledge of what does the most damage and what's most effective so I'd like to know what you think. I'm not too familiar with the names of the moves, but I do know the notation if you could use that from now on smile As for follow-ups to f+4, it's really to your heart's content. You're left at advantage on hit (on block I don't recommend doing anything since you're at -7). b+3 is a great move, especially since b+3,3 is a natural combo that does great damage. Another f+4 is nice, d+3 works, etc etc. d+3+4 is pretty worthless imo. Most people know it hits high, and will just duck it or CH you out of it. I don't use 1,1,3,3 with Hwoarang that much against good comp. Against people that don't play Hwoarang that often and don't block the low (or duck the high for that matter), I'll go with it. I wouldn't follow up with anything to be honest since that last kick is actually launch punishable, and even on hit you're at a disadvantage (unless you stop at the low). I'd sidestep afterwards to see if I could bait out an attack for a free b+3 or d/f+2. Remember, quality of comp dictates how you'll play. If you're playing somebody that doesn't punish, then use punishable moves. If they don't block canned strings, use canned strings. Just don't use them as a crutch since good players will not get hit by them.
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Posted: Mon May 14, 2007 9:13 am
Me <- Ling player
I've always had a huge problem with a certain King player, but I didn't remember I could ask for help here.
So. King. I'm afraid to go to Aop, because King's df+1,2 knocks me out of it. I'm bad at blocking lows, so I know that's one of the biggest problems, since King gets mean combo+air throw thingies from CH lows.
I'm not sure about turtling. I'm under the impression that King has the upper hand if we both turtle a lot. King's isn't exactly a bad match up for Xiaoyu.
My problem is probably the fact I suck too much, but I'd like to hear someone's thoughts.
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Posted: Mon May 14, 2007 11:34 am
Kradvity Me <- Ling player I've always had a huge problem with a certain King player, but I didn't remember I could ask for help here. So. King. I'm afraid to go to Aop, because King's df+1,2 knocks me out of it. I'm bad at blocking lows, so I know that's one of the biggest problems, since King gets mean combo+air throw thingies from CH lows. I'm not sure about turtling. I'm under the impression that King has the upper hand if we both turtle a lot. King's isn't exactly a bad match up for Xiaoyu. My problem is probably the fact I suck too much, but I'd like to hear someone's thoughts. Big lows that you can reliably see from King are d/b+3, d/b+4, and FC,d/f+1. Those are the ones you want to see. If you block the big arm sweep (FC,d/f+1), you get nothing. However, it's low parry bait. d/b+3 is crazy punishable on block as well. iSW/GS mix-up is duuumb. So good >.< Sidestepping is your friend. Watch out for random hopkicks and make sure to punish. Learn to duck the second hit of d/f+2,1 to get free WS. Don't forget to throw.
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Posted: Tue May 15, 2007 5:37 am
Icege Big lows that you can reliably see from King are d/b+3, d/b+4, and FC,d/f+1. Those are the ones you want to see. If you block the big arm sweep (FC,d/f+1), you get nothing. However, it's low parry bait. d/b+3 is crazy punishable on block as well. iSW/GS mix-up is duuumb. So good >.< Sidestepping is your friend. Watch out for random hopkicks and make sure to punish. Learn to duck the second hit of d/f+2,1 to get free WS. Don't forget to throw. Thanks. whee Can I duck the second hit of d/f+2,1 if the first one hits? And. What kind of frame advantage do I have after a parried FC,d/f+1? I never learned the frames for low parries.
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Posted: Tue May 15, 2007 9:22 am
Kradvity Icege Big lows that you can reliably see from King are d/b+3, d/b+4, and FC,d/f+1. Those are the ones you want to see. If you block the big arm sweep (FC,d/f+1), you get nothing. However, it's low parry bait. d/b+3 is crazy punishable on block as well. iSW/GS mix-up is duuumb. So good >.< Sidestepping is your friend. Watch out for random hopkicks and make sure to punish. Learn to duck the second hit of d/f+2,1 to get free WS. Don't forget to throw. Thanks. whee Can I duck the second hit of d/f+2,1 if the first one hits? And. What kind of frame advantage do I have after a parried FC,d/f+1? I never learned the frames for low parries. Not sure. I don't think so, but I could be wrong. Definitely on block though. Low parried punches give you 16frames while low parried kicks give you 17. I believe Ling gets d/f+2~1 regardless.
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