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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 8:02 pm
To the guy who voted Pent for worst...I say WTF man!?
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 8:04 pm
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Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 9:08 pm
Well it's true.
There have been a lot of statements made in this thread I vehemently disagree with (like Naomi calling Lute a tank and best Mage/Sage - Lute's good, but she's definitely not a tank), but calling Pent the worst Mage/Sage had to the biggest one. Even if Erk does get RNG lucky and gets better stats than Pent (he's still never going to see that A Rank in Staves, but staff utility aside) Pent would still be a really solid unit.
Think about it. How many FEs have you played? I know for certain you've made comments pertaining to 6-8. So calling Pent worst means you're saying he's worse than all of the following at least: Lugh, Lilina, Hugh, Lute, Ewan, Saleh, Erk and Nino. Pent is basically a completely better version of Saleh to begin with and he's comparable with a lot of the others on that list. Hugh costs money to use, Ewan and Nino have availability issues, Lilina can have doubling issues (actually, Lilina can have issues in any stat not named Magic, Luck, or Resistance), and Lugh is a completely statistically inferior version of Erk if you're basing it on final stats, which seems to be your style, and Erk's stats are comparable to Pent's. There could be various reasons for seeing some of those units as better or more valuable than Pent, but I can't imagine there being any for Saleh at the very least.
On another issue, while Aura is really powerful (but hardly necessary), Linde comes at level 1 and with only 2 Magic and not enough Speed to double reliably (she isn't even doubling KNIGHTS upon showing up). Even if her Magic growth is 50%, it's going to take a LOT of babying to get her to a point where she's self sufficient. She has pretty decent availability and time to get good and contribute for a good while, but the fact remains that if you're using Linde, you're going to have to baby her for quite a while also.
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 10:45 am
@ Linda: Sure, she may come at low stats (I guess Est archetypes ain't your cup of tea? If not, Ellis phoned, she said inb4endgame locked to staffs. Etzel too, but I hung up because he only had a D rank in staffs), but she is NOT the worst Mage in FE biggrin S. I mean, look at Boa for the love of God, his stats are just a hair better than Linda's, but his stats are almost permanently like that, unless you're crazy, he doesn't have a special wtfhaxx weapon (that being said, I usually reclass Rena and give her the Aura as her LCK and stellar MGC growth makes Aura into a Deathstar). Oh yes, and Linda has the highest MGC growth out of everyone in the game, and Ellis too, but Ellis is mainly just another A ranked staff user.
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 1:13 pm
Best: Sety Worst: Tormod (FE9)
For the best I considered a lot of mages/sages, mainly Lute, Soren, Pent, Erk, Nino, Merric, Azel, and to some extent Levn. The reason why I choose Sety is that he can be a powerhouse in the second generation. Yes he does come in a little late but his stats usually compensates that. With that being said if you give him Holsety tome he can lay waste to a lot of units.
For worst I choose Tormod mainly because I found other mages a lot better than him.
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:04 pm
Manic Martini Well it's true. There have been a lot of statements made in this thread I vehemently disagree with (like Naomi calling Lute a tank and best Mage/Sage - Lute's good, but she's definitely not a tank), but calling Pent the worst Mage/Sage had to the biggest one. Even if Erk does get RNG lucky and gets better stats than Pent (he's still never going to see that A Rank in Staves, but staff utility aside) Pent would still be a really solid unit. Think about it. How many FEs have you played? I know for certain you've made comments pertaining to 6-8. So calling Pent worst means you're saying he's worse than all of the following at least: Lugh, Lilina, Hugh, Lute, Ewan, Saleh, Erk and Nino. Pent is basically a completely better version of Saleh to begin with and he's comparable with a lot of the others on that list. Hugh costs money to use, Ewan and Nino have availability issues, Lilina can have doubling issues (actually, Lilina can have issues in any stat not named Magic, Luck, or Resistance), and Lugh is a completely statistically inferior version of Erk if you're basing it on final stats, which seems to be your style, and Erk's stats are comparable to Pent's. There could be various reasons for seeing some of those units as better or more valuable than Pent, but I can't imagine there being any for Saleh at the very least. On another issue, while Aura is really powerful (but hardly necessary), Linde comes at level 1 and with only 2 Magic and not enough Speed to double reliably (she isn't even doubling KNIGHTS upon showing up). Even if her Magic growth is 50%, it's going to take a LOT of babying to get her to a point where she's self sufficient. She has pretty decent availability and time to get good and contribute for a good while, but the fact remains that if you're using Linde, you're going to have to baby her for quite a while also. To be honest, I didn't really remember some of the mages. However, my displeasure with Pent came back first. I like Lugh, he's an amazing Sage and available early. Lilina can grow to be a powerful Sage too. I never use Hugh (though I do buy him), but I assume he's not terrible. Ewan comes out decent (but not worth the trouble that went into raising him). Nino is powerful for obvious reasons if you take the incredible effort to somehow level her up at that stage in the game. I didn't even think about Saleh, but I do remember I hate the guy. And i've played 6, 7, 8, and Shadow Dragon. I started playing 4, but it was painstaking to play it on a ZSnes emulator and I hadn't expected such long campaigns and complicated unit marriage systems involved in it. I'd have to use a guide to figure out who goes with what and in the end I just flaked out (don't judge me XD)
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Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 10:51 pm
Concerning Linde: The Est archetype most certainly isn't my cup of tea, no (it's so inefficient, and real Est characters hardly have the availability to make up for the amount of effort they usually require - final stats are not everything, though plenty of people only evaluate units by their final stats). Linde has passable enough availability, however, so that I don't consider her a real Est, though. I DO use her from time to time (which is going out of my way, mind you) and she requires more than a fair amount of favoritism to catch up. You could certainly do much worse, but this is FEDS - you get a LOT of crappy characters; not being the worst is hardly saying anything if you're not among the best either. Linde's on the fence. Oh, and when Elice phoned, she said "I can use Warp Staves" so I said "SOLD."
@Demonhornz: (I don't judge you xD). DS alone has a lot worse than Pent, too. And I particularly like Lugh, too. He looks like a banana before promoting xD.
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Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 1:35 pm
Well the results are in and the new topic is up. Best/Worst Fighter/Warrior. I'm doing this earlier than normal because I have to do some things.
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Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 1:42 pm
Best: Boyd
Worst: Dorcas. He always turns out badly for me. All the other fighters I have used have had decent stats where Dorcas...was screwed.
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Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 1:50 pm
Best: Ross (obviously when taking the fighter/warrior path) - I like him because you can level him up early in the game and get him to be a fighter at an acceptable rate. Once he's trained up, he far surpasses his father. I liked Ross better than Gonzales, but Gonzales is strong too.
Worst: Lot. I hate him...though his defense is okay when levelled, I suppose.
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Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 2:12 pm
Best- Ross. Ross is the best you can get in FE 8. He does surpress his father.
Worst- Um....Uh.... Lets see. Nolan. You get him to late in the game.
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Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 2:25 pm
I'll do things different and go Worst Best mainly because the Best is obvious (not Maji) and I had to think hard for the Worst.
Ugh, this one is haaaaard, you all know my apparent axeman fetish, and I put a lot of thought into this one, I even thought about putting an FE1 Saji who has absolutely no Spd growths whatsoever and doesn't promote, I was going to put Dagda, but he has his early game uses (ie: capturing, weakening the hilariously powerful first two bosses without Evayle Fire Sword ORKO'ng, etc) I've decided to go with Johalva.
Worst: Johalva (FE4)- This guy may get the honour to say he's the only Axe Fighter in the entire game (1st and 2nd gen), but he is completely unnecessary especially when his brother is a mounted unit and all your guys are already foot soldiers. Also, axe users in general are outclassed by a promoted Leaf if you really want to use axes and save some much needed EXP for your other guys.
For best, Barts was up there because he's the only Axe Fighter in FE1/3 who can hurt things in a reasonable time frame so he got the merit (IMO) of being the only Axe Fighter who can do things without favouring (although a favoured Maji is always good~), Leaf and Lachesis were up there, but most people are happy giving them swords, Lex is top tier too mainly because Elite and his Brave Axe, and ranking second place would be Havan with his PCC of 4, higher growths than Othlin, Ambush + Brave Axe and being able to use swords upon promotion, but Othlin is still better IMO.
Best: Othlin (FE5)- Anyone who played this game (again, it's my favourite in the series) will know this guy (you know, the guy who makes FE5 tenfold easier?) He comes in the first chapter, has the Deathstar of Wrath, gets his own death weapon (Pugi), is the Maji archetype, a respectable PCC of 3 and for the icing on the cake, when he promotes, he gets to use swords to balance out/kill the weapon triangle more than it already is in FE5.
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Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 3:08 pm
Best: Boyd (FE9)
Worst: Dorcas
I will admit that I'm not one for fighters. Though I did use Boyd a lot in FE9 mainly because became really great really fast for me. I liked using him in battle and he does get to have the triangle attack as well and I think he does cause the most damage among the three ( I could be mistaken).
Dorcas, I really didn't like him because he really wasn't that accurate with me. =/
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Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 3:40 pm
Water Faerie Naomi Worst- Um....Uh.... Lets see. Nolan. You get him too late in the game. Um, have you even played FE10 (that sort of statement makes me wonder)? Nolan comes in Chapter 1 and has basically perfect availability for a Dawn Brigade unit after that point. How is that late? Best: Nolan. It’s really close between him and Othin, but Nolan is more valuable in RD than Othin is in Thracia 776. Consider: Nolan has basically perfect durability thanks to Earth support and all of Part 1 to develop it with either Volug or Zihark, which guarantees the Dawn Brigade’s survival in Part 3. And upon promotion to Warrior, Crossbows allow him to rape anything that flies, and combined with Beastfoe let him rape any Laguz he comes across in those Part 3 chapters with no effort whatsoever (this also makes him a really good choice, even without Beastfoe, for Tibarn’s army and the Izuka chapter which is where all the easy experience is at). He also gets his own personal axe which lets you take more than one axe user to endgame should you desire to. So he basically becomes untouchable until the final, final chapter (because Ashera has an insane hit rate) thanks to Earth affinity, has excellent offense, a personal weapon, and as good availability as is possible for being in the Dawn Brigade. Micaiah’s team would be so much worse off without him. Othin has the fabulous Pugi Axe, Wrath, and 3PCC, so he has instant incredible offense from the beginning of the game onwards, but he doesn’t become easily invincible like Nolan does, and he isn’t as necessary or valuable as Nolan to the game he’s in. I suppose Othin has access to scrolls, but Nolan has access to bexp – and bexp>scrolls. Perfect defense+great offense>Perfect offense+pretty great defense. There are other good options out there as well (FE9 Boyd, Lott, Barst, etc...), but Othin and Nolan are better by a significant margin. Worst: Quite a few candidates, but I think Marty takes the cake. His class is technically called “Mountain Thief” (fancy word for what’s basically a Brigand), but it’s mono-axes and he promotes to Warrior rather than Berserker, so he’s just as close to the category as Othin is (who promotes not to Warrior but basically to what’s Hero in the game). Starts with 0 Skl and Spd, and growths of 10% and 15% respectively, and is locked to the least accurate weapon type. Not promising. He comes with a rather impressive Str of 9, but his growth in that category is only 15%, so isn’t going to remain attractive for too long. The guy has really high amounts of HP and Bld (Bld should cap in just 7 levels), so it looks as though his purpose is to capture things, but with such horrendous Hit, how the hell is he supposed to hit anything to capture? Not to mention he has practically no shot in Hell of doubling, so he basically has to be set up for unless he one-shots (not likely unless he’s Hammering an Armor) so he can just attempt to capture something. Dagda captures better early on, and Havan and many others do better later on (or you could always use a mount). And since he’s going to cap Bld so fast, he can’t be transported by other units or mounts, which quite severely limits his transportation options for some chapters. Trash =/. Ward, Dorcas, and Bord are all quite bad, too, but I’ve ranted enough on Marty that I’m not in the mood to discuss them in depth. @Lolwut: Liked your choices but pretty sure Leaf/Lachesis/Lex don’t count towards this category anyway- it’s best Fighter/Warrior, not best axe user.
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Posted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 3:52 pm
Concerning FE4 Axe users- I was just pointing out that Johalva is completely unnecessary when you have better units like Leaf to fill his shoes. And gen 1.. there isn't any full blood Axe Fighters, so I had to resort of referencing the God yes people of Lex and Lachesis. And for Marty: promote him. wink and I honestly think he's probably one of the best candidates for the Odo and Sety scrolls, he near caps everything else. Then again, I'm so obsessed with axe users, I'll do anything to make them usable, even giving the Sety scroll to Marty.
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