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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 12:19 pm
http://www.mothersagainstcirc.org/fleiss.htmlIf ever you have a son, the link above could be one of the most important things you can read. " Parents should enjoy the arrival of a new child with as few worries as possible. The birth of a son in the US, however, is often fraught with anxiety and confusion. Most parents are pressured to hand their baby sons over to a stranger, who, behind closed doors, straps babies down and cuts their foreskins off. The billion-dollar-a-year circumcision industry has bombarded Americans with confusing rhetoric and calculated scare tactics. ""Routine circumcision of babies in the United States did not begin until the Cold War era. Circumcision is almost unheard of in Europe, Southern America, and non-Muslim Asia. In fact, only 10 to 15 percent of men throughout the world are circumcised." "The natural p***s requires no special care. A child's foreskin, like his eyelids, is self-cleansing. Forcibly retracting a baby's foreskin can lead to irritation and infection. The best way to care for a child's intact p***s is to leave it alone." "Circumcision started in America during the masturbation hysteria of the Victorian Era, when a few American doctors circumcised boys to punish them for masturbating. Victorian doctors knew very well that circumcision denudes, desensitizes, and disables the p***s. Nevertheless, they were soon claiming that circumcision cured epilepsy, convulsions, paralysis, elephantiasis, tuberculosis, eczema, bed-wetting, hip-joint disease, fecal incontinence, rectal prolapse, wet dreams, hernia, headaches, nervousness, hysteria, poor eyesight, idiocy, mental retardation, and insanity. In fact, no procedure in the history of medicine has been claimed to cure and prevent more diseases than circumcision. As late as the 1970s, leading American medical textbooks still advocated routine circumcision as a way to prevent masturbation.5 The antisexual motivations behind an operation that entails cutting off part of the p***s are obvious. " "Circumcision denudes: Depending on the amount of skin cut off, circumcision robs a male of as much as 80 percent or more of his penile skin. Depending on the foreskin's length, cutting it off makes the p***s as much as 25 percent or more shorter. Careful anatomical investigations have shown that circumcision cuts off more than 3 feet of veins, arteries, and capillaries, 240 feet of nerves, and more than 20,000 nerve endings.31 The foreskin's muscles, glands, mucous membrane, and epithelial tissue are destroyed, as well."
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 12:23 pm
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 2:57 pm
I don't know...I prefer cut guys because they last longer and they can wear condoms.
I had a boyfriend who said that he physically could not wear a condom because of his foreskin. After trying to get the condom thing to work, I realised he was either right or able to make himself soft at the thought of wearing a condom. My cut boyfriend, however (he's only partially circumsized) can wear condoms fine.
I've also talked to other "uncut" people who have told me that they cannot physically wear condoms because the foreskin rubs against the p***s in a natural way that the condom inhibits....I'm not sure if this is completely true, but I thought it interesting to point out.
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 8:33 pm
Interesting... I honestly can't express much on this topic because the only experience I've ever had is with my fiance who is cut. I can tell where the scar is but other then that I don't know much about it. If I have a boy I probably won't circumcise because I don't see any benefit to it but I haven't done much research either.
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 9:30 pm
It's all BS scare tactics on both sides.
I know at least three males that as far as I know have had no problems being circumsized (husband, father, brother - though thinking about those last two's sex lives makes me kinda creeped out). And I know plenty of European friends who haven't so much as had a UTI in their lives and they are uncirc'ed
Here's the thing. It's likely this next baby is a boy. My husband and I have decided to not circumsize any son for simple reasons. 1. Neither side is compelling enough and 2. being agnostic my husband strongly feels the only compelling reason is religious and therefore not for us.
Seriously the bruhaha around baby boys' foreskin is akin to the people that will tell you formula will without a doubt make your baby stupid and fat and possibly kill them because it is POISON.
I've done serious study on the SCIENTIFIC studies about circumcision. YES an uncircumsized male is more prone to UTIs. HOWEVER 1 in four adults of ANY gender and phsyical intactness has a UTI and doesn't even know it. Pregnant women get UTIs like it's the plague and there is no cure. So, to me that's not convincing enough. BUT neither is the arguement that they are "SCARRED FOR LIFE" because simply it's just not true. My newborn nephew barely turned an eyelash when he was circumsized and is just as bubbly and happy and active as he was before the surgery.
Basically circ'ed or uncirc'ed there are millions of men on both sides that are perfectly happy and healthy and since it doesn't seem to matter scientifically either way...I'm just opting not to have to pay for the surgery.
I know that seems like a shallow decision but it's much more reasonable than: "OMG THE BABY BOY FORESKIN IT IS DAS ENDANGERD!!" which reading their material is exactly the fanatical craziness that Nocirc gives off. Which isn't any better than circ advocates who are like "THE FORESKIN IT IS EVIL AND DIRTY! THE p***s WILL ROT OFF!" riiiiiiggggghhhhttt...to both of them.
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 9:36 pm
3nodding Well said Nopenname
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 10:11 pm
I've never seen a cut p***s, except in porn. My ex was uncut, and he could wear condoms with very little problems. I wouldn't know with my current bf though, who is also uncut, because I've been on Depo the whole time since we started dating, and so I've never used a condom with him. xd
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Posted: Tue Jun 21, 2005 10:50 pm
I agree, Nopename. 3nodding I posted this because it's something I hadn't thought about it for more then a second before clicking that link, and I'm probably not the only one. I wanted to share it, and I like having the imput from all of you ^.^
Personally I've only been with one man, I intend to marry him but we have no finaces to do such a thing at this time. He has been cut, I can see his scar, but he doesn't seem to care in the slightest, and personally I like the look of a cut p***s better then uncut. However after all the information I keep happening on that has to do with collective decisions to mutilate children's genetiles when they're in infancy or hardly older, I want more people to know that it's going on and that it is worth thinking about as an issue.
As I said, I hadn't thought for a moment about it before, but after reading it, I've decided I will not let anyone circumsize any son I may have. If he wishes he had been when he's older, he can get it removed, but if he had it done as a baby he can't just grow it back. I will not pysically alter the body of my child lest it be to save his life, it will be his decision and no one else's, because it's his body and no one else's. All of this being if I ever have a son.
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Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 3:13 pm
A lot of parents have their infants circumsized because they SAY it's easier to clean, keep clean and take care of. This I wouldn't know for sure.
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Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:41 am
"Circumcision started in America during the masturbation hysteria of the Victorian Era, when a few American doctors circumcised boys to punish them for masturbating."
SICK!!!!!!!!
IF IT WRRE NOT FOR JERKING OFF I WOULD GO BACK TO SELF-HARM
HOW CAN SOME ONE BE PUNISHED FOR GETTING PLEASURE OUT OF THEIR BODY?
I AM NOT "CUT" AS YOU AL CALL IT AND I CAN USE MINE FINE I HAVE NO PROBLEM WEARING CONDOMS (WELLACTUALLY SOME ARE TOO SMALL FOR ME mrgreen BUT NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SKIN ITSELF)
ALSO I HAVE NO PROBLEM KEEPING MYSELF CLEAN I THINK CUTTING IT OFF IS NOT ONLY POINTLESS BUT STUPID WHAT IF THEY MESS UP? SLIP WITH THE KNIFE eek
IF IT WAS REALLY THAT BIG A PROBLEM THEN WE WOULD OF EVOLVED ROUND IT AND IF WE DID NOT EVLOVE WE WOULD OF DIED OUT AS A RACE AND BECAUSE WE ARE ALL STILL HERE I KNOW FOR A FACT THAT THERE IS NO PROBLEM WHAT SO EVER WITH IT
I DOUBT THEY HAD THEM CUT BACK IN THE DAYS OF CAVES AND A BBQ EVERY NIGHT SO WHY SHOULD WE HAVE THEM NOW?
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Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 10:14 am
There HAVE been a number of botched circumcisions where the p***s was cut off and the male was anatomically changed to a female. This is what has led to the large number of trans-gender studies that have been documented throughout the US.
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Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 1:49 pm
I've seen two penises and they were both uncut. I can't really say whether or not I have a preference, since I'm still a virgin, but my boyfriend doesn't want one because he says it'd lose a lot of the feeling and he doesn't want that.
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Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 7:28 pm
Yeah, but a cut p***s is cuter.
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Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 10:06 pm
My boyfriend's cut (he's a Jew!). I've never seen an uncut one, at least not up close and personal. From what I have seen (the pictures on that site), er.. ew. I don't get it. gonk I suppose it's all in what you're used to, though. I've never heard any complaints from my boyfriend, though, and I have no complaints, so it's all fine and dandy.
I agree with Nopenname as well.
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Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 11:13 am
INTERWIZZ9000 WHAT IF THEY MESS UP? SLIP WITH THE KNIFE eek Happens all the time, to diffrent levels of extremity. My boyfriend has a scar, as many circumcised men do. And it's true, as Oni pointed out, it was quite common for doctors to mess up, and then in a disgusting and pathetic attemt to fix their mistake, they'd simply do more damage, and attemt to change the child's gender to make it more socially acceptable. This happens not only with botched circumcisions, but when a child is born with slightly deformed genitles. It angers me, I've seen programs of adults reitterating their life experiences. Surgery after surgery, emotional confusion, being forced to take hormone pills to try to force their bodies to conform to what the doctors say it should be. Alot of them have no sexual pleasure as the ones with Clitoris' had them cut off. There are no words to discribe how dispicable I consider such proceedures.
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