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I don't see Lucifer has a evil entity or the devil(Satan or samael), i think he is actually good.

The only biblical passage written about him is actually referring to a King of Babolynia, some tranlater thought to call him Lucifer, which is technally correct, as Lucifer is latin for Light bearer and is a poetic roman name for the morning star which is the planet venus. The passage was symbolically refrencing that, unfortunaley the Hebrews had no contact with any persons speaking Latin at the time... so it's also false. ever since then some Christians thought it was referring to this and that and made up all the rest of the mythology about Lucifer. rolleyes It's also refrencing babolnion gods.

if I were you I'd be more worried about real (mesopatamian)demons like Lilith and her spawn. Who actually has ancient orgins, that predates her passage in the bible.(In the same book as "Lucifer"'s I might add. rofl )

True.

Occasionally, a demon walks through my turf and tries to play around with me. While I'm rather uneducated in the way of excorcisms, I instead send a "beacon" to heaven with the message "I got one". Then I just subdue it if I can and let the angelic paddywagon pick him up.

Um, Lucifer was Satan's name before he fell. His name was stricken from the Heavenly Book because of his sins, along with the other 200 angels who followed him. 'Morningstar' is Satan's Heavenly title (Isaiah 14:12 is using a metaphor (poetic terms were never my forte...) to compare the king to Lucifer, who thought to rule Heaven and fell because of it); He gained the name 'Satan'- 'Adversary' in Hebrew- (or Samael) only after he fell. God doesn't let Fallen keep their Heavenly names, it'd ruin what Heaven stands for to let all the cretins of Hell back in whenever they please.

And, no, Morningstar isn't bad- he's a big sweetie, really (also why I tend to call him Morningstar rather than 'Satan'). He's just a little lost and confused, in my POV (used to be an angel. Gotta count for something, right?). That's what makes him so damned dangerous, especially in my case...
The other thing about him is he's full of lust for revenge and pride; he hates that he can still remember Heaven and that he got stuck in Hell until he learns to stop being bitter. But again, prideful as he is, he won't admit defeat- especially not to his fellow Fallen. Repenting would mean admitting he made a mistake, which is insane to him as he believes he's perfect. Think Paradise Lost, but with less flair and more arrogance and power.

That's why I thought it was him... The absolute smugness of the man (I can't See, but I knew he was male right away). And he was able to say a Holy Prayer flawlessly and without wincing- I don't think non-Fallen demons can do that...

Interesting to see two takes similar to my own like this.



Actually...it wasn't Latin in Isaiah, it was in Hebrew. Here is where we get into the fun and tricky area of translation! Early translations from Hebrew into Latin, and eventually the Latin from Latin translation of Jerome (the Septuagint into what is commonly known as the 'Vulgate Bible') are where things get sticky. The word used in Hebrew that has been translated as "Lucifer", Heylel from Halal, has no concrete meaning. Here's the breakdown of it's usage in the Old Testament:

117 times = Praise
14 times = Glory
10 times = Boast
8 times = Mad
3 times = Shine(d)
3 times = Foolish
2 times = Fools
2 times = Commended
2 times = Rage
1 time = Celebrate
1 time = Give
1 time = Marriage
1 time = Renowned

So, as we can see, we're in a bit of a pickle as far as translation goes. "Lucifer" means Light-bearer, which is a close translation of what was commonly believed to mean the Morning Star, or what we now know to be Venus, in reference to the Babylonian King. "In the original Hebrew text, the fourteenth chapter of Isaiah is not about a fallen angel, but about a fallen Babylonian king, who during his lifetime had persecuted the children of Israel. It contains no mention of Satan, either by name or reference."

So, from an theological, academic standpoint, Lucifer isn't referencing an angel at all, let alone Satan (which is mainly a figure that has different connotations in the Old Testament than the New Testament). The rest is just cultural constructs, again, from a scholastic standpoint, due to time.

Of course, I don't personally subscribe to this all fully, or else I wouldn't have said that I know I've run into Lucifer before. xd

Lucifer is a poetic name for the "morning star", a close translation of the Greek eosphoros, the "dawn-bringer", which appears in the Odyssey and in Hesiod's Theogony.

A classic Roman use of "Lucifer" appears in Virgil's Georgics (III, 324-5):

Luciferi primo c** sidere frigida rura
carpamus, dum mane novum, dum gramina canent"
"Let us hasten, when first the Morning Star appears,
To the cool pastures, while the day is new, while the grass is dewy"
And similarly, in Ovid's Metamorphoses:

"Aurora, watchful in the reddening dawn, threw wide her crimson doors and rose-filled halls; the Stars took flight, in marshalled order set by Lucifer, who left his station last."
A more effusive poet, like Statius, can expand this trope into a brief but profuse allegory, though still this is a poetical personification of the Light-Bearer, not a mythology:

And now Aurora, rising from her Mygdonian resting-place, had scattered the cold shadows from the high heaven, and, shaking the dew-drops from her hair, blushed deep in the sun's pursuing beams; toward her through the clouds, rosy Lucifer turns his late fires, and with slow steed leaves an alien world, until the fiery father's orb be full replenished and he forbid his sister to usurp his rays.
—Statius, Thebaid 2.134

[edit] Origins in Isaiah
Statue of one of twelve lucifers at the Holy Trinity Column in Olomouc.In the Vulgate, an early-5th-century translation of the Bible into Latin by Jerome, Lucifer occurs in Isaiah 14:12-14 as a translation of the Greek word heosphorus ("dawn-bearer"), an epithet of Venus. The original Hebrew text of this verse was הילל בן שחר (heilel ben-schahar), meaning "Helel son of Shahar." Helel was a Babylonian / Canaanite god who was the son of another Babylonian / Canaanite god named Shahar.

Helel was the god of the morning star and his father was Shahar, god of the dawn. Some translations of Isaiah 14:12 "How art thou fallen from heaven, O day-star, son of the morning!" American Standard Version translating Hebrew Helel as "day-star" and the Hebrew word ben as "son" and the Hebrew word shahar as "morning." Others translate it as "Lucifer, son of the morning" 21st Century King James.

In Isaiah, this title is specifically used, in a prophetic vision, to reference the king of Babylon's pride and to illustrate his eventual fate by referencing mythological accounts of the planet Venus:

14:4 You will recite this parable about the king of Babylonia: How has the oppressor come to an end, the arrogance been ended?
14:10 They will all proclaim and say to you, "You also have been stricken as we were; you are compared to us.
14:11 Brought down to the nether-world were your pride and the tumult of your stringed instruments; maggots are spread out under you, and worms are your covers.
14:12 How have you fallen from the heavens, O glowing morning star; been cut down to the ground O conqueror of nations?
(Isaiah, Artscroll Tanakh)
The Jewish Encyclopedia reports that "it is obvious that the prophet in attributing to the Babylonian king boastful pride, followed by a fall, borrowed the idea from a popular legend connected with the morning star".[1]

In modern Jewish theology, Helel in Isaiah 14 is not equated with the Jewish concept of HaSatan (the adversary). Instead, the prophet is speaking of the fall of Babylon and along with it the fall of her false gods Helel and Shahar. There is satan which is a Hebrew word meaning "adversary" and in the Tanakh one will find many instances of the word used to describe human and angelic adversaries to man.

Later Jewish tradition, influenced by Babylonian mythology acquired during the Babylonian captivity, elaborated on the fall of the angels under the leadership of Samhazai ("the heaven-seizer") and Azael (Enoch, book vi.6f). Another legend, in the midrash, represents the repentant Samhazai suspended star-like between heaven and earth instead of being hurled down to Sheol.

The Helel-Lucifer (i.e. Venus) myth was later transferred to Satan, as evidenced by the 1st-century pseudepigraphical text Vita Adae et Evae (12), where the Adversary gives Adam an account of his early career,[2] and the Slavonic Book of Enoch (xxix. 4, xxxi. 4), where Satan-Sataniel (Sataniel/Satanel "The Keeper of Hell") (Samael?) is also described as a former archangel. Because he contrived "to make his throne higher than the clouds over the earth and resemble 'My power' on high", Satan-Sataniel was hurled down, with his hosts of angels, to fly in the air continually above the abyss.

Christian tradition of a literal fall from heaven drew upon the Homeric tradition, familiar to many. Homer's description of the parallel supernatural fall

"the whole day long I was carried headlong, and at sunset I fell in Lemnos, and but little life was in me"
relates the fall of Hephaestus from Olympus in the Iliad I:591ff; the fall of the Titans was similarly described by Hesiod. Through popular epitomes these traditions were drawn upon by Christian authors embellishing the fall of Lucifer.

Jerome, with the Septuagint close at hand and a general familiarity with the pagan poetic traditions, translated Heylel as Lucifer. This may also have been done as a pointed jab at a bishop named Lucifer, a contemporary of Jerome who argued to forgive those condemned of the Arian heresy. Much of Christian tradition also draws on interpretations of Revelation 12:9 ("He was thrown down, that ancient serpent"; see also 12:4 and 12:7) in equating the ancient serpent with the serpent in the Garden of Eden and the fallen star, Lucifer, with Satan. Accordingly, Tertullian (Contra Marrionem, v. 11, 17), Origen (Ezekiel Opera, iii. 356), and others, identify Lucifer with Satan.

In the fully-developed Christian interpretation, Jerome's Vulgate translation of Isaiah 14:12 has made Lucifer the name of the principal fallen angel, who must lament the loss of his original glory as the morning star. This image at last defines the character of Satan; where the Church Fathers had maintained that lucifer was not the proper name of the Devil, and that it referred rather to the state from which he had fallen; St. Jerome gave it Biblical authority when he transformed it into Satan's proper name.

It is noteworthy that the Old Testament itself does not at any point actually mention the rebellion and fall of Satan. This non-Scriptural belief assembled from interpretations of different passages, would fall under the heading Christian mythology, that is, Christian traditions that are derived from outside of church teachings and scripture. For detailed discussion of the "War in Heaven" theme, see Fallen angel.