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phi one zero

PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 12:21 pm


My training center does knife sparring at least a couple times a week, and while it's certainly a lot of fun, I somewhat question its usefulness.

We don't use real knives, for obvious reasons. Anyone who does use real knives for practice is an idiot who is likely to become a Darwin Award cantidate, but I digress. My point is, razor-sharp steel is an enormous psychological deterrent. You're never going to be as afraid of a training knife as you would be of a real one. So you're likely to be much more agressive than you would be in a real knife fight. This makes the dynamic of knife sparring much different than knife fighting, and thus not realistic.

Knife fighting as self-defense is kind of silly anyway, partly for reasons I've already mentioned. Since razor-sharp steel is such a psychological deterrent, pulling a knife on an unarmed attacker is pretty much guarunteed to get him to back off, unless he's crazy, on drugs, or just plain stupid, in which case adding a knife to the equasion is the last thing in the world you want to do. And if your attacker has a knife, run. Even if you also have a knife. The pride isn't worth the risk, period.

But knife sparring is still fun as hell, which I guess counts for something.

Any thoughts?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:11 pm


My cousin and I practice knife fighting. With our training what you can do with a knife, you can do with a stick, you can do with an empty hand. Having a firm understanding of the knife is your best bet on defending against it. Yes a real knife has a tremendous psychological effect, but the mind is altered as well as the body by intense training. Martial arts reconditions the reflexes. Good knife training will hopefully pay off if, God forbid, you are confronted by an attacker with a knife.

Marty Nozz


MrMovieLT

PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 5:09 pm


Knife sparring is great reflex training. It helps build hand eye coordination and can increase your speed a lot. I agree if someone pulls a knife get away as fast as you can. One of the drills I had people do was to have the defender in the corner or against a wall and the agressor blocking their path. This way they can work on getting out into the open giving them a chance to get away. Knife sparring is fun and can definately be benefitial but in the real world if you can get avoid it then you should.
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2005 3:01 am


Somebody posted this expression in the ABG about knife fighting that I thinks quite appropriate:
Winner Drips
Loser Gushes

DarklingGlory
Crew


Moonlight Penguin

PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2005 1:28 pm


We don't do sparring with knifes, more like self defense techniques. They really do help us out in the real world when we take a trip down the dark alley... I know for someone like me who needs it (female and young) that guys' heads turn the nasty way and try to get whatever they want however they want. This helps me think fast on my feet, if there was such a threat coming...
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 3:12 am


Sounds like a bad Japanese adult movie...

I think the idea is to, once you've somewhat mastered the actual technique, insist on your mind that it is a real knife. That might make it useful in real life combat.

Again, though. Two knives are worth more than a single sword.
But then a Beretta is worth more than a dozen kitchen knives.
Woahey. Martial Arts Valuta.

JoshuaKenzo


Threx

PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 7:22 am


I've been thinking about this, in a real knife fight, you want to be the aggressor. No, you need to be the aggressor. No if ands or buts. For every agressive move you make, its one less he can make. Putting yourself into a better possition with every passing second. If you control the positioning of both participents (you, and the other guy) you will win.

What is winning? Either a disabled opponent, and being able to get the ******** outta there. Your choice really. I vote you keep it up, and be more aggressive in your studies. The more aggressive you are now, the more you will be should such an event happen. Yes you will be more defensive, but since you where so very aggressive in training, less aggressive wont make much difference.

Edit: I do not have extensive MA background, nor have I been in a knife fight. However, supressing the enemy so they cannot act has been a war winning strategy long before I was born. I do not see why it shouldnt appy to knife fights. However, I am open for corrections.
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 8:05 am


Ah, one correction there. Agression usually takes along a certain risk of fury and loss of control.
We like to keep it called fighting spirit and the likes. It keeps the more spiritual oriented fellows happy.

I do understand what you mean, but it's not so much agression as just being confident and on top of things. If you can't break someone's concentration or focus, you can't break his bones or his mind.
Of course, focus should be a very large thing in real life combat.

JoshuaKenzo


Threx

PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 8:17 am


JoshuaKenzo
Ah, one correction there. Agression usually takes along a certain risk of fury and loss of control.
We like to keep it called fighting spirit and the likes. It keeps the more spiritual oriented fellows happy.

I do understand what you mean, but it's not so much agression as just being confident and on top of things. If you can't break someone's concentration or focus, you can't break his bones or his mind.
Of course, focus should be a very large thing in real life combat.


Well, call it what you want. I use simple terms, because im a simple person smile
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 10:39 am


I did knife sparring only once when I did Taekwondo (hope I spelled that right). Yes it was fun. I didn't know I was that good. My sparring partner never got me (we never used real knives. I don't know if anybody has. I hope not). I think it is a good reflex skill. It will help you.

jupiter4000

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phi one zero

PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 6:59 pm


I tend to agree that in most fights, it's advantageous to be the aggressor as much as possible. But I see knife fights as an exception to that rule. The reason? A well-timed defensive slash can be just as lethal as an offensive cut, and you can easily be on the receiving end of one if you're too aggressive against a competent knife fighter. Especially if he picks up on your aggression early.
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 8:05 pm


Our do jang does not do knife sparring but we do knife self-defense. I do find it useful though as long as it is taken seriously. You need to convince yourself that what is coming at you is a real knife. That's why the first thing I teach in knife defense is that when you a forced into such a situation, like being backed into a corner, is how to disarm the knife.

Amylin


MIA-BO

PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 10:42 am


we do knife sparring too but the only thing is,is that we dont use a knife...we use markers and a white t-shirt.it's fun cause after you are done you can seen where you have been marked and that is where you would have been cut.we have all kinds of fun with it too.
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 2:23 pm


MIA-BO
we do knife sparring too but the only thing is,is that we dont use a knife...we use markers and a white t-shirt.it's fun cause after you are done you can seen where you have been marked and that is where you would have been cut.we have all kinds of fun with it too.

Lol, thats actually a good Idea, just wear a white shirt, get washable markers and begin. Hmmm, who ever came up with that must be full of resources and useful tactics to train.

Dante Gabriel Mack


MIA-BO

PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 12:40 pm


Xanos Achite
MIA-BO
we do knife sparring too but the only thing is,is that we dont use a knife...we use markers and a white t-shirt.it's fun cause after you are done you can seen where you have been marked and that is where you would have been cut.we have all kinds of fun with it too.

Lol, thats actually a good Idea, just wear a white shirt, get washable markers and begin. Hmmm, who ever came up with that must be full of resources and useful tactics to train.

yeah we have more games like that too.you should try it,it's really fun.i remember when i first tried it.after i was done i was so dead.i got marked right across my neck!!after that i made up my mind that i wood just run is someone came at me with a knife...but now and days i would just take the knife from them.
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