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 Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:10 pm
Hopefully I'm doing this right.
I have found over the years that in everything I read or do, I find myself becoming more and more interested in villains. Be it from comics, to movies, to books I always find myself disinterested in the heroes story and wanting to learn more about the villain to the point where I will skip sections until the villain shows up again.
If I have anything to do with heroes I usually end up hating them when they are those people whose very being revolves around their extremely moral nature. I hate being like Superman, and Batman because they are, while cool, far too moral and heroic. Often everything they do leads to a situation being black and white and we never really explore the viewpoint of another.
It probably has something to do with my near lack of typical morals, but my love for anything revolving around death, destruction, and mayhem has led me to writing a story from the viewpoint of the villain. I'm not a good writer or anything, far from it, but figured I should.
There are about three types of villains I like
The villain whose only goal is total destruction and enjoyment, as they are villains at their purest, but have an interesting mindset a view...like Kefka.
The Revenge villain, as their stories are often far more interesting than that of the heroes, and could be used to explore consequences and choices.
And of course the villain who is not afraid to admit that all they want to do is dominate, but are not purely black and white. They have honor and moral, but typically their goal is worth standing against, but you can never call them..pure evil.
I happen to hate those villain that claim they are trying to help the world or things like that. Those villains usually come of as disingenuous and lazy, and often writers never portray them as insane enough to make us think they really think this, they are just stupid. These are pretty much your Final Fantasy villains most of the time.
So In my story I decided to [try] writing the story of a band of villains, its not like I'm going to totally ignore the heroes, I just find that most of the stories I write are based on heroes, and when someones writes from the viewpoint of villains, they normally don't try to explore anything but the pure evil view and never give us any thoughts.
I also find that most don't entertain the idea because no one likes the idea of sympathizing or liking a villain, as if it makes them terrible.
Would you read a story centered around a villain? What sort of villain do you like? Do you think it is wrong to explore the villains view? Do you actually know of any stories that do this and do it well?
Do you think that villains should simply be relegated to being that pure evil force and should never really be explore?
Are you more black and white? Or do you like the grey point?
Do you like Anti-heroes?
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Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:43 pm
I enjoy reading about villains. It provides a very different read than one centered around heroes. I especially enjoy reading about villains who retain their "villain" identities, rather than ones who become a tragic hero, like Wicked. I prefer to learn about a villain, what makes them tick, etc etc.
A really good read for that is "Soon I Shall Be Invincible" by Austin Grossman. You should pick it up!
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Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:51 pm
xinitia I enjoy reading about villains. It provides a very different read than one centered around heroes. I especially enjoy reading about villains who retain their "villain" identities, rather than ones who become a tragic hero, like Wicked. I prefer to learn about a villain, what makes them tick, etc etc. A really good read for that is "Soon I Shall Be Invincible" by Austin Grossman. You should pick it up! Yeah I think a villain who retain their identity, but those seem to be really hard to find if anything, even in comic books where you'd think it'd be easy. Ohhh I've seen that book, but I didn't really check it out, but when I get the chance I'll see if I can get my hands on it.
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Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:53 pm
asbloodrunscold xinitia I enjoy reading about villains. It provides a very different read than one centered around heroes. I especially enjoy reading about villains who retain their "villain" identities, rather than ones who become a tragic hero, like Wicked. I prefer to learn about a villain, what makes them tick, etc etc. A really good read for that is "Soon I Shall Be Invincible" by Austin Grossman. You should pick it up! Yeah I think a villain who retain their identity, but those seem to be really hard to find if anything, even in comic books where you'd think it'd be easy. Ohhh I've seen that book, but I didn't really check it out, but when I get the chance I'll see if I can get my hands on it. It's hard to sympathize with a true villain, and thus it is hard to write a book where the villain is the main character. But when it's pulled off successfully, it's such an awesome read!!!
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Posted: Sat Aug 02, 2014 11:06 pm
xinitia asbloodrunscold xinitia I enjoy reading about villains. It provides a very different read than one centered around heroes. I especially enjoy reading about villains who retain their "villain" identities, rather than ones who become a tragic hero, like Wicked. I prefer to learn about a villain, what makes them tick, etc etc. A really good read for that is "Soon I Shall Be Invincible" by Austin Grossman. You should pick it up! Yeah I think a villain who retain their identity, but those seem to be really hard to find if anything, even in comic books where you'd think it'd be easy. Ohhh I've seen that book, but I didn't really check it out, but when I get the chance I'll see if I can get my hands on it. It's hard to sympathize with a true villain, and thus it is hard to write a book where the villain is the main character. But when it's pulled off successfully, it's such an awesome read!!! I suppose it would be, but at the very least I think there would be interest. I like to believe that you can have interest, but you don't have to have sympathy, especially when it comes to villains. Do the book you recommended pull that off right? Cause that makes me want it even more.
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Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 10:55 am
asbloodrunscold xinitia asbloodrunscold xinitia I enjoy reading about villains. It provides a very different read than one centered around heroes. I especially enjoy reading about villains who retain their "villain" identities, rather than ones who become a tragic hero, like Wicked. I prefer to learn about a villain, what makes them tick, etc etc. A really good read for that is "Soon I Shall Be Invincible" by Austin Grossman. You should pick it up! Yeah I think a villain who retain their identity, but those seem to be really hard to find if anything, even in comic books where you'd think it'd be easy. Ohhh I've seen that book, but I didn't really check it out, but when I get the chance I'll see if I can get my hands on it. It's hard to sympathize with a true villain, and thus it is hard to write a book where the villain is the main character. But when it's pulled off successfully, it's such an awesome read!!! I suppose it would be, but at the very least I think there would be interest. I like to believe that you can have interest, but you don't have to have sympathy, especially when it comes to villains. Do the book you recommended pull that off right? Cause that makes me want it even more. Let's see.... I already mentioned "Soon I Shall Be Invincible." "The Black Corsair" by Emilio Salgari is a good read. It follows the adventure of the Black Corsair, a notorious pirate who has sworn vengeance against the mayor of a ocean town. "The Portrait of Dorian Gray" by Oscar Wilde is another interesting read. "Portrait" is interesting, because it shows the downfall of the main character. Oh! And "The Invisible Man" by H.G. Wells is one of my favorite books! It follows a scientist named Griffon who discovers the means to become invisible, and it leads to insanity. Hope that gets you started!
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Posted: Sun Aug 03, 2014 12:17 pm
xinitia asbloodrunscold xinitia asbloodrunscold xinitia I enjoy reading about villains. It provides a very different read than one centered around heroes. I especially enjoy reading about villains who retain their "villain" identities, rather than ones who become a tragic hero, like Wicked. I prefer to learn about a villain, what makes them tick, etc etc. A really good read for that is "Soon I Shall Be Invincible" by Austin Grossman. You should pick it up! Yeah I think a villain who retain their identity, but those seem to be really hard to find if anything, even in comic books where you'd think it'd be easy. Ohhh I've seen that book, but I didn't really check it out, but when I get the chance I'll see if I can get my hands on it. It's hard to sympathize with a true villain, and thus it is hard to write a book where the villain is the main character. But when it's pulled off successfully, it's such an awesome read!!! I suppose it would be, but at the very least I think there would be interest. I like to believe that you can have interest, but you don't have to have sympathy, especially when it comes to villains. Do the book you recommended pull that off right? Cause that makes me want it even more. Let's see.... I already mentioned "Soon I Shall Be Invincible." "The Black Corsair" by Emilio Salgari is a good read. It follows the adventure of the Black Corsair, a notorious pirate who has sworn vengeance against the mayor of a ocean town. "The Portrait of Dorian Gray" by Oscar Wilde is another interesting read. "Portrait" is interesting, because it shows the downfall of the main character. Oh! And "The Invisible Man" by H.G. Wells is one of my favorite books! It follows a scientist named Griffon who discovers the means to become invisible, and it leads to insanity. Hope that gets you started! U actually read "Portrait of Dorian Grey", its one of my favorite books. I thought about reading "The Invisible Man" but wasn't quite sure about it mostly because I'm not a huge fan of H.G. Wells' works. But there is certainly two books I need to put on my list the next time I can go pick them up. Thanks for that.
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Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 10:39 pm
Ah Villains. I think the terms have fangirls swoon. I like the portrayal of the Malfoy family in Harry Potter as villains. I'm not too overly fond of the invincible villain. When I create my villains or develop characters that are shady, I find my villains all follow that particular model. Sure they are cocky. They think that they will win and they strive to back stab and act like an actual character, but they are human. If they see themselves failing, they will want to cover it up. It will haunt them. They won't see so soulless about it. There will be freak outs and most of my villains do eventually die. I write a lot based on slavery and oppression. Odd yes, but something I'm good at writing.
See the villain can act emotionless, but no human is completely poker face. They will let their guard down and fall just like the Hero does and that's how I play it.
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Queen_EnchantedLuck Captain
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Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 11:40 pm
Oh I only find invincible villains work when they are certainly more emotional, because I find that it presents an opportunity to drive into the mind of a person who is totally self assured, and how unhinged they might become, and of course more interesting opportunities to write about their defeat. I wasn't too fond of the Draco family in Harry Potter, okay, I liked the Draco family, I despised Draco. Its a good model to follow with the villain the freaks out. I seem to have mind simply slip further into a maddened state since as they get closer and closer to failure, they start to snap , they don't try to hide it. I'm not very good with a failure playing over and over again so they tend to forget, and this is certainly one of my issues. I don't find many heroes falling though as people love good guys, so it makes it difficult to get anything from a villain in emotion.
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Posted: Tue Aug 05, 2014 11:58 pm
asbloodrunscold Oh I only find invincible villains work when they are certainly more emotional, because I find that it presents an opportunity to drive into the mind of a person who is totally self assured, and how unhinged they might become, and of course more interesting opportunities to write about their defeat. I wasn't too fond of the Draco family in Harry Potter, okay, I liked the Draco family, I despised Draco. Its a good model to follow with the villain the freaks out. I seem to have mind simply slip further into a maddened state since as they get closer and closer to failure, they start to snap , they don't try to hide it. I'm not very good with a failure playing over and over again so they tend to forget, and this is certainly one of my issues. I don't find many heroes falling though as people love good guys, so it makes it difficult to get anything from a villain in emotion.
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Queen_EnchantedLuck Captain
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 12:11 am
Queen_EnchantedLuck asbloodrunscold Oh I only find invincible villains work when they are certainly more emotional, because I find that it presents an opportunity to drive into the mind of a person who is totally self assured, and how unhinged they might become, and of course more interesting opportunities to write about their defeat. I wasn't too fond of the Draco family in Harry Potter, okay, I liked the Draco family, I despised Draco. Its a good model to follow with the villain the freaks out. I seem to have mind simply slip further into a maddened state since as they get closer and closer to failure, they start to snap , they don't try to hide it. I'm not very good with a failure playing over and over again so they tend to forget, and this is certainly one of my issues. I don't find many heroes falling though as people love good guys, so it makes it difficult to get anything from a villain in emotion. I never said Tom Felton wasn't a good actor XD Draco was just annoying, both in movies and books. I certainly see the appeal in the more human villain. I like multiple views of them when they are done well. I don't see ones with dual natures either, ones that goo from totally reasonable, to utterly nuts in moments and flip flops. The only time I have was in Warriors of Virtue! I actually chose not to see Maleficient because I thought it was trying to turn the bad guy into the good guy.
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 12:15 am
asbloodrunscold Queen_EnchantedLuck asbloodrunscold Oh I only find invincible villains work when they are certainly more emotional, because I find that it presents an opportunity to drive into the mind of a person who is totally self assured, and how unhinged they might become, and of course more interesting opportunities to write about their defeat. I wasn't too fond of the Draco family in Harry Potter, okay, I liked the Draco family, I despised Draco. Its a good model to follow with the villain the freaks out. I seem to have mind simply slip further into a maddened state since as they get closer and closer to failure, they start to snap , they don't try to hide it. I'm not very good with a failure playing over and over again so they tend to forget, and this is certainly one of my issues. I don't find many heroes falling though as people love good guys, so it makes it difficult to get anything from a villain in emotion. I never said Tom Felton wasn't a good actor XD Draco was just annoying, both in movies and books. I certainly see the appeal in the more human villain. I like multiple views of them when they are done well. I don't see ones with dual natures either, ones that goo from totally reasonable, to utterly nuts in moments and flip flops. The only time I have was in Warriors of Virtue! I actually chose not to see Maleficient because I thought it was trying to turn the bad guy into the good guy.
Maleficent was the same as Wicked in my mind and why not see things through the villains point of view. What I don't like is the constant victimizing because it almost cascades an excuse for the things they are trying to do. The Princess had nothing to do with Maleficent when she stated she wanted to kill her at a young age. That is inexcusable and she deserved her punishment which she brought on herself. No matter how she is betrayed, she choose a path to be deranged and should have a consequence.
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Queen_EnchantedLuck Captain
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:01 am
Queen_EnchantedLuck asbloodrunscold Queen_EnchantedLuck asbloodrunscold Oh I only find invincible villains work when they are certainly more emotional, because I find that it presents an opportunity to drive into the mind of a person who is totally self assured, and how unhinged they might become, and of course more interesting opportunities to write about their defeat. I wasn't too fond of the Draco family in Harry Potter, okay, I liked the Draco family, I despised Draco. Its a good model to follow with the villain the freaks out. I seem to have mind simply slip further into a maddened state since as they get closer and closer to failure, they start to snap , they don't try to hide it. I'm not very good with a failure playing over and over again so they tend to forget, and this is certainly one of my issues. I don't find many heroes falling though as people love good guys, so it makes it difficult to get anything from a villain in emotion. I never said Tom Felton wasn't a good actor XD Draco was just annoying, both in movies and books. I certainly see the appeal in the more human villain. I like multiple views of them when they are done well. I don't see ones with dual natures either, ones that goo from totally reasonable, to utterly nuts in moments and flip flops. The only time I have was in Warriors of Virtue! I actually chose not to see Maleficient because I thought it was trying to turn the bad guy into the good guy.
Maleficent was the same as Wicked in my mind and why not see things through the villains point of view. What I don't like is the constant victimizing because it almost cascades an excuse for the things they are trying to do. The Princess had nothing to do with Maleficent when she stated she wanted to kill her at a young age. That is inexcusable and she deserved her punishment which she brought on herself. No matter how she is betrayed, she choose a path to be deranged and should have a consequence. I'm actually not overly fond of Wicked, its good, but not my usual cup to tea. Everything I saw for the movie literally made it seem like she was the hero, even a tragic one and I didn't really like her position. I would have tired to kill her too if she did what she did. If she is the actual villain I'll check it out anyway, because it did look at the very least entertaining. It is sort of interesting to see how a villain believes they have been wronged, but the rationalization has to be on point pretty much otherwise its groan worthy.
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:39 am
asbloodrunscold Queen_EnchantedLuck asbloodrunscold Queen_EnchantedLuck asbloodrunscold Oh I only find invincible villains work when they are certainly more emotional, because I find that it presents an opportunity to drive into the mind of a person who is totally self assured, and how unhinged they might become, and of course more interesting opportunities to write about their defeat. I wasn't too fond of the Draco family in Harry Potter, okay, I liked the Draco family, I despised Draco. Its a good model to follow with the villain the freaks out. I seem to have mind simply slip further into a maddened state since as they get closer and closer to failure, they start to snap , they don't try to hide it. I'm not very good with a failure playing over and over again so they tend to forget, and this is certainly one of my issues. I don't find many heroes falling though as people love good guys, so it makes it difficult to get anything from a villain in emotion. I never said Tom Felton wasn't a good actor XD Draco was just annoying, both in movies and books. I certainly see the appeal in the more human villain. I like multiple views of them when they are done well. I don't see ones with dual natures either, ones that goo from totally reasonable, to utterly nuts in moments and flip flops. The only time I have was in Warriors of Virtue! I actually chose not to see Maleficient because I thought it was trying to turn the bad guy into the good guy.
Maleficent was the same as Wicked in my mind and why not see things through the villains point of view. What I don't like is the constant victimizing because it almost cascades an excuse for the things they are trying to do. The Princess had nothing to do with Maleficent when she stated she wanted to kill her at a young age. That is inexcusable and she deserved her punishment which she brought on herself. No matter how she is betrayed, she choose a path to be deranged and should have a consequence. I'm actually not overly fond of Wicked, its good, but not my usual cup to tea. Everything I saw for the movie literally made it seem like she was the hero, even a tragic one and I didn't really like her position. I would have tired to kill her too if she did what she did. If she is the actual villain I'll check it out anyway, because it did look at the very least entertaining. It is sort of interesting to see how a villain believes they have been wronged, but the rationalization has to be on point pretty much otherwise its groan worthy.
I kinda want to write a book based on a villain who thinks she's been wrong and has done a lot of hateful crimes but really she misunderstood something and caused herself and everyone a lot of pain.
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Queen_EnchantedLuck Captain
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2014 2:46 am
Queen_EnchantedLuck asbloodrunscold Queen_EnchantedLuck asbloodrunscold Queen_EnchantedLuck Ah but Tom Felton plays that villain well. And several others. lolol. But to each our own. Not so much freaks out but acts like an actual human. Some like to cover up their mistakes (some really well like Dexter), some like to betray someone effectively and keep lying even though he knows someone caught onto him (Oz in Wicked). And some are very judgmental and hold a grudge. (Maleficent). Some are even completely crazy. But I like to make them as humanly possible in their reactions and make them make mistakes. I never said Tom Felton wasn't a good actor XD Draco was just annoying, both in movies and books. I certainly see the appeal in the more human villain. I like multiple views of them when they are done well. I don't see ones with dual natures either, ones that goo from totally reasonable, to utterly nuts in moments and flip flops. The only time I have was in Warriors of Virtue! I actually chose not to see Maleficient because I thought it was trying to turn the bad guy into the good guy.
Maleficent was the same as Wicked in my mind and why not see things through the villains point of view. What I don't like is the constant victimizing because it almost cascades an excuse for the things they are trying to do. The Princess had nothing to do with Maleficent when she stated she wanted to kill her at a young age. That is inexcusable and she deserved her punishment which she brought on herself. No matter how she is betrayed, she choose a path to be deranged and should have a consequence. I'm actually not overly fond of Wicked, its good, but not my usual cup to tea. Everything I saw for the movie literally made it seem like she was the hero, even a tragic one and I didn't really like her position. I would have tired to kill her too if she did what she did. If she is the actual villain I'll check it out anyway, because it did look at the very least entertaining. It is sort of interesting to see how a villain believes they have been wronged, but the rationalization has to be on point pretty much otherwise its groan worthy.
I kinda want to write a book based on a villain who thinks she's been wrong and has done a lot of hateful crimes but really she misunderstood something and caused herself and everyone a lot of pain.That sounds interesting, though in my hands it'd totally be a comedy.
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