The NIV Bible... Not a reliable source?

[Sinlox]

Hello everyone! I'm Alexandria and I'd like to ask a question >.< Well, is there, by any chance that the NIV Bible could not really be a reliable source for readers of the Bible? The reason I ask is because my brother was watching this video where it was discussing some aspects of the New International Version bible. I had decided to eavesdrop and listen to the video. To my shock and dismay, I had heard that the NIV bible had been edited -- entire scriptures had been taken out and words had been changed. I was very saddened by this news, since this is the version of the bible which I had mainly read, throughout my life. So I did a little research and found this website:
http://www.jesus-is-lord.com/nivdelet.htm
It shows you what scriptures were taken out >.< And also, I had heard that there are words -- words, alone -- where a large amount of them were taken out, such as the words "fast" and "hell". It makes me assume that not only the NIV bible has been edited, but so has other versions, such as the American Standard Version, and the New English Translation.

I've heard that also, people, that have edited the Bible, making these mistakes and everything, have accused the bible of many things, such as contradictions and whatnot sad Perhaps, the only version I should read is the King James Version... >.<

All in all, I just wanted to inform everyone about this issue. It's the least I can do, I guess >.< Then again, I could be wrong about these missing verses, so I am prepared to be corrected, if I have been wrong, or anything. Thank you for reading!

 

[Sinlox]

gaia_angelleft gaia_angelright

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0998/0998_01.asp

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/1072/1072_01.asp

gaia_angelleft gaia_angelright

 

[Wildear19]

I too have this concern  

[real eyes realize]

***note: if a little yellow "police officer" emoticon shows up, click it; I'll be using screenshots in this post.

When a particular English translation decides to leave a verse out, it will tell you in the footnotes (and the reason for leaving the verse out is usually because they used a different manuscript). The NIV is no different. For instance, taking a look at a few of the accusations made on the first website you linked to, and actually comparing it to the NIV:

• Accusation:


Quote:
Matthew 17:21 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing? "Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting."


Let's Verify That:




KJV For Comparison:


Matthew 17:21 (KJV)

21 Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting.


Mark 9:29 (KJV)

29 And he said unto them, This kind can come forth by nothing, but by prayer and fasting.



NIV/KJV side-by-side:
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=mt+17:21;+mk+9:29&version=NIV;KJV


Verdict:

The NIV didn't "edit" anything out. It tells you, "we're using a different manuscript and it doesn't include this verse/word, but other manuscripts do".




• Accusation:


Quote:
Matthew 18:11 -- COMPLETELY removed [also deleted from the Jehovah's Witness "Bible"]. What are you NIV readers missing? "For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost."



Let's Verify That:




KJV For Comparison:


Matthew 18:11 (KJV)

11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.


Luke 19:10 (KJV)

10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.



NIV/KJV side-by-side:
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=mt+18:11;+lk+19:10&version=NIV;KJV


Verdict:

The NIV holds the same information despite relying on a different manuscript; when that manuscript varies, the NIV tells you. It didn't "edit" anything out. The manuscript literally did not have the verse in it.



• Accusation:


Quote:
Matthew 12:47 -- removed in the footnotes


question question question

...I'm not even sure what this accusation is saying.

Let's Verify What The Verse Actually Says:




KJV For Comparison:


Matthew 12:47 (KJV)

47 Then one said unto him, Behold, thy mother and thy brethren stand without, desiring to speak with thee.



NIV/KJV side-by-side:
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=mt+12:47&version=NIV;KJV

question question question I see no difference question question question

Verdict:

The NIV holds the same information despite relying on a different manuscript.





That said however, we do ourselves a favor looking into the Greek or Hebrew of a verse, instead of solely relying on an English translation—regardless of the English version you choose to read (whether KJV, NASB, ESV, NIV, etc...); sometimes the Hebrew or Greek conveys something that isn't fully expressed by the English.

For instance, the use of "elohim" which just gets translated as "gods"/god: you would have to study all the places it appears in the Hebrew to get a full grasp of what it truly means (it's a word that gets applied to not only YHWH, the Holy God of Israel, but to demons [Deuteronomy 32:17], angels [Psalm 8:5], idols we form with our own hands [Deuteronomy 4:28], and even to particular human men [Exodus 7:1]; so it gets applied to the true God... as well as to things that are not really creator god but that actually exist [whether "other beings" like angels, demons or human...or "a lifeless object" like a stone statue). The Old Testament conveys the belief in many "gods"/elohim, however there's only one Creator elohim (YHWH/Jesus/Holy Spirit) who deserves all the worship; there's no other like him.


I say all that to say this: there's no such thing as a perfect English translation. For deeper meaning, study the Greek and Hebrew (which you can do with an interlinear bible or a concordance). And whatever "claims" you hear in the future, actually go verify the accusation being made (that your bible version actually does what they're saying it does; and in this case, the claim is false [the NIV did not eliminate information; it used a different manuscript]; the website was distorting facts).

---

As for Chick's accusation, same thing:

• Accusation:

The NIV "edited out" Acts 8:37.


Let's Verify That:


NIV/KJV side-by-side:
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=ac8:37&version=NIV;KJV



Verdict:

The information is not missing if one bothers to check. The NIV holds the same information despite relying on a different manuscript.



• Accusation:

The NIV turns Jesus into a liar in John 7:8-10 because the NIV editors take out the word "yet".


Let's Verify That:


NIV/KJV side-by-side:
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+7:8-10&version=NIV;KJV


Verdict:

The information is not missing if one bothers to check. Jesus is not a liar. The NIV preserved the same information despite relying on a different manuscript. They were honest enough to tell you, "the manuscript we used actually lacked this word, but others have it".

Second of all, the overall accusation (of "adding to" or "taking away from") needs to include the KJV (going with Chick's interpretation of what it means to "add to" / "take away from"). In the very process of translation, words must be taken or added so that a sentence actually makes sense in another language grammatically. For instance, the "et" (את) in Hebrew has no translation. It's just a marker.

Quote:

Note that this word is left untranslated. Et is used to designate that the following word is the definite direct object of the verb. We translate: “The king built the great temple.”

http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Grammar/Unit_Six/Object_Pronouns/object_pronouns.html

Does it mean we're taking away a jot or tittle from God's word for not being able to translate it (and thus not being able to include it in the English)? No. (Korean is similar: it has "object marking particles" (을/를) and "subject marking particles" (이/가); such things have no translations, it just helps you know who is the object in a sentence [helps you see the word the verb is acting upon] / it clarifies the grammar of a sentence). No English translation will literally preserve every jot and tittle, because it literally doesn't have jots and tittles as part of its alphabet and grammar. And by the way, the interpretation/application we should use for "jot and tittle" is this:

Quote:

In the Greek original translated as English "jot and tittle" are found the words iota and keraia (Greek: κεραία).[2] Iota is the smallest letter of the Greek alphabet (ι). Alternatively, it may represent yodh (י), the smallest letter of the Hebrew and Aramaic alphabets. "Keraia" is a hook or serif, possibly referring to other Greek diacritics, or possibly to the hooks on Hebrew or Aramaic letters, (ב) versus (כ), or additional marks such as crowns (e.g. the Vulgate apex) found in the Torah. A keraia is also used in printing modern Greek numerals.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tittle

The claim that, "the editors of the modern translations are 'editing things out' on purpose, to be sneaky and evil and mislead people to hell" is a sensationalized rumor. It's a manuscript difference. And we're better off studying multiple translations, if not the Greek/Hebrew directly, when coming across apparent differences in word choice or appearance/disappearance of verses (though, most likely, there will be a foot note about it).  

[Garland-Green]

Thought I would share this link;

The NIV Challenge  

[musasgal]

@real eyes realize: Woah! That is my homework to read through properly. But at the same time, through the skim-reading, I have to agree.

Anyway, I have an NIV Bible. It's easy for me to read. What is really helpful is the footnotes at the bottom of the page. As real eyes pointed out in the diagrams, some of the verses has a letter beside it for either chapter or book (can't remember which). Some of the footnotes points out what different manual scripts of different means, others have what the verse is meaning.

Keep an eye out for them, since some versions are different than others.  

[Ratsah]

Take it from me, don't get caught up in the KJB vs NIV debate. It'll waste precious time that you need with the Lord. Both of them will draw you close to God. Studying through the KJB myself, I've found grammatical errors and mistranlations that the Greek corrects, both old and new manuscripts. To call one more inferior is missing the point. The grace of God abounds, and the Holy Spirit will settle out any misunderstandings. Trust in God.