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Jessie-the-Foodie

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 6:23 pm


Even if you aren't a Christian, if there was only one book, or rather, a book that's a collection of books, that I could recommend, I'd suggest looking into The Holy Bible. My favorite version is the King James, but I have several versions. Now, before you go, "Oh no, don't try to push that Christian stuff on me", I'd have to say that I'm not the first to suggest that even non-Christians give it a look (although it's definately good for Christians too).

You see, whether you believe the stories or not (which I do), the Bible is packed full of good ones, from the story of creation (which for non-believers can fit into mythology or something, I suppose), to the book of Revelations (which I suppose could be one of those apocolyptic sci-fis) it really has a lot of interesting stories. In fact, I've found bits and pieces of stories that you can find in the Bible in most, if not all of our modern stories and even video games. I can dish out examples if you'd like.

Aside from stories though, the Bible is packed full of history lessons, and if you look into it enough, you can even see where it supports scientific discoveries that occurred after the Bible was written. For example, I was watching on one of those educational channels that scientists believe that land rose out of the water by volcanic lava flowing to the surface and hardening. While I believe that the timing's off, and I don't believe that we evolved from...well, anything, I do see how it's possible by looking into the book of Genesis. There are also letters and poems written by people who existed long before the middle ages, the book of Psalms is a good example, and a book packed full of proverbs that make sense.

I do have some "favorites" in The Bible. Aside from the gospels, one of my favorite stories is the story of Joseph. I mean, what isn't appealing about a story about a young man who was sold into slavery by his brothers, and then rose to pretty close to the top, and turned around and gave his brothers the scare of their lives? Those are the kind of stories that I like to read.

Well, I like to read a lot of kinds of stories, but if your problem is getting past the thees and thous and verses and such, there are childrens' story versions that pretty much tell the same stories, with lots of pretty pictures. I grew up on those, and some of them are still my most favorite stories like...ever!

Actually, the story of Jesus Christ, my Savior and Lord makes me cry, whether I'm watching or reading it, but my point is, there are a lot of good stories, poems, and even letters and proverbs. It's like the ultimate book.
PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2010 3:42 pm


I would have to agree with you. The bible is a very good book to read. I like all the stories. I have been a christian for my whole life. I grew up christian. The only problem I have with the bible is all the contradictions inside of it.

I have a list of contradictions that I alone have found, and it truly bothers me. But the stories are still good.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2010 4:57 pm


There is a lot of deep symbolism in the bible and some of the contradictions are due to hand-copying and translation before modern technology.
PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2010 5:24 pm


That is a nice way of saying you have no clue. But that would make sense unless you think about what you are saying. So your saying that the only mistranslations are the contradictions. That seems kind of weird. Saying that there are mistranslations makes me think that the whole bible could have been mistranslated.

Maybe jesus miracles were simply mistranslations and not really miracles at all. I don't think names were hard to translate at all.
MAT 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

LUK 3:23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli.

Also the bible is supposed to be direct words from God. So symbolism isn't a viable explanation either.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2010 6:36 pm


0drizzt0
That is a nice way of saying you have no clue. But that would make sense unless you think about what you are saying. So your saying that the only mistranslations are the contradictions. That seems kind of weird. Saying that there are mistranslations makes me think that the whole bible could have been mistranslated.

Maybe jesus miracles were simply mistranslations and not really miracles at all. I don't think names were hard to translate at all.
MAT 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

LUK 3:23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli.

Also the bible is supposed to be direct words from God. So symbolism isn't a viable explanation either.
In the bible, grandfathers/great great grandfathers and so on were often called father. Genealogy is pretty vague in the Bible sometimes.
PostPosted: Sat Nov 06, 2010 8:14 pm


I've tried to read it, but I can never get very far without getting bored of the stuffy language and the repetitive story. Hell, I even got bored with the kids versions when I was a kid. It's essentially the same thing told 12,000 times over:
1. Good and Evil clash (Lucifer challenges God)
2. Good prevails (God wins)
3. Evil is punished (Lucifer and pals are banished to Hell)
4. Repeat
The only part of the bible I like is when Lucifer challenges God and the Apocalypse comes around. The reason being, it throws the base story right out in the open and says 'Look at it' instead of hiding it in the background.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 12:59 am


Translation is difficult because I believe that it was early greek (don't quote me on that) was written in all capital letters with no punctuation, no vowels, and no spaces so GODISNOWHERE could be translated as "god is now here" or "god is no where" which have two completely different meanings. Hence we have so many editions of the bible.

Old Testament stories were also around before paper so they were all passed down by word of mouth so there are a few kinks in those cause things don't pass down exactly correct through generations.

There are many things missing from the bible as well. Paul speaks of writing messages to several countries that we have no record of for example. And after copying 20 pages by hand you're bound to make a mistake somewhere.

So all in all, the bible is bound to be full of mistakes, but it is a good reference in many religions around the world.

There is a lot of symbolism in the bible. See Isaiah or Revelations for a headache of symbolism. smile
Even though it is direct word from God, Jesus did speak in parables instead of saying "Love your neighbor, your neighbor is everyone" for example.

Genealogy is vague only when it doesn't take up 10 pages smile

I agree that overall the bible does follow the continuing cycle of be on God's side or be punished (and we read and go, "you idiot! Change sides and hurry!"), but I think that many of the tales are great little stories that you remember for a long time after wards like Asop's fables (the tortoise and the hare).
(Sorry that most of that paragraph probably sounded completely sacrilegious)
PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 3:28 am


So I see that the whole "Translation is the problem" is a very popular reason for not actually looking into what the bible says. The correct answer for the contradiction mentioned above is that, back in bible times when people referred to someone, they would say "bill son of Jack".

Here's the tricky part. In bible times when you married someone, their father became your father (literally). So now you have two fathers, and can be addressed as son of both. Jacob was Josephs biological father, Heli was mary's biological father.

I'm tired of people saying "Oh, Lost in translation blah blah blah..." Every contradiction found in the bible (as far as I have read) can be explained through history or science. So I'm trying to get people to stop taking the easy way out (and giving more hope to athiests) and start reading it for real.

Also the early greeks took the alphabet from the phonecians, Changed the unused sounds and turned them into vowels. Even before that the greeks had a from called Linear B. (Linear A before that, which is yet to be decoded.) Linear B uses shapes. Punctation was unneeded.

And the only "Symbolism" is the parables, which it is easy to read what is a parable and what isn't.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 1:58 pm


Some misunderstandings about the Bible that I see here:

1. Lucifer and his angels weren't banished to Hell. They were cast to the Earth. They're walking the surface of the Earth now, and they will be destroyed. ((It's in Ezekiel somewhere. I can look it up.))

2. There are some issues with the translation, although I wouldn't exactly say that it's incorrect. Do you have a concordance? It should be able to tell you what the original words used meant for some of those words.

3. I don't think the Bible really contradicts itself. Some things might seem to contradict, but it's because of misinterpretation.

4. The Bible is not "direct words from God", not all of it anyway. It is written by men, different men. Some of them are witness accounts of what those men saw (some of which did have visions and hear God's voice and things like that), as well as poetry and letters written by men. It's inspired by the Holy Spirit, not WRITTEN by the Holy Spirit. I hope that makes sense ><;.
PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:13 pm


Regarding the banishing of Lucifer, Hell and Earth are synonymous to me for the most part, so I don't make any distinction ><

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:58 pm


I think Zerotheslayer and Kasi Karra have explained it better than I ever could. Shibu, Earth is not Heck, there is the bad here but there is also a lot of good things here.
PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 3:21 pm


Contrabass, don't tell me that. I had planned on killing myself in 12th grade, and those demons still haven't left me 2 years later. So I can say that Hell and Earth are the same, though things are looking up.

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Kasi Karra
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 7:07 pm


It's easiest to take the easy way out with "lost in translation" then to go searching for a random contradiction and then trying to prove the point smile

If the only "symbolism" is in the parables, then you're saying that there will be 7 pretty colored horses galloping around world on the last days followed by a 10 headed dragon? Along with the moon turning to blood, hearts of the children turning to the fathers, and a whore of the earth with the blood of her servants on her hands.
That's a parade I wouldn't want to miss.

There are a few religions that believe that Lucifer and his angels were cast out of heaven and did not get the privilege of receiving mortal bodies.

So until the savior comes again I can see Earth and "where Lucifer and his angels were sent Hell" being the same thing, but since Christ will come to the Earth eventually this can't be a permanent Hell.

@Shibu - if you still have demons bothering you I would suggest finding a light and extinguishing/banishing them soon
PostPosted: Sun Nov 07, 2010 7:12 pm


Kasi Karra

If the only "symbolism" is in the parables, then you're saying that there will be 7 pretty colored horses galloping around world on the last days followed by a 10 headed dragon? Along with the moon turning to blood, hearts of the children turning to the fathers, and a whore of the earth with the blood of her servants on her hands.
That's a parade I wouldn't want to miss.
Same here, I'll bring the popcorn : D

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:02 pm


I believe Hell comes from a misinterpretation of the Bible and ancient mythology. I believe it is based off of the ancient Greeks and Romans and their belief of the afterlife (example would be Hades), and I do not believe it was actually part of the first Christians' belief system. I believe that hell/hades, along with many other current "Christian" beliefs are a result of different religions (such as those which worship many gods/goddesses, which I believe are false) merging with the Christian religions, and yet refusing to let go of all of their own beliefs, and later using the scripture to try to prove that they were right, as well as misinterpretation.

For example, let's take science. I believe that science can prove God's existence, maybe even give us a better idea of how things happened (like perhaps when God told the land to rise to the surface of the water, maybe volcanoes did react and maybe the land was created by lava hardening), but I do not believe that it took millions of years, and I do not believe that man evolved from this...soup...I believe that many scientists, sure, might get some things right, but they are too focused on trying to prove their own beliefs to really see what their discoveries are really telling them.

My beliefs though, are not intended to offend anybody. In this country, here in the United States of America, I have a right to believe this way (at least for now), and you have rights to believe whatever you would like to believe.
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Bookworm's Haven (Favorite Books)

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