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II Palmtop Tiger II Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 8:55 pm
IntroductionOkay, first let me start by saying that this is going to require quite a lot of reading. I apologize for that, but I hope that at least a few of you are able to read everything in it's entirety and tell me what you like or don't like about it. Luckily for you guys, most of Kido, about half of Physical Strength, and nearly all of Reiatsu is a bunch of copy/pasting done with minor edits to numbers. You'll see what I mean by that when you get there. :3 New ListFirst things first - The Brand-Freaking-New Stat System! New ExceedYou may notice that rather than the exceed system being 12/10, it is now 15/10. This is to solve the problem of division specialties. Instead of offering both a 12/10 and 11/10, or just a 12/10 stat for each captain, those with major specialties are getting 15/10 for their primary and 13/10 for their secondary, and those with minor specialties are getting a 13/10 for their primary and a 11/10 for their secondary. This means all Lieutenants of each division will be two points lower in every area they may exceed; (13/10 & 13/10) or (14/10 & 12/10) or (12/10 & 10/10). That recreated list can be viewed here.Updated version can be found here.EditsThirdly, this overhaul is also going to cause some large edits to profiles, but I believe this is a step in the right direction to making RPCs less powerful than they sometimes are being portrayed as. For example, someone with a 10/10 in PS (say the 3rd Division Captain, hypothetically) stated their RPC could take multiple wounds to their bodies and continue fighting for a long time without succumbing to their wounds. However, that will now not be the case as a berserker status like that will only be available to the 11th Division Captain, as it rightfully should be (1st as well) at 15/10 in Endurance. Except those that can make it to 13/10 in PS... That actually brings up a good question now that I think about it. Should any Captain be able to take a 10/10 in PS and turn it into a 5 for Strength and a 15 for Endurance, simply because Captains can go over 10? If not, how about those that have PS as their primary? Should they be able to to take their 13/10 and turn it into a 11 in Strength and a 15 in Endurance? Or should only the Captain with the ability to go to 15/10 in that field be the only one allowed to go to 15/10 in either of the specialized fields? PointsFinally, the last and final change (that I can remember) is the addition of points for all ranks aside from officers. The point increase is to be directly proportional to the gap created by the 15/10 exceed. If you require my methods, look here for more information. Shinigami TechniquesI have updated the Agility System to better suit the new stat system, making it so not everyone and their sister can use Utsusemi, Senka, and Shunko. You may have lost something, so make sure you check it out! And that about does it. Questions? Comments? Concerns?
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Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 9:14 pm
This is a proposition, by the way, not me telling you guys what we're doing.
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II Palmtop Tiger II Vice Captain
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Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 9:32 pm
Okay then.
Point 1) When we apply these stat changes. Do we use the points for the main groups or the sub-divisions? If it is the former, how are we going to be allowed to break that number down into the sub-divisions? Will we place the number that was used for the main group and, if we want a higher stat in one of the sub-divisions, just take from one and add that to the other?
Point 2) I believe that only the captains allowed to specialize in that area should be able to reach the 14-15 range. I think that leniency to a max of 13 would be respectable towards the other captains. :3
That's about the only thing I saw that was confusing or troubling to me. Other than that, the system makes sense and is accepted by me.
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Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 9:58 pm
1) Ah... you don't know about the specialization, huh?You use both. In the beginning, there were six stat areas until Dante gave them specializations, stating that it was optional. Now, Sarah has made the specialization mandatory in that both descriptions must be put down on the profile no matter what, because this saves people the trouble to referring to the main list every twenty seconds if they surf profiles during fights. This also causes the member to be aware of their RPCs capabilities, and should lead to less overpowered characters.
The sub divisions go as follows; You take the main point for an area, multiply it by two, then split that product up into the subdivisions however you see fit without exceeding that product.
2) I think that only the captain that can go to 15/10 in that area, are allowed to achieve any number from 11-15 in either of the sub-divisions. I also believe that should apply to the lesser specializations as well. They are the Captain of that Division for a reason, and only they should be able to reach that plateau.
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Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 10:44 pm
1) With the 'New Exceed', I just want to clarify that Lieutenants are not allowed to exceed 10 points still, unless it is their specialization? Also, for Lieutenants again, I think in some cases it should be one instead of two points lower in some cases, since if it is (11/10) for Captains, such as the Eighth and Ninth Division in Hakuda, it will turn into (9/10), which any other Lieutenant could have. Just thought I'd say that ~
2) For the edits, I think that only the Captain with the ability to go to 15/10 in that field be the only one that is allowed to go to 15/10 in either of the specialized fields. However, I think that 11 or 12 or 13 out of 15 as a max would not be that bad for those who do not have the ability to go to 15/10 in that field.
Other than that, I basically understand everything else and I think it's fine.
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Posted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:34 pm
Well, yes. That's the only reason anyone can exceed a stat area, with the exception of Vizard masks. The points for the Lts will be dealt with tomorrow.
I agree with Anna, as I'd like to prevent there being a bunch of the same type of Shinigami running around, which, with the old system, happened a lot.
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II Palmtop Tiger II Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 5:15 am
I think the shinigami are to strong now... stare
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 6:56 am
It saddens me that you think I'd be so neglectful as to not apply the same overhaul to the Arrancar's Stats as well. neutral
Now, do you have anything useful to add, Mr. Stare-Pants?
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II Palmtop Tiger II Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 7:20 am
Ichimura Kenshin I think the shinigami are to strong now... stare How can you possibly think the Shinigami are too powerful now if you had no such problems when the 12/10 Exceed System was revealed? The prior 12/10 System and the new 15/10 System are exactly the same, because they are proportionally equivalent. Anything that was written down for 11-12/10 before the switch, now applies to 14-15/10, and a middle ground was created between that and 10/10. It's not as though 11-12/10's relative power levels remained constant and then a new power level was tacked on top of that. It is proportionally exactly, and I do mean exactly, the same thing.
If points are your problem, then I can again point out to you that it is still proportionally the same thing. Extra points were added only to allow the Shinigami to meet that 15/10 cap since they were able to meet 12/10 cap beforehand, so it stands to reason that degree of mastery would carry over to the 15/10. It is not as though we are to be seeing those points redistributed elsewhere, because they are meant to allow that mastery. If a member takes the new points they were given and decides to use them for things other than that 15/10 cap, then obviously they aren't going to have that mastery any longer.
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 10:59 am
Because the Shinigami are still RPing as though they're mightier than the Arrancar/Sephira. @_@ Idk... I just wanna see a change of pace and stuff. I'm more for unique and different ideas rather then generic ones. neutral
But, I am glad that the Arrancar stats are getting overhauled as well.
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II Palmtop Tiger II Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:11 am
Allow me to shed some light on that problem, even though I do not see this problem; all but one of the Sephira are secondary RPCs. Those have Shinigami as their primary RPCs are, on some unconcsious level, of the mindset that their Shinigami is better than their Sephira, because that's just how it is. It took a great deal of self control for me to RP Zenos and Hei on the same level for a little while, and it didn't even go all that well, because Hei is my first and favorite and I want him to be better.
I can speak for myself with Tsukiko. Yes, I do RP her better than most Sephira because of two things; I am terribly analytical about fights, and she pretty much is more powerful than a good deal of the Sephira there. Her largest drawback is her internal power and Reiryoku reserves, which are small in comparison, but other than that, she incredibly hard to beat. Still, as I showed when she was up against Ori, I noted that she could not fully beat him. Other than myself, I can't see where people are RPing the Shinigami as better than the Sephira, especially since the Shinigami lost.
Regardless, that's terribly off topic. This thread is to discuss any and all errors in the improved point system. As of right now, I'm working on rearranging the Exceed System so that each Captain gets two specialties. It's difficult to just look at it, so I had to turn it into a logic puzzle.
What changes of pace, exactly?
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:28 am
I suppose I'm wrong? xd LOL. I just get confused by numbers... they're not my forte.
I guess I want more realism - as realistic as Shinigami are >_<; I can't explain myself at the moment. But we're getting off topic, so enough of that.
Uh... I suppose the system's fine with me so far then. confused
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 11:37 am
xx__k a w a ii A N G E L 2) For the edits, I think that only the Captain with the ability to go to 15/10 in that field be the only one that is allowed to go to 15/10 in either of the specialized fields. However, I think that 11 or 12 or 13 out of 15 as a max would not be that bad for those who do not have the ability to go to 15/10 in that field.
Other than that, I basically understand everything else and I think it's fine. Like I stated earlier, we'd prefer it if there aren't a bunch of speed demons or Kidō gods running around and that's what this exceed system is supposed to accomplish. I think only those with that specialty, be it High or Low, Primary or Secondary, should be able to reach the cap stated or even exceed in that area. With the exception of Vizard because the Vizard mask adds to those fields with magic~
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 1:42 pm
I have completed my adjustments to the Stat Point System. It is viewable here in it's completed and organized form. Q/AHow come some divisions are stuck with lower points for both specialties?These divisions do not have specific specialties, thus they were given lower specialization in two fields to avoid each stat area from having two Captains with 15/10 and 13/10 in it (not necessarily the same Captain). Also, this allows that Division captain to be more well-rounded as the point increase can be put elsewhere. Why are the Lieutenant's points done differently for each Division?The first problem was that it was going to be that each Lieutenant's Specialization was two levels below their Captain no matter what. This being universal prevented Lieutenants and Captains from both being in the 14-15/10 power bracket (with the exception of Hakuda). However, in the cases in which a division does not specialize highly, the secondary specialization was already at 11/10, and two points below that is 9/10, which any Lieutenant could have, making it redundant. Looking back, it was possible for the lower divisions to specialize with 14/10 and 13/10 instead of 13/10 and 12/10, but, similar to the earlier issue, I wanted to prevent two captains occupying the 14/15 bracket, with the exception of the Captain Commander. Also, the lower Lieutenants getting one point below their captains creates a balance for the Division itself, allowing them to, shall I say, measure up to the others.
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II Palmtop Tiger II Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 2:34 pm
Ah. A question arose for me while making my profile. Hideki has Mechanical arms, ches? These add a superficial amount of strength behind his actual strength. Would it be wrong of me to boost his PS by 3 or 4 over the point amount, making his points like 57 or 58, due to this?
Just wondering before I made the change.
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