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 Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:24 pm
This is where people can debate about random stuff, however, there can only be ONE topic at a time. This is a friendly-forum, meaning no hatefulness! [Unless it's trying to get a point across... Theres a bit of a gray area]
Today's Discussion
Abortion
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Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:06 pm
I'm going to be the odd man out on a lot of these discussions I'm guessing, but that's got most everything to do with me being a Christian. As this has been deemed a safe area however, I hope I can voice my opinions without fear of changing my interactions with the people in the guild, as I really like you crazy peeps, and I would hate to lose the friends I have made here.
My stance is surprisingly [/sarcasm] , that Abortion is bad. I believe that every life is sacred and that all life has a purpose. To destroy the life of a child in utero, for any reason, in my opinion, is unacceptable. Please do not misconstrue this as many do...for I am not at all dis-compassionate to the incredibly unfortunate victims of rape, or to a child's well being in a household that cannot properly care for it. These events are unfortunate, and I would never ever wish the situation on anyone, but to destroy the life of the child is not the way to "resolve" the problem. (I will await debate points regarding this before expounding further)
Also, on the common subject of "when life begins"; Ignoring any religious aspect, I believe that the "life" of the child begins the instant the sperm hits egg to form a zygote. At that point, the genetic blueprint is there, and when left on it's natural course, that zygote will develop into a child. To me, that zygote is life. Plain and Simple.
...that's my take. I am interested to see what others believe.
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Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:35 pm
Yes, I can definitaely appreciate you view, Cobra. But my own way of looking at this issue is more likened to prevention of pain rather than prevention of life. That is to say, what I really mean, I'd rather know the unborn who are aborted were done so because of unwarrented circumstances (rape, poverty, unable to take full responisbility as needed). I'd rather the child never to have come into existance if it would only mean pain and suffering for the child. An example of which would be, a poverty-stricken family having a child and that child dieing from malnutrition.
It is too great a suffering for the child to go through. I'd rather the children of our world are not born into pain and sufferring. But if the child is aborted by a women is capable of raising it, loving it and taking complete responsibility for it, then I am not approving of abortion. Of course, in our world, with so many uncertain factors, it is nigh impossible to tell whether the suffering of the child will ever out-weigh the good.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 6:44 am
Cobra_X I'm going to be the odd man out on a lot of these discussions I'm guessing, but that's got most everything to do with me being a Christian. As this has been deemed a safe area however, I hope I can voice my opinions without fear of changing my interactions with the people in the guild, as I really like you crazy peeps, and I would hate to lose the friends I have made here.
My stance is surprisingly [/sarcasm] , that Abortion is bad. I believe that every life is sacred and that all life has a purpose. To destroy the life of a child in utero, for any reason, in my opinion, is unacceptable. Please do not misconstrue this as many do...for I am not at all dis-compassionate to the incredibly unfortunate victims of rape, or to a child's well being in a household that cannot properly care for it. These events are unfortunate, and I would never ever wish the situation on anyone, but to destroy the life of the child is not the way to "resolve" the problem. (I will await debate points regarding this before expounding further)
Also, on the common subject of "when life begins"; Ignoring any religious aspect, I believe that the "life" of the child begins the instant the sperm hits egg to form a zygote. At that point, the genetic blueprint is there, and when left on it's natural course, that zygote will develop into a child. To me, that zygote is life. Plain and Simple.
...that's my take. I am interested to see what others believe. ((I just wanted to add some information that most of you may not know)) Well if you didn't know, when a child goes up for adoption, they go into foster-care [Or something along the lines of that] That child's life is probably going to be a peice of s**t, some foster families do it only for the money. And then, besides foster-care, the children are sometimes used for brain-stem research.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 7:56 am
@Cory & Fruity : I can see your points, and yes it is unfortunate that some foster homes are in the program for the wrong reasons, but should we be punishing the children by killing them simply because our system is insufficient? That is our fault, not theirs. Do we want to shield children from as much harm as possible? Yes, absolutely... but we can't simply be aborting children because the system doesn't work. It's unfair to them, and they are voiceless to stand up for themselves.
On the flip side to your points Cory, adoption and foster homes can yield GREAT environments for children. I know many people who have been adopted, or grew up in foster care (and I am good friends with 2 people who were in fact adopted) and they have become wonderful people and have lived very happy lives.
How can we judge when someone will have a good life or a bad one? It's impossible, due to the fact that there are so many factors involved. But we can't simply be prematurely ending a baby's life simply because there may be a chance their life will not be ideal. No one knows what that child could make of themselves or what they would experience, so we have no right to play judge and executioner with their life.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:00 pm
I agree with Cobra. Everybody should have a chance to live. Yes it sucks that Foster homes suck, but does that mean we should kill the baby just because?
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A faint smile Vice Captain
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:11 pm
x-Jewlz-x I agree with Cobra. Everybody should have a chance to live. Yes it sucks that Foster homes suck, but does that mean we should kill the baby just because? Well I am not saying either way is better than the other, I am just adding in some points. On the other hand, the couple (or mom) should find someone who will adopt the child instead of just pawning them off to foster homes.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:48 pm
well it seems like I'm the first one in here, but I'm pro-choice.
I believe that what the woman does with her body is her own chocie, and the child, before it is born is infact part of ehr body. I do believe that once the baby has taken on a human shape that abortion should not be allowed but that early on it should be. Some people simply do not want children. It could be a simple accident. Others cant care for the child. Some know that they would be bad parents. I know friends that were adopted and they said they just went from shitty home to shitty home. I also know some that stayed in one good home. Other than that the foster care system is horrible. Children are rarely even taken out of it, because parents looking for adoption look for only the best traits in someone if they are adoptiong them. People are selfish and cruel and its just the nature of life. Many women fear for their figures, or fear they are not ready for a baby. I think that it should be up to the woman.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:49 pm
Constipated Emotion well it seems like I'm the first one in here, but I'm pro-choice. I believe that what the woman does with her body is her own chocie, and the child, before it is born is infact part of ehr body. I do believe that once the baby has taken on a human shape that abortion should not be allowed but that early on it should be. Some people simply do not want children. It could be a simple accident. Others cant care for the child. Some know that they would be bad parents. I know friends that were adopted and they said they just went from shitty home to shitty home. I also know some that stayed in one good home. Other than that the foster care system is horrible. Children are rarely even taken out of it, because parents looking for adoption look for only the best traits in someone if they are adoptiong them. People are selfish and cruel and its just the nature of life. Many women fear for their figures, or fear they are not ready for a baby. I think that it should be up to the woman. I mean, it is their body, they should be in control of it.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:03 pm
Aqua Fall 12 Constipated Emotion well it seems like I'm the first one in here, but I'm pro-choice. I believe that what the woman does with her body is her own chocie, and the child, before it is born is infact part of ehr body. I do believe that once the baby has taken on a human shape that abortion should not be allowed but that early on it should be. Some people simply do not want children. It could be a simple accident. Others cant care for the child. Some know that they would be bad parents. I know friends that were adopted and they said they just went from shitty home to shitty home. I also know some that stayed in one good home. Other than that the foster care system is horrible. Children are rarely even taken out of it, because parents looking for adoption look for only the best traits in someone if they are adoptiong them. People are selfish and cruel and its just the nature of life. Many women fear for their figures, or fear they are not ready for a baby. I think that it should be up to the woman. I mean, it is their body, they should be in control of it.
...a toe? ...a finger? ...a head? DNA is a blueprint. An amino acid code that dictates ever part of what you will look like, what form you will take. From conception, you have a complete genetic code, which knows from the very start what you will look like, when you grow your first toe, when you grow your first finger. DNA is a picture of what they will look like, isn't that enough of a "human form" to deem it a living entity?
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:09 pm
Where I draw the line is when the baby has a general shape of a head and arms and legs. DNA doesn't have anythign to do with it to me. iean I know that its the blueprints, but before it takes a definitive form its just a mass of rapidly reproducing cells. Once it takes a human form I think that thats when it becomes self-aware and then it isn't moral in my eyes.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 9:54 pm
I guess you and I will just disagree on this point in the end. I don't think i could explain my point of view anymore except to say that regardless of how developed the head,hand,toes are...the DNA is the same.
I would also say that the term "once it takes human form" is far too amorphous and variable a description to base a decision of Life or Death off of.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:04 pm
Yes we will dissagree. I just know first hand. [From family] How a baby can destroy a family or household if you are not prepared to ahve it. even if you give it up the parents are often left with feelings of guilt the rest of their lives. I understand what you mean. I just dont agree with it. Once it becomes self aware or concious thats when I think its immoral to kill it. Before that its just a mass of cells. But once it has a conciousness which I believe is when they take on the general shape of a human baby [Arms, Legs, Head, etc.] Then they have a soul and its practically murder. I know its an odd way to put it, but I dont know how to explain it any better.
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:08 pm
Oh I understand what you are saying just fine...I just don't agree with it, that's all. xd
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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:22 pm
I suppose we are at a standstill. XD
Next topic?
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