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What do you think about images of the Prophet Muhammad?
  There should be absolutely no images of him
  I would personally never depict him, but I don't get angry if other people do
  It depends. Tasteful ones are okay, offensive ones are not
  I think they're all fine. It's freedom of speech.
  I have no idea...
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Julri

PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 12:57 pm


Just wondering, what are your views on drawings of the Prophet Muhammad? I'm sure everyone remembers the controversy over those Danish comics which depicted Muhammad. What exactly is the ban on images of Muhammad and why is it there? Do you mind when people draw Muhammad, or does it depend on the context? For example, one of the comics in question depicted Muhammad as wearing a turban that was really a bomb, and I personally find that really disrespectful. But what about tasteful images of Muhammad?

Here are some articles I found on the subject, if you're interested: BBC & Daily Princetonian. If you'd like, you can view the original comics here and some comic responses here, but please note that some of them can be awfully offensive, so you might not want to view them.
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 7:23 pm


Julri
Just wondering, what are your views on drawings of the Prophet Muhammad? I'm sure everyone remembers the controversy over those Danish comics which depicted Muhammad. What exactly is the ban on images of Muhammad and why is it there? Do you mind when people draw Muhammad, or does it depend on the context? For example, one of the comics in question depicted Muhammad as wearing a turban that was really a bomb, and I personally find that really disrespectful. But what about tasteful images of Muhammad?

Here are some articles I found on the subject, if you're interested: BBC & Daily Princetonian. If you'd like, you can view the original comics here and some comic responses here, but please note that some of them can be awfully offensive, so you might not want to view them.


I'm a Muslim, and here to answer your question.

First of all, I personally hate those stupid Danish comics that are full of bullshit about the Prophet (S.A.W.W). Freedom of speech does not mean spouting hatred towards one's religion, nor any disrespect of it. And drawing pictures of Mohammed (S.A.W.W) is definitely a sin.

Why?

Allah, the God, dislikes images, such as paintings or sculptures. We should NEVER make a likeness of God's creation.

A hadith:
When the Prophet came to his house, his young wife Aisha had placed up a painting which depicted God's living Creation (i.e. animals or humans). Aisha had seen the Prophet's face turning red in anger, and he told her immediately to take the painting off. When his wife asked why, he said, "O Aisha! Do not depict the Creation of Allah. It is a grave sin and in the Day of Resurrection the painter/sculpture would be asked to make a soul on paper, which he would not be able to do and will be faced with a severe punishment."

It creates the likeness of His creation and we are imitating the Lord by creating things that are a likeness, such as animals and humans. It is especially discouraged and Mohammed disliked it very much.

However, on Wikipedia there ARE paintings of him of how he looked and the important scenes of Islam, which were created by ancient artists who had lived during his time. But, many people are not liking this and want the pictures to be down since there should never be a picture of Mohammed anywhere, since he discouraged having his face sculpted or painted.

Guardian of Peace


Julri

PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 7:49 pm


The Sacred Night


I'm a Muslim, and here to answer your question.

First of all, I personally hate those stupid Danish comics that are full of bullshit about the Prophet (S.A.W.W). Freedom of speech does not mean spouting hatred towards one's religion, nor any disrespect of it. And drawing pictures of Mohammed (S.A.W.W) is definitely a sin.

Why?

Allah, the God, dislikes images, such as paintings or sculptures. We should NEVER make a likeness of God's creation.

A hadith:
When the Prophet came to his house, his young wife Aisha had placed up a painting which depicted God's living Creation (i.e. animals or humans). Aisha had seen the Prophet's face turning red in anger, and he told her immediately to take the painting off. When his wife asked why, he said, "O Aisha! Do not depict the Creation of Allah. It is a grave sin and in the Day of Resurrection the painter/sculpture would be asked to make a soul on paper, which he would not be able to do and will be faced with a severe punishment."

It creates the likeness of His creation and we are imitating the Lord by creating things that are a likeness, such as animals and humans. It is especially discouraged and Mohammed disliked it very much.

However, on Wikipedia there ARE paintings of him of how he looked and the important scenes of Islam, which were created by ancient artists who had lived during his time. But, many people are not liking this and want the pictures to be down since there should never be a picture of Mohammed anywhere, since he discouraged having his face sculpted or painted.


Oh, so technically there aren't supposed to be images of any living creations? I didn't know that. Does that go for all images of humans/animals? For example, would a Gaia avatar count as a depiction of a human? (Okay, it sounds like I'm being a total smart a**, but I'm not trying to be. I really want to know.) Also, would photographs be okay? (I know there weren't any photographs in Muhammad's day, so I guess this is purely speculation.)
PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 4:29 am


I'll try to answer, but some of my point of view may be different from Sacred Night..

Actually, it's still a little controversial about pictures are forbidden in Islam.
Many say all of pictures are haram (forbidden), while others say only some of them are haram and the rest are makruh (better not do it, but not forbidden)

The pictures that definitely haram are those that contained a picture of something worshiped. A person or a thing that people respect until they worship them, while it's clear in Islam that Allah is the one and only that's allowed to be worshiped. And for this reason, the image of prophet Muhammad is prohibited, fearing that some people may worship him.

It's also forbidden for the drawings that try to stand up to or equal the creation of Allah. There are many scholar's opinions that saying the painting mentioned in hadith above only refer to specific paintings, and there's no hadith that clearly say that all pictures are forbidden

I don't know about Gaia avatar, but for photography, it doesn't really matter, since it's not something you "create", but "captured" on a film. Besides, the use of them are usually for documentation and for other information.

Every deed is depend on it's first intention. If the intention is bad, so will be the deed. But even if the intention isn't bad, if there's a possibility that people may take a bad use of it, then it's not good either.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:23 am


Julri
Just wondering, what are your views on drawings of the Prophet Muhammad? I'm sure everyone remembers the controversy over those Danish comics which depicted Muhammad. What exactly is the ban on images of Muhammad and why is it there? Do you mind when people draw Muhammad, or does it depend on the context? For example, one of the comics in question depicted Muhammad as wearing a turban that was really a bomb, and I personally find that really disrespectful. But what about tasteful images of Muhammad?

Here are some articles I found on the subject, if you're interested: BBC & Daily Princetonian. If you'd like, you can view the original comics here and some comic responses here, but please note that some of them can be awfully offensive, so you might not want to view them.


Well that whole incident made me step back and take a second look at the developing Islamic culture in the west. It was painfully frustrating watching people call for the 'blood' of others over a matter of freedom of expression.

If in Islam it's a sin then fine, let them sin.
PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 3:04 pm


Sorry, but I thought they were funny. I like things like that. I think that jokes should be allowed. It may be mean, but that isn't any less hilarious than making a white joke if your white, or a black joke if you black. (Personally, I make both white and black jokes. They are hilarious. And no one takes offense when I do.)

Falsequivalence


Shinigami Vayth

Newbie Hunter

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 4:39 pm


well, yeah, I understand your point..^^
but a white joke may be offensive for black, and vice versa. And this is what I think the limit it should be for freedom of speech, a tolerance not to insult other, whether you're originally want to insult or just joking.
PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 5:26 pm


While freedom of speech allows many things, people's responsibility should prevent such an occurrence.

Just like you don't yell "BOMB!" in an airport, nor do you pay for advertisements that say "Ha ha, you've just downloaded my virus. Have fun with your hard drive melted!" you don't disrespect people's beliefs with such an image. Slightly different situations and public reactions, but it's all related to responsibility in speech.

Besides, how on Earth are you going to make such a depiction accurate enough to be respectful, aside from the religion's prohibition - go off of stereotypes?! Great, that's going to win friends and influence people. confused

PrometheanSet


Mau Aita Dirac

PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:28 pm


----שלום / नमस्ते / سلام / Hello LOL...
----Not to offend anyone, but I thought it was hilarious, note each of the individuals walking to paradise are burning (suggesting they are suicide-bombers), the whole 72 virgins for dying in the name of allah is often held by (though not only by) extremists, I do not think this cartoon is attacking Al-Islam I think it's good natured humor at the expense of the extremist.
----But hey, what do I know I've never meet the cartoonist.
----It kinda reminds me of some of the jokes I've made about Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, Tenlikyou, Shinto, Taoism, Atheism, Agnosticism, Myself, etc etc... sweatdrop
----I have no problem with muslims unless they have a problem with me, but I did have a problem with the muslims who cried for the death or beheading of the cartoonist, I don't like those guys...
----And the should it be allowed inquiry, thats the Blasphemy Law vs Freedom of Speach question, I'm on the Freedom of speach position...
---- xd Live long and prosper xd
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2010 9:42 pm


This is the first I'm hearing of it. This is an interesting thread.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:57 am


Everyone else can live with their religious figure being made fun of so should Islam. Besides no one noticed when south park actually broadcast an uncensored depiction of Muhammed.
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2010 1:25 am


W'asalam Alyakum! Ironic, Freedom of speech here undermines the Constitution itself. The Freedom of Religion, including all of the doctrines therein.

Grand Priest


Shinigami Vayth

Newbie Hunter

PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:33 pm


Mau Aita Dirac
----שלום / नमस्ते / سلام / Hello LOL...
----I have no problem with muslims unless they have a problem with me, but I did have a problem with the muslims who cried for the death or beheading of the cartoonist, I don't like those guys...

That's it. muslims have no problem with others unless they have a problem with them. And this cartoonist made a problem with Muslims.

As I said in my previous post, a joke one think is funny, doesn't mean other will find it funny for sure. and what you think it's not a problem doesn't mean it's not a problem for others.

if 'freedom' is free without limit or constraint, then it's alright to insult everyone, insult a country, insult god, and although I don't like those terrorists who claim themselves as Muslim, then in this case their act will be considered as their freedom.
Welcome in the next world war twisted

lucid_mirror
Everyone else can live with their religious figure being made fun of so should Islam.

why? we're different individuals.
if, for example, you hit my friend and ask for their money, and he gives them to you, then why should I have to do the same when you hit and asks me?
I'm not him, and he's not me. simple, isn't it? ^^
PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:44 pm


Guardian of Peace
Julri
Just wondering, what are your views on drawings of the Prophet Muhammad? I'm sure everyone remembers the controversy over those Danish comics which depicted Muhammad. What exactly is the ban on images of Muhammad and why is it there? Do you mind when people draw Muhammad, or does it depend on the context? For example, one of the comics in question depicted Muhammad as wearing a turban that was really a bomb, and I personally find that really disrespectful. But what about tasteful images of Muhammad?

Here are some articles I found on the subject, if you're interested: BBC & Daily Princetonian. If you'd like, you can view the original comics here and some comic responses here, but please note that some of them can be awfully offensive, so you might not want to view them.


I'm a Muslim, and here to answer your question.

First of all, I personally hate those stupid Danish comics that are full of bullshit about the Prophet (S.A.W.W). Freedom of speech does not mean spouting hatred towards one's religion, nor any disrespect of it. And drawing pictures of Mohammed (S.A.W.W) is definitely a sin.

Why?

Allah, the God, dislikes images, such as paintings or sculptures. We should NEVER make a likeness of God's creation.

A hadith:
When the Prophet came to his house, his young wife Aisha had placed up a painting which depicted God's living Creation (i.e. animals or humans). Aisha had seen the Prophet's face turning red in anger, and he told her immediately to take the painting off. When his wife asked why, he said, "O Aisha! Do not depict the Creation of Allah. It is a grave sin and in the Day of Resurrection the painter/sculpture would be asked to make a soul on paper, which he would not be able to do and will be faced with a severe punishment."

It creates the likeness of His creation and we are imitating the Lord by creating things that are a likeness, such as animals and humans. It is especially discouraged and Mohammed disliked it very much.

However, on Wikipedia there ARE paintings of him of how he looked and the important scenes of Islam, which were created by ancient artists who had lived during his time. But, many people are not liking this and want the pictures to be down since there should never be a picture of Mohammed anywhere, since he discouraged having his face sculpted or painted.


confused no depictions? that's horrible. i can't imagine how people can enjoy their art world if images of living things are discouraged and distasteful....

also, Freedom of Speach actualy means exactly that. a person is allowed to say whatever they want, be it slanderous and hateful, or positive and loving. as much as i dislike the hatefull speach, i would feel personally disgusted to see a person's right to say it taken away. i hate the Patriot act for quite alot of that reason.

also, to say something is "definately a sin" is very judgemental and self-righteous. i'm not saying your wrong (although i personally believe that you are). just that you should try understanding the other side as well.

now, personally i don't see any reason for depictions of him to be banned (especially after the given reason), though i respect the idea behind it, and the religious right to believe that. still, i think it would be nice to have images in favour of a prophet that i'd be looking up to...

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:51 pm


Shinigami Vayth
Mau Aita Dirac
----שלום / नमस्ते / سلام / Hello LOL...
----I have no problem with muslims unless they have a problem with me, but I did have a problem with the muslims who cried for the death or beheading of the cartoonist, I don't like those guys...

That's it. muslims have no problem with others unless they have a problem with them. And this cartoonist made a problem with Muslims.

As I said in my previous post, a joke one think is funny, doesn't mean other will find it funny for sure. and what you think it's not a problem doesn't mean it's not a problem for others.

if 'freedom' is free without limit or constraint, then it's alright to insult everyone, insult a country, insult god, and although I don't like those terrorists who claim themselves as Muslim, then in this case their act will be considered as their freedom.
Welcome in the next world war twisted

lucid_mirror
Everyone else can live with their religious figure being made fun of so should Islam.

why? we're different individuals.
if, for example, you hit my friend and ask for their money, and he gives them to you, then why should I have to do the same when you hit and asks me?
I'm not him, and he's not me. simple, isn't it? ^^


neutral sir, your argument isn't very convincing. besides, you are now expressing the idea that one should be able to stand up for whatever they believe in, which nullifies any chance for "victory" in this discussion for either side. it becomes merely a stand-off, and the only solution is to agree to disagree.
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Debate/DIscuss Islam

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