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This isn't exactly DIRECTLLY related to prolife but it is in the same stream of thought:

This is something that has really bothered me since I hit puberty.
I'm a feminist in the less man hating sense of the word. In fact I do not hate men, however, I do hate the fact that many men treat other persons as sex objects. But not only that, have the nerve to justify such behaviour.
But also, I I hate when women do the same thing in return. In fact I'm just as disturbed by scatily clad men on magazines as the constant commodification of women in the media. It bothers me because it reflects the idea that a human being is only worth the sum of his/her parts and sexual appeal.
What's even worse is supposed "liberal" minded people are on the same bandwagon. For example, I was recently working as a lobbyist(canvasser rolleyes ) with one of the gentlmen who was my crew leader for my first day. Without getting into the details of all the other reasons he was a complete a**. The one thing that probably bothered me the most was his blatant sexual objectification of other people. This guy liked to inform ppl almost regularly that he was gay. Honestly, I could have cared less about that. What DID bother me was this; there was a young man going for his late afternoon jog. The man himself wasn't really memorable other than he wore a red shirt and I believe he had blond hair. The issue is that my crew leader thought it was appropriate to point out this random gentlemen inform me that he thought the gentleman "probably has a big d**k" I don't know about most people. But I thought such behavior was outright disrespectful.Perhaps he thought being gay exempted him from treating persons as human beings with feelings but instead as person valued only by what was dangling betwixt their legs.

It's no different than men who spend all their time talking about a woman's body in reference to her sex appeal and could care less who she is instead of what she is.
When I told him that he was being disrespectful he simply said that was "pseudo-morality" and it's "human nature". So wait.. not treating humans as sex objects is pseudo moral? I'm not saying it's wrong to be attracted to someone. What I'm saying is that assesment of persons worth based on sexual appeal and isolating only those traits is dehumanizing not human nature. For all we knew that guy could have been a despicable person. Being black and a woman I am part of the group that gets sexually objectified and commodified on a regular basis by mass media. I simply find such behaviour to be dangerous. We as a culture seem to readily reinforce this sort of treatment of each other as THINGS to be used. What I really don't understand most of all is why he felt so compelled to make such a disparaging comment. Why did he think I'd want to hear something like that? Did he think that because I was a straight woman, that I'd think such treatment of the opposite sex was okay? Neither women nor men should have to be treated like slabs of meat.

I agree, and it's another reason why capitalism bugs me. It seems all about mating. The cologne stores, the fashion, the fancy cars, the big money- Falunting one's feathers. It's not about who you are- It's about how well you conform and how much more of this conformity comodity you have than someone else.

I think perhaps it;s not necessarily capitilaism but materialism that is the problem. The economic strategy of capitalism is relatively neutral. But materialism is often a direct result. What happens is, a person's universe centers around the accumulation of material things. This impedes both intellectual and spiritual growth. If out entire motivation for accumulating knowledge or skills only relates to how those abilities will potentially make you materially wealthy, you miss out on alot in life. Somethings you learn in life have no monetary value. These people become very shallow and as a result, when they decide to pursue a mate, they do so as if they were shopping for a car. such persons do not make long term commitments or investments. Within 4 years of marriage, they are shopping for a new partner based on the criterion they used the first time. They didn't split up because of any real difficulties. They split up because they got bored with it. The relationship no longer had a new car smell, so they traded it in for a new one. Unlike a car that is only as useful as the parts used to make it, the same DOES NOT go for humans, but so many people have let that sort of mindset leach into their social interactions with human beings. Honestly, when I see any young gentleman whether he is attractive or not, my first thought is NOT his phallus size. I think what that guy said was total BS along with some other things he had said. If I see a guy that I find physically attractive, my first thought is, well is he a nice person? I don't know about you but I have my fair share of people that I've spoken with that I thought were attractive but by the time we had finished talking, he no longer looked attractive to me. In fact he looked hideous and i couldn't believe I even thought he was good looking in the first place.

Oh and as a side note, my crew member apparently had very recently come out the closet and since he was never obvioulsy flamboyant. there were other women on staff that thought he was "a beautiful man" and was very attracted to him. Perhaps my standards are just too different but he looked average to me. Maybe all that feeding of his ego, made him the jerk that he was. But really, at least every other employee there was really pretentious. All of them LOVED to talk about themselves and how much better they were than everyone else, namely conservatives and southerners. To me they were just a bunch of snobs.

I... I really don't see how that relates to what she said. o.O

What she's saying is that, in your communist society, those things would still exist and people would still want them, they'd just be free. It has nothing to do with capitalism, any more than people buying and eating food has to do with capitalism.

OP, while I agree that that person definitely went too far, I do think that a lot of people want to pretend like you shouldn't judge people by their body, or be attracted to people because of their body. But when you don't know someone, that's all you have to go on; How they look. And it's absolutely true that men, at least, think about that sort of thing when they're looking at a woman. And with guys, and from what I've heard also with girls, they like to talk to their friends about that sort of thing. All in fun! But also because they want to get a second opinion.

Although thinking of their sexuallity first may be primarily a guy thing. xd I know a lot fewer women who immediately judge a guy's p***s upon meeting them than I know guys who judge women's breasts, buttocks, that sort of thing. But then, those are more immediately visible, honestly. And I know very few guys whose minds immediately go to the v****a.

I also don't think that there is anything wrong with judging someone by their physical appearance. While I absolutely agree that attraction to a person, in the end, shouldn't be based solely or even primarily on their physical appearance, it does figure into the equation. I hate to be politically incorrect, but when I'm looking for someone I'm attracted to, I'm looking for someone I want to live with for the rest of my life. Someone I want to wake up to in the morning. If the person isn't somewhat physically attractive, they're going to fail those standards. According to political correctness, that sounds horrible to say, but it's true.

Mm. So while they certainly shouldn't be loudly talking about someone's sexual organs in public, I don't think that there's necessarily anything wrong with talking to friends about that sort of thing. :shrug: Unless, of course, it makes them uncomfortable, but even then, you're not a bad person for thinking or talking about that sort of thing. It's all about the situation, the intent, the attitude, and that sort of thing.

Which is where I step in, I.Am.<3

First of all, I'm gay, and as a gay man, I elicit these kinds of behavior as a natural impulse. It's inside of me (Don't go there).

Second, from my perspective, he was checking out a hot guy, just like any other girl at the club would do.

Did he say it loud enough that others could hear?

Because in my interpretation, he's spoken 'gay' to you, except you heard it as "He probably has a big d**k", which, in my world, means "He's so hot. Don't you think so?"

It's nothing to get upset over. And honestly, guys talk about their penises (in my estimation) more than girls would talk about their vaginal area. And gay guys make these kinds of jokes, you either go with it, and like that humor, or you don't. He's not painting broad strokes of sexual opression with an offhand big-d**k comment. If so, then I'm opressing people all over the place.

'Cept my comment would usually be something along the lines of... "Oh, I would let him rough me gently..." or... "God, I would SO ******** that."

I do similar things, like if I see someone trying to look really cool but failing (For example, the "balla" punks wearing pants down to their knees and giant chains, or the ******** in 4,000 dollar wanabe race cars doing 80 in a 50) I'm always like "Wow, that guy must have large p***s." In doing so, I'm of course joking about the fact that he's trying to act cool to impress women or whatever with the implied" Look at how cool my car is! I have a big p***s!"

But then, I think this is where some double standards come in.

Because talking like that about women can get you slapped with sexual harassment suits and or fired. Talking about the size of someone's breasts, or discussing how tight someone may or may not be...that's usually objectification, and so is talking about how big someone's p***s might be. It all comes down to treating a human as a body over their personality, and it makes some people uncomfortable to be talked about that way. It's not socially acceptable in public for a reason; some people do not like being sexualized, and some people don't like watching it happen. The fact of the matter is they weren't at a club. At a club, you'd expect that sort of thing. That's normal. That's sort of the point. If you don't like that behavior, you avoid clubs. It's just not socially acceptable behavior at work, because it really does make people uncomfortable.

It's true that the first thing you have to go on is appearance, but on the other hand, this man bypassed the way he was dressed, his hair, his eyes, everything and went straight to the hypothetical big p***s. You can tell a lot about someone from their appearance. Are they generally well-groomed, what sort of clothes are they wearing, what's their ethnic background, etc. But when you jump straight to how big someone's p***s might be? It's kinda creepy.

xd You've definitely got a point about it not being a club. 3nodding

:thinks lymelady has a tight bod.: wink