religion

[the grey seer]

how intersting  

[Doctor_Orc]

When I say “true religion” I made a slight mistake. I intended to refer to the true meaning of the word religion, as seen in History of Religions (I’m a big Mircea Eliade fan). So the beliefs and world views of a people are united in a body of myths, a mythology. The rites and traditions associated with this are Religion.

And yes, we are social animals; we have a basic urge to be in one or more groups.
I love sociology!  

[the grey seer]

neat orc very nice veiw  

[radio paste]

A religion is just a way people group themselves, the same as a country. While people in a country are generally grouped geographically, people in a religion are grouped on an intangible level, beliefs (both in the sense of "morals"/values and their belief in a common "history" despite the fact that its legitimacy is often... questionable, to say the least). So followers of a religion are only "exploited" as much as citizens of a country are. The only difference is that people in a religion have more of a choice, whereas people are generally born into the same country they will live in and pay taxes to for the rest of their lives.  

[the grey seer]

explotation is 4ever constant  

[Yukimura D Sanada]

Jariah Syn

catholics and christians r the same 2 me but the damn book was written in old hebrew people now a days can barly read it even if teir from that regio
no offense

some days, some nights some live, some die in the way of the samurai

first off chalolics and christians arent the same at all they believe in a simular God but chatholics literally worship a cracker study it more .. also there are many veriations of christianity that claim the same God but they are called false prophets and they give the faith a bad name if you say you study religion you should be a little less bias and study the facts

and as for the translation what im saying is scholars who still know old hebrew translated the books from the new testiment (dead sea scrolls original documents)
and it was only 4 words off from our modern english writing of the same book and the 4 words were changed like woman to female(not the acctual example) words that mean the same thing .. and btw these were proven by people who dont beleive in the religion/faith

some fight, some bleed sun up to sun down the sons of a battlecry

 

[Yukimura D Sanada]

Shiro_Kitsune_San

True, unshakeable faith is an amazing thing. I admire people who can find that kind of pillar in their lives.

On the other hand, religion has been used to explioit people for millenia. The Inquisition is a good example. The priests who tortured those poor people or burned them to 'purify' them truly thought they were doing them a favor.
The Catholic church in general seems like another good example to me (no offense to any Catholic members) because if you do anything 'heretical' the church can excommunicate you and effectively damn you to hell. I think that gives them waaaaaay too much power over their subjects. And besides, what right does some clergyman have to block my way to heaven if I think I deserve to go?
Of course, the only reason this works is not only do they scare people into becoming believers sometimes, but there are always people out there who are willing to follow anyone who takes charge, and often that has to with the church in many people's lives.
*sigh*
I suppose it would be interesting to see what the world would be like if religion didn't exist....

some days, some nights some live, some die in the way of the samurai

first off let me state again just to be clear the catholics are a cult just like the Mormons, or Jehovah's witness' (no offense to believers) they are offshoots of Christianity out there to be used as control .. catholicism was created by the romans as a way to meet Christians halfway and tame the followers of Jesus who posed a huge threat to destroying Rome as they knew it

and as for a world without religion.. anarchy would have insued long ago and wed all be dead or have reverted into animals with only primal insticts basically humanity wouldnt be so humane XD

some fight, some bleed sun up to sun down the sons of a battlecry

 

[Yukimura D Sanada]

Mightyenapup

I'm not a fan of religion... but I do find it interesting, and always pay attention to it.

Originally, religion wasn't established to exploit people. Originally, religion was actually sacred, but people weren't sensitive--like we are now--to cringe in fear at anyone who would mention the name of a god they didn't believe in. Usually, groups only knew about one god anyway--theirs. I believe that religion was created for two main reasons.

1. Someone or something to turn to for guidance or hope. Times have been tough all around since humans evolved into this 'greater mind'. Sun gods were probably some of the first to be created. As the Agricultural Revolution took place, as humans began to farm and settle, the sun became a very important resource. In winter, when it was cold, the sun also provided warmth. Etc.
2. Someone or something to blame when things went wrong. This follows suit of the other, so... yeah. Nature's really easy to blame because it can't talk back (only whip earthquakes on your a**). What, is the sun going to complain?

But as time began to pass, people murdered over disagreements in religion... Religious conflicts are the number one cause of death since "religion" came to be. The Holocaust is a good example that everyone knows. Hitler killed hundreds of thousands of Jews.

Personally, I don't know what I believe anymore. I've been raised Protestant, but honestly, concerning Christianity... I really doubt it...

some days, some nights some live, some die in the way of the samurai

acctually ive studied almost every world religion and the first god to be worshiped is always the supreme creator god who created the other gods then the rest of the world/ universe and so on

some fight, some bleed sun up to sun down the sons of a battlecry

 

[Doctor_Orc]

Yukimura has a lot of good points in his posts. The Uranian “class” god exists in all (or almost) traditions.
Like the god Uranus from which the name comes, these gods are super powerful, all being and all encompassing. They created reality, but didn’t quite finish the job (demiurgeous). They are now absent, in a faraway place in the sky. Their powers of creation and their job are left to their offspring or lower gods. This transfer of power is represented symbolically by a transfer of power, some mystical weapon, or even in a castration; seeing that the active principal and the symbols of power/activity/creation are phallic (monoliths, swords, spears, etc.)
In Induism there’s only one good, which manifests him/herserlf trough a series of emanations, dividing itself into lower gods, each one representing a different aspect. The more gods there are, the weaker each one is, and the less it represents. All of them put together is The One.
Like in the Tao te Ching: The One generates two (yin and yang) and the two generates three (sky, earth and the middle) and the three the ten thousand things (all that is).
God is like Schrödinger's Cat. His is all. If you open hi up and try to see a quality in it, the opposite one disappears. But God is all, so he is the unopened box, what’s inside is a lesser god, and the other lesser god is outside of the box.
If you cram all the universe in a single point its value would be zero. It would neutralize itself.
And even Christianity has esoterical (opposite to exoterical) traditions, like Gnosticism that explore this. And even Islam has the Suffi tradition that speaks of this (like Zen/Ch’an in Buddhism, etc.)

PS – Sorry about this confusing post, but I’m on a hurry to go on Carnaval Vacation. See you all next week.  

[radio paste]

Yukimura D Sanada

chatholics literally worship a cracker study it more

Yukimura D Sanada

if you say you study religion you should be a little less bias and study the facts

Please don't take offense, but you might want to practice what you preach.

If you are as well versed in religion as you say, you should realize that to "worship a cracker" is totally against Catholic teaching, which forbids worshiping any sort of image or symbol. Granted, the concept they actually believe in regarding the "cracker", Transubstantiation, is something I find very hard to accept, but regardless it isn't correct to say they worship a cracker.

Personally I find the fact that Catholics truly believe the host turns into Jesus Christ's actual body and blood even more insane. XD Blind faith or ignorance? Who knows.  

[Yukimura D Sanada]

interesting cool  

[WeHappyFew]

Doctor_Orc

Organized religion is a powerful weapon. But so are political parties and sport clubs. Any group in which people invest emotionally is prone to use this affection to manipulate their followers. There are little rational decisions when emotions are involved. The more you like something, the more dependent of it you are eventually become. You take pleasure out of it, and so you keep linked. If it says to you “do such and such because of all the things I gave you, and so I can keep giving it to you” you’ll probably do it with more conviction as more you, love it.

And large scale organizations are scared little things. They sit on top of ivory towers, dispensing illusions in the guise of answers to the basic needs in the Maslow pyramid.
Religions, real religions are alive. People participate in it’s rites and are as important to it as it is to them.

it seems to me your absolutely right, I'm a catholic, and i always have my doubts, but the way i see it is that it's a powerful weapon because people want it to be. The world is in bad shape right about now, and just like thousands of years ago, people feel in danger of being lost in this world, so they look for something constant (although the church seems like one of the most unpredictable institutions in the world), so they look for something in the world that gives them equality in a very social-class seperated world. they want something to base their lives, so even if they have no plan, they have foundation to base their lives on, that will not only help them in this life, but also in the next. People haven't changed in the thousand years that the church has existed, we still like to have something in our lives telling us that we're not completely alone, and always have something to fall back on. However it annoys me that it is so powerful, god has taught us to be humble and yes jesus is important, but all those thousands they spend on gold objects to beautify a church can be used to help those less fortunate. I try to not look at the church as an institution, as much as i do a school, it's better if you study the individuals that it produces, like Don bosco, mother theresa, ghandi (i know he's not christian, but he is influenced by his religion) , or St. franisco Xavier. Those are just a few of the hundreds.  

[Yukimura D Sanada]

radio paste

Yukimura D Sanada

chatholics literally worship a cracker study it more

Yukimura D Sanada

if you say you study religion you should be a little less bias and study the facts

Please don't take offense, but you might want to practice what you preach.

If you are as well versed in religion as you say, you should realize that to "worship a cracker" is totally against Catholic teaching, which forbids worshiping any sort of image or symbol. Granted, the concept they actually believe in regarding the "cracker", Transubstantiation, is something I find very hard to accept, but regardless it isn't correct to say they worship a cracker.

Personally I find the fact that Catholics truly believe the host turns into Jesus Christ's actual body and blood even more insane. XD Blind faith or ignorance? Who knows.

some days, some nights some live, some die in the way of the samurai

i do practice what i preach and yes i supose saying they worship a cracker was a bad way to put it but you understand that what they do goes against the teachings of their own bible as you stated they arent suposed to have any idols but they have all these things about praying to mary and the beleif that the cracker and wine literally become the body and blood of christ. christians use it a symbol but the catholics used it as an idol but claim that they dont.

some fight, some bleed sun up to sun down the sons of a battlecry

 

[the grey seer]

hypocites  

[radio paste]

Yukimura D Sanada

radio paste

Yukimura D Sanada

chatholics literally worship a cracker study it more

Yukimura D Sanada

if you say you study religion you should be a little less bias and study the facts

Please don't take offense, but you might want to practice what you preach.

If you are as well versed in religion as you say, you should realize that to "worship a cracker" is totally against Catholic teaching, which forbids worshiping any sort of image or symbol. Granted, the concept they actually believe in regarding the "cracker", Transubstantiation, is something I find very hard to accept, but regardless it isn't correct to say they worship a cracker.

Personally I find the fact that Catholics truly believe the host turns into Jesus Christ's actual body and blood even more insane. XD Blind faith or ignorance? Who knows.

some days, some nights some live, some die in the way of the samurai

i do practice what i preach and yes i supose saying they worship a cracker was a bad way to put it but you understand that what they do goes against the teachings of their own bible as you stated they arent suposed to have any idols but they have all these things about praying to mary and the beleif that the cracker and wine literally become the body and blood of christ. christians use it a symbol but the catholics used it as an idol but claim that they dont.

some fight, some bleed sun up to sun down the sons of a battlecry

Catholics do *not* use it as a symbol. They believe that what they are consuming is in fact the body and blood of Christ. To us, this seems ridiculous and we assume it must represent the body and blood, but they believe that the priest actually turned it into the body and blood. And Mary is a person, not an idol/symbol. An idol is defined as "an image or representation of a god used as an object of worship". Mary is not an image or representation, she is a person.

You may think that the crucifix is an image/representation, but Catholics use the crucifix as what i can only describe as a reminder while they direct their worship to the person, Jesus Christ, or God, or whoever they are praying to. The crucifix is not the object being worshiped, the figure behind the crucifix is.

I don't mean to split hairs, and while it may seem like I'm sticking up for Catholics, I find them as unsavory as the next person does. XD I just get frustrated by how many people make mistakes in their criticisms.