Suggestions!
If you have a really good idea for something that
could be added to the Bank, post it on the thread, and if it's original and creative, I'll put it here.
(These " . . . " that you see are where I cut out some of the messages, to make them take up less space. It's not important information I'm cutting out, just extra phrases.)
My original suggestion for it:
Pride of the Peaches
With one idea, given to me by oddthiefDARK and added to by YunaZeal while fishing at Durem RF, the bank could give interest based on both the activity level and the maximum deposit of the user. The higher the deposit, and the more that a user is active, the higher the interest can be; inversely, if the user becomes inactive, there will be no interest, and if the deposit is small, there will be no or a low interest. This would have some upper limit, of course... Wouldn't want people getting
too rich, now would we? (Also, this would best be balanced by a good loans system. There's quite a few ideas for this on
the fourth post right down below.)
YunaZeal
. . . the bank accounts of the users would have separate passwords other than their main account passwords, so that even if they got hacked or something like that, there would be less of a chance that they would lose everything that they worked so hard to get.
. . . Maybe there would be a type of safe-deposit box that they could keep their valuable items in; I've been seeing a lot of people getting scammed out of their items lately, and it's pretty ugly to log in and realize that the Nitemare scarf that you worked so hard to get your grabby mitts on has MYSTERIOUSLY VANISHED eek YunaZeal
. . . safe-deposit for when you get your grubby mitts on rares. Non-glitch'd, of course. But think about it. Banks also have safe-deposit boxes, so why not adapt this to Gaia?
Here's an idea I came up with:
prideofthepeaches
To avoid having the bank being too much of a strain on the servers, there could be a limit as to how many times you could deposit or withdraw gold in a day... Like, three transactions per day. Also, the interest would just be compounded once a day, not a constantly changing amount (since activity level is such a changing variable.) thelittleflamingo
. . . if there was a opening fee when you first make an account. Seeing as you have to buy a trading pass and the [vending license] it would only make sense to have an opening fee.
These three are from [Textbook Definition]!
(Idea A)
Instead of earning interest . . . certain items or benefits you get for keeping a certain amount of gold in the back over a certain amount of time. Much like in the Gamecube game Animal crossing. Lets say if you have 100k of gold in there for six months, you would get some rare item . . . There could be different amounts of gold and time periods, and lesser/greater prizes assigned for each. (Idea B)
Give interest in the form of 'Banker Points' or somesuch that cannot be transferred into gold but perhaps sold for gold, and collected like tickets for prizes, as said above. Maybe some special 'featured items' each month, donation items or rare items, or new items. (Idea C)
Only give interest if the person pays a LARGE sum of money to buy an interest-giving account. Make basic accounts with no interest, only safe storage, free, but make interest giving accounts much more expensive. perhaps 5-10k so that even if someone did wish to exploit it, they'd spend a few months making up (in interest) what they used to open the account. Libris
. . . have the Intrest Rate be an event, though. It would work sorta like this: While yer Deposit Box is permanant, the savings accounts are bought in periods of three days, one week, three weeks, six weeks, and nine weeks. You must, when opening one, choose what yer initial deposit will be, although afterwards you will not be able to put any money in (although you may take money out). You won't know what yer starting rate is going to be. You then open the account, and yer interest rate is chosen at random with odds depending on what set amount of time you choose for the account. Three days would have really bad odds of a good interest rate, while nine weeks will have really high odds for a good one. It would make it extremely fair for everyone, and wouldn't discrimate at all against someone's current amount of gold or time spent on Gaia.
Here's an idea for the safety deposit box. Thanks, hiriyou!
hiriyou
Make the safety deposit boxes a new gold sink. Gold sinks are good because they help level out the Gaian economy and this would help prevent an exploitation of the interest rates: you have to pay for a certain amount of space in your safety deposit box. You can start with the minimum SD box which will hold only two items, but then you can continuously pay extra gold for upgrades so you can hold more items in it. You could start by paying like 500g for the space for two items, then upgrade to hold another two at an extra 500g and so on and so on.
For the following idea, I'd expand on that and add a system of interest, so you'd have to pay a bit more if you took longer paying it back. Also, the interest rates that could be available could be dependent on the amount you have in the bank already.
[-Blazen-]
you should be able to take out loans from the bank like say your 5k off that fairy wings for your quest you could just borrow 5k from the bank then work off the 5k in one large payment or lots of small payments it depends
Here's some ideas for the loan system, from [Vanilla].
[Vanilla]
To prevent newbies from just taking out large loans for really expensive items they cannot pay back. There are three options.
a) Prevent them from spending anymore money till they pay it back. This will not actually solve the problem.
b) Limit the sizes of the loans according to how long you have been signed up for.
c) Build up the sizes of loans. Bobby Sue takes a loan of 1k and pays it back. She can now take a loan out of 5k as she paid off her last loan. When she pays her 5k back she can take out another loan.
Loaning could raise a whole lot of other issues - even with these three options. Gaians could make a heck of a lot of money, or simply just own a heck of a lot of bank money. I guess gaia could ban, contact or warn those who have been owning bank money for too long? prideofthepeaches
I'm thinking that the password would be given to you to memorize, and you wouldn't be able to change it... And it would be a completely random collection of 6-8 characters (letters and numbers). oddthiefDARK
The only problem would be if you forgot it. You would need a way to get a new password or get the stuff out to create a new bank acount . . . I'm thinking of having a list with a few questions on it and you pick two of the questions, for example: pet's name and mother's maiden name. You need to answer both of the questions to have the password given to you. Zarin Denatrose
Such a feature would need to also prevent hacking, preferably via a similarity check [making sure it and the main password are different.] And locking the items up for 24 hours in the case of 3 failed attempts in a row. I would suggest that if this were to happen, a PM would be sent to the account right away and 24 hours later, giving the owner of the account notification as to the fact that their account may not be safe. Pinky Promise
Adding to Blazen's idea, I say instead of paying like that we could have say, every time you earn gold to goes towards paying that sum of gold off. Therefor, no one could just transfer that item to another account and just you know, ignore the other.
A more detailed view of the loans idea.
kamocat
So, I propose that there be a loan feature with a slightly higher intrest rate than the savings account. If inflation is incorperated, there shall be two types of loans: fixed intrest and variable intrest. The offer for fixed intrest will change as inflation goes up and down, but once it is accepted, it stays the same until the loan is payed off. The intrest shall be the minimum that is payed off. Thus, the gain from savings accounts shall be slight (around 2%) to allow people who don't spend their lives on gaia to pay loans off. Indubitably Fetus
Anywho, what if, for the insterest, each day/week/month or however there is a button or something to recieve your interest. Though you only have a 24hr time frame in which to collect your interest. This way, someone can't put gold in the bank, leave it for a year or more and come back a collect a whole bunch fo interest.
Dark_Flower94
What if only 2-month old and older gaians could take out loans in the bank? It would prevent all the newbies from taking out loans just for gold. For example: Ted is new and wants gold, now. he hears of the bank and goes there and can't take out a loan. Jim has been a member for 2 months and can take a limit of 5k as a loan. 1-year members, 100k, 2 year members 150k, etc.
When you take out a loan, you must pay the loan in a certain amount of time. For example- Tim takes out a 5k loan, he has a month to give it back. Amanda takes out 100k and has 9 months to repay it. Greg takes out 150k and has 1 year to repay it and so on.
Greg takes out a loan of 150k, but has to log off. So he logs off and Ted hacks his account, taking the loaned gold. Ted will then find out that he cannot trade/hack Greg until he has repayed the loan. prideofthepeaches
a daily transaction/interest-gain history that you could just check up on whenever Kaoru-san305
I would love to have separate accounts for quests, breedable shops/mini shops, etc. Gyojiro
[Have interest] based on every certain number of posts.
Each [x-amount] posts would raise the amount of interest you can earn by [y-amount], for instance.
That way, they can keep mule making at a low, and inflation doesn't rise. dynamite_xx
If you wanted a loan maybe you could like temporarily trade one of your possesions (worth a minimum of 20k or something) for a maximum of a month or some amount of time and you would get as much money as the recent value of it is and then if you didn't pay back the money before the time was up you just wouldn't get your item back? Arihana
sometimes I'm questing for something, but then I'm tempted to buy something else, and with nothing to stop me, I just go ahead. Perhaps you could deposit gold and tell it to give it back to you only in ___ days? emeralddarkness
Though with the loans . . .
Limit the amount of gold that can be taken out based on previous loans/account age, as was suggested (possibly both, so as not to discriminate against newbies), but also have it be for a limited amount of time, and put a lock on outgoing trades until that loan has been payed off.
So... let's say that you're 20k off from a Coco kitty or something and you want to get one before inflation makes them any more expensive. Take out a loan of 20k and set a time limit to 1 week. You would then have 1 week to buy your coco and, once that 1 week is up any gold in your account and any gold you earned would automatically begin to go to the banking system instead of your account until it was payed off. You could earn in the same ways -- trades, shops, selling items, bumping, etc... but instead of it going from 0g up, it would go from -[number here]g up. Once you hit 0 again then you would have your debt payed off.
And, for slackers or people who would try transfering accounts, put a lock on outgoing trades (aka, they'd be able to recieve payment for something like an art shop and still be able to get donations, but not transfer anything from that account themselves) and, if they haven't payed back the loan in x amount of days, seize the item that they bought with the loan and hold them until it was payed off. If the account remains inactive for a long time, say a year, just throw the items back into the marketplace for the price that they were bought at. Taineyah
What if loaned gold had a "tag" on it that it couldn't leave your account except in the marketplace/shops. Once the gold had been spent at such, it would be "cleaned" so that it could be spent anywhere/traded by the recipient. It would probably be a similar transformation code to the one that allows a sealed envelope to be opened.
This would prevent people from making multiple mules, sending all the gold to their primary account, and then discarding the mules. You wouldn't be able to combine multiple small loans, this way. She Wrote It Hallelujah
Tho on the condition that the Bank has a [x] digit Access code that must be pressed on screen and not typed. with digits that appear randomly in one of 10 boxes.
(less likely to get hacked)
Here's an idea for a different system of interest. I think this could possibly work out, provided that a user could only make, say, one investment in one of these special accounts per unit of time... The larger the investment, the longer they'd have to wait to make another investment. One couldn't just make another investment immediately after ending the last.
Mr. Generosity
Perhaps GAIA could install a system where you invest X amount of gold into an account and can NOT touch it for a period of time (1 week, 3 weeks, etc). Once that time is up, your gold is returned with an interest based on how long it sat there. Obviously, there would need to be a limit to how much gold one could toss into such an account, to prevent people from quickly growing money.
I imagine it working like this:
- Option A
Wait Time: 1 week
Minimum investment: None
Maximum investment: 2,000 gold
Interest rate given: 15%
- Option B
Wait Time: 3 weeks
Minimum investment: 2,500 gold
Maximum investment: 5,000 gold
Interest rate given: 25%
- Option C
Wait Time: 5 weeks
Minimum investment: 5,000 gold
Maximum investment: 10,000 gold
Interest rate given: 50%
For example, let's suppose you decide to place 6,000 gold into account C. Exactly five weeks after doing so, you'd get a PM alerting that you may retrieve your funds, which has grown to 9,000.
Ideally, this system would work where you couldn't have more than ONE investment going at a kind, nor could you cancel without penalty. Ergo, if you decide to start an Option B account, you have to wait those three weeks before starting another account of any other type. ~`Rylee
I've got an idea to keep people from running away from loans (to another account)
Rather than going to the bank and taking out a specific amount of money,
add an option when buying things in stores or the marketplace to
"buy with loan" if you choose this the site takes all the gold you have, gives you the item and opens a loan account attached specifically to that item.
- You could not trade that item to anyone until it was paid off.
- If you did not make your minimum payments on the loan in time the item would be repossesd (taken away by the site)
- If the item is repossesed then some reasonable percentage (80%?) of the gold you had already put towards it would be returned
- If you don't pay back a loan in time then you can't take out another loan for awhile (maybe a long time, like six months. And if you don't payback several loans in a row you can't take out anymore ever again (a credit system, essentially))
I realised there would be some complications if this system was used for items in the marketplace and then the loans weren't paid back. Any donation items that the site took from debtors would be swallowed up and if a lot of noobs took out loans the economy could suffer.
. . .
- What if items from that scenario went to [NPC] Meredith's store in the marketplace (i realise she has no store but they had a [NPC] labtech with a store in the marketplace one year, this would be like that)
All the items seized would be entered in Meredith's store
- Commons could equal 75% of their store value (or whatever)
- Collectibles could be set with a price on some sort of algorithym that would rise approximately with inflation
(that would be a little complicated in terms of programming but it wouldn't make it any more complicated for regular users)
OR they could do it based on a search for lowest buy price like tektek does. Izu Fable
. . . you have a different password for the bank. BUT, gaia will randomize it FOR you, and you CANNOT change it.
. . . It'll be about 10 characters long. Gaia will email the password . . . Along to go with it, hackers change the email, right? So in the Account area, we should enter the ANOTHER randomized password that gaia made for us to change the passwords and email and Profile fields. The_Blue_Snow
. . . something like a credit score . . . Like if <x> took a <y> loan, and paid it off before/at the pay date, they would be able to take more out the next time or have an easier pay plan. Like wise, if <x> took a <y> loan, and paid it off after the agreed pay date, they would only be able to take a smaller loan until they could be trusted. prideofthepeaches
Bank accounts could be kept separate from the main account. If someone is unable to access their main account (perhaps through banning or forgetting of a password, username, and/or email), they could still retain the ability to send gold stored in the bank to a specified account, perhaps through the gift-giving system or something like that. lamoxlamae
To prevent someone from just dropping all their gold and disappearing, interest should be collected daily automatically after you have made at least 1 post and voted in at least 1 poll that day. This keeps gold coming in ONLY for active people, not mules. what_lurks_in_the_dark
Loaning . . . something along the lines of a bank note. Like a seperate gold system, and it's repaid by your own gold as time goes by. This gold is not tradeable, and when you have a det of 5k or more, you can't make any outgoing trades. Only incoming.
Safety deposit boxes . . . why not purchase slots of higher security for items that you really wish to protect. Like you have a kiki, and you don't think that just one password following the hacking can keep it safe, you can purchase more security for the kiki in the form of questions or passwords.
Bank accounts . . . I would like to see a system where you can create multiple accounts. Like one for a quest, and one for donations, and one to just save your gold. Moon Alice Syltheon
. . . I think we should make it so there's a new system where you can put an item into the bank, so it is safe from hackers, but when you do so, have the item still on your avitar so you can still show it off, but have it DISAPPEAR from your "my stuff" and "dress up." . . . sone4200
And why not have a "pawn style" loan system. So you want to borrow 20k. OK, thats fine, but do you have collateral? Real banks ask for collateral, why shouldn't Gaia? Aris`
. . . you can use the bank in two different accounts; the main account and a mule account . . . if you lose your main account, you can still access the bank that has all the things you put in there before from that mule account. And you can only choose the 2nd account once, meaning you can't change it. MisigisiM
How about, once you take out the loan, your trades are locked. If you do not pay back the loan in the amount of time you are alloted, items - starting cheapest first - are repossessed from your account until the remaining balance has been repaid. These items are held for an additional period of time - say 2-6 weeks depending on the size of the loan - and if you can raise the gold, you get them back, if not, the bank keeps them (and they are essentially deleted). . . . This way there's still a system for the user to recover their repossessed items, but at the same time there is a penalty for defaulting on a loan. Naoko Ai
Maybe if you had a set interest rate, or a max interest rate. People can't get over 500 or 1,000 a week in interest, or something like that.
For the following idea, I think the PIN could be entered onto a clickable number pad, which would have the numbers in different locations each time. I imagine this would be done with Javascript, probably.
Grey And Misty Eyes
to make the bank slightly more "foolproof" you could have the option to (Each time you use the bank) Answer a different security question, enter a "Pin" (given to you as an IMAGE when you first create your bank) or be allowed to withdraw only a total of 3 times a day but deposit as many times as you wish (By depositing you also have to enter your pin so hackers dont purposely deposit BOTTED GOLD to get you banned)
Inu-Darisa
if a user takes out, say...20k, they would be able to pay as they earn gold or if they did not pay every month, a certain percentage would be taken from earned and traded gold. If the user went 3 months with out willingly paying, ALL gold from trades, sales, and posting/polling/surfing would be taken until then debt is paid.
DJ Twissta
a Will system, where if the person decides to leave or execute his will, his friends will get certain items / gold :3
Persephone of the Seasons
Maybe there should be a Gaian credit history that allows you to take out only as much as you can reasonably pay back over time?
Answers to Common Skepticism
1. "I could just keep my gold in a mule account."
Did you know mules are often hacked? YunaZeal
It happened to a friend of mine not two days ago. He lost three veils, three coco kitties, and about 250K gold.
Also:
Ganseblumchen =3
I kept my nicer items and a lot of gold in a separate mule account, and it was alright, but after selling most of the items on that account and buying fairy wings, I didn't wear the wings. It didn't go with my avatar.
I kept it in there. Dx
And what do you know, I forgot the password. The wings are stuck and I can't get them.
2. "The rich would just get richer!"
No, everyone would gradually get richer at a reasonable rate. The interest would almost be like a small paycheck for being active on Gaia, and a bit larger if you've made a lot of gold from doing various things.
3. "You could always invest in one of the user-run banks." (User-run banks are now prohibited.)
If I knew the owner of such a bank and was able to trust him or her, I might consider that. However, this can be risky due to the existence of scams and the possibility of banning, hacking of said user's account, or computer problems. But most want the convenience and security that would come with a real Gaia Bank.
4. "People would be getting gold for no work!"
Work would be required to make this gold! First of all, you would have to work to get the gold in the first place. The more you would work, the more gold you would get, so you would be able to invest more money in the bank. Also, it has already been said that interest would be based on activity level. That means you would have to be on Gaia doing things in order for interest to increase!
5. "What about Kava's list of impracticalities [see here]?"
I've seen it, and I can respect her opinion that any interest system would mess up the economy. However, I do not agree with it. And if the admins decide to make an interest-free banking system, I'd be fine with that; interest is not essential in this petition. It is desired, but I'd rather have no interest than no bank account at all.
Also, something like one of [Textbook Definition]'s ideas could be implemented to reduce the effect interest would have on inflation.
I do think that an interest system can be workable, as long as it is counterbalanced by a good loan system. See the following quote, as I think it sums things up quite nicely:
shadetreader
A real bank pays interest, just as it must charge interest on loans. Remember, our savings accounts IRL are really just loans we make to the bank, that's why we get interest (banks pay to borrow money just like we do!) though it shouldn't have to complicate the gold system enormously. Good Gaian financial planning ought to be able to keep up with the gradual increase in prices for rare items. That is not inflation, as most of us call it, because it's caused by an increase over time in the perceived value of rare (relatively scarce) items, not primarily by an increase in the amount of "gold" on the site. Right?
