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Friendly Werewolf

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Gata-Gris
surprised Hi: There are merits to most of the issues that are raised here. I can only go by my own experience: I spent years trying to gain weight (I would probably be considered anorexic, except that I eat like a pig) and took so many people's advice on what to do to gain it and did not do so for many years (when I was 13 I weighed around 45 - 48 pounds). I ate ice cream several times a day, I took protein drinks, I even went to the doctor who prescribed some pills that were supposed to help me by slowing down my metabolism. It didn't work.....Two years ago, I did start to gain weight (maybe all those things worked all of the sudden??? lol ) and 8 months ago I was diagnosed with diabetes type 2. Go figure...I had to loose a lot of the weight I gained because my doctor said it contributed to the diabetes. I have the diabetes under control now.. I agree that there are specific body types and that "fat" is in the eyes of the beholder. Many cultures consider large women beautiful and skinny women lacking in beauty...

Sounds like you're one of those naturally thin people. wink Fat IS in the eye of the beholder and you're right; many cultures consider big women beautiful because they're able to have healthy pregnancies and provide for their children. Also, it shows that she's got enough to eat, which reflects well on her family and village/town/whatever. Finally, why should anyone WANT to be 'skinny' if they're fat? I mean, if you're fat and healthy, what's the deal? Love yourself for who you are and what you look like and damn anyone who says otherwise.

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EladrinStarmist
Um, no, some people are natually fat, some are naturally thin. Even if a fat person diets or excercises, they wont lose the weight. It's there to stay.


I actually do agree with a lot of this. The bmi is pretty screwed up because it does not take body type into account. Unfortunately, you're not really doing that either. Saying every fat person is doomed isn't very accurate either. Some people end up that way through genetics and some really do just overeat and lead sedentary lifestyles. This won't necessarily make you fat but it will make you fatter in comparison to what you'd be otherwise. I'd prefer it if fat and thin wasn't thought of in pounds but in terms for what's healthiest for you.


Wall of Text, but it means something.

Fat, overweight, or obese people DO NOT need to go on diets.
They need a lifestyle change. Diets are meant to be temporary.
Who continues eating that crap until they die?
They do it because it sounds good, and they think it'll bring instant results.
Perhaps, but the results will instantly be reversed when you get off of the diet.

Body shape is genetic, not pounds.
Yeah, some girls have thicker bones, but it's never meant to mean "I'm naturally fat."
Trust, I'm a big girl myself. I don't need anybody telling me I'm naturally gross.
Yeah, health issues cause obesity, obesity causes health issues.
SO DOES EVERYTHING ELSE!
>.<
People that think "fatphobes" are completely dissing them and getting on the defensive need to chill out. To be completely honest, most people don't care what you look like if you aren't a detrimental part of their lives.
Not to mention, you cannot say "this is only for positive posts." That limits freedom of speech and makes you just as close minded as the "fatphobes."

I agree with the people you're attacking, for the most part anyway.
Metabolism plays an important role in weight loss and gain. You figure out what you burn a day, and eat less than that. You do stretches, and body toning exercises. Maybe you won't go from a size 24 to a size 7, but you'll be healthier and you WILL lose weight.

It's funny how you said this isn't a thread about fat people, when 90% of your post was arguing against the ideas of "fatphobes." You hardly mentioned the struggle of people that are trying to gain weight.

Confidence is awesome, but not when you put other people down.
People are entitled to their opinions. Whether you agree with them or not, you ought to respect them. Not doing that makes you seem entirely unattractive to most people, and that's without looking at you.

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EladrinStarmist
Ivan Isaacss
EladrinStarmist
If all you're going to do is be an a**, Ivan, you're not welcome here.


I'm sorry, does it upset you that I think everything your telling us is wrong and need to question it rather than following like... what was the term used earlier... "A sheeple"
(Aside from the BMI is bullshit argument anyway)

It upsets me that you're overly harsh in your criticisms of fat people and that you're pulling the "I'm right, you're wrong" arguement. Have. you. read. the. links. on. the. front. page? Obviously I know you CAN read, you're just choosing not too. Please read them, digest the information, and come back. If you chose to keep ignoring the information I've provided, the only conclusion I can draw is that you choose to remain ignorant.


I have read them, and I have decided from this that points.

And I believe points 1,3,4,5, and six are wrong.
I also believe that points 7 and 8 are open to debate.
Point 10... Im not sure what you were trying to say there... A pharmacuetical company makes weight loss pills? Its called supply and demand. If I had the biological and chemical knowledge I'd do the same thing.

But, I will give you bonus points for stating obvious truths with points 2 and 9. smile

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WereRetty
This thread totally rocks.

I'm so sick of hearing how fat is unhealthy. My mom is overweight, I'm average weight and she kicks my a** when it comes to health any day. d:


A lot of your mother's weight probably comes from age. They do tend to pack it on more when they get older.
EladrinStarmist

Sounds like you're one of those naturally thin people. wink Fat IS in the eye of the beholder and you're right; many cultures consider big women beautiful because they're able to have healthy pregnancies and provide for their children. Also, it shows that she's got enough to eat, which reflects well on her family and village/town/whatever. Finally, why should anyone WANT to be 'skinny' if they're fat? I mean, if you're fat and healthy, what's the deal? Love yourself for who you are and what you look like and damn anyone who says otherwise.


It's interesting.. I have been told (several times, by a lot of ignorant people) that I couldn't possibly have healthy babies because I am so skinny. And have small breasts. And this is in the United States. In my experience it seems like this country associates healthy babies and pregnancies with plump women. It makes me wonder why our media (and others) try to tell us that fat women aren't beautiful. Why is it that our culture doesn't associate motherhood with beauty, like most other cultures do...

I got to that in a roundabout way, but you see what I mean

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Kitten West
EladrinStarmist

Sounds like you're one of those naturally thin people. wink Fat IS in the eye of the beholder and you're right; many cultures consider big women beautiful because they're able to have healthy pregnancies and provide for their children. Also, it shows that she's got enough to eat, which reflects well on her family and village/town/whatever. Finally, why should anyone WANT to be 'skinny' if they're fat? I mean, if you're fat and healthy, what's the deal? Love yourself for who you are and what you look like and damn anyone who says otherwise.


It's interesting.. I have been told (several times, by a lot of ignorant people) that I couldn't possibly have healthy babies because I am so skinny. And have small breasts. And this is in the United States. In my experience it seems like this country associates healthy babies and pregnancies with plump women. It makes me wonder why our media (and others) try to tell us that fat women aren't beautiful. Why is it that our culture doesn't associate motherhood with beauty, like most other cultures do...

I got to that in a roundabout way, but you see what I mean


Because in the western world mothers dont have to que seven hours for bread.
Kitten West
EladrinStarmist

Sounds like you're one of those naturally thin people. wink Fat IS in the eye of the beholder and you're right; many cultures consider big women beautiful because they're able to have healthy pregnancies and provide for their children. Also, it shows that she's got enough to eat, which reflects well on her family and village/town/whatever. Finally, why should anyone WANT to be 'skinny' if they're fat? I mean, if you're fat and healthy, what's the deal? Love yourself for who you are and what you look like and damn anyone who says otherwise.


It's interesting.. I have been told (several times, by a lot of ignorant people) that I couldn't possibly have healthy babies because I am so skinny. And have small breasts. And this is in the United States. In my experience it seems like this country associates healthy babies and pregnancies with plump women. It makes me wonder why our media (and others) try to tell us that fat women aren't beautiful. Why is it that our culture doesn't associate motherhood with beauty, like most other cultures do...

I got to that in a roundabout way, but you see what I mean


I think it has something to do with stretch marks, a baby pouch and bloatedness. It is horrible that motherhood in itself isn't beautiful unless you don't have those things.

That, and I know quite a few girls that view pregnancy as a fad, like a Gucci bag or something. It's sickening.
Hooray for pudge! heart

Friendly Werewolf

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Kitten West
EladrinStarmist

Sounds like you're one of those naturally thin people. wink Fat IS in the eye of the beholder and you're right; many cultures consider big women beautiful because they're able to have healthy pregnancies and provide for their children. Also, it shows that she's got enough to eat, which reflects well on her family and village/town/whatever. Finally, why should anyone WANT to be 'skinny' if they're fat? I mean, if you're fat and healthy, what's the deal? Love yourself for who you are and what you look like and damn anyone who says otherwise.

It's interesting.. I have been told (several times, by a lot of ignorant people) that I couldn't possibly have healthy babies because I am so skinny. And have small breasts. And this is in the United States. In my experience it seems like this country associates healthy babies and pregnancies with plump women. It makes me wonder why our media (and others) try to tell us that fat women aren't beautiful. Why is it that our culture doesn't associate motherhood with beauty, like most other cultures do...
I got to that in a roundabout way, but you see what I mean

Those people ARE ignorant; you can have a great pregnancy and deliver a beautiful baby no matter what your size; big or small. True, heavier babies over time are healthier ones but that doesn't have much to with how large or small the mother is before the pregnancy; it's all about how well she takes care of herself during. smile

TikiBox: Thanks for posting. I changed the front page a bit to make it more freedom of speech friendly wink and I'm not trying to put anyone down by making this thread. Skinny people who are trying to put on weight for whatever reason are struggling too. I get that. But I have a personal interest in fat people, hence the thread. If anyone wants to talk about how skinny people are made fun of and discriminated against feel free to make a new thread. smile This one's for us fatties. The point of this thread is HEALTH at EVERY size. Little or big. If you're not healthy, what else matters? People should love themselves no matter how big (or little) they are.

Friendly Werewolf

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Ivan Isaacss
I have read them, and I have decided from this that points.

And I believe points 1,3,4,5, and six are wrong.
I also believe that points 7 and 8 are open to debate.
Point 10... Im not sure what you were trying to say there... A pharmacuetical company makes weight loss pills? Its called supply and demand. If I had the biological and chemical knowledge I'd do the same thing.

But, I will give you bonus points for stating obvious truths with points 2 and 9. smile

You've decided to disregard scientific evidence and studies from medical journals and declared it wrong? Wow. Good on ya. rolleyes
Styrene
No one has the same definition of healthy.

As well,
In order for fat people to be fat they have to intake enough calories to maintain that weight. 170lb person needs more calories to maintain that weight than a 100lb person. This is common knowledge.


It's not true in every case. Metabolism is blamed for many things, and so is calorie intake and conscious activity, but in laboratory conditions, many of the theories just didn't pan out.

For one, people's metabolism doesn't actually vary that much as far as fuel (fat/carb) burning. The difference between a "naturally thin" person's "fast" metabolism, and let's say, a hypothyroid person's "slow" metabolism might be something like 50kcal if they are the same weight. Larger people often have even faster metabolisms than the "naturally thin".

What "naturally thin" actually means is prone to thinness. A combination of factors aside of metabolism go into that, and one of the big ones is a low appetite and higher unconscious activity levels. Some people move more when they sleep or while they are sitting. Also people who spasm or "stim" are constantly burning, even if they're not aware of it.

A "naturally fat" person, or someone prone to fatness may work out just as much as a naturally thin person, and eat the exact same thing, but they aren't moving as much when they sleep or when they're being still. I figured that out that was true in real life outside a lab when I became hypothyroid. My daily activity was making me much more tired than it used to, and my limberness reduced, so I was moving less in normal life.

Another thing that affects weight and appetite and food intake is digestive efficiency. Some people have problems that for some reason prevent their optimal absorption of certain nutrients. They have to eat more to get in enough iron or calcium than the average person, for instance.

One thing many of the weight loss experts don't like to talk about, but does factor in in this and hormonal issues, is pollution. There are so many more estrogenic and damaging compounds in our environment that it's not even funny. I stopped drinking from plastic cups, especially hot liquids from them, when a study came out that revealed that they're almost universally washed or processed or cured in chemicals that screw up your chromosomes and overload the body with estrogenic chemicals. The same reason guys are less fertile nowadays is the same reason the population of alligators and certain species of frogs are dying out even though they're protected...except humans get a little exposure compared to animals who get the stuff dumped into their water supply directly.

Male alligators in increasing numbers' weewees are too small to even copulate, much less breed.

So anyway, humans especially near industrial areas, are exposed to all kinds of mess that screws them up, and fatness is sometimes one of the results of it, and sometimes a protective factor. If women's bodies are in a crisis, they actually fight against factors that would reduce their fertility. Exposure to toxic chemicals puts the body in this mode, and they will attempt to swing the balance. The males have a lower sperm count (like 80% less than there used to be when they first discovered how to do that), so the females have to be at maximum physical conditions for carrying babies. So some fatness may actually be an instinctive, unconscious reaction to the state of the world economically and environmentally. It seems in the places where people can afford to be fat, they are fat despite the untrendiness of it.

Whether it is healthier or unhealthier to be fat, folks need to stop assigning a moral value to it. It comes from Christian beliefs that gluttony is a sin. Well sex except for purposes of reproduction is also a sin under that moral system...so is "witchcraft" as in anybody's religion except theirs, and atheism, and *thinking* about doing something wrong.

Fatphobia is part of that backwards mentality, and aside of that, it's psychologically unhealthy. If you want to lose weight, or like being thin, or have a preference for thinness, cool...but there's no reason to think that you are better or more moral or above someone else who weighs more.

You may just be able to operate on less calcium, iron, or B vitamins than someone else. Not all bodies are the same.

Witty Lunatic

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I don't really have anything to add...but Eladrin is a friend of mine and I'm attempting to show support for this wonderful idea for a thread.

I'm 6' tall and weigh about 200lbs. I'm not fit, but I'm healthy.
and I don't eat proper because I'm allergic to most fruit and vegetables.
EladrinStarmist

Sounds like you're one of those naturally thin people.

One of those? Dont you mean: "You sound like a normal person, as proportionatley speaking, its natural to be "thin" rather than fat.

EladrinStarmist


Fat IS in the eye of the beholder


Yes, and in the majority of beholders eyes, being fat is not as preferable in any situations over being thin unless you are in danger of falling down wells due to occupational hazards, perhaps a well builder maybe? I dont know.

EladrinStarmist


Finally, why should anyone WANT to be 'skinny' if they're fat? I mean, if you're fat and healthy, what's the deal? Love yourself for who you are and what you look like and damn anyone who says otherwise.


Because even if you eat "healthily", being fat is not as healthy as being thin, unless you happen to be stuck in a famine, in which case then it becomes healthier to have been fat since you have better energy reserves, however being fat in a famine also opens you up as a food source, so its somewhat of a double edged sword.


Thin > Fat when it comes to health, no questions.

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