Christians in Gaia

[wicked_fire]

x-Starberry-chan-x

You can't convert an athiest just b telling to them to pray and read the book. Its a lot harder than that and anyone that thinks otherwise is wrong.

I'm not athiest but i've heard conversion stories about athiests converting to the mormon or other faiths and it sometimes takes months or years. Athiests are just as strong in my opinion in what the y believe in.

The reason that Athiests and wicans and satanists convert to mormon more often if they convert at all if because mormonism is a little white lie of satans. He uses the book of mormon and redoes many of the main values in the Bible that God has set down. I could show some examples of this but again, I dont have the time right now.

[Lord Setar]

wicked_fire

dawnofthelight

Riviera de la Mancha

Of course it is the only true God. She bases her view like mine as I see and experience reality. Our God that we share in faith is the only one that is true as life has shown us. I do not intend to prove to you here and now in the sense to make you epistemically culpable to see our God as the one and only one because it is a perspective ultimately you must see to agree with. God has no interest in forcing you to do anything, and that includes believing in Him if you really dont want to do so. In proper form then, it is odd for you to demand proof for a religious belief like you would for th conclusion that 2 + 2= 4. Faith is by design ultimately incapable of creating this effect, for it is far too humanistic.

2+2=4 is an axiom, or automatic principle; 'God exists' is not an axiom or automatic principle, and is a matter of fact claim, thus requiring some form of proof to be knowledge or some type of logical justification to be believed in.

Ok how about this. You see the computer right in front of you, the walls of the house you are in, and so on. You know they exist because you can see them so thus you know they had a creater, a builder or an engineer. If you look down, or in the mirrior, you would see yourself you know that you exist thus you must have a creater.

False analogy. You're comparing naturally made structures (humans) with man-made structures.

[New Thought Queen]

wicked_fire

x-Starberry-chan-x

You can't convert an athiest just b telling to them to pray and read the book. Its a lot harder than that and anyone that thinks otherwise is wrong.

I'm not athiest but i've heard conversion stories about athiests converting to the mormon or other faiths and it sometimes takes months or years. Athiests are just as strong in my opinion in what the y believe in.

The reason that Athiests and wicans and satanists convert to mormon more often if they convert at all if because mormonism is a little white lie of satans. He uses the book of mormon and redoes many of the main values in the Bible that God has set down. I could show some examples of this but again, I dont have the time right now.

Provide proof that satan is behind mormonism.
Or don't mention it at all.

[Riviera de la Mancha]

dawnofthelight

Riviera de la Mancha

Incorrect. I have proof, but it is not the kind that can make you believe.

It would he as if you had a lover and I asked you to prove to me 100% to such a degree that I had to believe he or she loved you. Any act, any deed, any word you could bring up is not capable of accomplishing this, for any act of love can easily be an act of deception, malice, or veiled hatred. Not a single act of love makes someone epistemically culpable to recognize your love you share with your partner. Does this invalidate your love? No, of course it doesnt, because love, like many things, is not such that it allows for epistemic culpability in the same fashion as many would expect other things to be. Love is something that only exists in your reality. I can recognize it, but that is my own free will, not me being made to agree it is in fact love you share with some person.

Thats why I find it so odd you would ask for proof in that sense.

Subjective proof=/=objective proof. Some subjective claims of emotional abstraction require subjective proof (e.g. 'I am in love'), objective claims require universal and objective proof (e.g. 'God exists').

I never claimed my proof was objective.

God was never intended to be an objective proof, so I too am often baffled by those who seem to think it is. The Bible is full of God doing one chief thing; affording people a change to believe, not forcing them. Even if you view the whole text as a work of fiction, one theme that runs through it is the idea that He does not want to make you do anything. He always uses a human form that chose to see and follow Him.

[tragoedia scelesta]

Funkmasta-Zeph

wicked_fire

dawnofthelight

Riviera de la Mancha

Of course it is the only true God. She bases her view like mine as I see and experience reality. Our God that we share in faith is the only one that is true as life has shown us. I do not intend to prove to you here and now in the sense to make you epistemically culpable to see our God as the one and only one because it is a perspective ultimately you must see to agree with. God has no interest in forcing you to do anything, and that includes believing in Him if you really dont want to do so. In proper form then, it is odd for you to demand proof for a religious belief like you would for th conclusion that 2 + 2= 4. Faith is by design ultimately incapable of creating this effect, for it is far too humanistic.

2+2=4 is an axiom, or automatic principle; 'God exists' is not an axiom or automatic principle, and is a matter of fact claim, thus requiring some form of proof to be knowledge or some type of logical justification to be believed in.

Ok how about this. You see the computer right in front of you, the walls of the house you are in, and so on. You know they exist because you can see them so thus you know they had a creater, a builder or an engineer. If you look down, or in the mirrior, you would see yourself you know that you exist thus you must have a creater.

One of the worst analogies Iv'e heard in a very very long time.

LMAO. Yes; my Mom's egg and my Dad's sperm.

[MercuryChaos]

Riviera de la Mancha

I have proof, but it is not the kind that can make you believe

No, you don't have proof at all. What you have is faith, and that's something else entirely - that is, believing something without proof. I find it funny that religious people say that they are people of faith - essentially, that their beliefs are so strong that they don't feel they need any proof - but then when someone comes along and questions the validity of those beliefs, suddenly the religious texts have become proof. The fact is that theists cannot prove that there is a god any more than atheists can prove that there isn't.

I'm not saying that having faith is a bad thing, but please don't point at your faith and say it's proof - it isn't.

[wicked_fire]

crystal_pepzi

Riviera de la Mancha

xLady-Missiex

wicked_fire

I do understand this and my only answer that I can give to people like that is to read the Bible, all the answers are there.

Funny. The more I read of the Bible the stronger my assertions that it's just a story thus making me a bigger atheist. Maybe you should read the whole thing and see how confused you are.

I have read it many times and it has yet to confuse me in any serious way.

It has always been a source of truth for me. The fact that is confuses you means nothing to me. I happen to be a terrible math student, so if I told you, "This algebra makes no sense. Read the whole thing and you will see how confusing you get!", would that make any sense to you? No, because you could be a great math student, look at it and tell me, "Your really dont get this? Its quite easy for me." My own personal confusion over it has nothing to do with the actual state of the subject I observe, nor does it mandate that you wont get it .

So you've never wondered how a loving god would order genocide? Or why they'd ask their servant to kill his child? Or why god would order men to kill babies, rape women and tear their wombs apart?

Because that's rather confusing to me.

The answers to your questions are in the Bible, as I have told you before. Your thoughts are also worped by what other people have told you as I showed you with the rapeing of the virgin girls.

[Lord Setar]

wicked_fire

x-Starberry-chan-x

You can't convert an athiest just b telling to them to pray and read the book. Its a lot harder than that and anyone that thinks otherwise is wrong.

I'm not athiest but i've heard conversion stories about athiests converting to the mormon or other faiths and it sometimes takes months or years. Athiests are just as strong in my opinion in what the y believe in.

The reason that Athiests and wicans and satanists convert to mormon more often if they convert at all if because mormonism is a little white lie of satans. He uses the book of mormon and redoes many of the main values in the Bible that God has set down. I could show some examples of this but again, I dont have the time right now.

Wait, where are your figures on an increased rate of conversion to Mormonism? Do note that Mormonism is a denomination of Christianity, if the name "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints" hasn't tipped you off enough.

[tragoedia scelesta]

I can't deny the existence of a God. However, I refuse to believe that a person who has lives a good life will go to "hell" solely because he does not believe in "God".

[wicked_fire]

Lord Setar

wicked_fire

x-Starberry-chan-x

You can't convert an athiest just b telling to them to pray and read the book. Its a lot harder than that and anyone that thinks otherwise is wrong.

I'm not athiest but i've heard conversion stories about athiests converting to the mormon or other faiths and it sometimes takes months or years. Athiests are just as strong in my opinion in what the y believe in.

The reason that Athiests and wicans and satanists convert to mormon more often if they convert at all if because mormonism is a little white lie of satans. He uses the book of mormon and redoes many of the main values in the Bible that God has set down. I could show some examples of this but again, I dont have the time right now.

Wait, where are your figures on an increased rate of conversion to Mormonism? Do note that Mormonism is a denomination of Christianity, if the name "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints" hasn't tipped you off enough.

i know that they claim to be christians but i am telling you that they are not. if you want stats and what not read Lucifer Dethroned & Wicca satans little white lie Both by William and Sharon Schnoebelen.

[New Thought Queen]

Riviera de la Mancha

dawnofthelight

Riviera de la Mancha

Incorrect. I have proof, but it is not the kind that can make you believe.

It would he as if you had a lover and I asked you to prove to me 100% to such a degree that I had to believe he or she loved you. Any act, any deed, any word you could bring up is not capable of accomplishing this, for any act of love can easily be an act of deception, malice, or veiled hatred. Not a single act of love makes someone epistemically culpable to recognize your love you share with your partner. Does this invalidate your love? No, of course it doesnt, because love, like many things, is not such that it allows for epistemic culpability in the same fashion as many would expect other things to be. Love is something that only exists in your reality. I can recognize it, but that is my own free will, not me being made to agree it is in fact love you share with some person.

Thats why I find it so odd you would ask for proof in that sense.

Subjective proof=/=objective proof. Some subjective claims of emotional abstraction require subjective proof (e.g. 'I am in love'), objective claims require universal and objective proof (e.g. 'God exists').

I never claimed my proof was objective.

God was never intended to be an objective proof, so I too am often baffled by those who seem to think it is. The Bible is full of God doing one chief thing; affording people a change to believe, not forcing them. Even if you view the whole text as a work of fiction, one theme that runs through it is the idea that He does not want to make you do anything. He always uses a human form that chose to see and follow Him.

Would an unbeliever be sent to hell?

[New Thought Queen]

wicked_fire

Lord Setar

wicked_fire

x-Starberry-chan-x

You can't convert an athiest just b telling to them to pray and read the book. Its a lot harder than that and anyone that thinks otherwise is wrong.

I'm not athiest but i've heard conversion stories about athiests converting to the mormon or other faiths and it sometimes takes months or years. Athiests are just as strong in my opinion in what the y believe in.

The reason that Athiests and wicans and satanists convert to mormon more often if they convert at all if because mormonism is a little white lie of satans. He uses the book of mormon and redoes many of the main values in the Bible that God has set down. I could show some examples of this but again, I dont have the time right now.

Wait, where are your figures on an increased rate of conversion to Mormonism? Do note that Mormonism is a denomination of Christianity, if the name "Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints" hasn't tipped you off enough.

i know that they claim to be christians but i am telling you that they are not. if you want stats and what not read Lucifer Dethroned & Wicca satans little white lie Both by William and Sharon Schnoebelen.

Cite or concede.
Mentioning books is not valid proof on an online debate.

[CH1Y0]

Anything less than a martyrdom is half-assed and the martyrs were condemned by Augustine. I suppose if you follow an orthodox Christianity you might do fine though.

[wicked_fire]

Funkmasta-Zeph

wicked_fire

x-Starberry-chan-x

You can't convert an athiest just b telling to them to pray and read the book. Its a lot harder than that and anyone that thinks otherwise is wrong.

I'm not athiest but i've heard conversion stories about athiests converting to the mormon or other faiths and it sometimes takes months or years. Athiests are just as strong in my opinion in what the y believe in.

The reason that Athiests and wicans and satanists convert to mormon more often if they convert at all if because mormonism is a little white lie of satans. He uses the book of mormon and redoes many of the main values in the Bible that God has set down. I could show some examples of this but again, I dont have the time right now.

Provide proof that satan is behind mormonism.
Or don't mention it at all.

read Lucifer Dethroned And Wicca satans little white lie Both by william and sharon schnoebelen

[Riviera de la Mancha]

xLady-Missiex

Riviera de la Mancha

xLady-Missiex

wicked_fire

I do understand this and my only answer that I can give to people like that is to read the Bible, all the answers are there.

Funny. The more I read of the Bible the stronger my assertions that it's just a story thus making me a bigger atheist. Maybe you should read the whole thing and see how confused you are.

I have read it many times and it has yet to confuse me in any serious way.

It has always been a source of truth for me. The fact that is confuses you means nothing to me. I happen to be a terrible math student, so if I told you, "This algebra makes no sense. Read the whole thing and you will see how confusing you get!", would that make any sense to you? No, because you could be a great math student, look at it and tell me, "Your really dont get this? Its quite easy for me." My own personal confusion over it has nothing to do with the actual state of the subject I observe, nor does it mandate that you wont get it .

You don't get confused as to why "these rules" need to be taken seriously (Kill gays, non-believers, naughty children) while others are needed to be taken in other ways?(No shellfish, pig, clothing made of two different fibers) Why are some ok while others are not?

Don't you think it's a little silly to gain "morals" from a book? I could read a Disney book and get better morals. In fact I think that not needing a book to gain morals proves that I, along with other atheists, have better morals than someone who doesn't do something only because they believe the sky is watching over them every second of every day to catch them doing something naughty so that it can throw them into a huge flaming pit.

It's your hell you burn in it.

No, not really, because I can tell what is a cultural element versus an actual law such a being would ask for.

Things like killing gays are cultural customs that all the bedowin peoples readily believed in, which is why they have died out over the years; they lost their relevance when compared to reality. I follow that which has remained a constant in my life and in the lives I see others live. When I have been in relationships, I do not look at the meaningless acts that people tell me mean love, like buying me a nice toy or a new shirt, because these ideas when studied carry no meaning in my life worthy of seeing it as love. I look to permanent examples, like someone being there for me, or when I have exposed my failures to someone and they continue to support and love me in return. These are permanents that I hold to, just like my faith. Killing gays is a custom that in life has to relevance, while treating others with the care I show myself has never lost its truth in my life or reality.

I also never claimed I gain morals from a book. Like all things, I choose my morals that I follow. Books are like people to me; they make their cases for a given view, and I decide if this is true to reality. As a result, I think anyone who seems to think they are stand alone agents in morality and dont seek the council of others tend to formulate the worse morals. The most educated atheists I know, including a close professor of mine who majored in it among other things, is that they have a voracious reading and dialogue capacity that they use to formulate their morality.