The Abortion Debate

[Aino Ailill]

Heart of the Fallen Angel

[fake smile]

i think its like a double bystandered.
correct me if i am wrong. ..and meh grammer ish like totaly wrong

i know that i am pro choice.
it should be the female's choice to take the babies life b.c there are big responsiblities and when maybe shes in a point of time in her life that she can have this baby and thats all she sees is abortion. but when she has other options like once the baby is born have another home that she can be adopted and make sure that the family she gives the child to is a good one but thinks that abortion will make it easier ((in my point of veiw)) so she wont get to attached to this life inside her. but butbut if she got prego b.c of a guy who raped her then more then likely i would give the baby to a adopted family.

but but but when THE FATHER wants the child. b.c u know there are gewd guys out there who feels like they need to take care of wat they made and did even if its a mistake. anyway if the father wants the to keep the child there should be a law that if u r the legal parent/gaurdian of the child and the mother (for example) doesnt want the to be the prime or share in the care giving of the child then the mother must sign a legal document and should not have to pay for 18yrs b.c of the father (might) use the child for child support (wait i am not sure if a father can do that) for his own use and not in the benieft of the child. she would give all her power of judge ment and rights that is given to her when she has this child to the father of child and move on with her life.

i theres so many things that are argued about this subject of abortion.
and PLUS RELIGION HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE NATION SO LIKE WHEN THE PPL IN THAT R IN ANY KIND OF OFFICE FOR OUR GOV. TRIES TO USE THERE POWER FOR THERE RELIGOUS FAITH TO STOP ABORTION ISH LIKE PSSING MEH THE ******** OFF B.C NOT ALL PPL BELIEAVE IN GOD AND SINS AND ALL OF THIS ....its nonsence to put religous values into dissions of the ppl

Uh, can anyone decipher this post? I can't really make that much sense out of it, and it appears to be all over the place with whatever point it's trying to make.

I gave up.

[Heart of the Fallen Angel]

Aino Ailill

Heart of the Fallen Angel

[fake smile]

i think its like a double bystandered.
correct me if i am wrong. ..and meh grammer ish like totaly wrong

i know that i am pro choice.
it should be the female's choice to take the babies life b.c there are big responsiblities and when maybe shes in a point of time in her life that she can have this baby and thats all she sees is abortion. but when she has other options like once the baby is born have another home that she can be adopted and make sure that the family she gives the child to is a good one but thinks that abortion will make it easier ((in my point of veiw)) so she wont get to attached to this life inside her. but butbut if she got prego b.c of a guy who raped her then more then likely i would give the baby to a adopted family.

but but but when THE FATHER wants the child. b.c u know there are gewd guys out there who feels like they need to take care of wat they made and did even if its a mistake. anyway if the father wants the to keep the child there should be a law that if u r the legal parent/gaurdian of the child and the mother (for example) doesnt want the to be the prime or share in the care giving of the child then the mother must sign a legal document and should not have to pay for 18yrs b.c of the father (might) use the child for child support (wait i am not sure if a father can do that) for his own use and not in the benieft of the child. she would give all her power of judge ment and rights that is given to her when she has this child to the father of child and move on with her life.

i theres so many things that are argued about this subject of abortion.
and PLUS RELIGION HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE NATION SO LIKE WHEN THE PPL IN THAT R IN ANY KIND OF OFFICE FOR OUR GOV. TRIES TO USE THERE POWER FOR THERE RELIGOUS FAITH TO STOP ABORTION ISH LIKE PSSING MEH THE ******** OFF B.C NOT ALL PPL BELIEAVE IN GOD AND SINS AND ALL OF THIS ....its nonsence to put religous values into dissions of the ppl

Uh, can anyone decipher this post? I can't really make that much sense out of it, and it appears to be all over the place with whatever point it's trying to make.

I gave up.

Yeah, I seriously don't know whether to pick this post apart, or compliment it, cause it reads like something a 4 year old wrote.

[Lady Miyo]

Heart of the Fallen Angel

Aino Ailill

Heart of the Fallen Angel

Uh, can anyone decipher this post? I can't really make that much sense out of it, and it appears to be all over the place with whatever point it's trying to make.

I gave up.

Yeah, I seriously don't know whether to pick this post apart, or compliment it, cause it reads like something a 4 year old wrote.

Eh, it's prolly a drive by posting anyways, I wouldn't worry too much about it.

[Pickle Me Tink]

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

[Kata Samoes]

Heart of the Fallen Angel

fake smile

i think its like a double bystandered.
correct me if i am wrong. ..and meh grammer ish like totaly wrong

i know that i am pro choice.
it should be the female's choice to take the babies life b.c there are big responsiblities and when maybe shes in a point of time in her life that she can have this baby and thats all she sees is abortion. but when she has other options like once the baby is born have another home that she can be adopted and make sure that the family she gives the child to is a good one but thinks that abortion will make it easier ((in my point of veiw)) so she wont get to attached to this life inside her. but butbut if she got prego b.c of a guy who raped her then more then likely i would give the baby to a adopted family.

but but but when THE FATHER wants the child. b.c u know there are gewd guys out there who feels like they need to take care of wat they made and did even if its a mistake. anyway if the father wants the to keep the child there should be a law that if u r the legal parent/gaurdian of the child and the mother (for example) doesnt want the to be the prime or share in the care giving of the child then the mother must sign a legal document and should not have to pay for 18yrs b.c of the father (might) use the child for child support (wait i am not sure if a father can do that) for his own use and not in the benieft of the child. she would give all her power of judge ment and rights that is given to her when she has this child to the father of child and move on with her life.

i theres so many things that are argued about this subject of abortion.
and PLUS RELIGION HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE NATION SO LIKE WHEN THE PPL IN THAT R IN ANY KIND OF OFFICE FOR OUR GOV. TRIES TO USE THERE POWER FOR THERE RELIGOUS FAITH TO STOP ABORTION ISH LIKE PSSING MEH THE ******** OFF B.C NOT ALL PPL BELIEAVE IN GOD AND SINS AND ALL OF THIS ....its nonsence to put religous values into dissions of the ppl

Uh, can anyone decipher this post? I can't really make that much sense out of it, and it appears to be all over the place with whatever point it's trying to make.

Okay.

"I think it's like a double standard.
Correct me if I'm wrong, and my grammar is totally wrong:

I know that I am pro-choice.
It should be the female's choice to take the baby's fetus's life because there are big responsibilities and when maybe she's at a point in her life that she can't have a baby and that's all she sees as her choice is getting an abortion. However, when she has other options like adoption and making sure that the family is a good one but thinks that abortion will make it easier (in my point of view), so she wont get to attached to the fetus inside her. But but but if she got pregnant because she got raped, then more than likely I would give the baby to an adopting family.

But but but, when THE FATHER wants to keep the pregnancy because, you know, there are good guys out there who feel like they need to take care of what they made if it's an accident. Anyway, if the father wants to keep the pregnancy there should be a law saying that if you're the legal parent/gaurdian of the child, and the mother (for example) doesn't want the to be the primary or share custody for the child, then the mother must sign a legal document and should not have to pay for 18+ years of childcare, because the father (might) use the child for child support (Wait, I'm not sure if a father can do that) for his own use and not in the benefit of the child. She would then give over custody to the father of child and move on with her life.

I think there's so many things that are argued about this subject of abortion.
Plus, religion has nothing to do with the nation, so when the people in the government try to use their power in favor of their faith to stop abortion, it pisses me the ******** off. Not everyone believes in God and all that. It's nonsense to put religious values into decisions for the people."

Does that help?

[Chocolatey Sprinkles]

Pickle Me Tink

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

That doesn't really scream pro-choice to me. If she gets pregnant, who are you to say that she HAS to go to the clinic? What if she doesn't believe in abortion? And where's a condom in all of this sleeping around? Why not pay for a $5 box of condoms instead of a $500 abortion?

If you don't want to be a father prematurely, wear a condom and ask if she's on birth control. It won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk. But if she gets pregnant, it is HER choice to make to abort, not your's.

[Aino Ailill]

RubberDuckOfHell

Pickle Me Tink

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

That doesn't really scream pro-choice to me. If she gets pregnant, who are you to say that she HAS to go to the clinic? What if she doesn't believe in abortion? And where's a condom in all of this sleeping around? Why not pay for a $5 box of condoms instead of a $500 abortion?

If you don't want to be a father prematurely, wear a condom and ask if she's on birth control. It won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk. But if she gets pregnant, it is HER choice to make to abort, not your's.

"Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic."

In other words, he and his partner have discussed the possibility of pregnancy and he has made clear his position. If she does not agree with it, than she can not risk sex with him. It is her choice, but he is only choosing to have sex with those who would make the choice.

Also, never was it said that he does not use contraceptives. Given that he takes the time to make clear his position on fatherhood prior to sex, I would not find it unreasonable to assume he does use it.

[Pickle Me Tink]

RubberDuckOfHell

Pickle Me Tink

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

That doesn't really scream pro-choice to me. If she gets pregnant, who are you to say that she HAS to go to the clinic? What if she doesn't believe in abortion? And where's a condom in all of this sleeping around? Why not pay for a $5 box of condoms instead of a $500 abortion?

If you don't want to be a father prematurely, wear a condom and ask if she's on birth control. It won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk. But if she gets pregnant, it is HER choice to make to abort, not your's.

Birth control fails. Thanks for assuming that it doesn't and I don't use it, that means every woman who gets pregnant was obviously too stupid to use birth control, right? Or do you only say that to men who get women pregnant, because you spent about half of your post assuming I don't use them. If she doesn't believe in abortion, I won't have sex with her, obviously. I make it very clear, I won't have sex if she won't abort any pregnancies.

It's her choice of course, but it affects me, and without abortion, I'd be screwed. I'm glad it's around, and glad it's not too hard to persuade women to choose it, because it really is no big deal, and being logical is enough to convince the smart ones. I want reproductive freedom. You don't tell women that they shouldn't have abortions, they need to think about the consequences before they have sex. Don't tell me the same thing. It doesn't scream pro-choice to completely disregard my choice, my right to reproductive freedom, and my own financial and emotional situation. But you wear the title like a banner. The truth is, we're on the same side...we want abortion legal, for different reasons. You want women to be able to choose abortion, I want women to be able to choose abortion and have their partners weigh in on it. True, I want to get rid of child support altogether since women can opt out of the financial burden of raising a child but men can't, but for now, I'm fine being careful with who I have sex with.

Edit: By weigh in on, I mean their choice should have some say in legal procedures related to it, like, deciding how much of my money I need to shell out every month.

[Aino Ailill]

Pickle Me Tink

RubberDuckOfHell

Pickle Me Tink

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

That doesn't really scream pro-choice to me. If she gets pregnant, who are you to say that she HAS to go to the clinic? What if she doesn't believe in abortion? And where's a condom in all of this sleeping around? Why not pay for a $5 box of condoms instead of a $500 abortion?

If you don't want to be a father prematurely, wear a condom and ask if she's on birth control. It won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk. But if she gets pregnant, it is HER choice to make to abort, not your's.

Birth control fails. Thanks for assuming that it doesn't and I don't use it, that means every woman who gets pregnant was obviously too stupid to use birth control, right? Or do you only say that to men who get women pregnant, because you spent about half of your post assuming I don't use them. If she doesn't believe in abortion, I won't have sex with her, obviously. I make it very clear, I won't have sex if she won't abort any pregnancies.

It's her choice of course, but it affects me, and without abortion, I'd be screwed. I'm glad it's around, and glad it's not too hard to persuade women to choose it, because it really is no big deal, and being logical is enough to convince the smart ones. I want reproductive freedom. You don't tell women that they shouldn't have abortions, they need to think about the consequences before they have sex. Don't tell me the same thing. It doesn't scream pro-choice to completely disregard my choice, my right to reproductive freedom, and my own financial and emotional situation. But you wear the title like a banner. The truth is, we're on the same side...we want abortion legal, for different reasons. You want women to be able to choose abortion, I want women to be able to choose abortion and have their partners weigh in on it. True, I want to get rid of child support altogether since women can opt out of the financial burden of raising a child but men can't, but for now, I'm fine being careful with who I have sex with.

The partner weighs in on it? Legally or otherwise? As otherwise is granted with the freedom of Speech and Expression. Legally, there are issues.

[vanilabien]

Sadly, the only way the abortion debate can be settled is if someone can scientifically prove that the unborn child is an alive human being, protected to a right to life. And then prove at what stage it is of this status. Or even prove that it is not an alive human being, and even that would be hard to do. People asserting that unborn children have a soul will make little difference to a government that like to keep religious politics out.

[Pickle Me Tink]

Aino Ailill

Pickle Me Tink

RubberDuckOfHell

Pickle Me Tink

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

That doesn't really scream pro-choice to me. If she gets pregnant, who are you to say that she HAS to go to the clinic? What if she doesn't believe in abortion? And where's a condom in all of this sleeping around? Why not pay for a $5 box of condoms instead of a $500 abortion?

If you don't want to be a father prematurely, wear a condom and ask if she's on birth control. It won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk. But if she gets pregnant, it is HER choice to make to abort, not your's.

Birth control fails. Thanks for assuming that it doesn't and I don't use it, that means every woman who gets pregnant was obviously too stupid to use birth control, right? Or do you only say that to men who get women pregnant, because you spent about half of your post assuming I don't use them. If she doesn't believe in abortion, I won't have sex with her, obviously. I make it very clear, I won't have sex if she won't abort any pregnancies.

It's her choice of course, but it affects me, and without abortion, I'd be screwed. I'm glad it's around, and glad it's not too hard to persuade women to choose it, because it really is no big deal, and being logical is enough to convince the smart ones. I want reproductive freedom. You don't tell women that they shouldn't have abortions, they need to think about the consequences before they have sex. Don't tell me the same thing. It doesn't scream pro-choice to completely disregard my choice, my right to reproductive freedom, and my own financial and emotional situation. But you wear the title like a banner. The truth is, we're on the same side...we want abortion legal, for different reasons. You want women to be able to choose abortion, I want women to be able to choose abortion and have their partners weigh in on it. True, I want to get rid of child support altogether since women can opt out of the financial burden of raising a child but men can't, but for now, I'm fine being careful with who I have sex with.

The partner weighs in on it? Legally or otherwise? As otherwise is granted with the freedom of Speech and Expression. Legally, there are issues.

Like, say I can't afford a child. I should be able to, while a woman is pregnant, at the beginning, or beforehand sign a document, saying I am in no position to pay, pregnancy was not the intention of sex, and she's the one who decided to keep the pregnancy, therefore I shouldn't be responsible on the financial end. This may sound stupid, but finances is a reason some women abort. I think I should get a choice where that is concerned.

I'm not heartless, I don't want kids and women to starve, but when I have sex, pregnancy is not what I want the outcome to be, and I don't want to deal with it when women have a way out. Yes, their way out takes a toll on their bodies, but if I could get pregnant, I would abort for financial reasons despite that, because it would be worth it to me.

[Kata Samoes]

Aino Ailill

RubberDuckOfHell

Pickle Me Tink

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

That doesn't really scream pro-choice to me. If she gets pregnant, who are you to say that she HAS to go to the clinic? What if she doesn't believe in abortion? And where's a condom in all of this sleeping around? Why not pay for a $5 box of condoms instead of a $500 abortion?

If you don't want to be a father prematurely, wear a condom and ask if she's on birth control. It won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk. But if she gets pregnant, it is HER choice to make to abort, not your's.

"Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic."

In other words, he and his partner have discussed the possibility of pregnancy and he has made clear his position. If she does not agree with it, than she can not risk sex with him. It is her choice, but he is only choosing to have sex with those who would make the choice.

Many women will have sex with guys regardless of the guy wanting an abortion, and may not abort if she gets pregnant for whatever reason. This still happens, so the argument still stands.

[Kata Samoes]

Pickle Me Tink

RubberDuckOfHell

Pickle Me Tink

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

That doesn't really scream pro-choice to me. If she gets pregnant, who are you to say that she HAS to go to the clinic? What if she doesn't believe in abortion? And where's a condom in all of this sleeping around? Why not pay for a $5 box of condoms instead of a $500 abortion?

If you don't want to be a father prematurely, wear a condom and ask if she's on birth control. It won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk. But if she gets pregnant, it is HER choice to make to abort, not your's.

Birth control fails. Thanks for assuming that it doesn't and I don't use it, that means every woman who gets pregnant was obviously too stupid to use birth control, right? Or do you only say that to men who get women pregnant, because you spent about half of your post assuming I don't use them. If she doesn't believe in abortion, I won't have sex with her, obviously. I make it very clear, I won't have sex if she won't abort any pregnancies.

You seemed to have missed the bolded, and attacked her for an assumption she didn't make. What did was grasp at straws, which is just not cool in a debate.

Besides, what if she lied to you?

[Chocolatey Sprinkles]

Pickle Me Tink

RubberDuckOfHell

Pickle Me Tink

Pro-choice because I don't want to be a father. I can have sex all I want, why should I be punished for it? I don't want to pay child support for 18 years. Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic. I'll pay, but I won't sleep with a girl who might make me a father. If they took away abortion, I can't really tell her to get an illegal abortion. The only time it was an issue was when someone went back on her word and decided to keep it, but I reasoned with her. I was scared I'd be forced to be a father though, and I don't think I should have to live with that fear.

That doesn't really scream pro-choice to me. If she gets pregnant, who are you to say that she HAS to go to the clinic? What if she doesn't believe in abortion? And where's a condom in all of this sleeping around? Why not pay for a $5 box of condoms instead of a $500 abortion?

If you don't want to be a father prematurely, wear a condom and ask if she's on birth control. It won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk. But if she gets pregnant, it is HER choice to make to abort, not your's.

Birth control fails. Thanks for assuming that it doesn't and I don't use it, that means every woman who gets pregnant was obviously too stupid to use birth control, right? Or do you only say that to men who get women pregnant, because you spent about half of your post assuming I don't use them. If she doesn't believe in abortion, I won't have sex with her, obviously. I make it very clear, I won't have sex if she won't abort any pregnancies.

I am fully aware that birth control fails and that condoms fail too. If you would read again I said "it won't completely stop her from getting pregnant, but it lessens the risk".

Quote:

It's her choice of course, but it affects me, and without abortion, I'd be screwed. I'm glad it's around, and glad it's not too hard to persuade women to choose it, because it really is no big deal, and being logical is enough to convince the smart ones. I want reproductive freedom. You don't tell women that they shouldn't have abortions, they need to think about the consequences before they have sex. Don't tell me the same thing. It doesn't scream pro-choice to completely disregard my choice, my right to reproductive freedom, and my own financial and emotional situation. But you wear the title like a banner. The truth is, we're on the same side...we want abortion legal, for different reasons. You want women to be able to choose abortion, I want women to be able to choose abortion and have their partners weigh in on it. True, I want to get rid of child support altogether since women can opt out of the financial burden of raising a child but men can't, but for now, I'm fine being careful with who I have sex with.

I mean that's fine. Your post, however, seemed to say "You're pregnant, you're aborting". Some women do change their mind however, as you seem to have experienced. But some might just want to carry it to term and then put it up for adoption, which to me is not the best alternative, but if that's what she wants, then I don't see why anyone should stop her. Now if she carried it to term and then decided to raise the child herself, then yeah, you would kind of have a problem. Sorry about my response to your first post, it's just your first post sounded a little funny.

Aino Ailill

"Girls dating me know before we have sex, if she gets pregnant, it's off to the clinic."

In other words, he and his partner have discussed the possibility of pregnancy and he has made clear his position. If she does not agree with it, than she can not risk sex with him. It is her choice, but he is only choosing to have sex with those who would make the choice.

But again, what if she changes her mind? What if, after she's pregnant and going to get an abortion, has last minute doubts and wants to keep it or something?

Quote:

Also, never was it said that he does not use contraceptives. Given that he takes the time to make clear his position on fatherhood prior to sex, I would not find it unreasonable to assume he does use it.

And again, that's true, you'd think that contraceptives would be a given, but you never really know. I know guys who have the same stand-point as him, but don't wear a condom as long as he knows that the girl is on birth control. Now, I am not saying that all guys are that stupid, and I'm not saying that Pickle Me Tink is either, but it's always a possibility that he could not want to wear a condom for the better feel. So I didn't really mean to sound like...well like a b***h. If that's how it came off, I'm sorry Pickle Me Tink.

[Heart of the Fallen Angel]

vanilabien

Sadly, the only way the abortion debate can be settled is if someone can scientifically prove that the unborn child is an alive human being, protected to a right to life. And then prove at what stage it is of this status. Or even prove that it is not an alive human being, and even that would be hard to do. People asserting that unborn children have a soul will make little difference to a government that like to keep religious politics out.

No one is debating that a fetus isn't alive. Fetii are living entities of the human species, that much is fact and has been scientifically proven. The issue however is that no human has the right to use a portion of my body without my expressed and ongoing consent.

For example, I am having consentual sex with a man. Half way through, I decide I want him to stop, and tell him to do so. He does not stop, at this point he is now raping me, and I can kill him if necesary to make him stop. Why should a fetus gain rights to use my body without my consent when no other human has that right.