The Abortion Debate

[Kata Samoes]

sachiko_sohma

ShadowIce

sachiko_sohma

Maybe not, but you wouldn't seem like a very good person if you let them starve to death if you had plenty.

Countless people die of starvation every single day. Tens of thousands of children will die today from starvation and preventable diseases resulting from hunger. You and I didn't help them. We could have saved them, but we didn't. Instead, we bought a computer. We bought a TV. We bought expensive packaged food. It may not be fun to face the realization that we could save people and don't, but it's true.

How do you know I didn't help anyone? I can't help the whole world but I do help people when I can. I didn't buy the t.v., my parents did.

How do you know who has and who hasn't helped anyone? How do you know how selfish a person is?

You don't. You can't judge.

[+the_pink_blueberry+]

sachiko_sohma

Rinaqa

Look, if I was pregnant, and wanted an abortion, you wouldn't know, and you wouldn't affect my life. And it's already been pointed out - right to bodily integrity > right to life.

If I did get pregnant, you could tell me to give my baby up for adoption - only if you want to pay for my pregnancy and my baby until it is adopted.

A fetus, is not your body, just in it. I'm not stopping anyone, just tired of people saying "it's my body" when it clearly is not YOUR body, just using it.

It doesn't matter that the fetus isn't part of the mother's body.

Example: Person A has a house. Non-human living organism B enters that house. Person A has the right to remove non-human living organism B from that house, as it is her house.

Now, instead of a house, it's her womb, and non-human organism B is her unwanted fetus. She has the right to remove the fetus from her body (remember, a fetus does not have the rights of a human, only the potential to gain these rights), because it is her body. So the "My body" argument does work, because it is a reference to an unwanted guest in her body, whom she has the right to expel.

[DarkFire168]

sachiko_sohma

ShadowIce

divineseraph

no. i am not taking bread by not donating- i am not giving bread either. it is a neutral relationship. did i literally walk up to the poor and steal their food, then it would be murder. and calling it "indirect killing"- look at the bullet analogy. by that logic, your logic, shooting someone is not bad, as YOU didn't kill them, the BULLET did.

If a poor person started stealing my food and I stopped them, and their not having food access to my food caused them to die, I would not be charged with murder.

The embryo doesn't have food independently of me and then I decide to take away this independently obtained food through abortion. The embryo is taking my food from my body without my consent. I am simply choosing not to donate my food from my body to the embryo, just as you are choosing not to donate bread to the poor man.

Maybe not, but you wouldn't seem like a very good person if you let them starve to death if you had plenty.

Now now Sachiko, lets not get into the Morality slippery slope here.

[ShadowIce]

sachiko_sohma

How do you know I didn't help anyone? I can't help the whole world but I do help people when I can. I didn't buy the t.v., my parents did.

I didn't say you didn't help anyone. But I will bet that you have bought something you didn't need (or if you have no money because you are a minor with no job, then you had your parents buy something for you that you didn't need). And I bet that you will do so again. Every time you buy something you don't need to survive (or have someone buy something for you that you don't need to survive) you are choosing material possessions over someone's life. You may never see them, you may never know their name, but they died because you didn't help them. It's the same thing for me. And practically every other USA citizen in existance. It has been said that for the first time in world history we could end world hunger if we just put the resources into doing so . . . but we don't. Instead, we buy lip gloss and soda pop. We have our groceries put into expensive packaging and then throw the packaging away. We buy posters for our walls. We buy games. We go to movies. We buy CDs. We let people die. I'm not saying that you are a bad person for doing this, it's just human nature and it's reality. If everyone sat down and realized we could save people if we just used our money to vaccinate children in third world countries rather than buy perfume, then maybe someday people will actually sit down and do it. But while people sit around and make excuses about how it isn't their fault, about how it isn't them who carries the blame, we will get nowhere because no one will do anything. Everyone will keep passing the buck.

I guess I'm saying I don't think it is consistant to say someone is a bad person for not giving up 9 months of their life along with thousands of dollars, risks to their health and life and future, and constant physical discomfort to help one "person" when we don't even do a sixth of that to help hundreds.

[Turtle Dove]

Also It really depends on how far along the pregnancy the woman is.
I am pro choice.. there are so many situations when a pregnancy can ruin a girls life.. like if she's a preteen (giving birth could kill her) or if she's in high school.. (she would have to drop out.)
most teenage pregnancies end with a break up between the partners too..

[CAPTAIN Plixy[Stix]]

Turtle Dove

Also It really depends on how far along the pregnancy the woman is.
I am pro choice.. there are so many situations when a pregnancy can ruin a girls life.. like if she's a preteen (giving birth could kill her) or if she's in high school.. (she would have to drop out.)
most teenage pregnancies end with a break up between the partners too..

Abortion is legal in the first trimester, second is an iffy, and third is for medical reasons.

What do you think of married women aborting?

[Moniquill]

Turtle Dove

Also It really depends on how far along the pregnancy the woman is.
I am pro choice.. there are so many situations when a pregnancy can ruin a girls life.. like if she's a preteen (giving birth could kill her) or if she's in high school.. (she would have to drop out.)
most teenage pregnancies end with a break up between the partners too..

While this is 100% valid, I do feel the need to point out that only 19% of abortions are performed on women under 20.

[Turtle Dove]

Humanity is like a virus.. a disease. we're choking our plannet and killing our host. We are a deadly thing..

[Turtle Dove]

Moniquill

Turtle Dove

Also It really depends on how far along the pregnancy the woman is.
I am pro choice.. there are so many situations when a pregnancy can ruin a girls life.. like if she's a preteen (giving birth could kill her) or if she's in high school.. (she would have to drop out.)
most teenage pregnancies end with a break up between the partners too..

While this is 100% valid, I do feel the need to point out that only 19% of abortions are performed on women under 20.

Still.. I think it's up to the woman to choose.. I dont think it's fair, really. I mean its our body.. and there are so many unwanted children in the world.. i'm pro adoption too smile

[Turtle Dove]

[I am teh Haruka]

Turtle Dove

Also It really depends on how far along the pregnancy the woman is.
I am pro choice.. there are so many situations when a pregnancy can ruin a girls life.. like if she's a preteen (giving birth could kill her) or if she's in high school.. (she would have to drop out.)
most teenage pregnancies end with a break up between the partners too..

Abortion is legal in the first trimester, second is an iffy, and third is for medical reasons.

What do you think of married women aborting?

I think that parents should be ready to have a child when they are going to have one. I have a friend whose parents dont love her at all.. she is their seccond child. I think that parents should be commited and prepared before having a child..
I sort of ruined my mom's plans for herself because she had to raise me.. I still feel bad about it..even though I couldn't really help it.. bad example, I know.. but yeah.

[Issabee]

ShadowIce

sachiko_sohma

How do you know I didn't help anyone? I can't help the whole world but I do help people when I can. I didn't buy the t.v., my parents did.

It has been said that for the first time in world history we could end world hunger if we just put the resources into doing so . . . but we don't.

That's exactly right. If every person living above the poverty line donated just $1 a month, they would raise billions every single month.

[CAPTAIN Plixy[Stix]]

Turtle Dove

[I am teh Haruka]

Turtle Dove

Also It really depends on how far along the pregnancy the woman is.
I am pro choice.. there are so many situations when a pregnancy can ruin a girls life.. like if she's a preteen (giving birth could kill her) or if she's in high school.. (she would have to drop out.)
most teenage pregnancies end with a break up between the partners too..

Abortion is legal in the first trimester, second is an iffy, and third is for medical reasons.

What do you think of married women aborting?

I think that parents should be ready to have a child when they are going to have one. I have a friend whose parents dont love her at all.. she is their seccond child. I think that parents should be commited and prepared before having a child..
I sort of ruined my mom's plans for herself because she had to raise me.. I still feel bad about it..even though I couldn't really help it.. bad example, I know.. but yeah.

Sex is used for more than reproduction. Sometimes the birth control will fail.

[Turtle Dove]

Issabee

ShadowIce

sachiko_sohma

How do you know I didn't help anyone? I can't help the whole world but I do help people when I can. I didn't buy the t.v., my parents did.

It has been said that for the first time in world history we could end world hunger if we just put the resources into doing so . . . but we don't.

That's exactly right. If every person living above the poverty line donated just $1 a month, they would raise billions every single month.

Sometimes humanity makes me sick.. we are destroying the planet, you know. Like cancer, we are killing off our host. slowly but surely

[ShadowIce]

[I am teh Haruka]

Sex is used for more than reproduction. Sometimes the birth control will fail.

I think what she was saying (and maybe I'm wrong) is that people shouldn't give birth if they aren't ready for a child. Not that they shouldn't have sex.

But I could be wrong. ninja

[[ I Break For Beavers ]]

Turtle Dove

Also It really depends on how far along the pregnancy the woman is.
I am pro choice.. there are so many situations when a pregnancy can ruin a girls life.. like if she's a preteen (giving birth could kill her) or if she's in high school.. (she would have to drop out.)
most teenage pregnancies end with a break up between the partners too..

I don't think that's normally the case..