my lack of gay pride offends straight people

[Sin Error]

Gordums

TaoShaman

I'm not saying that people shouldn't try to change things. And in the civil rights movement there were many people that chose to peacefully state their concerns and tried to change things without screaming at the top of their lungs without giving any reasoning or alternatives. What I'm saying is that it is unrealistic to just expect people to bow to your opinion just because you want them to. Sometimes to reason with people you have to follow their rules. And there's also the fact that you can't change everyone's opinon. There's still racism, there's still sexism. You can try to change the majority's opinion, but there will always be a minority that you cannot change. Like do the majority of people really protest against gay rights? No,most people really are at least indifferent. That small portion that is doing the protesting probably aren't going to change. The people to try to influence are the indifferent people, they don't really have an opinion and are probably more open to listening.

It is unrealistic to make people change their opinions because we want them to, but that's why we need to be engaged and create this discussion and dissent, be visible and activated, including protests. Get them to know that as a minority community, we do have rights as human beings and to encourage acceptance with diversity. There will be some people who will still hold negative notions, but as long as we encourage this acceptance, we can eventually overturn those opinions. For example, owning slaves is no longer an issue where as about 2 centuries ago, it was moral to own slaves of your own race.
My point is that I find it problematic when you say things won't change because life is constantly changing. When you say things won;t ever change, that simply belittles the movement and does nothing good for us. You degrade our potentials as human beings to create change. You may not see it because of whatever privileges or experiences you have in life, but changes are there. Even if we aren't changing, it's important for us to keep up what we are doing because if we stand down, we will get run over.

Nettles Hart

Haha, hi! I love you too! ^^

I'm sorry, I just get really passionate about this subject. sweatdrop

Haha I also do get passionate in issues like these cool

Sin Error

I don't really have pride for being gay...I mean should I? should I aslo have pride for having black hair? or for having brown eyes? maybe pride for being white or ******** that s**t, though no hate on the people who do have pride and if I get the chance to go to a parade, I will. beacuse I do support them, I mean gays get enough hate already, so I see this pride thing as an event where they can express themselves and show the world that eveybody is different and that no matter what they do, we won't go away. Gay parades will go on as long as theres hate for gays and that's it.

also yes, those people seem a little too supportive...in a ignorant kinda way.

ALSO STOP FLIPPIN SHITS MAN.

Peace and love.

I think you should have pride in who you are, rather than focusing on specifics - which is the point of the pride parades. People are different and because are not normal and don't fit in a shoebox, we don't register as proper, but instead as weird. I don't know who you are, but I do trust that you are a human being and lives and breathes and bleeds red blood like mine. You and I are made of the same type of building blocks but what sets us apart is not only different physical features which are minute, but rather, you as a person and myself as a person. Nobody will ever be YOU because of your lived experiences inside your own lived body, and thus I will never be able to understand you because I have lived my own different experiences from my own body. This unique property of autonomy is something so valuable it can never be replicated or destroyed because no matter how you change as a person, I can never be you. The fact that your autonomy can do things, move things, create, discuss, destroy, and a whole host of other verbs makes you somebody that can change in life. That in itself, is something that you should take pride in, along with many other things.

When you put it that way...
nice choice of words, truly remarkable. I salute you smile
though you gotta make sure that pride doesn't consume you.  

[--Untoten Kase--]

All I need is one star in the sky...

Uhm, I really don't wanna get in an argument... So, I'll say what I came here to say, and hope that no one gets offended. (Cause from some experience in this guild, everyone seems a bit sensitive. No offense, I'm a bit sensitive too.)

First, to the point of this thread:
Those people sound to me like the kind of fanatics who shove their thoughts down people's throats to get them on their side. And believe me, I've dealt with sh*t over and over. (i.e, when I went to the 2009 Mayhem Festival. Marilyn Manson was headlining the main stage, and a bunch of fanatic religious Christians were protesting. Not that I have a problem, this is just an example.)
Don't listen to them. Just be who you are, and if anyone tells you what to think of yourself or what to make others think of you, screw them. It's your life. Live it YOUR way. :3

Second:
I agree with Nettles Hart. She has a really good point. The whole idea is to express who you are. And, I've never been to one of the parades. Mostly cause I don't think any of them go around where I live. Or I just never hear of any coming near. But, from what I hear about them, it seems to be for 3 things.
1. Expressing yourself
2. Having fun
3. Showing others that you don't give 2 shits about what they think, and you'll be gay/lesbian/bi no matter what others think.
But that's just what I THINK.

...Wish for you every night.

 

[TyDaCat]

My signature is proof I have my pride. I am the right person, even though I am not am decorated as I wanted, Gay pride is about taking pride in you GLBTTQ* community. *Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, Transexual, Two-spirited, Queer*  

[Gordums]

Taeryyn

I certainly don't hate myself for my sexuality, and I have no issue with people who represent the more...flamboyant side of our community. That said, I wouldn't say I have much "gay pride". I'm not proud of the fact that I like apples, and likewise I don't feel proud that I like men. Doesn't mean I'm ashamed, though.

Our pride parade here is pretty tame. Just a couple of local community groups marching with lots of rainbow banners and balloons, some glitter, and then a barbeque afterwards. Nothing extreme. *shrug* Not all pride parades are full of scantily-clad dancers and drag queens. Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with either type of parade. I don't really think it makes sense to try and amputate or hide the groups in the LGBT community that don't measure up to some arbitrary "normal" standard. For one thing, it's hateful, and for another, it's deceitful.


Unrelated to the topic at hand, I am really disappointed by the catty insults being thrown around. :/

That ellipsis before "the more flamboyant side" somewhat irked me. Are you sure you don't have issues with "that side" of the queer community? If you need to pause to think of a way to describe them, that does appear as an issue in my opinion.
But you are right, nobody should be excluded from the pride parade, and that's exactly what it is about. Pride for inclusion. No matter what background you have you are welcome. Whether you defy your societal gender role or not or whatever, have pride in yourself. Whether you're flaming gay or cold straight.
And yes, the catty comments are displeasing. They steer us from a discussion and dissent to attacks.

lgtenos

Lol, there isn't much homophobia. Conservatism is only deemed upon the county as a whole. Actually, the only reason why we're deemed conservative is because we have an extremely high population of elderly (who are, by assumption, more inclined to conservative points of view).

However, from my experiences (and the experiences of others), most of the population really doesn't give a damn about the LGBT community. We're all so caught up in the glamor that is Orange County that we succeed in realizing that such minor differences hardly make a dent in the overall community.

I think it is unfair to say there isn't much homophobia because you yourself may not be experiencing it or seeing it, but many others guaranteed are experiencing it and many of them aren't disclosing it
If your population is mostly conservatives, then your social attitude as a country is affected by the majority of populace - rather, the people. But there are many many conservatives who are in our generation, you jsut may not have come across them.
If the population doesn't give a damn about the LGBT community, then we need to make them give a damn. There are so many injustices that are done to the queer community that people don't care about, and it's important to get people to care.

 

[Matasoga]

This reminds me of a conversation in my guild that is at least tangentially related, where I said "It would be best to see gay pride events disappear because they are only necessitated by a society that perpetuates the idea of gay shame. If gay pride events were no longer there it would mean that gay shame was no longer a strong force in modern society.
"Of course the idea that one is deficient or that there is something wrong with gays must disappear first. It won't go away just because gay pride has, so make no mistake: I am not advocating that gay pride be done away with in the hopes of making a more acceptable society. It doesn't work like that, as I'm sure we all realize."  

[Shanna66]

lgtenos

Shanna66

oh wow, hope you dont get too much homophobia over there sad

Lol, there isn't much homophobia. Conservatism is only deemed upon the county as a whole. Actually, the only reason why we're deemed conservative is because we have an extremely high population of elderly (who are, by assumption, more inclined to conservative points of view).

However, from my experiences (and the experiences of others), most of the population really doesn't give a damn about the LGBT community. We're all so caught up in the glamor that is Orange County that we succeed in realizing that such minor differences hardly make a dent in the overall community.

well i suppose thats good ^.^  

[lgtenos]

Gordums

If the population doesn't give a damn about the LGBT community, then we need to make them give a damn. There are so many injustices that are done to the queer community that people don't care about, and it's important to get people to care.

Lolz~ What I meant to say was: homosexuality is not that big of a deal here. Yes, of course we get a few crazy nut-jobs who post their hatred towards our community, but, for the most part, they go unnoticed [from all parties]. I think it's a GOOD thing people don't care about the LGBT. It shows that we're becoming so mainstream that same-sex ideas are evolving into the norm.

Again, this is my area. Not so sure about your respective areas.  

[Shilberu Erikku]

Isn't pride the same thing as arrogance?  

[Shanna66]

Shilberu Erikku

Isn't pride the same thing as arrogance?

not really. in some cases sure but not in all. just like hate is not the same as murder, sometimes one can lead to the other but they dont always go hand in hand  

[Gordums]

lgtenos

Gordums

If the population doesn't give a damn about the LGBT community, then we need to make them give a damn. There are so many injustices that are done to the queer community that people don't care about, and it's important to get people to care.

Lolz~ What I meant to say was: homosexuality is not that big of a deal here. Yes, of course we get a few crazy nut-jobs who post their hatred towards our community, but, for the most part, they go unnoticed [from all parties]. I think it's a GOOD thing people don't care about the LGBT. It shows that we're becoming so mainstream that same-sex ideas are evolving into the norm.

Again, this is my area. Not so sure about your respective areas.

When people do straight hate, people fight back. When people make racial comments they fight back. But people make hateful homophobic comments and people don't fight back. Regardless whether because of a homophobic or racial or hateful comment period, we should all be fighting back. That apathy isn't because we are evolving into the norm. That apathy is bacause we aren't PART of the norm.
Just because we have less prominent homophobic violence in our areas than other places doesn't mean we should not be outraged. If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention. Hate needs to stop period, no matter where it is and who it is from. Homophobic violence shouldn't even be happening and that why we need to fight back. pirate

 

[Shanna66]

Gordums

lgtenos

Gordums

If the population doesn't give a damn about the LGBT community, then we need to make them give a damn. There are so many injustices that are done to the queer community that people don't care about, and it's important to get people to care.

Lolz~ What I meant to say was: homosexuality is not that big of a deal here. Yes, of course we get a few crazy nut-jobs who post their hatred towards our community, but, for the most part, they go unnoticed [from all parties]. I think it's a GOOD thing people don't care about the LGBT. It shows that we're becoming so mainstream that same-sex ideas are evolving into the norm.

Again, this is my area. Not so sure about your respective areas.

When people do straight hate, people fight back. When people make racial comments they fight back. But people make hateful homophobic comments and people don't fight back. Regardless whether because of a homophobic or racial or hateful comment period, we should all be fighting back. That apathy isn't because we are evolving into the norm. That apathy is bacause we aren't PART of the norm.
Just because we have less prominent homophobic violence in our areas than other places doesn't mean we should not be outraged. If you're not outraged, you're not paying attention. Hate needs to stop period, no matter where it is and who it is from. Homophobic violence shouldn't even be happening and that why we need to fight back. pirate

where im from sounds alot like he is describing. it itsnt that gay hate is being ignored, but there isnt much of it at all. the worst i got was someone stopped being my friend and a teacher telling me that gay sex sends you to hell. i live in an area that isnt the most gay friendly, but for the most part people dont care if your gay or not. its almost as normal as being straight  

[lgtenos]

Shanna66

i live in an area that isnt the most gay friendly, but for the most part people dont care if your gay or not. its almost as normal as being straight

Bingo.  

[Taeryyn]

Gordums

Taeryyn

I certainly don't hate myself for my sexuality, and I have no issue with people who represent the more...flamboyant side of our community. That said, I wouldn't say I have much "gay pride". I'm not proud of the fact that I like apples, and likewise I don't feel proud that I like men. Doesn't mean I'm ashamed, though.

Our pride parade here is pretty tame. Just a couple of local community groups marching with lots of rainbow banners and balloons, some glitter, and then a barbeque afterwards. Nothing extreme. *shrug* Not all pride parades are full of scantily-clad dancers and drag queens. Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with either type of parade. I don't really think it makes sense to try and amputate or hide the groups in the LGBT community that don't measure up to some arbitrary "normal" standard. For one thing, it's hateful, and for another, it's deceitful.


Unrelated to the topic at hand, I am really disappointed by the catty insults being thrown around. :/

That ellipsis before "the more flamboyant side" somewhat irked me. Are you sure you don't have issues with "that side" of the queer community? If you need to pause to think of a way to describe them, that does appear as an issue in my opinion.
But you are right, nobody should be excluded from the pride parade, and that's exactly what it is about. Pride for inclusion. No matter what background you have you are welcome. Whether you defy your societal gender role or not or whatever, have pride in yourself. Whether you're flaming gay or cold straight.
And yes, the catty comments are displeasing. They steer us from a discussion and dissent to attacks.

Oh, for the love of Pete...

You read way, way too much into those three dots.

The ellipsis was because I was unsure of my choice of words, because I had a feeling someone was going to complain about my choice of adjective, no matter what I said. Looks like it was a legitimate concern. neutral

If my punctuation was enough to make you doubt my sincerity, here it is loud and clear:

I don't have an issue with people who have a personality that is different than mine, and that includes people who are flaming, flamboyant, fabulous, extra-outgoing, whatever. I do, however, have an issue with people twisting my words, jumping to conclusions, and getting bent out of shape over my choice of punctuation.  

[Gordums]

Taeryyn

Gordums

Taeryyn

I certainly don't hate myself for my sexuality, and I have no issue with people who represent the more...flamboyant side of our community. That said, I wouldn't say I have much "gay pride". I'm not proud of the fact that I like apples, and likewise I don't feel proud that I like men. Doesn't mean I'm ashamed, though.

Our pride parade here is pretty tame. Just a couple of local community groups marching with lots of rainbow banners and balloons, some glitter, and then a barbeque afterwards. Nothing extreme. *shrug* Not all pride parades are full of scantily-clad dancers and drag queens. Personally, I don't think there's anything wrong with either type of parade. I don't really think it makes sense to try and amputate or hide the groups in the LGBT community that don't measure up to some arbitrary "normal" standard. For one thing, it's hateful, and for another, it's deceitful.


Unrelated to the topic at hand, I am really disappointed by the catty insults being thrown around. :/

That ellipsis before "the more flamboyant side" somewhat irked me. Are you sure you don't have issues with "that side" of the queer community? If you need to pause to think of a way to describe them, that does appear as an issue in my opinion.
But you are right, nobody should be excluded from the pride parade, and that's exactly what it is about. Pride for inclusion. No matter what background you have you are welcome. Whether you defy your societal gender role or not or whatever, have pride in yourself. Whether you're flaming gay or cold straight.
And yes, the catty comments are displeasing. They steer us from a discussion and dissent to attacks.

Oh, for the love of Pete...

You read way, way too much into those three dots.

The ellipsis was because I was unsure of my choice of words, because I had a feeling someone was going to complain about my choice of adjective, no matter what I said. Looks like it was a legitimate concern. neutral

If my punctuation was enough to make you doubt my sincerity, here it is loud and clear:

I don't have an issue with people who have a personality that is different than mine, and that includes people who are flaming, flamboyant, fabulous, extra-outgoing, whatever. I do, however, have an issue with people twisting my words, jumping to conclusions, and getting bent out of shape over my choice of punctuation.

Why are you so offended? I wasn't attacking you.
It's an honest observation and I'm just voicing a concern.

 

[Taeryyn]

Gordums

Why are you so offended? I wasn't attacking you.
It's an honest observation and I'm just voicing a concern.

I am offended because, as I said, I felt like you twisted my words around and accused me of disliking or being uncomfortable with people who are flamboyant. To be honest, it did feel like an attack (or at the very least, a very negative assumption about my beliefs), but since you didn't mean it as such, I do apologize for the sarcastic response.