The Fluffy Before and After

[AniMajor]

I brought this up in a thread in M&R, so Tea suggested I bring it here.

I was wondering what happens to fluffy pagans. They come into M&R, here, or the Supernatural forum all the time, claiming to be the reincarnation of Merlin, being a half-demon/half-angel combination, or, at the very least, that OMGoddess, the world is so beautiful and all their spells work and everyone should be free to believe what they want.

And many of them leave after a few posts about "well, that's what you believe", then "stop being such a jerk", and finally "I don't care what you say, I'm still four kinds of awesome." And I obviously can't ask them what happens afterwards, so I'm asking those who stick around.

I think there was a thread about asking how people were when they were just starting out, so it's not going to be just about that, but where you are now.

The question is, then: how fluffy were you, and where are you now?

For me, I don't know if I was ever typically fluffy, and I didn't know that there were books about magic and paganism that weren't fiction. So, most of what I learned was actually out of fictional sources, like Star Wars, or the various fantasy books I read as a kid. I used to also think I was psychic, but my psychic powers mostly consisted of predicting the numbers and colors my sister was thinking of.

Now, I know more about different types of paganism, and the "Wicca" that I tried so hard to avoid isn't even the real thing. The stuff I know is a lot more reliable than it used to be, but I still feel like I'm swimming in the shallow end of the knowledge pool. And I don't really feel a drive to get better, even if I do enjoy lurking in the guild and reading the neat stuff that other people do.  

[Bastemhet]

As a young high schooler I read Silver Ravenwolf and thought I was Wiccan for a while. Then I realized that that was BS and was into Cunningham. Then...I dunno, I guess it just wasn't doing it for me, and became an atheist.

A decade later, here I am. I've always been aware of trying to check my sources, but I think a big part about how I got where I am as a Kemetic Reformed Reconstructionist is finding the few bastions of intelligence on the internet and finding out which sources were good and which were not. From there I read the good stuff and built a good enough knowledge base that I can tell when something is going to be bs and when I've come across a good source. It just takes time, patience, and a passion for what you're doing. Thankfully my goddess has been very patient with me. smile  

[Gho the Girl]

I used to be in my own little world, surrounded by thoughtforms.

I'm sort of back where I started, but not really. I've returned to Christianity, but in completely different way than most of my Christian kindred. The path God has set for me has been rather winding.  

[too2sweet]

Quote:

The question is, then: how fluffy were you, and where are you now?

I don't think I was ever "I don't care what you say, I'm still four kinds of awesome.", but I did start out with a lot of my "knowledge" based on misinformation. I know I definitely didn't like being challenged on it, though it was more because I had several years of practice/study and felt (at the time) that I was knowledgeable (at least on certain things), more than it being a case of "I read this book and I now know the secrets of the universe". Every so often I run across posts that I made when I first came on Gaia, and I admit I cringe at some of them.

I think it's sad when people won't even try to listen. I've learned the hard way, that just because we don't like what we are hearing - doesn't mean that we should ignore it for our own opinions. It can be a painful process though, and not everyone is ready to face that. One of the most important things that separates "those that get it" from "those that don't", is the understanding that not all sources are created equal. Once you understand that, it makes a big difference. Most of the time once you can point someone to a reliable source text (and they actually take the time to read it), the light bulb goes off. I admit, it's not something I really thought all that much about. I think I assumed (particularly in the case of books published by Llewellyn) that this publisher specializes in these kinds of book, so they would know... wouldn't they? sweatdrop  

[Recursive Paradox]

I was a fairly standard fluffy Christian and then actually got a good understanding of the Scriptures. And then I began to develop philosophical issues with them and moved on to philosophical materialism/empiricism (which I called Atheism back then) except that I was a fluffy PM/E.

Yep, that's right, I was one of those angry, "I can disprove your silly beliefs with SCIENCE" type of capital A PM/E atheists. I was obnoxious.

Then I got some world shaking UPG and shut my obnoxious mouth while I explored that. During this time my parents were still forcing me to go to church, despite how tense things were considering that's YHVH's ground. I admit that I was supremely disrespectful and continued to test and experiment with the UPG there (including the precursors to Ether Channeling), something that probably made my broken oaths to him even more obvious and nasty. I'm still not sure how to make amends for that.

I finally put my foot down and refused to enter the church and then continued to experiment. I had moved from a fluffy atheist to a theorizing eclectic. I began looking into other religions for things that were similar to the very tiny amount of CPG I had and the rest of the UPG I was attempting to test.

I largely found that nothing in its entirety fit. Oftentimes context made even taking pieces not workable. What little bits I could pull together informed some other elements of the cosmology and metaphysics, but in the end it largely was my own CPG and UPG that I was forced to rely on when constructing the metaphysical theories of Etherism.

And now, having come from follower fluffy zones, I'm the founder of a religion, a path that treats the Self as sacred and solitary seeking of growth, power and wisdom our goal.  

[CuAnnan]

My fluffy days were in the nineties. I read my dad's journals and figured myself an inhereted magus.

Not that I told anyone other than the pagan I'm still in touch with and her reaction, combined with meeting my first Mr Darks, sorta snapped me out of it.

I then tried my hand at worshiping foreign Gods. It took me a while to turn my gaze towards Ireland. By the time I was 18, I had devoted myself to Annan. So it's been about ten years.

While I fervently believe that the learning never stops, I can see how much I've learned in that time.  

[patch99329]

I wasn't really fluffy in the 'willful ignorance' sense, but I was misguided.

For about a week when I first started I thought wicca was thousands of years old, then I thought wicca was about 'the goddess and nature' (I am quoted as saying such) and practiced for a few months before learning otherwise. xD  

[TeaDidikai]

I grew up in a tradition.
I wasn't given a chance to really be a fluffy, because it would have ended in my aunt coming from where ever she was at the time and giving me an a** beating.

I'm not being figurative. Threats of honest to goodness violence did a lot to curb me from being fluffy.  

[whiporwill-o]

i would also say i wasn't 'fluffy' in the willful ignorance way, but alot of my 'knowledge' was based in misinformation. for about, mmm, 3 years i believed myself to be wiccan because of those oh-so-wonderful books by Llewellyn. oh well, better late than never. the only time i have ever told anyone that they had no idea what they were talking about was when my former employer said that she was a wiccan highpriestess because she took an online class and one other time because a woman claimed that silver ravenwolf was the greatest wiccan author in existance *headdesk*.

currently, i'm not sure what i believe, but i do know what i don't and i suppose that's progress. right now i'm more of a seeker of knowledge/lurker when it comes to the guild. i always check my sources now (which can be a pain in the a**, but worth it not to look a fool and not offend anyone). i'm more or less at a stand still as far as beliefs go and it'll just have to stay that way for a while because i've re-started college and it leaves little time for much else.  

[AniMajor]

Recursive Paradox

I was a fairly standard fluffy Christian and then actually got a good understanding of the Scriptures. And then I began to develop philosophical issues with them and moved on to philosophical materialism/empiricism (which I called Atheism back then) except that I was a fluffy PM/E.

I never was a Christian, so all of my issues with it used to be based on misunderstandings of what it was. I still have issues with it, after reading the Bible, but at least I don't think Christianity is all about loving people forcefully, recruiting, and fearing a vengeful god that may or may not be related to the loving and recruiting.

CuAnnan

Not that I told anyone other than the pagan I'm still in touch with and her reaction, combined with meeting my first Mr Darks, sorta snapped me out of it.

I never got a chance to be a Mr. Dark, because I seemed to attract Mr. Darks, and there was no way I was going to end up like them.

The worst part was that I couldn't talk to anyone or bounce discoveries off of anyone, because it would just become part of their Mr. Dark story.  

[Ishtar Shakti]

Well I went from being a natural empath to my brother trying to make me help him make a hole to another dimension to being an athiest and shutting my senses down after being overloaded by information to being forced to believe in something as everyone I knew kept running into this one spirit who'd been stalking me my entire life.
Acceptance/Innocence --> denial denial denial --> acceptance

I'm pretty sure I've known alot of deluded people. I think the only thing I ever really believed that was ultra fluffy was that the spirit realm could merge with the realm of the living and even then I didn't think it was really probable. I think that was more that I wanted it to be true rather then belief.

I still half way believe it I just don't think its probable, anything is possible though. I think I would probably be happier if I could just not believe in anything. Its hard though because seeing is believing so to speak. Most of the crazy things other people have thought up are fun to think about. Trying to imagine how something could possibly happen no mater how far fetched it is allows me to think. It challenges me. Some of it depends on what the state of nature really is though, so the approaches have to match the conceptual make up and then how fluffy it really is depends on how the world really is. This can be hard to verify.

I don't really know much about religions so I don't have much misinformation. I don't really have many beliefs or opinions that I hold to. I'm not always realistic in my expectations of others. I sometimes expect them to know things that they don't or understand things the first time I say things because I really hate repeating myself.

I guess I don't always have an accurate portrayal of others in my mind. I'm trying to work on this though. I expect more or think better of them then they are necessarily capable of. Sometimes negative things don't even occur to me. Like I want to give others the benefit of the doubt to such an extent that I blind myself to some information and this seems like a very bad thing so I'm trying to take into account both the good and the bad. So I'm currently working on that and speaking whats on my mind...

I'll get it at some point
p.s. I never really believed that a hole could be made just that I met a whole bunch of people who wanted to do these crazy impossible things and one of them was my brother. His hole idea made me think about trying to actively do something and how to do it successfully. Why it would be hard to do something, why it might seem impossible etc. It made me consider what you Could do what Was possible how to make it happen etc. Experimenting is a useful thing and no one had ever told me that anything was either impossible or possible so it allowed me to go into the situation without bias. I was pretty much a battery in the hole making experiment. I didn't do anything just sat there.  

[TeaDidikai]

Wow... speaking of Mr. Darks...  

[whiporwill-o]

TeaDidikai

Wow... speaking of Mr. Darks...

i'm sorry, i don't quite understand what a 'mr. darks' is. sweatdrop  

[TeaDidikai]

whiporwill-o

i'm sorry, i don't quite understand what a 'mr. darks' is. sweatdrop

It wasn't directed at you Hun.

Basically a Mr. Dark is a psychological construct designed to grant autonomy by individualizing in a hyper-religious mythology

English Translation:
"The Boogyman is coming! I shall save the world!" Or a variation like that.  

[whiporwill-o]

TeaDidikai

whiporwill-o

i'm sorry, i don't quite understand what a 'mr. darks' is. sweatdrop

It wasn't directed at you Hun.

Basically a Mr. Dark is a psychological construct designed to grant autonomy by individualizing in a hyper-religious mythology

English Translation:
"The Boogyman is coming! I shall save the world!" Or a variation like that.

thank you, i always see people here refer to Mr. Dark. i kinda had an idea, but i wasn't positive.

and thanks again, i didn't think it was aimed at me, surely someone would've said something before now. ninja