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I'll answer your question with an analogy, if you'll so allow me to do so. Most of your questions can be answered with it.

So a man and a woman have a child. Someone asks tell me about the process.

The man says, well after the woman talked me into having a child, I worked two jobs to provide and added a room to the house and fixed up the room for it and drove my wife to the hospital and had the baby and put it in the room.

Someone else asks about it (a little more important person).

The man says, well first my wife took me to olive garden, my favorite restaurant, and being seduced by the bread sticks convinced me to get another child. While she was feeling down, I felt bad and told her to stay home, so I had my regular job at the bank, but then started doing personal baseball practices with my son's friends and helped them really get down their game. My son didn't want to share a room with a new child, so we went to an architect and asked how to build an extra room. We cut out the side of our kitchen and got a company to come in and build an extra room. We decided not to check the gender beforehand so we painted the room half blue half-pink, and got many toys. My wife and I were out tandem biking and she felt like the baby was starting to be ready to come out. We called our best friend and she drove us home and I got in my minivan and started driving really fast to the hospital. She laid I the backseat so the pain wasn't as bad. We got her into the emergency room and I was about to puke so I went into the waiting room. The baby came out apparently, I wasn't there to watch it. Having kissed the baby, we put it in the room with all the other babies and let my wife relax a bit before going home and putting the baby in his new crib in his own room.

These two stories are the same. One has more detail, but it's the same. Many of your contradictions are solved with this kind of analogy. For example, Jesus was taken to the high preist. One other story says He was taken to Jesus to the relative before the high preist, well, Jesus was taken to the high preist. That isn't a contradiction. Genesis 1 and 2, in Genesis 1 God made the heavens and the earth and all the time matter and energy and organisms. Then in Genesis 2 He gets more specific. I made Adam, then I made Eve from Adam, and then I made all the humans through them. The generality to specific gap is what is tripping you up, and others in search for contradictions.

If it doesn't answer you, feel free to ask more questions


No...that isn't what it's like. A more apt description of what goes on would be, using your analogy, would be the man saying they discussed having a baby over breadsticks at Olive Garden, and the woman saying the conversation never occurred. Both situations cannot have happened, so either one of them is wrong, or they both are. THAT is what a contradiction is. And saying that people both are and are not justified by their works, since the statements conflict with each other, IS A CONTRADICTION...

Example?


He just gave you one, stop being obtuse.

Asking for a biblical example, calm down. We can actually you know dialog instead of having you just try and run over me ya know


Everything does not have a reference in the bible, mluck. I gave you contradictions, and you handwaved them on the basis that they were copypasta from a web-copy of a book. You then proceeded to produce copypasta of your own and never once acknowledged your own hypocrisy.

The very notion that I could have an honest dialogue with you is almost as doubtful as the notion that there will ever be credible evidence for gods. Don't even try to act like you've been respectful or even honest ever since encountering me in ED. It's pathetically transparent and it isn't going to work.

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No...that isn't what it's like. A more apt description of what goes on would be, using your analogy, would be the man saying they discussed having a baby over breadsticks at Olive Garden, and the woman saying the conversation never occurred. Both situations cannot have happened, so either one of them is wrong, or they both are. THAT is what a contradiction is. And saying that people both are and are not justified by their works, since the statements conflict with each other, IS A CONTRADICTION...

Example?


He just gave you one, stop being obtuse.

Asking for a biblical example, calm down. We can actually you know dialog instead of having you just try and run over me ya know


I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.
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The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

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He just gave you one, stop being obtuse.

Asking for a biblical example, calm down. We can actually you know dialog instead of having you just try and run over me ya know


I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.
Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.

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refer to the Romans Road
These are the verses that you are talking about.


Which, by the way, IS NOT EVIDENCE. The bible is the CLAIM. The claim does not provide evidence for itself.

Also, nothing about what I'm about to respond to actually responds to what I've said. In fact, it's like you went out of your way to make your religion even more immoral...Are we sure he's not a poe?

Quote:
Everyone is a sinner. Nobody is good.


Oh, really, well, tell me what babies who die shortly after birth have done to deserve eternal torment/reward. And if you're going to point back to original sin, please indicate the morality of punishing someone based on someone else's wrong doings (I could also ask for verification that the account of genesis even happened, but I have a strong feeling you'll just point to the bible again, or to an apologetics site, which both are equally terrible when it comes to proving claims, so I'll oblige you for a bit).

Quote:
The wages of sin is death,


Which is a punishment not fitting the crime...

Quote:
but the free gift of God is eternity through Jesus Christ.


Which raises a few questions. First, do you believe that JC was god? Because if you do, that means god sacrificed himself to himself as a loophole to rules he created when he could have just changed it to begin with. Do you not believe JC was god? Not much better. Now god's having someone killed for a loophole to rules he created that he could have just changed to begin with. Also, if god is all-knowing, how come he didn't know well beforehand that people weren't going to obey him, and so he'd have to create a loophole to rules he created that he could have just changed to begin with? Are these rules that much more powerful than god? Is god, then, not all-powerful? In fact, with the amount of times, according to the bible, that he's gotten so angry that he's decided to do something drastic to try and fix the rules he created that he apparently cannot change, god comes off as a massive ******** idiot....no wonder you worship him.

Quote:
God showed his love for us when we were yet sinners by dying for us


You mean by threatening to eternally torture us forever unless we believe him? Yeah, that's not love. A loving god wouldn't create an eternal torture pit for his creations...but you know who would? A psychopath...

Quote:
For it is believing with your heart that made you right with God,


And, getting back to the actual topic that started this conversation, works! Which you both are and are not justified by! Thanks bible for clearing that s**t up.

Bible: No problem, Rumble.........Actually, that's a problem, Rumble.

Consistent in his inconsistency as always.

Quote:
and it is confessing with your mouth that you are saved


You mean, from the eternal torture pit god created out of "love" which you are automatically sent to to begin with, unless you profess a belief (and maybe or maybe not do works...it's unclear)....again, this system is immoral.

Quote:
For being right with God, we have peace because of what Jesus has done for us


Refer back to the questions. Also, I could point out again that you haven't demonstrated any of the claims, and that I could ask for your evidence, however, with your track record, it's probably best to not force you to embarrass yourself any further.

Quote:
So there is no condemnation for those who believe in Christ Jesus


And eternal torture for those who don't, even if they did more to benefit humanity than Jesus may have (cause we don't even know if he actually existed, or if the stories about him, even the non-supernatural ones, are true)...again, this system is immoral.

Quote:
Nothing can separate us from His love


Except iron, apparently...

So after reading this tripe, it's apparent that you no longer have an argument, and just want to preach...However, ignoring the arguments to spout bible verses doesn't make the evidence we've provided go away, and you just end up looking foolish in the long run. Also, why you're preaching to a bunch of atheists who clearly know your book better than you do and expecting some kind of beneficial results is almost beyond me....I think all of us have mentioned that we were former christians at one point in this thread or another, so it's not like we haven't heard this line of indoctrination before....

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That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.


One says you made a turkey and ham with ranch.
One says you made a turkey (no ham) with thousand island.
One says you made a tuna and swiss with honey mustard - and later made a turkey and ham.
One says you made a turkey and ham, but doesn't get to the part where you toasted or sauced it.

What was the sandwich?

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No...that isn't what it's like. A more apt description of what goes on would be, using your analogy, would be the man saying they discussed having a baby over breadsticks at Olive Garden, and the woman saying the conversation never occurred. Both situations cannot have happened, so either one of them is wrong, or they both are. THAT is what a contradiction is. And saying that people both are and are not justified by their works, since the statements conflict with each other, IS A CONTRADICTION...

Example?


He just gave you one, stop being obtuse.

Asking for a biblical example, calm down. We can actually you know dialog instead of having you just try and run over me ya know


I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.


....IT'S A ******** ANALOGY! It is ridiculous to ask for that specific of an example when we're talking about an analogy. Your objection has become so idiotic, it'd be like me objecting over your soccer analogy, because soccer isn't the same as religion.

And even then, THERE'S STILL AN EXAMPLE OF THIS! As Judas both return the money to the Pharisees for betraying Jesus (the conversation that happened), AND kept the money (the conversation that didn't happen)...A contradiction so blatant, that even Ray Comfort had to admit that it was a contradiction...

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He just gave you one, stop being obtuse.

Asking for a biblical example, calm down. We can actually you know dialog instead of having you just try and run over me ya know


I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.
Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.

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I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.
Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.


Actually, one verse says he hung himself (which is the version where he returned the money), and the other says he fell headlong while tending to his field and his guts spilled out (which is the version where he kept the money and bought the field). It's actually a contradiction as well, one that I've heard apologists try to defend with the same line you used.

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I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.
Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.


Actually, one verse says he hung himself (which is the version where he returned the money), and the other says he fell headlong while tending to his field and his guts spilled out (which is the version where he kept the money and bought the field). It's actually a contradiction as well, one that I've heard apologists try to defend with the same line you used.


You've got to love a good argumentum ex culo...aren't these the same people who won't accept that evolution happens because they cannot go into the backyard and watch flies turn into swans?

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I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.
Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.

If I drove my car and watched a guy get hit by a car with assumed death, I'd say he died because he got hit by a car. If a doctor came a few hours later and examined the untouched dead body, he might say that there was a split in the skin where his organs poured out.

Have you ever seen an autopsy report? Even if a game like Phoenix Wright or csi Miami or something. A police officer will say he got hit with a bat and died. The autopsy will say something like the the neck went with such force that paralysis occurred simultaneously to the aorta breaking. Same thing. Remember Luke is a doctor.

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Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.


Actually, one verse says he hung himself (which is the version where he returned the money), and the other says he fell headlong while tending to his field and his guts spilled out (which is the version where he kept the money and bought the field). It's actually a contradiction as well, one that I've heard apologists try to defend with the same line you used.


You've got to love a good argumentum ex culo...aren't these the same people who won't accept that evolution happens because they cannot go into the backyard and watch flies turn into swans?


It's not that bad, but it's still pretty bad. I remember hearing that argument before (in fact, I think it was mluck who was making it, but I could be wrong on that), and it was my first time encountering true apologetics...

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I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.
Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.


Actually, one verse says he hung himself (which is the version where he returned the money), and the other says he fell headlong while tending to his field and his guts spilled out (which is the version where he kept the money and bought the field). It's actually a contradiction as well, one that I've heard apologists try to defend with the same line you used.
It doesnt say he was tending to his field. Also, what do you think he fell from?

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I pointed out the biblical example IN THAT VERY SAME POST! For ******** sake, how dishonest are you!?!

I'm looking for a biblical example where someone said they had a conversation, and then another source explicitly states they did not have a conversation.
Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.

If I drove my car and watched a guy get hit by a car with assumed death, I'd say he died because he got hit by a car. If a doctor came a few hours later and examined the untouched dead body, he might say that there was a split in the skin where his organs poured out.

Have you ever seen an autopsy report? Even if a game like Phoenix Wright or csi Miami or something. A police officer will say he got hit with a bat and died. The autopsy will say something like the the neck went with such force that paralysis occurred simultaneously to the aorta breaking. Same thing. Remember Luke is a doctor.


Continuing along the same line of argument when it's been stated MULTIPLE TIMES that your analogies are flawed is EXTREMELY dishonest of you....that isn't a proper analogy, as it's not two differing perceptions on the same event that we're talking about. It's two statements that negate each other, so that, at best, only one of the statements can be true (providing they both aren't incorrect). You've done nothing to demonstrate that your analogy is valid...only found new ways to try to make the same poor argument that has already been refuted...

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Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.


Actually, one verse says he hung himself (which is the version where he returned the money), and the other says he fell headlong while tending to his field and his guts spilled out (which is the version where he kept the money and bought the field). It's actually a contradiction as well, one that I've heard apologists try to defend with the same line you used.
It doesnt say he was tending to his field. Also, what do you think he fell from?


It doesn't, however, the verse immediately goes from his purchase of the field, to his death, which context would imply that he was working on at the time...though, I obviously can't say that that is definitely what the verse is saying, so you have a point there.

And to your other question....his feet. If you're going to point out the "it doesn't say he was tending his field" argument, I can turn that around and say that "it doesn't say he fell after hanging himself"...In fact, that he would fall after hanging himself seems like it'd be an important note to make...and the verse doesn't make it.

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Y
The point was two people said something different= Contradiction

Not necessarily.
If I took my baby cousin to the zoo, I'd tell my grandmother that I went to the zoo with landen and had fun. Landen would say we went to the zoo and saw giraffes and lions and meerkats and we share a favorite animal (hippo) and went to the concession stand and got lots of treats and the gift shop where I got Legos and had a blast!

That isn't a contradiction.

I got bread and meat and put it all together, toasted it for 3 minutes, put some sauce on the sandwich and ate it, and saying I made a sandwich isn't a contradiction.
It wasnt a contradiction because "Landen" clarified what was so fun about the trip to the zoo. If he said you guys went to a houseparty with alcohol, then that would be a contradiction.

Anyway there are Bible verses people would claim is a contradiction because two seperate information. For example Judas' demise. Many think its a contradiction because Matthew said he went to hang himself and Luke (I think) said he fell from a great height and his body exploded and his guts spilled. But really Judas hung himself and died then his body fell after a long time in the hot sun, which made his corpse easily to explode from impact.

If I drove my car and watched a guy get hit by a car with assumed death, I'd say he died because he got hit by a car. If a doctor came a few hours later and examined the untouched dead body, he might say that there was a split in the skin where his organs poured out.

Have you ever seen an autopsy report? Even if a game like Phoenix Wright or csi Miami or something. A police officer will say he got hit with a bat and died. The autopsy will say something like the the neck went with such force that paralysis occurred simultaneously to the aorta breaking. Same thing. Remember Luke is a doctor.


Continuing along the same line of argument when it's been stated MULTIPLE TIMES that your analogies are flawed is EXTREMELY dishonest of you....that isn't a proper analogy, as it's not two differing perceptions on the same event that we're talking about. It's two statements that negate each other, so that, at best, only one of the statements can be true (providing they both aren't incorrect). You've done nothing to demonstrate that your analogy is valid...only found new ways to try to make the same poor argument that has already been refuted...

You can't say I don't like the answer if it's the right answer. Jesus talked in parables that made perfect sense but to others it made no sense.
Gaia Forums » MISC Forums » Forum & Sticky Archive » Morality and Religion

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