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Are you familiar with the beliefs of Wicca?
Yes
46%
 46%  [ 23 ]
No
16%
 16%  [ 8 ]
A little bit
38%
 38%  [ 19 ]
Other
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 50


promised_child

PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 9:47 pm
TN_Lark
promised_child

i have more scars from the witches, than the wiccans- but a couple from the wiccans.... not a fun time, i didnt care cuz i wanted to die anyway- Christ took my pain and helped me deal, not something the "goddesses" could or would do. i am contented in my Faith, more than that i am more happy these past 5 years than i ever was in my entire life.


I am glad that you found a spiritual path that helped heal you and gives you joy.

Wicca did the same for me. I found in the arms of my Goddess all the healing that I never found in the faith of my birth.

What is truly wonderful is that we each found our way home..even though are homes are not the same.

-Lark-


but who is your goddess? what is her history, her stories? it is information my coven couldnt give, and its very important.  
PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2007 11:29 am
promised_child]
but who is your goddess? what is her history, her stories? it is information my coven couldnt give, and its very impor
pbtrk1al:0="promised_child]
but who is your goddess? what is her history, her stories? it is information my coven couldnt give, and its very important.


My personal Goddess is Sekhmet. Sekhmet is the daughter of Ra and one of the oldest of the Egyptian deities. She is often referred to as one of the "Eyes of Ra", the other being Bast. She is a fierce Goddess who is the defender of order and living rightly or ethically. She may appear as a lioness or as a woman with a lion's head. Sometimes she is referred to as the Defender of Ma'at. Ma'at was the Egyptial Goddess who judged the soul to determine whether the person had lived according to the Divine teachings. Sekhmet also judged and punished if a people or a nation failed to follow the Laws of Ma'at.

She is also a healing Goddess who protects against sickness of the body and the mind. Her son is the patron God of physicians.

Understand that not all Pagans follow the same Goddess. Each of us comes to know the Deities on a parsonal basis and may find that they are drawn to different ones. In my own coven each member is expected to develop a personal relationship with both a God and a Goddess. None of us have the same patrons. Who you end up working with has a great deal to do with the spiritual lessons you need to learn.

-Lark-  

TN_Lark

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promised_child

PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:22 pm
TN_Lark
promised_child]
but who is your goddess? what is her history, her stories? it is information my coven couldnt give, and its very impor
pbtrk1al:1="promised_child]
but who is your goddess? what is her history, her stories? it is information my coven couldnt give, and its very important.


My personal Goddess is Sekhmet. Sekhmet is the daughter of Ra and one of the oldest of the Egyptian deities. She is often referred to as one of the "Eyes of Ra", the other being Bast. She is a fierce Goddess who is the defender of order and living rightly or ethically. She may appear as a lioness or as a woman with a lion's head. Sometimes she is referred to as the Defender of Ma'at. Ma'at was the Egyptial Goddess who judged the soul to determine whether the person had lived according to the Divine teachings. Sekhmet also judged and punished if a people or a nation failed to follow the Laws of Ma'at.

She is also a healing Goddess who protects against sickness of the body and the mind. Her son is the patron God of physicians.

Understand that not all Pagans follow the same Goddess. Each of us comes to know the Deities on a parsonal basis and may find that they are drawn to different ones. In my own coven each member is expected to develop a personal relationship with both a God and a Goddess. None of us have the same patrons. Who you end up working with has a great deal to do with the spiritual lessons you need to learn.

-Lark-


interesting, what if they dont?  
PostPosted: Sun Dec 30, 2007 7:48 am
promised_child
interesting, what if they dont?


Do you mean what happens if someone in my group does not develop a relationship with a Deity?

It's never happened. Most people come to Wicca because they are already hearing the voice of the Gods calling them to this path. After all, having a personal relationship with Deity is one of the core tenets of Wicca. Those of us who walk this path talk to our Gods every single day, and out Gods speak back to us. If that were not so I imagine that the person would decide that Wicca is not their path and continue looking until they did find that connection to Deity that is central to all religions.

-Lark-  

TN_Lark

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android_22

PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 1:05 pm
I'd like to post, I have a question for you mademoiselle, however I would like to complement you as well on your effort to bridge the gaps and such about the misconceptions. I have lived with such things in my life for a long time. And its about time people starting learning instead of hating. Hugs not guns peoples smile

Anyways what is your take on the whole Halloween and Christmas deal?
Are you angered by it? saddened by it? Do you find the modern image of the witch (worts and green nose etc...) to be insulting or humorous?  
PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:26 pm
The problem I have with Wiccan "Magic" is the fact that it clearly doesn't have any affect whatsoever. It is basically like a prayer. Which is how a true wiccan explains it, generally. But all these self-help books and new-age books are full of "spells" which are clearly of no use. How can I tell they are useless? They are all vague concepts like "luck" and "love" and "wealth", things which are all a matter of luck indeed and is thus no surprise when it fails to change anything and seems amazing when it "works".

It's just the annoying capitalization on angsty teens who want to seem original and do their "Magick" or "Magik" or "Magikck" or however many K's they're throwing on it these days. (The extra K's add uniqueness, a desired trait of angsty teenage girls).

I have nothing against any religion, but it's the numerous idiots who picked up a "Pagan religions for dummies" book and think they are now uber priestesses who can cast a rank 3 fireball.

Also, another thought of mine- Perhaps wiccan gods and goddesses are essences of a one force- I know that hindus have a similar belief as this in Brahma, where he's what we would see as "God" with the other gods acting like our angels, or like the trinity, doing different things to the same basic effect of existence.  

divineseraph


divineseraph

PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:55 pm
TN_Lark

Christians beliefe that Jesus is the Son of God and their Savior. Because they believe this it is their truth..but it cannot be proven as a fact. A Muslim believes in the truth of Allah. A Wiccan has other truths.
-Lark-


I would like to clear something up- Allah is the Christian God, they are synonymous.

Jews, Christians and Muslims all worship the same God under Abraham, and his name is YHWH. There are separations, but they are between which people were and were not prophets.

But, this fact leads me to my idea that possibly all religions lead to one God, ad even many polytheistic religions include an idea of gods being part of a larger God (Your goddesses you mentioned being "eyes", and the brahma in hinduism, and Aton in egyptian religions.) I look for parallels in religions, rather than separations.

Edit- Also, in... Genesis (I believe it is?) God refers to himself as "We" several times. this is passed off as a royal "we" but it's still interesting that it's specifically "We" and not "I".  
PostPosted: Sat Aug 09, 2008 2:07 pm
I knew this one girl who claimed to be a strong believer in Wiccan... she seemed sort of errr... not normal. She said she was a reincarnation of this mermaid goddess and that she was a mermaid herself in her TRUE form but she stayed in a human form. I know this sounds absurd but I'm serious... that's what she said. She never directly told me but she told her boyfriend and her boyfriend told me and some friends... she even said that it was really secret and that her "government" could kill him (her boyfriend) if he told anyone. Also, she claimed that she met "King Neptune" and that his real name is "Richard"
LOL
anyways yup yup that is all.  

D i v i n i t y

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TN_Lark

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 10:59 am
D i v i n i t y
I knew this one girl who claimed to be a strong believer in Wiccan... she seemed sort of errr... not normal. She said she was a reincarnation of this mermaid goddess and that she was a mermaid herself in her TRUE form but she stayed in a human form. I know this sounds absurd but I'm serious... that's what she said. She never directly told me but she told her boyfriend and her boyfriend told me and some friends... she even said that it was really secret and that her "government" could kill him (her boyfriend) if he told anyone. Also, she claimed that she met "King Neptune" and that his real name is "Richard"
LOL
anyways yup yup that is all.


Unfortunately all religions have their share of nuts and flakes. And there are many who claim to be Wiccan who haven't the faintest idea of what Wicca is all about. I would say that this girl is living in some fantasy land rather than being a practitioner of Wicca. It's this sort of person who makes those of us who are Wiccan cringe whenever we hear it.

-Lark-  
PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:08 am
android_22
I'd like to post, I have a question for you mademoiselle, however I would like to complement you as well on your effort to bridge the gaps and such about the misconceptions. I have lived with such things in my life for a long time. And its about time people starting learning instead of hating. Hugs not guns peoples smile

Anyways what is your take on the whole Halloween and Christmas deal?
Are you angered by it? saddened by it? Do you find the modern image of the witch (worts and green nose etc...) to be insulting or humorous?


Sorry to have been so long in responding, and I'm glad you're finding my posts useful in trying to bridge the gaps in misunderstanding between Christians and Wiccans.

In regards to your question about how I feel about Halloween and Christmas, no those holidays don't bother me or make me upset. They are not MY holidays. I celebrate Samhain while you celebrate Halloween. Samhain marks for me the last harvest and the ending of the year. It is also a solemn time for most Wiccans because it is the time when we honor our loved ones who have died.

And for me Yule marks the beginning of the new year with the birth of the Sun God. It is a promise of life renewed and a time of great joy. Although I don't celebrate Christmas as a Pagan holiday I do celebrate it as a time to be with my non-Wiccan family. And we do share many of the traditions such as the Christmas tree, wreaths, evergreens, giving presents, etc.

Nor do I mind the Hollywood stereotype of the Witch with the green skin and warts on their nose. It is simply a misconception born of the idea that Witches are evil and should therefore be ugly. The fact of the matter is that Witches come in every shape, size, color, and appearance. Some of us are ugly, but I've never seen one with green skin unless they ate too much Halloween candy (LOL!)

-Lark-  

TN_Lark

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TN_Lark

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:33 am
divineseraph
The problem I have with Wiccan "Magic" is the fact that it clearly doesn't have any affect whatsoever. It is basically like a prayer. Which is how a true wiccan explains it, generally. But all these self-help books and new-age books are full of "spells" which are clearly of no use. How can I tell they are useless? They are all vague concepts like "luck" and "love" and "wealth", things which are all a matter of luck indeed and is thus no surprise when it fails to change anything and seems amazing when it "works".

It's just the annoying capitalization on angsty teens who want to seem original and do their "Magick" or "Magik" or "Magikck" or however many K's they're throwing on it these days. (The extra K's add uniqueness, a desired trait of angsty teenage girls).

I have nothing against any religion, but it's the numerous idiots who picked up a "Pagan religions for dummies" book and think they are now uber priestesses who can cast a rank 3 fireball.

Also, another thought of mine- Perhaps wiccan gods and goddesses are essences of a one force- I know that hindus have a similar belief as this in Brahma, where he's what we would see as "God" with the other gods acting like our angels, or like the trinity, doing different things to the same basic effect of existence.

I would like to clear something up- Allah is the Christian God, they are synonymous.

Jews, Christians and Muslims all worship the same God under Abraham, and his name is YHWH. There are separations, but they are between which people were and were not prophets.

But, this fact leads me to my idea that possibly all religions lead to one God, ad even many polytheistic religions include an idea of gods being part of a larger God (Your goddesses you mentioned being "eyes", and the brahma in hinduism, and Aton in egyptian religions.) I look for parallels in religions, rather than separations.

Edit- Also, in... Genesis (I believe it is?) God refers to himself as "We" several times. this is passed off as a royal "we" but it's still interesting that it's specifically "We" and not "I".


I'm going to combine two of your posts and try to respond to them with one reply here.

First of all let me clear up a common misunderstanding of the difference between prayer and magic. In both cases the person in question wishes to change the shape of the Universe to bring them something they desire. In such a case a Christian would pray to God and ask that God make what they desire happen. And if their God heard their prayer he would perhaps grant what they wanted.

Wiccans believe that our Gods have given us the ability to accomplish such changes ourselves without having to have the assistance of the Gods. This ability is what we call magic or spellwork. We might in some circumstances also pray to our Gods for their assistance, but in most cases we will simply use our own abilities and our magic to make what we desire come into fruition.

Does Wiccan magic work? Oh yes, it certainly does. But it does not work in the way that Hollywood portrays it. Nor is it simply a matter of reading some words out of a book. And that's why for the majority of people who don't take the time and effort to really study the mechanics of maic it doesn't work. Successful magic requires clear focus, intent, the ability to manipulate and direct energy, and the knowledge of how magic works. The more specific the aim of the magic, the better it works.

In regards to your statement about their being only one God you touch on an issue that is often debated in the Pagan community. We have those who are called "soft polytheists" who do believe as you said that all of our Gods and Goddesses are simply facets of one unknowable Divine being. I have often wondered how much of this outlook is based on an unwillingness to free themselves from their upbringing in one of the monotheist religions.

Many of us, myself included, are what are called "hard polytheists" who believe that each of the Gods and Goddesses is a unique Divine being in their own right and not a reflection of a single being. My personal interaction with the Goddesses that I have direct contact with is that they are totally separate entities.

You are correct that in Genesis the initial passages speak of the "elohim" which is plural for Gods. Remember that in the early history of the Jews YWHW was a tribal god of the people of Israel. Yet the Jews recognized that other people had other Gods. In fact up until the destruction of the Temple of Solomon there was a shrine to Asherah in the Temple where she was worshipped as the wife of YWHW. It was only much later that the idea came into being that YWHW was not only the God of the Jews, he was the ONLY God.

So perhaps those of us who see the Gods as plural ARE correct and are in accordance with the earliest writings of the Bible. Christians chose to follow YWHW. Pagans chose to follow those other Gods.  
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 9:51 pm
TN_Lark
Quote:
Allow me to explain myself further concerning my initial response. I was using gravity as an example that proves the rule that there is only one truth. No matter what I do or think, gravity exists in the same way. Gravity is a known truth. The fact that any particular religion cannot be proven is irrelevant. Gravity still proves that reality does not conform to beliefs. You typed "but they ARE true for their believers." Am I to assume that you believe reality is shaped, or rather formed by one's desires? If so, this sounds a lot like lordstar's response.


You are confusing "facts" with "truth" and they aren't the same thing. Gravity is a fact, it can be proven through scientific study. Fire is hot, water is wet...all facts.

Religions are not facts..they are beliefs and they are truths. They are real and accurate to those who follow them..but unlike facts they cannot be proven. And it is possible to have many, many truths.

Christians beliefe that Jesus is the Son of God and their Savior. Because they believe this it is their truth..but it cannot be proven as a fact. A Muslim believes in the truth of Allah. A Wiccan has other truths. And all of these truths are real to the people who believe in them. Some truths are even shared across religious boundaries such as the idea that we should treat others with love and respect. But none of us can prove that our truths are the only one or that they are facts.

And yes, I do belive that it is possible to change the shape of reality in conformance with desire and will..that's what magic is all about.

I will also point out that I am not here to try to defend my beliefs to anyone. What I am here to do is to try to answer questions about what Wiccans believe and how they practice so that people can understand that we are not dangerous or threatening people. When all of us understand the other better the world will be a kinder and better place to live.

-Lark-


Allright! I'm Back to pick this up.

You say that I am confusing facts with truth. The only difference between the terms is that truth is truth, and a fact is a truth that everyone agrees to be a truth. Like I said before, the fact that the existence of gravity is a fact, does not change the nature of truth that we can learn from it.


Why don't I just cut out the middle-man and get straight to it. The philosophy that you have prescribed to is called "Relativism."
This is Plato's statement of its claims: "The way things appear to me, in that way they exist for me; and the way things appear to you, in that way they exist for you"
This is today's "everybody wins" philosophy that has been adopted by postmodernists, humanists, and the apathetic. The problem with this philosophy is that a person does not possess the mental ability/capacity(or supernatural power or whatever) that would be required in order to create and define reality. What I mean is, just because we believe something to be true, that doesn't make it so.
If I point at a bench and tell you that I believe that it is a tasty watermelon, will you honestly, being a rational human being, tell me that I am right? And what happens when I try to eat it?

Truth is standalone, unaffected by perception or preference. (John 14:6) Jesus said to him, "I am the way, ~~the truth~~, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me." Why would he call himself the truth? Because none can grasp what truly "is" without acknowledging the reality that Jesus is Lord.
This argument isn't new. It is as old as the Garden of Eden, where man thinks he can be like God, instead of subject to him.

And another thing. Lets just say that you're right, that we can impose our preferences upon what really is true. Why then, do bad things happen? If we decide what the truth is, why isn't your life perfect because you have believed and therefore made it so? Why did the Holocaust happen? Please, believe it away for me.
Simple answer: We can't change the truth or make it. We can only find it.
Or do you believe that we can only change truth when no one can tell that the change happened? rofl

Concerning changing the state of reality with magic, why go small? If you can really impose preference upon reality, then it shouldn't be a hassle for you to time-travel, teleport right in front of me, etc. just by believing that you can.


Divineseraph, I laughed my head off at the "Rank 3 fireball" thing.  

brad175


brad175

PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 10:19 pm
I almost forgot to address magic. As a Christian, I do not deny that magic is possible. In fact, according to the Bible, people can do some supernatural things, but they get their power from 1 of 2 sources: God or Satan and his demons.
Examples:
Moses parted the Red Sea - God
The demon-possessed man in the Bible's super-strength (broke chains) - Satan
The ability of God's people to lay hands upon someone and heal them of their sickness - God
Consulting spirits(which are really demons and they're probably screwing with you) - Satan
Speaking in the Heavenly tongue - God

Wiccan magic would undoubtedly fall into the Satan category
I know in saying this that I am calling the practice of Wiccan magic evil, but I'm merely attempting to clarify my faith's position on that of Wicca.  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:37 am
Forgive me but, I have to say it. Wicca has been pretending to be an acneint religion since 1957. I've explored it and read the books, and its rally paganism for dummies. Now you have your beliefs and to me they sound more eclectic pagan than Wiccan. Me personally, and Druid. I find its base a better better than Wicca and while Neo-Druidry is a revival of the ancient Druidism its been proven the base religion has been around for a very long time. But, Wicca is not much more than a Paganism for dummies type religion. Many who claim paganism are pretty ill informed on everything and I met many who think nature worship has nothing to do with being any type of pagan.  

Ricette

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