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Harry Potter.....Good Or Bad [can be closed] Goto Page: [] [<<] [<] 1 2 3 ... 12 13 14 15 16 17 [>] [»|]

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Whats your opinion?
Good
68%
 68%  [ 48 ]
Bad
31%
 31%  [ 22 ]
Total Votes : 70


ioioouiouiouio

PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2006 11:27 am
Silent Expressor
Ok so he wields "magic", they never really call him a wizard though. The magic that aslan has is in some way supposed to represent God's power

So as long as we don't 'call' it wizardy, then it's okay? Oh, don't worry officer, I wasn't stealing, I was repossesing.

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No...I'm sure the writers had reasons to th chastise them

But the fact is they didn't, which, according to your arguement, makes them evil people who will make people become gang-rapers and murderers.



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Yes I understand what fiction is, but I still believe strongly that the Harry Potter series presents some problems.

But how? As divineseraph (and several others throughout this debate) has put it, if harrpy potters give you problems with your relationship with God, then you pretty much didn't have a relationship.


Quote:
Polygamy is the more than one spouse if im not mistaken? I believe that polygamy is wrong...

Yes, it is. And Jesus had at least one story about polygamy. The Parable of the ten virgins. All about ten women who are waiting to meet their husband. According to you, this makes Jesus evil and a sinner.



Quote:
I guess it would be

I don't suppose you read that link I put up? It talked about how the Golden Rule (Do unto others as you would have them do unto you). Besides James 2:10 Clearly states that Ends cannot justify the means if the means are wrong, as those who break a single law are guilty of breaking every one.  
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 2:02 pm
Quote:
So as long as we don't 'call' it wizardy, then it's okay? Oh, don't worry officer, I wasn't stealing, I was repossesing.
OK i see your point...


Quote:
But the fact is they didn't, which, according to your arguement, makes them evil people who will make people become gang-rapers and murderers.
No, I never said that the Harry Potter Series is going to turn people into wizards and witches, I said that the introduce people to it.


Quote:
But how? As divineseraph (and several others throughout this debate) has put it, if harrpy potters give you problems with your relationship with God, then you pretty much didn't have a relationship.
That may be so....I cant help what my convictions are. Im just saying, when I read the books I felt myself getting angrier at myself and at the people in my family. The books are very angry books and they make a lot of things that the Bible specifically talks about seem ok

Quote:
Yes, it is. And Jesus had at least one story about polygamy. The Parable of the ten virgins. All about ten women who are waiting to meet their husband. According to you, this makes Jesus evil and a sinner.
I know the parable of the ten virgins, The parable represents something completally different though. It represents how we are to be ready for Christ's second coming, which because the 5 virgins didnt have enough oil for their lamps, they werent ready.



Quote:
I don't suppose you read that link I put up? It talked about how the Golden Rule (Do unto others as you would have them do unto you). Besides James 2:10 Clearly states that Ends cannot justify the means if the means are wrong, as those who break a single law are guilty of breaking every one.
No I didnt read the link because I already knew the direction you were going. What if the Means are right though, then the Ends may justify the Means...if im not mistaken. The C.S. Lewis series the "Means" of his book is fantasy, the ends is to teach childeren about Christ, The Harry Potter series does not teach about Christ and it has so many messages in it, such as Revenge is ok, and Use your anger to your advantage, and these are only two of the messages that the books have.  

Silent Expressor


ioioouiouiouio

PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 2:55 am
Silent Expressor
No, I never said that the Harry Potter Series is going to turn people into wizards and witches, I said that the introduce people to it.

Pretty much the same thing, when you think about it.

Quote:
That may be so....I cant help what my convictions are. Im just saying, when I read the books I felt myself getting angrier at myself and at the people in my family. The books are very angry books and they make a lot of things that the Bible specifically talks about seem ok

Then I would venture a guess that the problem lies with you and not these books. Take a long deep look at your own faith. Ask yourself some questions about it. I say this not to be mean, but I firmly believe that someone who lets their faith shaken by pure, 100% fiction (and not even the allegorical kind) did not have a very firm basis in the first place. Remember, this was originally said by me long before I knew this about you. It's not personal, and so don't take it as such.

Quote:
I know the parable of the ten virgins, The parable represents something completally different though. It represents how we are to be ready for Christ's second coming, which because the 5 virgins didnt have enough oil for their lamps, they werent ready.

And Harry Potter was written as a story to give J.K. Rowling's little daughter hope to get her through the very tough times (as I recall from an article written about J.K. Rowling, at the time, her daughter didn't have enough toys 'to fill a shoe box'). Certainly not what you'd call ulterior motives.



Quote:
No I didnt read the link because I already knew the direction you were going. What if the Means are right though, then the Ends may justify the Means...if im not mistaken. The C.S. Lewis series the "Means" of his book is fantasy, the ends is to teach childeren about Christ, The Harry Potter series does not teach about Christ and it has so many messages in it, such as Revenge is ok, and Use your anger to your advantage, and these are only two of the messages that the books have.

No, Yes, in Harry Potter the main character seeks justice for his parents death. Of course, considering the fact that they were murdered (and in a rather horrific way, from what I understand of the avada kadavra), this is rather understandable. Condonable? I doubt it, though, through the progression of the books, Harry gains more reason to pursue the Voldemort than just vengeance. Secondly, there is nothing wrong with having or even using anger. The Bible has numerous mentions of God's 'Wrath' and it's disastrous consequences (case in point: Noah's ark).  
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 7:42 am
Cometh The Inquisitor

No, Yes, in Harry Potter the main character seeks justice for his parents death. Of course, considering the fact that they were murdered (and in a rather horrific way, from what I understand of the avada kadavra), this is rather understandable. Condonable? I doubt it, though, through the progression of the books, Harry gains more reason to pursue the Voldemort than just vengeance. Secondly, there is nothing wrong with having or even using anger. The Bible has numerous mentions of God's 'Wrath' and it's disastrous consequences (case in point: Noah's ark).


Isn't vengange God's alone? We do not have any sort of authority over creation. When we decide to take revenge into our own hands, we try to usurp God from that role. And that's wrong, isn't it?

Now, I do agree that there is nothing wrong with anger. But often times when we act on it we sin. There are certain situations which enable us to act on anger without sinning.

In anger I have insulted people before. That's not a right way to act on anger.

But also in anger at where I have ended up spiritually I have eliminated things from my life that hindered me in my walk with Christ. And this is a right way to act on anger.

And to the other issue, personally I've never been convicted that HP is wrong. However, I've pretty much stopped reading it because I got tired of Harry's angst. He whines a lot. I don't read whiny people.  

Berezi


ioioouiouiouio

PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 12:06 pm
Berezi

Isn't vengange God's alone? We do not have any sort of authority over creation. When we decide to take revenge into our own hands, we try to usurp God from that role. And that's wrong, isn't it?

The fact that vengeance is God's alone should dissuade the act of revenge, but should not paralyze christians in the pursuit of justice. While, in the beginning, Harry's primary goal was vengeance, he, throughout the course of the story realises that justice is the answer (possibly the only worthwhile character growth in the entire series).



Quote:
And to the other issue, personally I've never been convicted that HP is wrong. However, I've pretty much stopped reading it because I got tired of Harry's angst. He whines a lot. I don't read whiny people.

I can understand that one. Harry Potter is written rather poorly and I only continue to read it out off principle (I started the series and I'm gonna finish it).  
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 9:13 pm
Cometh The Inquisitor

The fact that vengeance is God's alone should dissuade the act of revenge, but should not paralyze christians in the pursuit of justice. While, in the beginning, Harry's primary goal was vengeance, he, throughout the course of the story realises that justice is the answer (possibly the only worthwhile character growth in the entire series).


You're right about that. But even so, we must know when to stop.



Quote:

I can understand that one. Harry Potter is written rather poorly and I only continue to read it out off principle (I started the series and I'm gonna finish it).

That's probably the only reason why I read the sixth one...I think that her writing got worse as she went along. I enjoyed the first four or so. Then it was just "Oh, my angst! Angst! Oh, hot Ginny! ANGST!"

Although I do want to read the last one to find out if Dumbledore really dies. He's my favorite character aside from Sirius, also "dead". That made me so mad, by the way. (My Sirius didn't have tatoos. He was really tall and kind of skinny...kind of cool-lookin.)  

Berezi


divineseraph

PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2006 12:49 pm
but is anger and angst not a part of reality? a writer must not look only at what will be a happy ending or a lesson learned, ut what is real. a well-developed character is like a real person, with thier own individual morals, beliefs and thoughts, even if they are not you own nor even the authors. a good character must seem real, to bring forth emotions of all kinds. otherwise they are just bland and boring and their lives and deaths are inconsequential. characters must have rel motives, even if they aren't the most noble- they can be of lust, of wrath, of jealousy or hatred, so long as it is realistic. a character with no motivation, a c haracter who does not change or move or feel is pointless.  
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2006 3:44 pm
divineseraph
but is anger and angst not a part of reality? a writer must not look only at what will be a happy ending or a lesson learned, ut what is real. a well-developed character is like a real person, with thier own individual morals, beliefs and thoughts, even if they are not you own nor even the authors. a good character must seem real, to bring forth emotions of all kinds. otherwise they are just bland and boring and their lives and deaths are inconsequential. characters must have rel motives, even if they aren't the most noble- they can be of lust, of wrath, of jealousy or hatred, so long as it is realistic. a character with no motivation, a c haracter who does not change or move or feel is pointless.


I agree whole-heartedly.  

ioioouiouiouio


PoppyDadswell

PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 5:48 am
ok,i think harry potter is harmless but witty.jk rowling did say that she did not believe in magic.also anyone silly enough to attempt to flly on a broomstick can try from here to eternity and get nowhere.harry wanting to get revenge on bullies is a natural human desire,which makes harry all the more real.the idea of revenge is bad for you but making a stand against bullies and the oppresed is a good thing.  
PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 5:46 pm
To say that any book is "bad" or "evil" is really quite ridiculous.

Harry Potter is not the Bible. The characters and situations reflect the people and society of today, and no, people probably shouldn't base their life off a series of children's books.

However, that doesn't make it somehow wrong or damaging to read them.

No, the characters are not the picture of Christian perfection, but if reading about imperfect characters, is somehow evil and harmful to our relationship with God, then we may as well avoid associating with real people who are imperfect. Which basically means that we should all be locked in dark little closets with a torch and a Bible.

Honestly. They're books. Fictional books, no less. Read them if you like, take what message you care to from them, and move on with your life. If a person starts turning to magic and satanistic rituals because they read a kids' fantasy book, they couldn't have been particularily strong Christians in the first place.



Oscar Wilde
You and I are what we are and will be what we will be. As for being poisoned by a book, there is no such thing as that. Art has no influence upon action. It annihilates the desire to act. It is superbly sterile. The books that the world calls immoral are the books that show the world its own shame.
 

SinfulGuillotine

Perfect Trash


PoppyDadswell

PostPosted: Tue Aug 29, 2006 1:09 pm
Tangled Up In Blue
Silent Expressor
After reading through some of the posts it looks like I have to make my original argument yet again

All right then, allow me to ask you something: do you perchance watch television—aside from the 700 Club, that is? Because it's absolutely chuck full of sexual immorality, debauchery, hatred, discord, rage, selfishness, factitiousness and drunkeness. If there's anything that has the appearances of evil, it's prime-time T.V. Or is T.V. exempt because it's so mind-destroying and vegetative that it leaves one's brain too bloody paralyzed for Satan to even bother attacking? Oh those blasted books! They'll lead us down the path of destruction yet.


personally TV is much more wrong than books,books can incite the mind,but TV daily displays a mind numbing trash of violence,drugs,drink,maschosism and swearing, and gives the generally opinion that these activities are popular,normaland acceptable, and leads kids to think they must follow them to be popular also.  
PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:28 pm
I live in Georgia...and we had a HUGE debate in the public school system about harry potter. One of my friends actually went to the debate to suppot it...i don't think she knew that my old counselor was there to show what it did to her client.
My counselor was Marcia. <3. I miss her...-_-.
But that's besides the point. Marcia was pentacostal and believed in spiritual things more so then i suppose...other denominations. But that is something that i believe sometimes other demoninations tend to overlook.
Her 14 year old client read the Harry Potter books..and after reading them started wicca and other witchcraft. It took her...months and months of intensive counseling and spiritual cleansing to get her out of it.
-She was old enough to realize that what she was reading was a book...she did it anyway
-she said she wished she never read harry potter in the first place because of what it did to her.

Tell that girl who had to go through months of counseling such that it was only a book.  

Siren of Saturn


ioioouiouiouio

PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:40 pm
Siren of Saturn
I live in Georgia...and we had a HUGE debate in the public school system about harry potter. One of my friends actually went to the debate to suppot it...i don't think she knew that my old counselor was there to show what it did to her client.
My counselor was Marcia. <3. I miss her...-_-.
But that's besides the point. Marcia was pentacostal and believed in spiritual things more so then i suppose...other denominations. But that is something that i believe sometimes other demoninations tend to overlook.
Her 14 year old client read the Harry Potter books..and after reading them started wicca and other witchcraft. It took her...months and months of intensive counseling and spiritual cleansing to get her out of it.
-She was old enough to realize that what she was reading was a book...she did it anyway
-she said she wished she never read harry potter in the first place because of what it did to her.

Tell that girl who had to go through months of counseling such that it was only a book.

Easily. There a boatloads of people out there that easily let fantasy alter their perception of reality and the majority of them had preexisting conditions (mental conditions, low-self esteem that caused the fantasy to be used as a sort of escapism, etc.) that allowed the fantasy to work it's way from being a harmless book to becoming a worldview.

As has been stated earlier in this thread, 'stupid people will do stupid things no matter what you give them as a medium for their stupidity.'

In short, blame the person, not the book.  
PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:51 pm
Cometh The Inquisitor

In short, blame the person, not the book.
In a loving manner, of course.  

Berezi


Siren of Saturn

PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:55 pm
Cometh The Inquisitor
Siren of Saturn
I live in Georgia...and we had a HUGE debate in the public school system about harry potter. One of my friends actually went to the debate to suppot it...i don't think she knew that my old counselor was there to show what it did to her client.
My counselor was Marcia. <3. I miss her...-_-.
But that's besides the point. Marcia was pentacostal and believed in spiritual things more so then i suppose...other denominations. But that is something that i believe sometimes other demoninations tend to overlook.
Her 14 year old client read the Harry Potter books..and after reading them started wicca and other witchcraft. It took her...months and months of intensive counseling and spiritual cleansing to get her out of it.
-She was old enough to realize that what she was reading was a book...she did it anyway
-she said she wished she never read harry potter in the first place because of what it did to her.

Tell that girl who had to go through months of counseling such that it was only a book.

Easily. There a boatloads of people out there that easily let fantasy alter their perception of reality and the majority of them had preexisting conditions (mental conditions, low-self esteem that caused the fantasy to be used as a sort of escapism, etc.) that allowed the fantasy to work it's way from being a harmless book to becoming a worldview.

As has been stated earlier in this thread, 'stupid people will do stupid things no matter what you give them as a medium for their stupidity.'

In short, blame the person, not the book.

True...
*agrees that people can be very stupid and let things go too far...-_-*
*but there must also be the realization that Harry Potter is a door that your cracking open to more dangerous things.*
But why should we as christians even entertain something like harry potter when it so plainly deals with things that goes against everything that Christ stands for?
I think this has gone beyond it being a book...it's gone to the point where we as christians have become so desensetisized*sp??* to something so plainly evil. -_-. It's not Harry potter that makes me sad...
it's that.
I think it makes God sad too sad  
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