The Book of Revelation (Questions to ask)

[peacecorps333]

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[We Dont Negotiate]

First of dont Copy and Paste, give Credit to the origional author of the Statment please which would be the TCC

1) Yes
2) whut?
3) I wasnt aware that it ever changed "from" works?
4) Yes as long as it was a firm rod "Of" love
5) Yes

6) No it shouldent, it is as valid as any other book, to doubt it is to doubt the Word of John and to doubt the word of John brings all his other books into question and if this is so, the whole New Testiment is shaken and cannot be trusted

I guess you belive it was just a Politoal satire on Nero aye?

Edit: I typed Paul instead of John  

[We Dont Negotiate]

peacecorps333

Would Jesus tell you he is coming soon and then not come?

Also prove to me, the John that wrote one of the gospels is the same John that had that dream called "The Book of The Book of Revelation"
John is a common name.


The TCC info you asked for:

http://www.christian-community.org/library/revelheresy.html

Who is to say what is soon to the Lord, does time work the same way for the Lord God? if it works of the Metaphysical basis that all time was once a Singularity as the Universe expands then time is completely Relative to interpriation and everything has allready happend, then indeed the time is Near, or is upon us every day.

This is no less conclusive than a lot of failed Prophecy from the OT or just basic failed fact.

Proove to me it isnt?, also even if it is not the Council of Niceia decided to put it into the Gospels and this is a Decision we now live with, we must remember the early fathers decided not to put in a lot of Books which we may not completely agree with, they had to have an actual commitee just to decided if Jesus was the son of God or not, they decided he was(Not by a large margin) and proceeded to edit all our current Gospels to reflect this. The Gospels of Mary , Judas, Jalasaticeese all have crazy and wonderful ideas and tales in them which could very well have changed the very way we veiw Christianity today.

If you begin to say "this one book should not be in here!" you then say "This book cannot be trusted, the people who put them together were wrong" it is then far to easy to say "...so was this book and this one and this one" "Luke and Matthew were edited to fit an agender, important facts were ommitted".

Where do you draw the line?

I personally Disagree with a lot of the teachings of John and Paul , i veiw them as Un Christ Like and far to influenced by there Jewish legacy and there humanity, but i follow them i dont just pick and choose from the teachings, to do so would be a dangerous path.  

[IcarusDream]

Does something that doesn't exist anymore cry?  

[Orizion]

Wow... I thought these would be different questions, such as "what does it mean, for example is the dragon an actual dragon, or just metaphorical?"

Jesus does not kill, doesn't vomit, doesn't change His mind, and as for the iron rod, I'm not sure. I don't see Him sending someone to hell to doesn't believe every word of the Book of Revelation, because, after all, it is a very difficult one to comprehend, let alone believe.

The quote "He will wipe away every tear..." is referring to how it will be for all believers in heaven. Just in case anyone has any doubt that heaven will be a good experience. Even if those who were thrown into the lake of fire do still exist (which I believe they don't, as Icarus pointed out), those in heaven will not be exposed to or aware of them.

for We Dont Negotiate, you say that a lot of OT Prophecy has failed. I have firm evidence to support that it has succeeded. Unless you can prove that OT Prophecy failed, your statement is false. In addition, the line is drawn when one story's accounts outweigh other story's. Judas' Mary's and Jalasaticeese's "gospels" don't agree with each other, and probably have inconsistencies in themselves. Matt's, Luke's, John's, and Mark's agree with each other, and are consistent; thus, they are trustworthy accounts. 4 accurate, agreeing gospels versus 3 inaccurate, disagreeing "gospels." You do the math.  

[Reverend MacManus]

Salvation is brought through faith and acceptance of Christ the saviour, not through good deeds and "works."

Children are born innocent, except from the concept of "original sin." In essence, I don't see them being killed by Jesus. Not that he would kill anyone anyways. Part them for judgment or cast them to tormet forever, possibly, but murder them no.

Love sometimes needs to be wrought with an iron hand, such as a father's discipline to his son. We're seeing the results these days of a lack of it, and how parents who rebelled against their parents in recent generations are having kids and don't know how to be parents themselves. It's sad in my eyes.

One place you can look around for many great answers is www.gotquestions.org. Make good use of it.  

[Three Mile Sprint]

Orizion

Wow... I thought these would be different questions, such as "what does it mean, for example is the dragon an actual dragon, or just metaphorical?"

Jesus does not kill, doesn't vomit, doesn't change His mind, and as for the iron rod, I'm not sure. I don't see Him sending someone to hell to doesn't believe every word of the Book of Revelation, because, after all, it is a very difficult one to comprehend, let alone believe.

Oh so because its difficult to understand why, it must be false....or can be ignored...smoothe logic there dear


for We Dont Negotiate, you say that a lot of OT Prophecy has failed. I have firm evidence to support that it has succeeded. Unless you can prove that OT Prophecy failed, your statement is false.

I have HUNDREDS of failed or falisified Prophecys from God himself and his messengers that never came to pass, ill pick a few i like

That Egypt would be uninhabited by humans or animals for forty years after being destroyed by Nebuchadrezzar. But there was never a time when Egypt was uninhabited. Humans and animals have lived there continuously since Ezekiel's prophecy. Ezekiel 29:10-13

God promises to cast out seven nations including the Amorites, Canaanites, and the Jebusites. But he was unable to fulfill his promise. Deuterononmy 7:1

God says that Solomon's kingdom will last forever. It didn't of course. It was entirely destroyed about 400 years after Solomon's death, never to be rebuilt. 2 Samual 7:13, 16

These verses falsely predict that Babylon will never again be inhabited. Issiah 13:19-20

This verse predicts that there shall be five cities in Egypt that speak the Canaanite language. But that language was never spoken in Egypt, and it is extinct now. Issiah 19:18

Jeremiah prophesies that all nations of the earth will embrace Judaism. This has not happened. Jeremiah 3:17

Matthew (1:12) lists Jeconiah as an ancestor of Jesus -- which, according to this prophecy, disqualifies Jesus as the Messiah.Jeremiah 22:28-30


In addition, the line is drawn when one story's accounts outweigh other story's. Judas' Mary's and Jalasaticeese's "gospels" don't agree with each other, and probably have inconsistencies in themselves. Matt's, Luke's, John's, and Mark's agree with each other, and are consistent; thus, they are trustworthy accounts. 4 accurate, agreeing gospels versus 3 inaccurate, disagreeing "gospels." You do the math.

It is just as easy to stipulate they to were all Edited in the forming councel to agree, i mean if they could barely agree Jesus was the son of God then there is little hope for anything else

 

[Aquiella]

stare

I don't understand where these questions are coming from.

It looks to me like your trying to make a point about something but don't have all the facts.

It also looks like your trying to prove either that the bible is wrong(can't happen) or that God is full of it. (also baloney)

Therefore, I dub these questions as poppycock and will not answer them.  

[Three Mile Sprint]

Aquiella

stare

I don't understand where these questions are coming from.

It looks to me like your trying to make a point about something but don't have all the facts.

It also looks like your trying to prove either that the bible is wrong(can't happen) or that God is full of it. (also baloney)

Therefore, I dub these questions as poppycock and will not answer them.

Then why did you bother posting at all?

Inability to question the core foundations of our faith will only result in blind ignorance, and the mindless repeating of book phrases (something i see far to often here) will only serve to indocrinate us into what are often Untruth's.

Any Scholar or person of initelligence know's that the bible contains instances of mistakes, it removes nothing from what is the core of our faith.

Open your eyes  

[SUPERSQUIRRELX]

Well much of the book is just the apostle John's interpretation of a vision that was sent to him by God. So it's all very figurative whether or not it is supposed to represent something true or be entirely figurative.  

[Anji-Neko-Chan]

peacecorps333

The Book of Revelation (Questions to ask)

Would Jesus kill little children because their parents sinned?

Would Jesus vomit you and me out of the Kingdom of heaven for being only luke warm?

Would Jesus change salvation by faith back to salvation by works?

Would Jesus direct his disciples to rule with an "iron rod" instead of love?

Would Jesus send you to hell for not believing every word of the Book of Revelation?

The Book of Revelation should be crossed out in every Bible.
Go get a pen, pencil, or marker.

O___O Oh my goodness...Okay let me try to answer this the right way...wow...xD

1) Jesus wouldn't kill a child because of parent's sin. John chapter 9 speaks of a man who was healed by Jesus from blindness (he was born blind). The disciples asked him if he was blind because of his parents' sin. Jesus said no. A child has nothing to do with the sins of his parents. Now if the child grows up and does the same sin their parents did, then that is their sin not the parents. Everyone is accountable to their own deeds. Jesus cared for people that didn't have a voice back then in his society, and that included women and children. And Jesus himself said that whoever humbles himself like a child would receive the kingdom of heaven (Matthew 18; 4)

2) Let's look at the verse: Revelation 3:16
"But since you are like lukewarm water, neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of my mouth!"

This was written specifically to the church in Laodicea. Now the reason for this verse is to state that God cannot tolerate a person who is wishy washy with their beliefs. The people believed in God one minute and the next minute they are doing things not of God (hence the hot and the cold). It's like Katy Perry's song. "Your hot then your cold. Your yes then your no. Your in then then your out." That was what the verse is taking about. A person shouldn't flop back and forth like that when it comes to God. In the same way that most of us can't stand an indecisive person, God can't stand when people are that way with Him. You gotta pick a side. There is no in between. The lukewarm person is the one that is in between. They say they love God, but they are living sinful lifestyles, and that is being fake. That fake attitude is what gets a person "vomited out." because the human body can only take in cool to cold or warm to hot liquids. If it is lukewarm the body automatically coughs it back up because it doesn't sit well in the stomach. It is a figure of speech, because God is not human, so he doesn't have a stomach. OMG imagine if he did?!?!?! That would be a LOT of puke D:

3) Salvation starts by faith and is continued through works. A person can give all their money to charity and stuff. But if he has not accepted Jesus and has no faith or love behind the action it is in vain. In the same sense if you accept Jesus by faith and are really mean to people then it shows you have no love. And since God calls us to love each other, being bad to people means you don't have love and are calling God a liar (which he is not). And if you call God a liar then I am really not sure if you'll end up at the pearly gates or not. When it comes to salvation faith and works go hand in hand.

4) The iron rod: I suggest that you please read this because it is way too much to copy and paste. Iron Rod Say WHAT?

5) The purpose of Revelation is to "REVEAL" what would happen in the future. In the 3 years of Jesus' ministry he predicted his death to the disciples and what would happen in the end times. He also stated that nobody knows the date that this will occur but the Father God. Even Jesus himself did not know. It is impossible for man to predict when this Apocalypse would happen which is why the bible says to always live in a way that should the end times come upon us, we would be ready to go with our father in heaven.

We should thank God for being merciful and allowing us to live in this time of grace. He is giving everyone a chance to turn from their bad ways and turn towards God. But the bible predicts that NOT everyone is going to be saved. No matter how hard we preach, or how hard we try and spread the Word of God there will be people to deny it. And as much as we don't want people to suffer the terrible fate, people will suffer because they chose not to believe. It is inevitable.

What I am concerned is that you are taking the book of Revelation a bit to literal, and that people are gonna get pwnd by Godzilla or something. Revelation is known to be one of the hardest to interpret, because it is written with A TON of symbolism.

And who are you to say that the book of Revelation should be crossed out? Why? Because you don't understand it and therefore based on what you derived from it you think it should be crossed out because you didn't like what you thought it said? That's odd.

I wish I could do that with math. Math was my worst and most hated subject. Too bad I can't cross out algebra and calculus from every math textbook =/ but hey we need math whether we like it or not right? mad D:  

[Neferet -House of Night-]

peacecorps333

The Book of Revelation (Questions to ask)

Would Jesus kill little children because their parents sinned?

Would Jesus vomit you and me out of the Kingdom of heaven for being only luke warm?

Would Jesus change salvation by faith back to salvation by works?

Would Jesus direct his disciples to rule with an "iron rod" instead of love?

Would Jesus send you to hell for not believing every word of the Book of Revelation?

The Book of Revelation should be crossed out in every Bible.
Go get a pen, pencil, or marker.

1. No Jesus wouldn't kill little kids because their parents sinned. Ummm they aren't the ones that sinned therefore they shouldn't die.

2. What the hell do you mean by vomit? O.o

3. salvation is both works and faith. People think it's more faith than works but in reality, you need to have both in a type of balance.

4. No. Jesus is all about love. Whereever people get this iron rod type deal is probably having some issues and needs to stop taking the Bible seriously any more than it has to be taken seriously. Books are not meant to be taken literally, when you do take it literally, all kinds of hell will break loose.

5. I dunno and I really don't care. I'm not a Christian. I'm ecclectic. I follow my own path and combine some religious beliefs and incorporate my own philosophy along with the phiosophy of others.

And the book of revelations isn't talking about the future. In fact, it is about what is going on during the Roman occupation of Jerusalem. A Non-fiction book does not use figurative language. Anyone who has at least payed attention to high school English knows that the Bible uses literary devices which are more commonly found in fiction. The Bible is a group of stories or chapters that are supposed to give the people of that time hope in a very depressing time, and in some cases it does give people hope in the worst of times. Which is why some people convert. However you have people taking it a little too far than what it should and you have what we like to call extremists. Suffice to say, there are a bunch of extremists in every religion, but that only happens when people take it farther than what it has to be. I'm just waiting for someone to take Aesop's Fables to the extreme. =.=  

[Neferet -House of Night-]

Anji-Neko-Chan

peacecorps333

The Book of Revelation (Questions to ask)

Would Jesus kill little children because their parents sinned?

Would Jesus vomit you and me out of the Kingdom of heaven for being only luke warm?

Would Jesus change salvation by faith back to salvation by works?

Would Jesus direct his disciples to rule with an "iron rod" instead of love?

Would Jesus send you to hell for not believing every word of the Book of Revelation?

The Book of Revelation should be crossed out in every Bible.
Go get a pen, pencil, or marker.

O___O Oh my goodness...Okay let me try to answer this the right way...wow...xD



I wish I could do that with math. Math was my worst and most hated subject. Too bad I can't cross out algebra and calculus from every math textbook =/ but hey we need math whether we like it or not right? mad D:

We need math. But we don't need to do anything higher than 2+2, 2-2, 2/2 and 2x2. Algebra and Calculas are both classes required by degrees for engineers. I am not an engineer nor do I plan on being one. I'm an artist and I don't really see how doing mathematical equations makes my drawing look better. Wen in reality all I need is geometry and not any other math. Which is why I think that math shouldn't really be apart of a Bachelor's of Arts. It makes no sense and doesn't necessarily go with it.