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 Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 7:06 am
Ayri^eagle [Haruko]
Hmmm... I can't really understand Vegetarianism...
or Veganism either, for that matter... it just doesn't
make a whole lot of sense to me... Now, don't get me
wrong, I respect you for your vigilance and strong
ability to control your want for indulgences. But, it
is a proven biological fact that humans are omnivores
and need to eat meat in order to be healhy. There are
a handful of Vegetarians and one Vegan in my family
and I love them very much, but I can't seem to fully
comprehend their dietary choices. I would understand
if someone was allergic to many meats, then being
Vegetarian would make sense because it would be in
order to live... I don't get why you would deprive your
body of nutrients it needs because you feel bad for an
animal that was meant to be eaten. Please don't take
this as an attack on Vegetarians, I do not wish to seem
like a "hater," I just have an opinion and would like to
state it for others to discuss... agreements and/or
disagreements are always welcome if they are a kind
of POSITIVE criticism. -[Haruko]Actually, in this modern age, it is extremely easy to get more htan enough of all the nutrients you need that you might usually get from meat. In fact many studies have shown vegatarians are actually much healthier and likely to live longer. Don't many Buddhist pledge not to harm any other living creature?
Well, yes... nowadays you can get supplements
and such to aid in your lack of nutrients, but
there was a time when those were not very well
known or did not exsist at all and so many
vegetarians were, as a fact, unhealthy and
malnourished. I am at a loss... -[Haruko]
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Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 5:41 pm
[Haruko] Ayri^eagle [Haruko]
Hmmm... I can't really understand Vegetarianism...
or Veganism either, for that matter... it just doesn't
make a whole lot of sense to me... Now, don't get me
wrong, I respect you for your vigilance and strong
ability to control your want for indulgences. But, it
is a proven biological fact that humans are omnivores
and need to eat meat in order to be healhy. There are
a handful of Vegetarians and one Vegan in my family
and I love them very much, but I can't seem to fully
comprehend their dietary choices. I would understand
if someone was allergic to many meats, then being
Vegetarian would make sense because it would be in
order to live... I don't get why you would deprive your
body of nutrients it needs because you feel bad for an
animal that was meant to be eaten. Please don't take
this as an attack on Vegetarians, I do not wish to seem
like a "hater," I just have an opinion and would like to
state it for others to discuss... agreements and/or
disagreements are always welcome if they are a kind
of POSITIVE criticism. -[Haruko]Actually, in this modern age, it is extremely easy to get more htan enough of all the nutrients you need that you might usually get from meat. In fact many studies have shown vegatarians are actually much healthier and likely to live longer. Don't many Buddhist pledge not to harm any other living creature?
Well, yes... nowadays you can get supplements
and such to aid in your lack of nutrients, but
there was a time when those were not very well
known or did not exsist at all and so many
vegetarians were, as a fact, unhealthy and
malnourished. I am at a loss... -[Haruko]even centuries ago it was quite possible to get all those nutrients naturally. Pythagorus, the great mathematician, was a vegatarian. And why should innocent beings suffer for your wantings of diet? I also thought i would share these quotes with you...I hope you take them to heart “Nothing will benefit human health and increase the chances for survival of life on Earth as much as the evolution to a vegetarian diet.” Albert Einstein “It is significant to note that those who live on vegetarian food are less prone to diseases, whereas non-vegetarians are subject to more diseases. Why? Because animal food is incompatible with the needs of the human body.” Sri Sathya Sai Baba “If slaughterhouses had glass walls, everyone would be a vegetarian.” Paul McCartney “I've been a vegetarian for years and years. I'm not judgemental about others who aren't, I just feel I cannot eat or wear living creatures.” Drew Barrymore Nothing more strongly arouses our disgust than cannibalism, yet we make the same impression on Buddhists and vegetarians, for we feed on babies, though not our own." Robert Louis Stevenson “A human can be healthy without killing animals for food. Therefore if he eats meat he participates in taking animal life merely for the sake of his appetite.” Leo Nikolaevich Tolstoy The eating of meat extinguishes the seed of great compassion. --Mahaparinirvana (Buddhist)
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 7:06 am
Ayri^eagle [Haruko] Ayri^eagle [Haruko]
Hmmm... I can't really understand Vegetarianism...
or Veganism either, for that matter... it just doesn't
make a whole lot of sense to me... Now, don't get me
wrong, I respect you for your vigilance and strong
ability to control your want for indulgences. But, it
is a proven biological fact that humans are omnivores
and need to eat meat in order to be healhy. There are
a handful of Vegetarians and one Vegan in my family
and I love them very much, but I can't seem to fully
comprehend their dietary choices. I would understand
if someone was allergic to many meats, then being
Vegetarian would make sense because it would be in
order to live... I don't get why you would deprive your
body of nutrients it needs because you feel bad for an
animal that was meant to be eaten. Please don't take
this as an attack on Vegetarians, I do not wish to seem
like a "hater," I just have an opinion and would like to
state it for others to discuss... agreements and/or
disagreements are always welcome if they are a kind
of POSITIVE criticism. -[Haruko]Actually, in this modern age, it is extremely easy to get more htan enough of all the nutrients you need that you might usually get from meat. In fact many studies have shown vegatarians are actually much healthier and likely to live longer. Don't many Buddhist pledge not to harm any other living creature?
Well, yes... nowadays you can get supplements
and such to aid in your lack of nutrients, but
there was a time when those were not very well
known or did not exsist at all and so many
vegetarians were, as a fact, unhealthy and
malnourished. I am at a loss... -[Haruko]even centuries ago it was quite possible to get all those nutrients naturally. Pythagorus, the great mathematician, was a vegatarian. And why should innocent beings suffer for your wantings of diet? I also thought i would share these quotes with you...I hope you take them to heart “Nothing will benefit human health and increase the chances for survival of life on Earth as much as the evolution to a vegetarian diet.” Albert Einstein “It is significant to note that those who live on vegetarian food are less prone to diseases, whereas non-vegetarians are subject to more diseases. Why? Because animal food is incompatible with the needs of the human body.” Sri Sathya Sai Baba “If slaughterhouses had glass walls, everyone would be a vegetarian.” Paul McCartney “I've been a vegetarian for years and years. I'm not judgemental about others who aren't, I just feel I cannot eat or wear living creatures.” Drew Barrymore Nothing more strongly arouses our disgust than cannibalism, yet we make the same impression on Buddhists and vegetarians, for we feed on babies, though not our own." Robert Louis Stevenson “A human can be healthy without killing animals for food. Therefore if he eats meat he participates in taking animal life merely for the sake of his appetite.” Leo Nikolaevich Tolstoy The eating of meat extinguishes the seed of great compassion. --Mahaparinirvana (Buddhist)
I do appreciate your enthusiasm...
and I can respect your point of view,
But it is a proven Biological fact that
we humans are made for eating other
creatures. It is not mean, it is just for
survival. We have sharp teeth which
are meant for ripping meat and our
eyes are set foreward, not to the side,
which shows that we are predators,
not prey. We are supposed to eat meat.
It is just a fact.
I love Vegetarians because of their
dedication and determination, I do not
have that kind of control over myself
sometimes, and so I can appreciate a
Vegetarian lifestyle because of the strong
restraint they show. I just know that I
am an Omnivore, which means I am
supposed to eat meat and fruites/vegetables.
I do not mean to "fight" with you or
anything, so please do not take it that
way. I am just trying to grasp a better
understanding of a lifestyle far different
from mine. I do not think that Vegetarians
are "weird" or "dumb" or anything of the
sort, on the contrary, as I stated before,
I am in awe at their steadfast self-control
and perserverance.
Although I know that scientific fact has
proven that humans are supposed to eat
meat because they are biological predators,
I can respect someone with different views
than mine and therefore do not mind too
much if someone is Vegetarian, because
that is their choice and not mine. I will most
likely continue to eat meat for the rest of my
life. But maybe someday I will try Vegetarianism
to find further knowledge on the subject.
I thank you so much for your arguments
and love your enthusiasm. I hope this will
not come between us and our future
discussions. -[Haruko]
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:04 am
I have found something for you...
A life-long Buddhist's view on
Vegetarianism... It is quite interesting...
Good Questions & Good Answers - (Vegetarianism)
And a direct quote from him states:
"The Buddha was not vegetarian. He did not teach his disciples to be vegetarians and even today, there are many good Buddhists who are not vegetarians." - Ven S. Dhammika
He also asked this:
"If there was a man who was a very strict vegetarian but who was selfish, dishonest and mean, and another man who was not a vegetarian but who was thoughtful of others, honest, generous and kind, which of these two people would be the better Buddhist?"
-[Haruko]
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Posted: Wed Feb 28, 2007 5:13 pm
It is true that when you eat meat, you are indirectly and partially responsible for killing a creature but the same is true when you eat vegetables. The farmer has to spray his crop with insecticides and poisons so that the vegetables arrive on your dinner plates without holes in them. And once again, animals have been used to provide the leather for your belt or handbag, oil for the soap you use and a thousand other products as well. It is impossible to live without, in some way, being indirectly responsible for the death of some other beings. This is just another example of the First Noble Truth, ordinary existence is suffering and unsatisfactory. When you take the First Precept, you try to avoid being directly responsible for killing beings.
I just wanted to say about that that I eat only organic vegatables, never use leather or toilatries with animal products, so I am not responsible for these deaths...
If there was a man who was a very strict vegetarian but who was selfish, dishonest and mean, and another man who was not a vegetarian but who was thoughtful of others, honest, generous and kind, which of these two people would be the better Buddhist?
I just wanted to say taht I would have said the first one was perhaps not a better Buddhist, but a better person, because to me, most animals (at least the ones we generally eat) are far superior to the human being.
The last thing I wanted to say was i enjoy a good solid debate
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Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 7:03 am
Ayri^eagle It is true that when you eat meat, you are indirectly and partially responsible for killing a creature but the same is true when you eat vegetables. The farmer has to spray his crop with insecticides and poisons so that the vegetables arrive on your dinner plates without holes in them. And once again, animals have been used to provide the leather for your belt or handbag, oil for the soap you use and a thousand other products as well. It is impossible to live without, in some way, being indirectly responsible for the death of some other beings. This is just another example of the First Noble Truth, ordinary existence is suffering and unsatisfactory. When you take the First Precept, you try to avoid being directly responsible for killing beings.I just wanted to say about that that I eat only organic vegatables, never use leather or toilatries with animal products, so I am not responsible for these deaths... If there was a man who was a very strict vegetarian but who was selfish, dishonest and mean, and another man who was not a vegetarian but who was thoughtful of others, honest, generous and kind, which of these two people would be the better Buddhist?
I just wanted to say taht I would have said the first one was perhaps not a better Buddhist, but a better person, because to me, most animals (at least the ones we generally eat) are far superior to the human being. The last thing I wanted to say was i enjoy a good solid debate
Wow... if I knew how to spell "two-shay"
properly, I would put that... (touche' maybe?)
I am surprised and very intrigued at the
fact that you actually took the time to read
some of those questions and answers that
he posted on my favorite website...
Buddha Net I really love that you have a
really strong opposition... your opinions
fascinate me and I really appreciate it.
I hope we can have a sort of "debate"
friendship and appreciate eachother's
valuable opinions. I love getting on Gaia
because I know that a new and exciting
post is waiting my arrival... -[Haruko]
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Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 3:08 pm
[Haruko] Ayri^eagle It is true that when you eat meat, you are indirectly and partially responsible for killing a creature but the same is true when you eat vegetables. The farmer has to spray his crop with insecticides and poisons so that the vegetables arrive on your dinner plates without holes in them. And once again, animals have been used to provide the leather for your belt or handbag, oil for the soap you use and a thousand other products as well. It is impossible to live without, in some way, being indirectly responsible for the death of some other beings. This is just another example of the First Noble Truth, ordinary existence is suffering and unsatisfactory. When you take the First Precept, you try to avoid being directly responsible for killing beings.I just wanted to say about that that I eat only organic vegatables, never use leather or toilatries with animal products, so I am not responsible for these deaths... If there was a man who was a very strict vegetarian but who was selfish, dishonest and mean, and another man who was not a vegetarian but who was thoughtful of others, honest, generous and kind, which of these two people would be the better Buddhist?
I just wanted to say taht I would have said the first one was perhaps not a better Buddhist, but a better person, because to me, most animals (at least the ones we generally eat) are far superior to the human being. The last thing I wanted to say was i enjoy a good solid debate
Wow... if I knew how to spell "two-shay"
properly, I would put that... (touche' maybe?)
I am surprised and very intrigued at the
fact that you actually took the time to read
some of those questions and answers that
he posted on my favorite website...
Buddha Net I really love that you have a
really strong opposition... your opinions
fascinate me and I really appreciate it.
I hope we can have a sort of "debate"
friendship and appreciate eachother's
valuable opinions. I love getting on Gaia
because I know that a new and exciting
post is waiting my arrival... -[Haruko]If there was no one to disagree with me I'm sure I would feel less passionate about many of my beliefs...and there would be others I'd have that I don't now. debate builds one.
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Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:48 am
I honestly believe I cold not have put it better myself! -[Haruko]
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Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 3:40 pm
[Haruko]
I honestly believe I cold not have put it better myself! -[Haruko]well, thank you
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Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 6:58 am
Ayri^eagle [Haruko]
I honestly believe I cold not have put it better myself! -[Haruko]well, thank you
You are quite welcome! -[Haruko]
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Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2007 3:59 pm
[Haruko] Ayri^eagle [Haruko]
I honestly believe I cold not have put it better myself! -[Haruko]well, thank you
You are quite welcome! -[Haruko]and I usually struggle to word things
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Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2007 3:40 pm
i would like to say that when I said the vegatarian was a better person...I should have said MIGHT be a better person. It would depend why he was mean (doesn't understand/like people?) and why he was vegatarian (doesn't want to kill animals?)
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Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2007 4:44 am
I'm not vegetarian. I belive in the human state of omnivours. Death by being eaten is as natural as it gets in the world.
pus i like meat too much sweatdrop
however I do 100% belive in tying to minimalise any suffering the animal would have at its death and am very ooppsed to the 'hamas' method. I say they should all be killed before any slicing and dicing happens - and through a bolt through the head to make them braindead.
whiel farming etc happens, i belive that it is definatly out responsiblility to care for these sentient beings and treat them with respect.
I also 100% agree with free range and would encourage all types of meat animals to be free range. I disagree with veal and lamb (even though lamb is gorgeous tasting-lol) because they haven't been given a proper life being kileld off so younga dn cruelly just for teh sake of more tender meat.
if it means anything I also fished with my grandad and sister, but decided to stop. i didn't want to cause the fish any unesecary suffering - it looked hideously stressful for the poor things.
so i do have some morals...of a sort. i know wheret he line is, for me anyway emo
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:33 pm
I am moving in with my dad and his vegetarian girlfriend, Michelle.
She is very sweet and doesn't like the cruelties that are put upon
animals to make our food. I stayed with her for about nine days
and was unable to eat meat or touch anything that wasn't organic
*lol* and I had quite a lot of fun, actually. Even though I hate tofu
and had a hard time digesting veggie-based "chik'n nuggets," it
was a pleasant experience and I learned so much along the way. I
am stil not vegetarian and do not plan to change that any time soon,
but I have experienced something I normally wouldn't and come out
a better person. I am still firm in my beliefs but now have an even
better understanding as to why I think the way that I do. -[Haruko]
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Posted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 9:30 am
i find this is something that a lot of buddhist choose. i have choosen to respect other life by not eating meat. i feel that every animal has a soul and as they respect me i should also respect them as we are all trying to reach an understand and i am respecting them by not eating them. life is something so valuable i think that all deserve at chance at it regardless of what stage they are at. we can all reach a higher understanding and this is my way of respecting that.
i also find that to me eating meat is a selfish act. i don't understand how you can understand that it possesses a soul capable of nirvana and not respecting the process involved. i just couldn't justify that even thought our bodies are formed for eating meat.
to me the worse thing that you can do is placing yourself on a pedestial and justifing selfish actions by saying "its taste good, i just couldn't give it up" i just don't understand this. i respect you but do not understand the choice
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![[Haruko]'s avatar](https://a1cdn.gaiaonline.com/dress-up/avatar/ava/5f/9e/c3d174d9e5f_flip.png?t=1237929369_6.00_00)
