Homosexuality, gay marriage: My study of the Bible | Page 1 | Bible Studies and Discussions | Guild Forums

Aetherius Lamia
Crew

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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 3:53 pm

This thread is a work in progress, and eventually I shall post it in Morality & Religion.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
This is going to be a rather long post, as I'm examining every passage listed in my Bible's index. If your Bible, Torah, or Qu'ran has anything more, please contribute. What I'm doing is combing the Bible for anything semi-relevant to homosexuality and gay marriage, and "the gay lifestyle" (which I suppose it merely living life as heterosexuals would, except with a man instead of a wife). I'm then stating thoughts I have after reading it.

My goal is to either affirm or deny my homosexual urges and thoughts about marriage, after reading everything I can find that the Bible has to offer.

I've gone through this already, but here is my exposition. I will print it and take it to a priest at my church for an in-depth discussion. (I figure he will have something to offer, with his familiarity and expertise, that I have not yet seen here. And if he doesn't, then I'll have "all my bases covered", so to speak, before talking with my parents.)

Statements I hope will be addressed that seem to come up in discussions:

Homosexuality is a choice, not something to be understood.
Homosexual urges are temptations from Satan.
Living with another man is immoral and sinful.
Homosexual sex is sinful.
Marriage is the union of a man and a woman, and is exclusive of two of the same gender.
Homosexuals are more promiscuous than heterosexuals.
Artificial insemination among lesbians is a sinful corruption of God's plan for procreation.
Homosexuality, as a form of diversity, is to be accepted, rather than stifled.
Christians who once denounced homosexuality but now are accepting of it have been corrupted.
People who condemn homosexuals as sinners are hypocritical, since we're all sinners.

Are there any others? Obviously, some of the questions can only be answered through looking at the text as a whole, as there are no passages in the Bible about artificial insemination or promiscuity in society today. The statement about hypocrisy is obviously fallacious, as are a few others, but I don't want to leave any "stone unturned"...

Everything I've listed here I think is related, or may be brought up in discussion. If homosexuality is sinful, then I have questions as to why:

Why are our spirits restricted by the physical bodies in which they're placed?
Why would God, encompassing and surpassing our physical differences, care if we also desired to surpass them?
What is it about love between heterosexuals that homosexuals cannot share?

If there is an equally-valid alternate interpretation of a passage, please share it. This index and these passages are from a 2000 version of The Catholic Youth Bible. The lists in caps are categorized under "Life and Faith Issues". The caps in indigo are from a category called "Sacrament Connections".
I was slightly mistaken when I made the list, thinking it a list of all the passages.

1513: Article Subject Index

This subject index is not an index to the Bible itself (sometimes called a concordance). Rather, it is an index to the subjects covered in the various articles in The Catholic Youth Bible. But because most articles are based on a Bible passage, this index will also help you find Bible passages related to these topics.

abortion
62, 684, 926, 1124
p62: Exodus, 1.15-22
The king of Egypt said to the Hebrew midwives, one of whom was named Shiphrah and the others Puah, "When you act as midwives to the Hebrew women, and see them on the birthstool, if it is a boy, kill him; but if it is a girl, she shall live." But the midwives feared God; they did not do as the king of Egypt commanded them, but they let the boys live. So the king of Egypt summoned the midwives and said to them, "Why have you done this, and allowed the boys to live?" The midwives said to Pharoah, "Because the Hebrew women are not like the Egyptian women; for they are vigorous and give birth before the midwife comes to them." So God dealt well with the midwives; and the people multiplied and became very strong. And because the midwives feared God, he gave them families. Then Pharoah commanded all his people, "Every boy that is born to the Hebrewsa you shall throw into the Nile, but you shall let every girl live."
I don't see this passage as regarding abortion -- I see it as about murder. But I suppose one could interpret it as abortion, as it's about children being killed without them having any say in the affair. However, this passage does nothing to argue against the idea of abortion as a tool from God to prevent unwanted pregnancies.
684: Psalm 139, The Inescapable God
To the leader. Of David. A Psalm.
O LORD, you have searched me and known me.
You know when I sit down and when I rise up; you discern my thoughts from far away.
You search out my path and my lying down, and are acquainted with all my ways.
Even before a word is on my tongue, O LORD, you know it completely.
You hem me in, behind and before, and lay your hand upon me.
Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is so high that I cannot attain it.
Where can I go from your spirit? Or where can I flee from your presence?
If I ascend to heaven, you are there; if I make my bed in Sheol, you are there.
If I take the wings of the morning and settle at the farthest limits of the sea,
even there your hand shall lead me, and your right hand shall hold me fast.
If I say, "Surely the darkness shall cover me, and the light around me become night,"
even the darkness is not dark to you; the night is as bright as the day,
for darkness is as light to you.
For it was you who formed my inward parts; you knit me together in my mother's womb.
I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; that I know very well.
My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth.
Your eyes beheld my unformed substance. In your book were written all the days that were formed for me, when none of them as yet existed.
How weighty to me are your thoughts, O God! How vast is the sum of them!
I try to count them -- they are more than the sand; I come to the endl -- I am still with you.
O that you would kill the wicked, O God, and that the bloodthirsty would depart from me --
those who speak of you maliciously, and lift themselves up against you for evil!m
Do I not hate those who hate you, O LORD? And do I not loathe those who rise up against you?
I hate them with perfect hatred; I count them my enemies. Search me, O God, and know my heart; test me an know my thoughts.
See if there is any wickedn way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting.o
l Or I awake
m Cn: Meaning of Heb uncertain
n Heb hurtful
o Or the ancient way. Compare Jer 6.16
Near the end we see some of the old Jewish mentality that Jesus sought to wipe away (hating your enemies rather than loving them). There is a bit about pregnancy, which I have highlighted. If we have the audacity to tell God we don't want children, then, it should be done before the fetus begins to grow into a child. Even then, how do we know that's okay with God, if having the child to begin with is a blessing from Him? If having a child is a blessing from God, then it would make sense that He wants us to have it.
Jeremiah 31 seems to be about exiles reuniting, scattered families reuniting, mourning turns to rejoicing, etc. My Bible has an excerpt about Rachel weeping, saying it "is quoted in Mt 2.16-18, Project Rachel is an organized ministry for women who have had abortions. And Rachel Weeps is a holocaust exhibition recalling the murder of millions of Jewish men, women, and children."
926: Jeremiah 31.15-17
Thus says the LORD: A voice is heard in Ramah, lamentation and bitter weeping. Rachel is weeping for her children; she refuses to be comforted for her children, because they are no more.
Thus says the LORD: Keep your voice from weeping, and your eyes from tears; for there is a reward for your work, says the LORD: they shall come back from the land of the enemy;
there is hope for your future, says the LORD: your children shall come back to their own country.
This is a good passage for abortion if the point is established that the child in the mother's womb is in fact her child. But if it is a fetus, only just planted, and she does not want a child, the passage is instead about a bereaved mother (ie, a woman who actually wanted the child.)

What I mean to say is, once again, this passage does not do much to argue against the rejection of a fetus that isn't wanted. And in that context, it seems abortion would be a good tool to prevent unwanted children from entering the world -- and I would then project that God would shrug his shoulders at the rejected blessing, and give it to someone else who actually wanted it.

But ultimately, I must then ask: Who are we to surmise what God intends? With what authority can I say what I've just said?
The Slaughter of Innocents, p1124
The event described in Mt 2.16-18 is often called the Slaughter of the Innocents. In many circumstances in history, innocent people, including infants and young children, have been massacred in the name of war or convenience (see "Rachel Weeps," Jer 31.15-17).
Today, abortion is one of those circumstances. To many people, it seems to be a simple solution to the inconvenience of an unwanted pregnancy. But what of the innocent lives that are destroyed? With abortion, "they are no more" (Mt 2.1 cool . Our church teaching is clear: All human life is sacred, and abortion is wrong. How might we as individuals or communities support pregnant women to ensure they do not choose abortion?
I've highlighted in green what appears to me to be the crux of this argument. That a fetus is an innocent life. They apply it as a definition. But what of my stance: That if we want the child, then it becomes an innocent life. That if we don't want it, then it is a wasted blessing -- sort of like squandering wealth?
1123: The Massacre of the Infants, Matthew 2.16-18
When Herod saw that he had been tricked by the wise men,k he was infuriated, and he sent and killed all the children in and around Bethlehem who were two years old or under, according to the time that he had learned from the wise men.o
Then it was fulfilled what had been spoken through the prophet Jeremiah:
"A voice was heard in Ramah, wailing and loud lamentation, Rachel weeping for her children; she refused to be consoled, because they are no more."
k Or astrologers; Gk magi
Once again, the passage is specifically about the murdering of young children and infants. It then coincides with both my argument about abortion and the argument presented by the Church.

The argument that has not yet been resolved is why the Church decides to label all pregnancies as children meant to live. I suppose they do it because, if the life was not prematurely ended, it would then be meant to live, and would, barring the tragic death of the mother.

In other words, why does the Catholic Church not consider accepting the blessing a possible choice? The Catholic Church instead holds the belief that if you are pregnant, it is God's will to bring life into the world, and to go against it is murder. Perhaps their logic goes like this:
- If you don't want a child, abstain from sex. (Or, more liberally, use condoms and birth control pills.)
- If children are blessings from God, then becoming pregnant is God's work, and going against God's plan is a sin.
Seems pretty cut and dry, from this perspective.
acceptance
1150: The Laborers in the Vineyard
I decided to link to a text equivalent or identical to that of my own. See Matthew 20.1-16. It's about God accepting everyone, and loving one who (sincerely) turns to Him on his deathbed just as much as one who has accepted Him all his life.
agape
1359: did you KNOW?: God's Love
Greek, the language of the New Testament, has several words for love. There are words for parental love, romantic love, and love between friends or relatives. The rare Greek word Paul uses in First Corinthians, chapter 13 -- agape -- is reserved for a special kind of love.
Apage (ah-GAH-pay) is love without conditions or motivations. It is there no matter who you are or what you do. It willingly chooses to serve without expectation of service in return. The Bible tells us that God is agape (1 Jn 4.16). The source of agape is the unconditional love of God. God's agape is revealed to us in Jesus Christ. Through our faith in Christ, we become a channel for communicating this wonderful love to others.
We are created in God's image. God wants us to love one another with the agape that Paul describes in chapter 13. It's a wonderful challenge!
> 1 Corinthians, chapter 13
Coincidentally, it is the necessary basis for altruism -- something psychologists do not believe exists (as told to me by Dr John Pennington at MTSU from (Honors) Social Psychology), as every human action can be "explained" by 'more earthly' reasons such as "he gave money to the bum to make himself feel better," or "Mother Theresa did it for fame or for treasure in Heaven or because she felt God wanted her to do it", "the woman died saving her children to ensure her genes were passed on to future generation, according to evolutionary psychology," etc. In other words, any supernatural explanation is to be disregarded in favor of a natural one, because science deals with the realm of the natural. (It then becomes erroneous if one believes it superior to dealing with the supernatural.)
Anyway, a passage more or less equivalent to my own can be found at 1 Corinthians, chapter 13.
COMMITMENT
Num 30.2-4
168: Vows Made by Women; Numbers 30.1-4
Then Moses said to the heads of the tribes of the Israelites: This is what the LORD has commanded:
When a man makes a vow to the LORD, or swears an oath to bind himself by a pledge, he shall not break his word; he shall do according to all that proceeds out of his mouth.
When a woman makes a vow to the LORD, or binds herself by a pledge, while within her father's house, in her youth,
and her father hears of her vow or her pledge by which she has bound herself, and says nothing to her; then all her vows shall stand, and any pledge by which she has bound herself shall stand.
I suppose the reason for the father overhearing is because it was an older society where women had to have permission from their fathers, not that there's necessarily anything wrong with that ... The point of this passage is to be "a man of your word", so to speak. biggrin But we already knew that.
Deut 6.1-9; 11.8-9
182: The Great Commandment; Deuteronomy 6.1-9
Now this is the commandment -- the statues and the ordinances -- that the LORD your God charged me to teach you to observe in the land that you are about to cross into and occupy,
so that you and your children and your children's children may fear the LORD your God all the days of your life, and keep all his decrees and his commandments that I am commanding you, so that your days may be long.
Hear, therefore, O Israel, and observe them diligently, so that it may go well with you, and so that you may multiply greatly in a land flowing with milk and honey, as the LORD, the God of your ancestors, has promised you.
Hear, O Israel: The LORD is our God, the LORD alone."
You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might.
Keep these words that I am commanding you today in your heart.
Recite them to your children and talk about them when you are at home and when you are away, when you lie down and when you rise.
Bind them as a sign on your hand, fix them as an emblemo on your forehead,
and write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.
o Or as a frontlet
Great. Homosexuals can do that just as well as heterosexuals, right?
188: Rewards for Obedience; Deuteronomy 11.1-9

Keep, then, [having seen all the wonders of the LORD performed in taking you from Egypt and bringing you here,] this entire commandment that I am commanding you today, so that you may have strength to go in and occupy the land that you are crossing over to occupy,
and so that you may live long in the land that the LORD swore to your ancestors to give them and to their descendants, a land flowing with milk and honey.
So, this is sort of obvious. Keeping the commandments lead to good things, which lead to more good things. Kind of begs the question, why not? Getting back into the context of this post, though: Homosexuals remain committed to God and they will be blessed -- assuming, of course, that homosexuality doesn't interfere with a relationship with God. Let's see if any scripture up ahead brings this idea into focus.

Joshua 24.1-14 is Joshua -- speaker for God -- recounting all the badass things God did for the Israelites, conquests and such since Abraham.
236: The Tribes Renew the Covenant; Josh 24.14-15
"Now therefore revere the LORD, and serve him in sincerity and in faithfulness; put away the gods that your ancestors served beyond the River and in Egypt, and serve the LORD.
Now if you are unwilling to serve the LORD, choose this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your ancestors served in the region beyond the River or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you are living; but as for me and my household, we will serve the LORD."
Right. Stay committed to God.
Mk 8.34-38
1181: Jesus Fortells His Death and Resurrection; Mark 8.31-38
[Jesus tells the disciples all the crap he'll have to go through. Peter tries to rebuke him, Jesus says 'gtfo, noob'.]
He called the crowd with his disciples, and said to them, "If any want to become my followers, let them deny themselves and take up their cross and follow me.
For those who want to save their life will lose it, and those who lose their life for my sake, and for the sake of the gospel,j will save it.
For what will it profit them to gain the whole world and forfeit their life?
Indeed, what can they give in return for their life?
Those who are ashamed of me and of my wordsk in this adulterous and sinful generation, of them the Son of Man will also be ashamed when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels."
j Other ancient authorities read lose their life for the sake of the gospel
k Other ancient authorities read and of mine
commitment: 169, 696, 1050, 1181, 1231, 1400
169: Making a Vow
[The first two of three paragraphs talk about how serious vows actually are, and how they are misunderstood or not appreciated today.]
The Israelites also took vows seriously. Numbers, chapter 30, is devoted to laws about vows. The laws were sexist by our standards. For example, a father or a husband could veto a woman's vows. Such laws were deemed acceptable in the Israelites' patriarchal society, but they are not in ours.

696: All the Days of My Life
[Talks about living together for the rest of your life married to one woman, and how divorces have become frequent.]
The writer of Prov 5.15-23 is warning men, in particular, against adultery, which remains, even today, a primary reason marriages break up. But the author's wish in verse 19 could easliy be rephrased to address both husbands and wives: "May you always be intoxicated (as in elated, not drunk) by each other's love." ...
> Prov 5.13-23

Proverbs 5.15-23
Drink water from your own cistern, flowing water from your own well.
Should your springs be scattered abroad, streams of water in the streets?
Let them be for yourself alone, and not for sharing with strangers.
Let your fountain be blessed, and rejoice in the wife of your youth,
a lovely deer, a graceful doe. May her breasts satisfy you at all times; may you be intoxicated always by her love.
Why should you be intoxicated, my son, by another woman and embrace the bosom of an adulteress?
For human ways are under the eyes of the LORD, and he examines all their paths.
The iniquities of the wicked ensnare them, and they are caught in the toils of their sin.
They die for lack of discipline, and because of their great folly they are lost.
Note that there is still no reason why it must (or cannot) be a wife.
1050: The Long History of Rebellion; Hosea 12.2-6
The LORD has an indictment against Judah, and will punish Jacob according to his ways, and repay him according to his deeds.
In the womb he tried to supplant his brother, and in his manhood he strove with God.
He strove with the angel and prevailed, he wept and sought his favor; he met him at Bethel, and there he spoke with him.d
The LORD the God of hosts, the LORD is his name!
But as for you, return to your God, hold fast to love and justice, and wait continually for your God.
d Gk Syr: Heb us
Erm ... okay.
1050: I Therefore Commit
This prayer from Elizabeth S. Tapia of the Philippines could have been written in response to Hosea's call to live justly, to live the spirit of being a holy people of God:
We should not oppress children, indigenous people,
women, the homeless, refugees and victims of war.
We need to live in the sense of people and creation.
For I believe in the interwovenness of life.
Creator and Creatures. Cosmic and Individual.
West, North, East, South. Rest and Prayer.
Food and Freedom. Theology and Ecology.
I therefore commit myself, together with you,
to take care or mother earth.
To advocate for peace and justice.
To choose and celebrate life.
These things I believe. Amen.
(From Maren C. Tirabassi and Kathy Wonson Eddy, Gifts of Many Cultures, p. 115)
> Hos 12.2-6
Only problem I have with this prayer/poem is that she commits me for me. >_>; Who gave you my say, lady?!
1181: "Total Commitment" is the title of the article.
Once again, the point is that in order to live a fulfilling life, you must commit yourself completely to Jesus, and that this includes a willingness to suffer for what is right, and for upholding his teachings (which, by the way, are nothing but good ideals that everyone should follow). I suppose it makes sense, as life is pointless without the spiritual realm. They based this article on Mark 8.34-38, which has already been quoted above.
1231: The Loaded Question
[Jesus asks us to do things that seem radical to us. It also asks, does the rich ruler ask Jesus his loaded question from "eagerness or conceit"?] Our human tendency is to hoard our money and our material goods. But with God's help (verse 27), we can become generous with those in need.
> Lk 18.18-30
These sentiments hold for "developed" countries, but what about the few tribes remaining that have almost nothing? Does it hold for them, too? I suppose it does; I recently saw a National Discovery Channel documentary about a marriage ceremony -- there were boobies! -- and the family of the betrothed were arguing about cows. "Such and so got married and he got to keep his cow..." I dunno.
1231: Luke 18.18-30; The Rich Ruler
A certain ruler asked him, "Good Teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
Jesus said to him, "Why do you call me good? No one is good but God alone.
You know the commandments: 'You shall not commit adultery; You shall not murder; You shall not steal; You shall nto bear false witness; Honor your father and mother.'"
He replied, "I have kept all these since my youth."
When Jesus heard this, he said to him, "There is still one think lacking. Sell all that you own and distribute the moneyj to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; then come, follow me."
But when he heard this, he became sad; for he was very rich.
Jesus looked at him and said, "How hard it is for those who have wealth to enter the kingdom of God!
Indeed, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God."
Those who heard it said, "Then who can be saved?"
He replied, "What is impossible for mortals is possible for God."
Then Peter said, "Look, we have left our homes and followed you."
And he said to them, "Truly I tell you, there is no one who has left house or wife or brothers or parents or children, for the sake of the kingdom of God,
who will not get back very much more in this age, and in the age to come eternal life."
j Gk lacks the money
My mom later told me that "the eye of a needle" was actually the name of a very short gate in some city, and that to get camels through, they had to stoop or bend down on their knees or something ridiculously hard to make a camel do. Does anyone know if this is true or false? Has anyone else heard this? Wikipedia says no historical evidence has been found, but not only is nothing cited for that statement, but even if true, it could just indicate it hasn't been found yet.
1400: "Commitment to Your Goal". This article states that remaining committed to a goal is a sign of maturity. It's based on the following:
1399: Pressing toward the Goal; Philippians 3.13-16
Beloved,[Gk Brothers] I do not consider that I have made it my own;[Other ancient authorities read my own yet] but this one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and straining forward to what lies ahead,
I press on toward the goal for the prize of the heavenly [Gk upward] call of God in Christ Jesus.
So, nothing seems to be stopping a homosexual couple from sharing all this with their children, eh? But I'm dodging the point: I read all these thinking they might address commitment in a monogamous relationship, but instead they only address remaining committed to God. And really, that's what a monogamous relationship in marriage parallels. (See The Screwtape Letters by C.S. Lewis for more detail.)
contentment
724: New and Improved!
NEW! IMPROVED! These two words are basic to many ad campaigns. No matter how good a product is, sooner or later, it will be "new and improved." The reason is simple: the advertisers want us to think the product is even better.
The writer of Ecclesiastes would not be very impressed with the claims of advertisers today. The author sounds skeptical in 1.9: "There is nothing new under the sun." The Teacher is not going to be taken in by claims that something is new and improved. This person has seen it all before.
Advertising can get us thinking that our life isn't good enough, that we have to have more things and new things in order to be happy. In fact, we need to have a little bit of the attitude of the Teacher if we want to find contentment. Throughout the Book of Ecclesiastes, this writer invites us to enjoy what we have now.
Have you ever gotten something because of its advertising, only to be disappointed afterward? Are you enjoying the things you have now?
> Eccl 1.1-11

723: Reflections of a Royal Philosopher; Ecclesiastes 1.1-11: Ecclesiastes 1.1-11 is more or less equivalent to my own Bible.
724: The Futility of Self-Indulgence; Ecclesiastes 2.1-11 is also of note. Not only is life here in and of itself pointless, but ultimately, self-gratification is also a futile pursuit.
corruption
283: Power and Corruption
Power corrupts. ... And in 1 Sam 15.22-23, we have a vivid example. ... No king, no president, no prime minster [sic] is above the law. Especially when that Law comes from God. ...
> 1 Sam 15.22-23
I quoted the important bits of the article.
284: 1 Samuel 15.22-23
And Samuel said, "Has the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obedience to the voice of the LORD? Surely, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to heed than the fat of rams.
For rebellion is no less a sin than divination, and stubbornness is like iniquity and idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the LORD, he has also rejected you from being king."

1248: Righteous Anger
... [Jesus] is not out of control, but he certainly is angry!
Even though we are often told that we should not show anger, sometimes, it is appropriate to do so. Righteous anger is a reaction to an injustice or something that is not right. Jesus is upset because [jerks] have made the Temple a marketplace and have defiled the sacred place. He controls his righteous anger and channels it in a civil and religious challenge against the corrupt and greedy leaders (see "Jesus and Civil Disobedience," Mt 21.12-13). Righteous anger should be expressed in ways that challenge evil and unjust situations but never in ways that cause violence or injury to another person. ...
> Jn 2.13-17
John 2.13-17 is more or less equivalent to my Bible, except my Bible says "both the sheep and the cattle", not "with the sheep and oxen"; my Bible makes it more clear that Jesus didn't whip the people from the Temple. sweatdrop

Well then, if there's nothing wrong with gay marriage, then there certainly is reason for this righteous anger ...
deception
37: When Lies Boomerang
[jacob is deceived by Laban, to whom he fled when he deceived Esau, his brother.] Jacob's lies and deceit have boomeranged, so now he is the victim.
Somehow, our lies, gossip, and manipulation of others often come back to haunt us. So it was with Jacob. So it will be with us if we follow his example.
> Gen 29.15-30
Genesis 29.15-30; the story is pretty simple.
54: God's Master Plan
[Good can come from bad things. Example: Joseph's sold to Egypt, and as a result saves the lives of many, including his entire family.] He sees the events of his family's life as part of God's plan to preserve life and to make sure that the covenant continues. [It] doesn't justify what his brothers did, but it does help us realize that good can come out of a tragic event. It's often hard for us to understand why something bad is happening, but as time passes, we often gain perspective and insight. These are the rewards of trust and faith. ...
> Gen 45.5-8
Genesis 45.5-8 has the same thing as my Bible; a few slightly different words.
diversity
863: NATIVE AMERICAN - The Tent and the Circle
[It talks about how circles represented unity and harmony in Native American cultures.]
> Isa 40.22-23

Isaiah 40.22-23
It is he who sits above the circle of the earth, and its inhabitants are like grasshoppers; who stretches out the heavens like a curtain, and spreads them like a tent to live in;
who brings princes to naught, and makes the rulers of the earth as nothing.

1260, 1297, 1318
evil
12, 1176, 1476, 1493, 1494. See also Satan
FAMILY
Gen 4.9; 12.10-20
Sir 3.1-16
Eph 5.21-6.4
families
131, 666, 720, 768, 769, 1203, 1212, 1353, 1394, 1407
fidelity
885: did you KNOW? - Bride and Bridegroom
In ancient Israel, the bride and bridegroom gradually became a metaphor, or symbol, for the relationship between Israel and God as pictured in Isa 61.10 and 62.5. In these passages, Israel is the bride, and God is the faithful bridegroom, who loves her, lavishes her with blessings, and continues to be faithful to her. When Israel strays from the Covenant or goes after foreign gods, she is compared to an unfaithful lover, even a prostitute who pursues other partners (for a graphic example, see Ezek 16.1-43). The prophet Hosea even marries a prostitute as a living example of God's faithfulness (Hos 1.2)! The wonder of God's love is that through all of Israel's infidelity (and ours), God always remains willing to take it (and us) back.
> Isa 61.10

885: [The Good News of Deliverance (1-11)] Isaiah 60.10
I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my whole being shall exult in my God; for he has clothed me with the garments of salvation, he has covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decks himself with a garland, and as a bride adorns herself with her jewels.
[The Vindication and Salvation of Zion c.62] Isaiah 62.5
For as a young man marries a young woman, so shall your builder[Cn: Heb your sons] marry you, and as a bridegroom rejoices over the bride, so shall your God rejoice over you.
I don't understand the footnote. Cn? "your sons" = "builder" = God?
fornication
1351: Living Well
Some people think that God or the Christian religion is primarily interested in preventing us from doing fun things. They imagine the Bible as a book of thou-shalt-nots, and the church as a place where they are told to avoid enjoying themselves!
Paul helps us understand that God's desire is for us to live well. All good gifts from God, including food and sexuality, are meant to be enjoyed to the fullest. But they also can be misused, and if they are, we miss out on the joy and purpose intended by God.
For example, in 1 Cor 6.12-20, Paul affirms that sexual intercourse is meant to bond two people for life. Fornication -- sexual intercourse between people who are not married -- defeats its true purpose. Fornication diminishes the full joy and beauty of sexual intimacy as intended by God.
God created our sexuality. Our sexual desires -- felt keenly during adolescence! -- are not sinful but a normal part of being human. As the author of our sexuality, God wants us not to be hurt by this gift but instead to experience its fullness in marriage.
> 1 Cor 6.12-20
I would have said "hurt through this gift"; the gift itself does not hurt; it's its misuse, from giving into temptation, that hurts ... 1 Corinthians 6.12-20 has some footnotes which my own Bible lacks.
1411: True Love Waits
The church has taught from its beginning that fornication, including premarital sex, is wrong. Paul's teaching in 1 Thess 4.1-8 clearly explains why. If we get involved in a sexual relationship outside of marriage, we are exploiting another person (verse 6) -- even if that person is a willing partner. God intends sexual intercourse to create a lifelong bond between two people for the creation of a family. Sexual expression outside of marriage diminishes the beautiful purpose of sexual intimacy.
Paul reminds the Thessalonians to live in ways pleasing to God. To behave contrary to God's purpose is to say no to the gift of the Holy Spirit and to the holiness God wants for us. In our culture, sex is often portrayed as a recreational activity, violating the gift of sexuality God created within us! God's message in the Bible and the church calls us to take a stand that is unpopular with some people -- to support sexual abstinence until marriage.
Valuing our gift of sexuality and expressing it as God intended is not always easy. However, this old idea has a new slogan and campaign today: True love waits. Think about it!
> 1 Thess 4.1-8
1 Thessalonians 4.1-8 is similar, but it differs a bit in translation. In verse three, my Bible says "fornication" instead of "immorality", "control your body in holiness and honor" (with a footnote with the alternative shown and explained on that site), etc. Pretty much the same thing, though.
homosexuality
24: The Depravity of Sodom; Genesis 19.1-11
The two angels came to Sodom in the evening, and Lot was sitting in the gateway of Sodom. When Lot saw them, he rose to meet them, and bowed down with his face to the ground.
He said, "Please, my lords, turn aside to your servant's house and spend the night, and wash your feet; then you can rise early and go on your way." They said, "No; we will spend the night in the square."
But he urged them strongly; so they turned aside to him and entered his house; and he made them a feast, and baked unleavened bread, and they ate.
But before they lay down, the men of the city, the men of Sodom, both young and old, all the people to the last man, surrounded the house;
and they called to Lot, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us, so that we may know them."
Lot went out of the door to the men, shut the door after him,
and said, "I beg you, my brothers, do not act so wickedly.
Look, I have two daughters who have not known a man; let me bring them out to you, and do to them as you please; only do nothing to these men, for they have come under the shelter of my roof."
But they replied, "Stand back!" And they said, "This fellow came here as an alien, and he would play the judge! Now we will deal worse with you than with them." Then they pressed hard against the man Lot, and came near the door to break it down.
But the men inside reached out their hands and brought Lot into the house with them, and shut the door.
And they struck with blindness the men who were at the door of the house, both small and great, so that they were unable to find the door.
This passage seems to me to be about rape, the lust for power, and inhospitality. If you say this passage is about condemning homosexuality, I must ask you to explain why.
25: Be Kind to Strangers
If our first gesture to outsider were one of respect, kindness, and gracious hospitality, what might our world be like? The story of Sodom and Gomorrah shows us the results of disrespect, inhospitality, and the attempted abuse of strangers. Like Abraham, Lot is a wonderful host. But the people of Sodom want Lot's visitors for their own sexual pleasure (to "know" someone is often biblical language for sexual intercourse). For the author of Genesis, this horrendous crime calls for the most severe punishment.
As children of God, it is our responsibility to extend our kindness to stranger and friend alike. So how are visitors or new students treated in your school? How are visitors treated in your home?
> Gen 19.1-11

126: A Very Special Gift
[This article talks about sex laws, and how they are meant to keep sex holy and pure. It then makes a comparison between fornication and opening Christmas presents early; kind of spoils it.] God wants us to wait, so it will be as special as it is meant to be.

126: Leviticus 18.22
You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.
This passage differs substantially from what M. S. suggests; he says it's any sexual connection between men, but the wording here seems to be more about a**l sex. I mean, how else could you "lie with a man as with a woman"? "Lie with" seems to mean sleeping with, not lying beside as in cuddling. I hope to find a reputable analysis of the original Hebrew.
A conversation concerning the original Hebrew in Leviticus
M. S.: leviticus says it's detestable. romans says that it's unseemly, and that god will judge them appropriately. jesus defined marriage as between a man and a woman.
(07:01:49 PM) Daniel: Romans doesn't say that, and in Leviticus the original text is too ambiguous to say what it means.
(07:01:56 PM) M. S.: it's not at all. the website u gave makes it look like it is, BUT, if you take any text in another language, take out a translator dictionary, and do it one word at a time, it wont make sense. like in french, there's the term "pleurer chats en chiens. what does that mean?
(07:02:49 PM) Daniel: so what about Biblical scholars, who study this thing, and say that in its proper context its about pagan sodomy?
(07:02:50 PM) M. S.: if I translate like that website, I would get -- no thats not the french, lemme think.
(07:03:32 PM) Daniel: Daniel: so what about Biblical scholars, who study this thing, and say that in its proper context its about pagan sodomy?
(07:03:43 PM) M. S.: who says that? i dont know any bible scholars. what im saying is this: in french, "pleurer le cordes" means "raining ropes". now i could then say that its talking about people throwing ropes out their windoes, but that's not true, b/c a good translator would translate it as "raining cats and dogs". you have to know context and metaphors of the language. no language can be translated word for word, and then you have a good translation, b/c metaphors and similes are different. so you have to know the language's metaphors, and in hebrew, knowing the metaphors, it's talking about homosexual sex
(07:05:41 PM) M. S.: my knowledge of hebrew isn't that good, and the fact that the website only presents an romanized version of the hebrew text speaks poorly as to the website's value.
(07:06:22 PM) M. S.: a good translator would first present it in the hebrew
(07:06:45 PM) Daniel: i'll try to find it from more reputable sources, then
(07:06:58 PM) Daniel: but dude, it doesn't make any sense to me that a God beyond gender would try to restrict us to our physical bodies. we are supposed to be not of this earth, aren't we?
(07:07:23 PM) M. S.: well you see
(07:07:26 PM) Daniel: "in this world but not of it," as the phrase goes
(07:07:28 PM) M. S.: we're in between. we have some divine qualities (re: God giving man the "breath of life" and creation, but we're still made of this earth
(07:07:57 PM) M. S.: reference: creation
(07:08:05 PM) Daniel: yes, a hybrid as C.S. Lewis says
(07:08:10 PM) M. S.: YES
(07:08:12 PM) M. S.: exactly, and that's true
(07:08:21 PM) M. S.: now the hebrew word in leviticus 18:22 for lie is shakab
(07:08:39 PM) Daniel: obviously it's talking about a**l sex i think
(07:08:46 PM) M. S.: no
(07:08:46 PM) Daniel: or sex between men as with women.
(07:08:56 PM) M. S.: is defined simply as "sexual connection"
(07:09:02 PM) M. S.: carnally,
(07:09:04 PM) M. S.: or copulation
(07:09:05 PM) Daniel: really, now?
(07:09:10 PM) M. S.: yes
(07:09:15 PM) M. S.: uh strong's 7902. shkabah.
(07:09:23 PM) Daniel: so why isn't that what's printed?
(07:09:32 PM) M. S.: b/c the word translates as "lie". is like uh, what does read mean? no bad explanation. in hebrew, there are no vowels. you write the consonants, and then put squiggles around them for vowel sounds.
(07:10:35 PM) M. S.: so the word is shakab, which translates as "lie", but is a sexual term.
(07:11:03 PM) M. S.: like when you say "yeah, jim and pam are sleeping together", you know what that means. it means they're having sex. but if someone in spain translated it, they wouldn't know that, unless they knew what it meant in that context. same w/ shakab.
(07:11:42 PM) Daniel: k
(07:11:49 PM) M. S.: does that make any sense?
(07:12:10 PM) Daniel: yes. a question i have about it is, what about the word for 'male'? or man, or whatever word it is.
(07:12:26 PM) M. S.: k it's zakar
(07:12:28 PM) Daniel: i read it was typically translated as "first-born male"
(07:12:36 PM) M. S.: no really: all it is is "male". very generic term.
(07:12:46 PM) Daniel: seriously?
(07:12:49 PM) M. S.: can be man or animal, anything. just means "male".
(07:13:03 PM) Daniel: Why didn't they say "man", then?
(07:13:25 PM) M. S.: context. it's talking about relations between men and women, and it talks about bestiality with the word beast, to avoid confusion.
(07:13:54 PM) Daniel: k
(07:14:08 PM) M. S.: so zakar in this part refers to men. shakab is sex, etc. the hebrew says "don't shakab with zakar as mishkab 'ishshah, for that is tow'ebah".
(07:15:30 PM) M. S.: shakab is sex, zakar is male.
(07:15:38 PM) M. S.: now, the verse is "don't lie with men as with women". the word "with" is mishkab. mishkab is the word for Bed, or having sex. either one.
(07:16:24 PM) M. S.: 'ishshah is woman. tow'ebah is something that is "morally disgusting".
(07:16:51 PM) M. S.: so a true, literal translation of the verse would be, "Don't have sex with a man like you have sex with a woman, because that is morally wrong".
(07:17:25 PM) M. S.: i dunno where the "a**l" stuff comes from
(07:17:25 PM) Daniel: you said the word could mean Bed. Why couldn't it be "Don't have sex with a man in a woman's bed"?
(07:17:35 PM) M. S.: metaphor. no b/c it's not a noun, it's figurative speech.
(07:18:19 PM) M. S.: another metaphor for sex, like "sleeping together". you'll notice that mishkab is very close to shakab, b/c shakab is the root.
(07:19:06 PM) M. S.: it's bed, but the word is derived from shakab, sex.
(07:21:45 PM) Daniel: mind if i quote you and add you to that thread?
(07:21:57 PM) M. S.: that's fine
(07:21:58 PM) Daniel: and will you cite your sources for me?
(07:22:00 PM) M. S.: as long as your format it
(07:22:03 PM) M. S.: uh strong's notes
(07:22:03 PM) Daniel: of course
(07:22:15 PM) Daniel: can you find me a URL with the exact edition you're using?
(07:22:15 PM) M. S.: just do the hebrew stuff though. well, i'm using strong's concordance. this guy a while back got a hundred or so people w/ backgrounds in theology, Herbrew, and so on, and they cross-referenced every word in the bible from the original texts. all 8674 hebrew words and 5523 greek words from the new testament. put them into a dictionary, assigned each one a number.
(07:24:45 PM) M. S.: so a bible will say have a word, followed by like "#582". you look up 582 in strong's concordance and see the word, and what it means.
(07:25:22 PM) M. S.: but the whole a**l sex thing, not sure where u heard that
(07:25:38 PM) M. S.: but it's made up, there's absolutely nothing at all remotely resembling that in the hebrew text
(07:25:54 PM) M. S.: uh URL: http://www.htmlbible.com/sacrednamebiblecom/kjvstrongs/
(07:26:16 PM) M. S.: that's king james, which is word-for-word, with metaphors. revised, i think, so it has the older texts
(07:26:36 PM) Daniel: I also heard King James' had problems.
(07:26:41 PM) M. S.: this is revised
(07:26:46 PM) Daniel: oh, so it's fixed?

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 3:55 pm

127: Penalties for Violations of Holiness (chapter 20); Leviticus 20.13

If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall be put to death; their blood is upon them.

Well, that seems pretty clear. Again, I would like to analyze the original text -- or see a scholar do it. It seems clear to me that this also applies vice versa. (I can't believe some people actually say "It's okay for lesbians -- just not for gay men." It's like, an intentional blindness to reason.)

107: Introduction to The Book of Leviticus

... It is primarily a list of laws, rules, and instructions to ensure holiness and order in worship and the people's way of life. ... Most Scripture scholars believe that the laws and regulations in Leviticus developed over hundreds of years after the people entered the Promised Land. The book was composed at a time when the priests were struggling to unify Israel as it lay in ruins from its Babylonian conquerers. They wished to gather the various traditions and regulations that governed Israel's way of life. The author of Leviticus, referred to as the Priestly writer, writes as if these gathered traditions and regulations were given by God to Moses at Mount Sinai as part of the original Law. The author wishes to show that these laws are an extension of the Sinai Covenant.
If the goal of Israel's existence is to "be holy, for I [the Lord] am holy" (Lev 11.44), then the Book of Leviticus records how holiness becomes part of every aspect of Israel's existence. Chapters 17-26 are described as the Holiness Code. ... The purpose of Leviticus is to call Israel to follow the Law, and thus become a holy people and make its land a suitable place for God to dwell.
The customs and rites in Jesus' time are observances of the laws in Leviticus. Many of those customs and rites were left behind as Christianity emerged as a distinct religion.
Period Covered: after the Exodus, during the Israelites' encampment at Mount Sinai
Author: the Priestly writer writing after the Babylonian Exile
Theme: to teach the way of holiness through observance of the Law and religious ritual

260: Gibeah's Crime; Judges 19.22-26

While they were enjoying themselves, the men of the city, a perverse lot, surrounded the house, and started pounding on the door. They said to the old man, the master of the house, "Bring out the man who came into your house, so that we may have intercourse with him."
And the man, the master of the house, went out to them and said to them, "No, my brothers, do not act so wickedly. Since this man is my guest, do not do this vile thing.
Here are my virgin daughter and his concubine; let me bring them out now. Ravish them and do whatever you want to them; but against this man do not do such a vile thing."
But the men would not listen to him. So the man seized his concubine, and put her out to them. They wantonly raped her, and abused her all through the night until morning. And as the dawn began to break, they let her go.
As morning appeared, the woman came and fell down at the door of the man's house where her master was, until it was light.

I can't believe that site actually listed this passage; it has nothing whatsoever to do with homosexuality.

1326: did you KNOW? Homosexuality and AIDS

In making his case that all people are in need of salvation, Paul talks about the sinfulness of humankind in Rom 1.18-32. As a specific example of what happens when people turn from God's truth, he discusses homosexual activity in verses 26-27.
Some people interpret these verses to mean Paul is condemning homosexual persons. But this is a serious misinterpretation of Paul's words. Why? First, look at the context. After this specific example in verses 26-27, Paul lists all kinds of sinful behaviors in verses 28-32. He is not picking on homosexuals -- rather, he is showing that all people are guilty of sin.
Most important, notice that Paul never condemns people; he condemns sinful behavior. The Catholic church does the same. The church teaches that homosexual orientation is not sinful, but it also states that any sexual activity outside of marriage is wrong.
Romans 1.18-32 has also been used wrongly against AIDS victims. Some of them have been told that their horrible disease is a result of God's vengeance against homosexual behavior. Our loving God would never use AIDS, or any other disease, to punish people.
> Rom 1.18-32

1325: The Guilt of Humankind; [url=http://www.nccbuscc.org/nab/bible/romans/romans1.htm#v18]Romans 1.18[/url]-32 of The Catholic Youth Bible

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and wickedness of those who by their wickedness suppress the truth.
For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.
Ever since the creation of the world his eternal power and divine nature, invisible though they are, have been understood and seen through the things he has made. So they are without excuse;
for though they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their senseless minds were darkened.
Claiming to be wise, they became fools;
and they exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling a mortal human being or birds or four-footed animals or reptiles.
Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the degrading of their bodies among themselves,
because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.
For this reason God gave them up to degrading passions. Their women exchanged natural intercourse for unnatural,
and in the same way also the men, giving up natural intercourse with women, were consumed with passion for one another. Men committed shameless acts with men and received in their own persons the due penalty for their error.
And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind and to things that should not be done.
They were filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, covetousness, malice. Full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, craftiness, they are gossips,
slanderers, God-haters [footnote: or God-hated], insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, rebellious toward parents,
foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless.
They know God's decree, that those who practice such things deserve to die - yet they not only do them but even applaud others who practice them.

I've highlighted an excerpt which to me seems rather ambiguous. Paul makes it clear that these horrible sins they fell into were a direct result of turning away from God, from what they knew to be the truth. The reason it is unclear to me is because it does not say "they turned to homosexuality," but that seems to be a leading conclusion (thus the article about homosexuality). Rather, it just says the were "consumed with passion", which I think means consumed by worldly thoughts and ungodly desires. In this case, it would then fall in, as the article says, that Paul is saying that turning away from God leads to sin, and all the other acts he lists (which can be seen on the various /b/ channels.) It seems to me this passage does not condemn homosexuality or even homosexual sex. It merely points out that by turning away from God you fall into iniquity.

1351: Lawsuits among Believers (6.1-11); 1 Corinthians 6.1-10

[Paul finds it odd that sinners take their grievances to fellow sinners, rather than to saints.]
In fact, to have lawsuits at all with one another is already a defeat for you. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be defrauded? But you yourselves wrong and defraud -- and believers[Gk brothers] at that.
Do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived! Fornicators, idolaters, adulterers, male prostitutes, sodomites,
thieves, the greedy, drunkards, revilers, robbers -- none of these will inherit the kingdom of God.

Once again, there is not a strong connection here with homosexuality. That website has some weird translation involving "the effeminate" and "liers with mankind", as if they're trying to make it be about homosexuals (or eunuchs). The closest it comes is "sodomites", which is vague, because if Paul wanted to say "homosexuals" he would have said homosexuals, or the corresponding word that would translate as such, since I've heard the word didn't exist in Greek. It seems if this passage is to condemn homosexuality, it must also be analyzed in the original language. I guess I'll have to try to find it, unless you have it already? What is the context in which he uses "sodomite"? Is he referring to Temple prostitution as with "male prostitute"?

I went to Abiding Harvest Methodist Church in Broken Arrow, OK. Dr. Chris Buskirk was the presiding pastor of the church, and gave a presentation during the service about homosexuality. He cited the following in a powerpoint printout that was included in the bulletins.

1420: Warning against False Teachers (3-11); 1 Timothy 1.8-11

Now we know that the law is good, if one uses it legitimately.
This means understanding that the law is laid down not for the innocent but for the lawless and disobedient, for the godless and sinful, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their father or mother, for murderers,
fornicators, sodomites, slave traders, liars, perjurers, and whatever else is contrary to the sound teaching
that conforms to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me.

Hm, once again, nothing about homosexuality, unless you can provide extra information about the context in which "sodomite" is used. Could this be that temple prostitution thing again? Even then, what is sodomy? Why is it defined to be a**l sex?

One of the pictures in the presentation was a smiling girl holding a sign that read "

GOD HATES FAGS

". Buskirk had it adjacent to an illustration of Christ gently holding a despairing homosexual (gay apparently because his hair was short and he wore a purple shirt and nice jeans), his point being that homosexuals are to be loved like any other sinner, not despised. The sign the girl held had "Mal 1:3" at the bottom. I looked up what I'm assuming is the corresponding passage.

1113: Israel Preferred to Edom; Malachi, 2-5

I have loved you, says the LORD. But you say, "How have you loved us?" Is not Esau Jacob's brother? says the LORD. Yet I have loved Jacob
but I have hated Esau; I have made his hill country a desolation and his heritage a desert for jackals.
If Edom says, "We are shattered but we will rebuild the ruins," the LORD of hosts says: They may build, but I will tear down, until they are called the wicked country, the people with whom the LORD is angry forever.
Your own eyes shall see this, and you shall say, "Great is the LORD beyond the borders of Israel!"

"Hated" must mean something else, either finding their actions anathema, or being apart from them due to wickedness... a literal reading wouldn't make sense here, if you are to hold the belief that God is love and everything good while hatred comes from Satan. In any case, it doesn't have anything whatsoever to do with homosexuality.

1480: Introduction to the Letter of Jude

The purpose of the Letter of Jude is to warn churches about false teachers who come into the Christian community with lies and tricks, making trouble wherever they go. The author recalls stories from the past in which God punished such people: stories about the Egyptians who opposed God's plan to bring the Hebrew people to the Promised Land; the immoral people of Sodom and Gomorrah; the angels who revolted against God; and Cain, who killed his brother. The author also encourages people to build themselves in the faith. Finally, the author cautions Christians to ignore ungodly people -- unless those people truly want to change, in which case, Christians should be examples of the mercy of Jesus Christ.
Notice that this letter includes some words that are unfamiliar to modern Christians or that have different meanings today. For instance, the word saints refers to the members of the Christian community, and a love feast is a celebration of the Eucharist.
The message of the Letter of Jude is difficult to understand for many reasons. We know almost nothing about who wrote it, who it was written to, when it was written, and what it is really addressing -- except from hints in the letter itself. Tradition says the author is Jude the brother of James and Jesus (see Mk 6.3; the name Jude is a form of Judas). Modern readers often find the letter's message too negative and its examples too strange to provide direction for life today.

1481: Jude 1.5-16: Judgment on False Teachers

Now I desire to remind you, through you are fully informed, that the Lord, who once for all saved[Other ancient authorities read though you were once for all fully informed, that Jesus (or Joshua) who saved] a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe.
And the angels who did not keep their own position, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains in deepest darkness for the judgment of the great day.
Likewise, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which, in the same manner as they, indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural lust,[Gk went after other flesh] serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
Yet in the same way these dreamers also defile the flesh, reject authority, and slander the glorious ones.[Or angels; Gk glories]
But when the archangel Michael contended with the devil and disputed about the body of Moses, he did not dare to bring a condemnation of slander against him, but said, "The Lord rebuke you!"
But these people slander whatever they do not understand, and they are destroyed by those things that, like irrational animals, they know by instinct.
Woe to them! For they go the way of Cain, and abandon themselves to Balaam's error for the sake of gain, and perish in Korah's rebellion.

It goes on from there. I cited 5-11, although that site says Jude v7 deals explicitly and specifically with homosexuality. The verse is highlighted in green. The entire letter is very cryptic. I must once again disagree with the statement that this is about homosexuality and ask for an illustration as to why that assumption is made. First, you cannot assume "unnatural lust" implies homosexuality, because that's not what the text says. (The assumption of bestiality would be equally valid; we know that their sins were horrible and great in number and that they wanted to rape Lot's guests, that's pretty much it.) Specifically, in the context it's written -- "likewise," "in the same manner as they" -- the major point here is that they went against what God had planned for them; in that sense, a rejection of God and a turning away from him, as the angels did.

As for "sexual immorality", we have already seen from the passage in Genesis that there was lust for power, rape, abuse, and clearly explicit violations of what God had meant sex to be, so you can't say it's explicitly about homosexuality there, either. In fact, believing this passage to be about homosexuality depends entirely upon the assumption that homosexuality was a major crime of Sodom and Gomorrah, which is not made clear by the story in Genesis. This passage is unfortunately the last from that site.

HYPOCRISY
Mt 6.1-6; 23.1-36
Lk 18.9-14
Jas 1.22-2.4
JUDGMENT OF OTHERS
1130: Judging Others [i](Lk 6.37-42)[/i]; Matthew 7.1-5
"Do not judge, so that you may not be judged.
For with the judgment you make you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get.
Why do you see the speck in your neighbor's[Gk brother's] eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye?
Or how can you say to your neighbor,[Gk brother] 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' while the log is in your own eye?
You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your neighbor's[Gk brother's] eye.
So, does this mean don't point out sin because you yourself have sin? Or does it mean don't condemn because you yourself will be condemned? They are two very different things altogether, yet Phantom Ronin and others like him try to group them as one and the same. I'm inclined to interpret this as the following: Don't condemn others for their sin because you yourself have it; treat others the way you want to be treated, because what goes around comes around.

The "taking the speck out" part is difficult; the first thought that jumps to mind is "don't try to help others out of sin until you yourself are sinless", but it doesn't make much sense to be silent if you have something worthwhile to say, and it would contradict the idea of being brothers in Christ -- because brothers help each other out. I can only suppose it goes back to condemnation, but I wonder what the metaphor refers to if not instruction or advice.

1211: Judging Others [i](Mt 7.1-5)[/i]; Luke 6.37-42
"Do not judge, and you will not be judged; do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven;
give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together, running over, will be put into your lap; for the measure you give will be the measure you get back."
He also told them a parable: "Can a blind person guide a blind person? Will not both fall into a pit?
A disciple is not above the teacher, but everyone who is fully qualified will be like the teacher.
Why do you see the speck in your neighbor's[Gk brother's] eye, but do not notice the log in your own eye?
Or how can you say to your neighbor,[Gk brother] 'Friend,[Gk brother] let me take out the speck in your eye,' when you yourself do not see the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your neighbor's[Gk brother's] eye.
Well, the bit about blind leading the blind is pretty clear. I suppose the message is this: Give your advice, and leave it up the individual to make up his own mind after his own independent thought. Thus, it is not "being judgmental" to point out sin and give advice. It is being judgmental to assume God will punish them for their actions; leave God's affairs to God.
1341: Do Not Judge Another; Romans 14.1-13
Welcome to those who are weak in faith,[Or conviction] but not for the purpose of quarreling over opinions.
Some believe in eating anything, while the weak eat only vegetables.
Those who eat must not despise those who abstain, and those who abstain must not pass judgment on those who eat; for God has welcomed them.
Who are you to pass judgment on servants of another? It is before their own lord that they stand or fall. And they will be upheld, for the Lord[Other ancient authorities read for God] is able to make them stand.
Some judge one day to be better than another, while others judge all days to be alike. Let all be fully convinced in their own minds.
Those who observe the day, observe it in honor of the Lord. Also those who eat, eat in honor of the Lord, since they give thanks to God; while those who abstain, abstain in honor of the Lord and give thanks to God.
We do not live to ourselves, and we do not die to ourselves.
If we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord; so then, whether we live or whether we die, we are the Lord's.
For to this end Christ died and lived again, so that he might be Lord of both the dead and the living.
Why do you pass judgment on your brother or sister?[Gk brother] Or you, why do you despise your brother or sister?[Gk brother] For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God.[Other ancient authorities read of Christ]
For it is written, "As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall give praise to[Or confess] God."
So then, each of us will be accountable to God.[Other ancient authorities lack to God]
This passage is pretty clear. I wonder if these "ancient authorities" my Bible's footnotes refer to are old copies made of the original manuscripts mentioned in The Case for Christ by Lee Strobel.
1383: Galatians 3.26-28
for in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith.
As many of you as were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.
There is no longer Jew or Greek, there is no longer slave or free, there is no longer male and female; for all of you are one in Christ Jesus.
Personally, I find this supportive of gay marriage. See the highlighted excerpt. Actually, it's defended by the entire passage: "for [we] are all one in Christ Jesus." We are all equal, indiscriminately on level ground in Christ Jesus. You may argue that I'm taking it out of context, that Paul means "as far as judging each other" is concerned, that no one is better than another. I think such a strict interpretation diminishes the meaning of this passage. As Paul says, the important thing is being "clothed with Christ". "Paul [also] insists that circumcision -- and all the other Jewish ceremonial laws -- [have] nothing to do with faith in Jesus and was unnecessary for Gentile Christians" (1379). The law in Leviticus about gay sex is ambiguously worded in its original language (Hebrew, right?), and others have said it may be interpreted as having to do with pagan ceremonies and the inheritance of the first born. Something about the words chosen for "men" and a few other things, that the word chosen for "men" is more typically translated as "first-born male", and that a far clearer word is usually used -- anyone know what I'm talking about and have that copypasta? Please quote it if you do. In any case, it's the only denouncement of homosexual intercourse that I have seen from the Bible, and if it is specifically about pagan ceremonies, then not only must it be disregarded for Gentile Christians, but I must ask why it's been continually printed as otherwise.
judgment of others
1298: Peter's Report to the Church at Jerusalem; Acts 11.1-18
Now the apostles and the believers[Gk brothers] who were in Judea heard that the Gentiles had also accepted the word of God.
So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcised believers[Gk lacks believers] criticized him,
saying, "Why did you go to uncircumcised men and eat with them?"
Then Peter began to explain it to them, step by step, saying,
"I was in the city of Joppa praying, and in a trance I saw a vision. There was something like a large sheet coming down from heaven, being lowered by its four corners; and it came close to me.
As I looked at it closely I saw four-footed animals, beasts of prey, reptiles, and birds of the air.
I also heard a voice saying to me, 'Get up, Peter; kill and eat.'
But I replied, 'By no means, Lord; for nothing profane or unclean has ever entered my mouth.'
But a second time the voice answered from heaven, 'What God has made clean, you must not call profane.'
This happened three times; then everything was pulled up again to heaven.
At that very moment three men, sent to me from Caesarea, arrived at the house where we were.
The Spirit told me to go with them and not to make a distinction between them and us.[Or not to hesitate] These six brothers also accompanied me, and we entered the man's house.
He told us how he had seen the angel standing in his house and saying, 'Send to Joppa and bring Simon, who is called Peter;
he will give you a message by which you and your entire household will be saved.'
And as I began to speak, the Holy Spirit fell upon them just as it had upon us at the beginning.
And I remembered the word of the Lord, how he had said, 'John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.'
If then God gave them the same gift that he gave us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could hinder God?"
When they heard this, they were silenced. And they praised God, saying, "Then God has given even to the Gentiles the repentance that leads to life."
Who are "these six brothers" who also accompanied him? I can only assume either six people who were beside Peter when he spoke with the circumcised, or else I've missed or am misunderstanding something? This evidence explains Paul's opinion that circumcision is no longer necessary after baptism for Gentiles -- but what of Jews? I mean, Judaic Christians or whatever. God specifically told them he wanted them circumcised in memorial of the covenant he made with Abraham, didn't he? Paul insists Gentiles do not need to become Jewish before becoming Christian, but what of Jews?
1327: PRAY IT! - Examination of Conscience
[This prayer asks God to remind us to remain humble when we become egotistical and haughty.]
> Rom 2.1-4
1327: The Righteous Judgment of God; Romans 2.1-4
Therefore you have no excuse, whoever you are, when you judge others; for in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself, because you, the judge, are doing the very same things.
You say,[Gk lacks You say] "We know that God's judgment on those who do such things is in accordance with truth."
Do you imagine, whoever you are, that when you judge those who do such things and yet do them yourself, you will escape the judgment of God?
Or do you despise the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience? Do you not realize that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance?
A bit redundant, as all this has already been stated above.
LOVE
Song 8.6-7
Mt 5.43-48
Mk 12.28-34
1 Cor, ch 13
MARRIAGE
8: Gen 2.18-25
Then the LORD God said, "It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper as his partner."
So out of the ground the LORD God formed every animal of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name.
The man gave names to all cattle, and to the birds of the air, and to every animal of the field; but for the man[Or for Adam] there was not found a helper as his partner.
So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then he took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh.
And the rib that the LORD God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man.
Then the man said, "This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; this one shall be called Woman,[Heb ishshah] for out of Man[Heb ish] this one was taken."
Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and clings to his wife, and they become one flesh.
And the man and his wife were both naked, and were not ashamed.
This is the one of the Biblical roots of marriage, and other points about it are made throughout the Bible, parallels between Christ and the Church, God and the Israelites, etc. Notice, however, that it no points are made against gay marriage here. It says, "that's why heterosexual marriage exists," not "this is why homosexual marriage doesn't exist."
740: Song 8.6-7
Set me as a seal upon your heart, as a seal upon your arm; for love is strong as death, passion fierce as the grave. Its flashes are flashes of fire, a raging flame.
Many waters cannot quench love, neither can floods drown it. If one offered for love all the wealth of one's house, it would be utterly scorned.
This excerpt is about love, not marriage. I suppose the marital vows are drawn from it, though: until death, regardless of wealth, etc.
MARRIAGE
8: Gen 2.18-25
Then the LORD God said, "It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper as his partner."
So out of the ground the LORD God formed every animal of the field and every bird of the air, and brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called every living creature, that was its name.
The man gave names to all cattle, and to the birds of the air, and to every animal of the field; but for the man[Or for Adam] there was not found a helper as his partner.
So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then he took one of his ribs and closed up its place with flesh.
And the rib that the LORD God had taken from the man he made into a woman and brought her to the man.
Then the man said, "This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; this one shall be called Woman,[Heb ishshah] for out of Man[Heb ish] this one was taken."
Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and clings to his wife, and they become one flesh.
And the man and his wife were both naked, and were not ashamed.
This is the one of the Biblical roots of marriage, and other points about it are made throughout the Bible, parallels between Christ and the Church, God and the Israelites, etc. Notice, however, that it no points are made against gay marriage here. It says, "that's why heterosexual marriage exists," not "this is why homosexual marriage doesn't exist."
740: Song 8.6-7
Set me as a seal upon your heart, as a seal upon your arm; for love is strong as death, passion fierce as the grave. Its flashes are flashes of fire, a raging flame.
Many waters cannot quench love, neither can floods drown it. If one offered for love all the wealth of one's house, it would be utterly scorned.
This excerpt is about love, not marriage. I suppose the marital vows are drawn from it, though: until death, regardless of wealth, etc.
1148: Teaching about Divorce [i](Mk 10.1-12)[/i]; Matthew 19.1-12
When Jesus had finished saying these things, he left Galilee and went to the region of Judea beyond the Jordan.
Large crowds followed him, and he cured them there.
Some Pharisees came to him, and to test him they asked, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any cause?"
He answered, "Have you not read that the one who made them at the beginning 'made them male and female,'
and said, 'For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh'?
So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what god has joined together, let no one separate."
They said to him, "Why then did Moses command us to give a certificate of dismissal and to divorce her?"
He said to them, "It was because you were so hard-hearted that Moses allowed you to divorce your wives, but from he beginning it was not so.
And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for unchastity, and marries another commits adultery."[Other ancient authorities read except on the ground of unchastity, causes her to commit adultery; others add at the end of the verse and he who marries a divorced woman commits adultery]
His disciples said to him, "If such is the case of a man with his wife, it is better not to marry."
But he said to them, "Not everyone can accept this teaching, but only those to whom it is given.
For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by others, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let anyone accept this who can."
So, stick with it, once you're married. It's a serious thing, and for this reason I'm not sure if I could make such a commitment. I'm almost paralyzed with the choices for desktop computers; how could I make such a lifetime choice? ... very powerful thing. Anyway, nothing here precluding gays, either.
1184: Teaching about Divorce [i](Mt 19.1-9)[/i]; Mark 10.1-12
He left that place and went to the region of Judea and[Other ancient authorities lack and] beyond the Jordan. And crowds again gathered around him; and, as was his custom, he again taught them.
Some Pharisees came, and to test him they asked, "Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?"
He answered them, "What did Moses command you?"
They said, "Moses allowed a man to write a certificate of dismissal and to divorce her."
But Jesus said to them, "Because of your hardness of heart he wrote this commandment for you.
But from the beginning of creation, 'God made them male and female'.
For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife,[Other ancient authorities lack and be joined to his wife]
and the two shall become one flesh'. So they are no longer two, but one flesh.
Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate."
Then in the house the disciples asked him again about this matter.
He said to them, "Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her;
and if she divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery."
What does "becoming one flesh" mean, exactly? Surely it means more than "their relationship is very close and they make many decisions together". It seems, in the context in which its used, to have a deeper significance.
John 2.1-11 is about Jesus turning water into wine. Only reason it's listed is because it takes place at a wedding.
The Old Life and the New (17-24); Ephesians 4.21-33
For surely you have heard about him and were taught in him, as truth is in Jesus.
You were taught to put away your former way of life, your old self, corrupt and deluded by its lusts,
and to be renewed in the spirit of your minds,
and to clothe yourselves with the new self, created according to the likeness of God in true righteousness and holiness.
Rules for the New Life
So then, putting away falsehood, let all of us speak truth to our neighbors, for we are members of one another.
Be angry but do not sin; do not let the sun go down on your anger,
and do not make room for the devil.
Thieves must give up stealing; rather let them labor and work honestly with their own hands, so as to have something to share with the needy.
Let no evil talk come out of your mouths, but only what is useful for building up,[Other ancient authorities read building up faith] as there is need, so that your words may give grace to those who hear.
And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with which you were marked with a seal for the day of redemption.
Put away from you all bitterness and wrath and anger and wrangling and slander, together with all malice,
and be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ has forgiven you.[Other ancient authorities read us]
I accidentally quoted the fourth chapter instead of the fifth, but rather than delete it, I decided to keep it. It's good advice. rolleyes
1393: The Christian Household [i](Cp Col 3.18-19)[/i]; Ephesians 5.21-33
Be subject to one another out of reverence for Christ.
Wives, be subject to your husbands as you are to the Lord.
For the husband is the head of the wife just as Christ is the head of the church, the body of which he is the Savior.
Just as the church is subject to Christ, so also wives ought to be, in everything, to their husbands.
Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her,
in order to make her holy by cleansing her with the washing of water by the word,
so as to present the church to himself in splendor, without a spot or wrinkle or anything of the kind -- yes, so that she may be holy and without blemish.
In the same way, husbands should love their wives as they do their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself.
For no one ever hates his own body, but he nourishes and tenderly cares for it, just as Christ does for the church,
because we are members of his body.[Other ancient authorities add of his flesh and of his bones]
"For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two will become one flesh."
This is a great mystery, and I am applying it to Christ and the church.
Each of you, however, should love his wife as himself, and a wife should respect her husband.

1394: Children and Parents [i](Ex 20.12; Deut 5.16)[/i]; Ephesians 6.1-4
Children, obey your parents in the Lord,[Other ancient authorities lack in the Lord] for this is right.
"Honor your father and mother" -- this is the first commandment with a promise:
"so that it may be well with you and you may live long on the earth."
And, fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord.
1394: Family Relationships
When Eph 5.21-6.4 comes up in the Sunday readings, it sometimes causes confusion. People ask, "How can the Bible teach that a wife should be subject to her husband?" This is another case where we must take into account the cultural context in order to properly interpret the passage. At the time the Letter to the Ephesians was written, the male gender was dominant in society. Wives and children were considered men's property. The letter's challenge to a man to love his wife and to treat his children respectfully was probably viewed as a radical statement by people at the time.
Our culture is different. Just as we should not interpret 6.5-9 as giving permission to own slaves, we should not interpret 5.21-6.4 as commanding submissive behavior of married women today. Understanding this, we can appreciate the passage as it was intended: a practical guide for a family life where love is the rule (see "The Christian Family," Col 3.18-4.1).
Read Eph 5.21-6.4 and then reflect on these questions:
- How does 6.1-4 indicate that honoring is a two-way street?
- What does it mean to live in a family where love is the rule?
- How do you love and honor your parents and siblings?
> Eph 5.21-6.4
I assume then that homosexuals were also nowhere near as vocal as they are today, similar to women's status in western society. In that case, all of this still applies -- as the dialogue says, "where love is the rule" -- with a dominant homosexual, as I've heard is typically the case in homo relationships.
1 Jn 4.4-16: This talks about determining false prophets and how God is love. It must have been listed accidentally as being about marriage.
marriage
47: article about Levirate Marriage. Onan's ejaculations on the ground was a violation of this law; it isn't about contraception.
453: article about maintaining Israel's identity. Ezra 9 and 10 is about them not marrying foreigners because they felt a need to keep their traditions pure and identity strong as people of God.
696: talks about divorce in marriage. See Proverbs 5.15-23 under commitment.
885: see Isaiah 60.10 under fidelity.
1148: Catholic Connections - Marriage
When the Pharisees try to test Jesus with a question about divorce, Jesus speaks about marriage. Rather than focus on the negative, Jesus turns everyone's attention to the positive -- the beauty of two people who "are no longer two, but one flesh" (Mt 19.6). Catholics celebrate Jesus' positive view in the sacrament of Marriage, one of the seven official sacraments of the church. The church believes that in a Christian marriage, God's love and grace are present in a special way (see Eph 5.21-33).
The wedding rings and the vows professed in front of the assembled guests are important symbols in the ceremony, but the primary sign of the sacrament is the spouses themselves. It is their love, commitment, and faith that make God's love real and present to the community.
> Mt 19.1-9 [under MARRIAGE above]
Ephesians 5.21-33 is already quoted under MARRIAGE, above.
1351: See the 'Living Well' article under fornication. The idea here is that sex is most fully enjoyed within the confines of marriage, and that outside of marriage the pleasure is lessened -- so, by having sex outside of marriage, you're hurting yourself and your mate, and open yourself all the other dangers of premarital sex, including becoming pregnant with an unwanted child, which would then be killed through no fault of its own (terrible).
morality
83: article about the Ten Commandments being a handy summary of the Sinai Covenant. Fundamental in three religions, they continue to serve as a foundation for morality for both Jews and Christians...
85: the Ten Commandments are to be honored still today.
1333: Our Inner Struggle
In Rom 7.15-16, Paul reveals his own struggle to do what is right. It seems there's a part of us that wants to do right, and another part that wants to do wrong. Even when we try to be good, "evil lies close at hand" (verse 21), ready to have its way.
Paul uses the words spirit and flesh to describe this struggle. In his time, people thought passions and strong emotions originated in the body. So Paul says our flesh tempts us to do wrong, and out spirit wants us to do right. Paul does not mean that our physical bodies are evil and the source of sin. He means that we are all at war with ourselves.
Sin is hard to resist at times. To do what is right requires us to stop and think clearly about our choices and actively select good over sin. The good news is that God, the understanding forgiver, is on our side in the struggle. Thanks be to God!
> Rom 7.14-25

1332: The Inner Conflict; Romans 7.14-25
For we know that the law is spiritual; but I am of the flesh, sold into slavery under sin.[Gk sold under sin]
I do not understand my own actions. For I do not do what I want, but I do the very thing that I hate.
Now if I do what I do not want, I agree that the law is good.
But in fact it is no longer I that do it, but sin that dwells within me.
For I know that nothing good dwells within me, that is, in my flesh. I can will what is right, but I cannot do it.
For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I do.
Now if I do what I do not want, it is no longer I that do it, but sin that dwells within me.
So I find it to be a law that when I want to do what is good, evil lies close at hand.
For I delight in the law of God in my inmost self,
but I see in my members another law at war with the law of my mind, making me captive to the law of sin that dwells in my members.
Wretched man that I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death?
Thanks be to the God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with my mind I am a slave to the law of God, but with my flesh I am a slave to the law of sin.
A little confusing, and it does bring up a very valid question: Who and what is Satan, and what is his role in hell? In the book of Job he's a member of God's court, whose role is to test people to see if they are truly loyal to God...? But in popular Christian belief, he is a sort of opposite of God, an embodiment of all that is not of God. Christians believe in demons, who serve Satan as angels serve God, but others -- I believe the Ba'hai Faith is one of these -- would take Paul literally here, saying "each of us has our own devil" that we must overcome, and that hell and Satan as Christians know them do not exist ... Anyone know more?
1406, 1471
peacemaking
1340
personal appearance
265, 735, 1371
pleasure
726
pornography
736
promiscuity
126
right living
128, 414, 617, 620, 671, 691, 699, 752, 754, 967, 1023, 1050, 1071, 1154, 1351, 1387, 1406, 1459, 1461. See also values
Satan
570, 1176, 1494, 1502
SEXUALITY
Gen 1.26-31
Tob 8.4-9
Song
Eph 5.1-14
1 Thess 4.3-8
sexuality
126, 310, 632, 733, 735, 736, 739, 1351, 1411
sin
9, 12, 13, 97, 110, 251, 310, 342, 457, 632, 786, 917, 991, 1258, 1279, 1329, 1332, 1333, 1406, 1499
stereotypes
1251
submissiveness
1422
TEMPTATION
Gen, ch 3
Mt 4.1-11
Mk 1.12-13; 7.14-23
Lk 4.1-13
temptation
9, 310, 784, 1126, 1206, 1207, 1332, 1333, 1373, 1440
understanding
234, 332, 1150, 1178
values
187, 422, 617, 967. See also right living
weakness
9, 1178, 1377
WISDOM
2 Chr 1.7-13
Prov 8.1-21
Wis, ch 7
wisdom
332, 334, 414, 645, 648, 699, 714, 747, 748, 749, 752, 754, 1347
women
78, 243, 244, 271, 492, 499, 507, 739, 810, 1251, 1278, 1306, 1343, 1361, 1422
young people
687, 1204, 1308, 1392

As you can see, I have my work cut out for me.

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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 3:56 pm

Questions and Answers About the Bible; The Catholic Youth Bible

What does it mean to say that God inspired the Bible? Did God speak directly to the Bible's authors?

Christians make a fantastic claim about the Bible: God is the author of the sacred Scriptures. They believe the Bible is God's word, containing the truths that God wishes to reveal to humankind for our salvation. Through the Holy Spirit, God inspired the human authors of the Bible's books to reveal these truths in their writings. These two concepts -- God's inspiration of the biblical authors and God's revelation in their writings of the truths about God and God's will for us -- are two important Christian beliefs about the Bible.
To say that biblical authors were inspired by God does not mean that they took dictation directly from God. They were true authors using creative literary forms to communicate the people's experience of God. In fact, many of the books had more than one author. Some books went through several decades of development in which the stories were told and retold, written down, combined, and edited. The church believes the Holy Spirit was guiding the many people involved throughout this whole process.

How do I know that what is in the Bible is true? Aren't there mistakes in the Bible?

Christians believe that the Bible is true and without errors when it teaches the things God wishes to reveal for the sake of salvation. This is called the inerrancy of the Bible.
Some Christians also believe that the Bible is without error in every respect, including all references to scientific and historical facts. But Catholic Christians, along with others, are cautious about making this claim. The Catholic church teaches that in order to interpret the Bible correctly, we must understand what the human authors intended to communicate at the time of their writing. To know what God wants to reveal through their words, we must take into account "the conditions of their time and culture, the literary genres in use at that time, and the modes of feeling, speaking, and narrating then current" (Catechism of the Catholic Church, no. 110).
In other words, from our modern viewpoint, some statements in the Bible may seem like mistakes. But these "mistakes" may be due to the difference between a biblical author's cultural perspective and our cultural perspective. Or they may be due to our misunderstanding of a biblical author's use of literary devices such as metaphors, fiction, and poetry. Or perhaps they are due to a biblical author's different understanding of science or history. In its introductions and articles, The Catholic Youth Bible will help you understand the biblical authors' intentions and the church's teaching about what God is revealing through them.

...

The Bible was written a long time ago. What does it have to do with my life today?

Christians believe the Bible's core message of God's desire to be in a loving relationship with human beings is greater than the difficulties caused by the passing of time and by cultural differences between the biblical era and our time. They believe that the more people read, reflect on, and study the Bible, the more they can discover what God is saying to people today. The Bible's message does not wear out or become obsolete. However, the Bible was originally written by and for people who lived in different historical circumstances. In order to make the Bible relevant to our time, people need to interpret it in its proper context (see the next chapter, "How to Read and Study the Bible," for help on this). This process of making the Bible's message current for our time is called actualization.
Each person, community, and culture brings its life experiences to interact with God's revelation in the Bible. God's word sheds light on our hopes and struggles and in so doing becomes a source of new life for us. Knowing that God forgives our sins, liberates from the things that oppress and enslave us, and rejoices in our successes gives us the inner peace we all seek. The Bible tells us that we are entrusted with Jesus' mission to share God's peace, justice, and love -- a mission that gives true meaning to our life.
Of course, the best way to discover what the Bible has to do with your life is to read and study it yourself. The same Holy Spirit who inspired the original authors will also be your companion as you spend time with the Bible -- comforting, exciting, challenging, and encouraging you along your way.

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 3:58 pm

reserved

Aetherius Lamia
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Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 7:53 pm

Reserved!

Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2007 7:54 pm

Reserved ... I don't know how many more I'll need. This'll probably be the last one.

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Posted: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:17 am

Reserved. I guess I can delete this post if I don't need it.

Posted: Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:40 pm

wow you really are retarted....
Why is being gay so bad the bible never said gays are bad. Jesus never said it either. The only people who said that are critical idiots that think if it's not EXACTLY what the church says it's worng....

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Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:03 pm

Lunasa the moon warrior

wow you really are retarted....
Why is being gay so bad the bible never said gays are bad. Jesus never said it either. The only people who said that are critical idiots that think if it's not EXACTLY what the church says it's worng....

Who are you calling retarded?

Posted: Thu Nov 22, 2007 5:13 pm

i hope you dont mind me posting this. but i would like to suggest that everyone watch for the bible tells me so. this documentary changed my thinking about homosexuals. consider it because just bashing them. forthebibletellsmeso.org

sunshinehearttrob

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Aetherius Lamia
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Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 6:19 pm

sunshinehearttrob

consider it because just bashing them.

What?

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