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I've recently started wondering about the differences that exist between books of different genres, and books of the same genre.
For example, some so-called 'science fiction' short stories and novels are as different from each other as ... well ... older stories by the late great James H. Schmitz and newer hits like the science fiction movie, The Matrix.
The difference between fantasy and science fiction is astounding in its variance. Some people believe that they are the same thing; others that the chasm's worth of differences between the two genres is so vast that a bridge could not possibly span it. Heck, there are some religious fanatics who insist that any book that strays from the path of biblical correctness is evil.
So what is your view on the differences between and within genres?
Are war novels and horror the same thing? Does it really make a difference whether it is YA or Children's? If you had to classify every single book that you had read, what would your plan be? This is meant to be a discussion on how individuals feel about the issue.
This space reserved (just in case!)
Isn't anyone else going to say anything...?
Well some genres are easy to spot, like science fiction (though that can be broken down farther into soft and hard science fiction; this distinction is based on how much actual science is in the book.)
But when it comes to putting a book into a genre, it gets abit tough. Like where would one place Valis, by Phil d**k? Sci-fi? Horror? Metafiction? Post-modern?

Genre used to be easy to spot, when the number of writers was lower. The ancient Greeks belived the tradgedy should not have any comedic elements and vice-versa. In contemporary fiction, even thedistinction between verse and prose is blurred. Look at Ulysses by Joyce.

(more to come. Love this topic!)
I recently read a Livejournal post on this very topic. The author put forth the theory that speculative fiction, under which umbrella both fantasy and science fiction fall, is a much less cohesive genre than, say, mystery or romance. She said it could probably be argued it's not really a genre at all.

Myself, I believe it <i>is</i> a genre, but certainly a very broad one. The only common element of the books which fall under its purview is some sense of "Otherness," which keeps the setting from quite matching up with our own accepted reality. Some books are full of Otherness, and some books (like those classified under magic realism) may only mention a small Otherness in passing.

This is why I believe that fantasy and science fiction are not nearly so separate as many argue, since the argument is based on the idea that fantasy endorses stagnance, and science fiction espouses progress. This is a complete fallacy, to my mind. I've read science fiction which felt like a sermon in favor of maintaining the status quo, and I've read fantasy that seemed an anthem for change. The big difference between the two is window-dressing, in my experience. Extrapolative science versus extraordinary magic, spaceships versus dragons, pulse pistols versus swords.... Take all of that away, and what you're left with are the same basic questions and ideas: "What if the world were different?" "What if this was a different world?" "What if a character with this personality ran across this thing she didn't understand? What would she do?" "What if a character with this personality suddenly found himself at the heart of a conflict? Would he be up for the challenge?"

I think this is one reason I'm enjoying the conscious movement of interstitial fiction that seems to be occurring in the publishing world in recent years. Since I never saw that huge of a difference between the genres that are being intermingled, I just see it as the next logical step in the ongoing communal discussion of which books are a large part.
Most novels can go under more than one genre, which is possibly why classifying them seems so difficult. As far as science fiction and fantasy are concerned, the distinction there is that science fiction is "what if" for this world. It doesn't have to contain a lot of science in it, but it is speculation as to what could possibly happen if such-and-such a thing happened. Fantasy has more to do with magic, imaginary worlds, fantastic beings. Sci-fi and fantasy do overlap sometimes.
War stories and horror are, equally, not the same thing. Someone being stalked by mad axe man who hacks their friends to bits doesn't necessarily have anything to do with a war. A war story could be suspense, romance, horror, science fiction, and a war story all at the same time.

The reading level of YA and Children's ficition should be different, but it isn't always. Pet peeve of mine.
Skyhop Shuiguo
Most novels can go under more than one genre, which is possibly why classifying them seems so difficult. As far as science fiction and fantasy are concerned, the distinction there is that science fiction is "what if" for this world.


But that definition discludes so many sf stories which have nothing to do with this world or even the human race. To me, the main distinction between sf and fantasy is a certain sensibility carried by the characters. In an sf story, even if science is not a big part of the plotline, the characters still regard the inexplicable or the progressive in scientific terms. In a fantasy story, even if magic is not a big part of the plotline, the characters relate to the unusual in magical or supernatural terms. This sensibility is also often displayed in the narrative, with metaphors and references based in whichever system (magic or science) the world and characters rely on.
I like the responses that I've heard so far. Thank you for your input smile . Here's another question, though: Is it possible to have books of the same series that are of different genres? Can an author ever start a series off in the Children's section and end up in the Young Adult or an older classification? What series have you read that prove your opinion?

My answer to that one would have to include Madeline L'Engle's books. The point that I am trying to make with them is that even though they all appear to be relatively similar, one could put them in different genres. Many Waters could easily be a science fiction, fantasy, or historically based fiction while A Wrinkle in Time and A Wind in the Door are very different (although the same characters act out the plot). It's not even clear whether these books belong in a certain age group or not. What are you thoughts on this?
coolwaterwoman
Skyhop Shuiguo
Most novels can go under more than one genre, which is possibly why classifying them seems so difficult. As far as science fiction and fantasy are concerned, the distinction there is that science fiction is "what if" for this world.


But that definition discludes so many sf stories which have nothing to do with this world or even the human race.


One last poke at this, and then I'll consider your questions, Okiimiru. That definition doesn't exclude stories on different planets about different races in some ways. Aliens are still a question of what if, and people on different planets is what if, too. We can't fly to any other planet and have people living on it yet, not even in this solar system. The universe that is used in science fiction stories is the same universe, more often than not. They still answer questions, for example "what if there was life on other planets?" or "what would life be like on other planets?" Straight fantasy doesn't do this. The line between sf and fantasy can be shady. They often cross into each other. Aliens, space travel, and human magic can all go together in the same book, making it both science fiction and fantasy. If a story contains magic, it is fantasy. That part will always be fantasy, never science fiction.
There is a difference in the writing styles, I agree. Dune is a great example of this. It is pure science fiction, there are no elements of fantasy. But it's written like a fantasy novel.

Sorry Okiimiru, I'll have to get back to your questions later, it's dinner time.
Anything is possible, so yes you can write a series in which the genre of each book is different, and you can vary the reading levels of the series. Whether it would be effective or not is another question.

J.K. Rowling intended to raise the level of the Harry Potter books as Harry aged, but I don't think that really worked. It just got a bit more serious. I haven't read any series off-hand that changed genre wildly, but that doesn't necessarily mean it won't work. I can't say that I really know what you're talking about with the Madeleine L'Engle books because I haven't read them.
I think it would be hard to pull off. I'm inclined to think that by the time an author has to change genre, they're reaching a little and it's time to stop. Especially if the books rely on what kind of story they tell, if it's about the story more than the characters. If it's about the characters, it would be more likely to work. But you wouldn't want a book that started with a girl and her school/boy problems like Angus, Thongs, and Full Frontal Snogging, which in the second book introduced a magical power/battle between good and evil. The genre shift would have to more subtle.
That's my two cents, anyway. Mum would get mad at me for saying that; she reckons its two bits. Whatever.
I think it is definatly possible to have a series start in one genre and end in another. The Wizrd of Oz is a good example (as is, if I understand it correctly, Alice in Wonderland, for teh same reasons) they both started out as political "call to action" novels, and grew into a children's series. I know Gulliver's Travels wasa political novel, but I can't remember if there were any more.
Skyhop Shuiguo, I think I'll have to respectfully disagree with you that sf asks what if and fantsy doesn't (if that's what you're saying. Sorry if I'm not interpreting it correctly). I think that fantasy asks what ifas well; it justs asks different questions in a different way. "What if magic really was real?" or "What if there was a rece of beings that was at once more wise, beutiful, magical and powerful the humans (ie the Elves)?" I think fantasy asks what if, it just doesn't do it inthe same way the sf does. And, of course, we do like to break the laws or science occasionally wink
Hmm. Okay.
Let's say I narrow it down a bit. SF asks questions of our world/universe, things that could be or may be.
There's a trilogy of books that I'm reading that starts off with horror/mystery. Later on, it seems to go more into horror/occult, especially witchcraft. I've found it's fun to make stories with different chapters of a few genres, then suddenly switch to other genres just for the heck of it.
The Series of Unfortunate Events becomes more comedy-based later on.
Skyhop Shuiguo
That definition doesn't exclude stories on different planets about different races in some ways. Aliens are still a question of what if, and people on different planets is what if, too.


Yes, but neither is a what if about <i>our</I> world, which is the definition you originally gave. Furthermore, fantasy can <i>also</I> pose what ifs about our world, as in urban fantasy and magic realism, and it can posit alien lifeforms on alien planets. They may not be called "aliens" nor "planets," but that's semantics, not a fundamental difference in intent.

Skyhop Shuiguo
We can't fly to any other planet and have people living on it yet, not even in this solar system. The universe that is used in science fiction stories is the same universe, more often than not.


Yes, and? It could as easily be argued that the universe used in fantasy stories is the same universe. It's the worlds that are different. Sometimes that matters, sometimes it doesn't, in both sf <i>and</i> fantasy.

Skyhop Shuiguo
They still answer questions, for example "what if there was life on other planets?" or "what would life be like on other planets?" Straight fantasy doesn't do this.


Exactly what is your definition of "straight fantasy?" Do you have a corollary definition for "straight sf?" Fantasy asks questions about other lives on other worlds. It asks questions about <i>this</i> life on <I>this</i> world. As I said before, the key difference is that the power that makes the "what if" possible in sf is science, and the power that makes the "what if" possible in fantasy is magic. The questions themselves remain the same. What if we could fly? What if we were immortal? What if we could bring people back to life? What if we could duplicate ourselves in some fashion (cloning or golems or doppelganger)? And, of course, the <I>big</i> question that so much fantasy and sf both address: <I>Should</I> we do a thing simply because we <I>can</I> do a thing? And what are the consequences of doing it?

Skyhop Shuiguo
There is a difference in the writing styles, I agree. Dune is a great example of this. It is pure science fiction, there are no elements of fantasy. But it's written like a fantasy novel.


It's not a difference in style, it's a difference in language, in semantics. Yes, there are styles that are "traditional" to both sf and fantasy, but none of those styles are essential to the genre itself. What is essential is the genre vocabulary, wizards versus scientists versus warp drive versus dragons. Often, it's not only the questions that overlap, but the concepts. They're simply expressed differently.

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