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Do you use mystical halfbreeds in your stories?

There was this one time... 0.29218106995885 29.2% [ 71 ]
Yes 0.2798353909465 28.0% [ 68 ]
In every story I've ever written <3 0.0082304526748971 0.8% [ 2 ]
Multiple times in the same story!! 0.045267489711934 4.5% [ 11 ]
Never 0.18518518518519 18.5% [ 45 ]
I never have and I never will! 0.053497942386831 5.3% [ 13 ]
Mystical what...? What are you talking about? 0.049382716049383 4.9% [ 12 ]
Poll Whore 0.08641975308642 8.6% [ 21 ]
Total Votes:[ 243 ]
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Okay, maybe its just me, but I can't seem to go more than a week (if that) before I hear about someone's plans to make a story about a half-demon something or other who happens to be the long lost daughter of the King of Demons. Or some such thing.

I'm not here to discourage this line of thinking ENTIRELY. Mystic Half-breeds do have their place, and can shine if used properly. There is nothing INHERENTLY wrong with them in most cases. Like anything else, they have their pros and cons. The problem arises when every boy and his dog happnes to be a half-something. And a princess. etc. (especially if it really is a boy...) Or, more or less, when people use them thoughtlessly, as an excuse for wierd hair colors and special powers.

If you are going to use them as an excuse for wierd hair and/or special powers, at least think things through.

What I do intend to do, is to make sure that people can make an informed decision of whether or not such a character is a good move or not.

However, bear in mind that I'm not in an entirely reasonable mood at the moment, so this may come off as a little harsh.

Sueishness: Mystic halfbreeds tend to generate a lot of mary sue type characters. For those of you who have used them and not made a sue, I apologize. But I feel it necessary to at least comment on the risk involved here.

What you have here is the potential for a character to be more than human while still being very much human. You have poeple who may or may not be able to pass off as 'normal' while having access to a great deal of supernatural powers, plus possible guidance from supernatural parents. This is a deadly combination. It doesn't get any better when you have people constantly making prophesies about their characters.

I think a touch of common sense can alleviate much of this problem, though. A lot of it simply boils down to consequences. Like any other character, you must explore the consequences of every aspect of your character. If supernatural beings can breed with mortals in your world, then what are the consequences? What are the consequences for your character's parents? What are the consequences your character has to face? (Racism comes to mind but sadly isn't often done properly.)

Implications: One must consider the implications of using halfbreeds within a story. Because there are radical implications both globally and immediately.

First of all, the existence of such a character proves the existence of two races. Or demons and angels. Or vampires. or whatever. You get the point. But this should have a big effect on the world at large. If you have two races, then how do they interract? Given the way humans interract with each-other in the real world... well... it probably won't be pretty.

In the case of a religiously based character, this problem takes an entirely different face. Congratualtions, your character has just proven the existence of God. Or the Devil. There goes the atheists. So, you have to bear in mind the effect that this will have on people's perceptions of religion. Also, your character might not be well liked by religious extremists from a different religion (assuming one exists now that the existence of your God has been proven.) Although warring pantheons might be an interesting premise, I doubt that was what you had in mind when you made the character.

Also, at some point you have to address the problem that your character is probably not the first halfbreed born, and will probably not be the last. How many half-breeds are there, in fact? Bear in mind that as the population of either species expands, so does the potential for half-breeds between them. Want to make a war between them to reduce the populations? But you have just created the perfect breeding environment for more! (And resentful ones at that) Or... have they become so prolific that they have since become like a race unto themselves? In our modern world, even if the popluation of half-breeds was 1% of the world population, they would number in the hundreds of millions. Imagine what a hundred million half-elves could do if they got riled up and decided to make their own place in the world.

In a more immediate sense, you have to explore the personal implications of what it means to be a half-breed. I'm not going to spend a lot of time on this, but once again, common sense is important here. You have to consider the kind of family life the character has. Was the character raised by the 'normal' parent? The supernatural parent? Both? How does the local community react to this? How does this reaction affect the character? (If I had a penny for every time a half-breed was exiled from his/her community... What happened to good old fashioned witch burning and crucifixion. For that matter, if your not using a christian theology, as in Jesus doesn't exist in your world, then there should be no reason why it wouldn't be used in your typical fantasy setting save in favor of gorier methods of execution.)

Anyway... you have to consider both sides of the coin. Yes, people may not like your character because he/she is different. But, if that character is really bestowed with immense supernatural powers, people may also want to make use of that character's abilities. (This can take on a lot of different aspects.) Or alternatively, the character may force the community to accept him/her. If the character is really a nigh-unstoppable power-house, why would he tolerate people looking down on him? Most people would feel justified beating up someone who left a burning cross (for a bad example) on his door-step. (Not to mention the potential for making oneself a tyrant or false god.)

For that matter, make the benefit a character receives from supernatural parentage realistic to the setting. In all likelihood, when interbred with a weaker race, the offspring will have powers in between the two extremes of the parents. The child will be stronger than the normal race, but weaker than the special race.

Tacking on the titles: It seems to me that a lot of people think that any half-breed must automatically come from royalty as well. I find this to be particularly annoying. Even more-so when it is a lost princess that has to go on a quest to reclaim her rightful throne. This is rarely done right.

I suppose I can't refute the concept. This goes way back to Greek mythology, with Zeus sleeping with anyone he could, and whatnot. But at least think the titles through as well. Just because the character happens to be the daughter of the local lord doesn't make her a princess. It depends on the king, and how the character came to be. And even if the character is legitimate and accepted by the people, that doesn't necessarily make her the heiress to the throne.

Naturally, things will seldomly go smoothly. The first hurdle to cross is whether or not the character is even legitimate. (especially if we're talking in terms of non-human societies, or cultural taboos) It isn't hard to imagine a king sneaking out of his castle for some pleasurable company in the evening. What is hard to imagine is the court taking the illegitamately concieved child seriously when she comes claiming to be the heir to the throne.

Another problem is that anyone who sees this illigitimate offspring as a potential threat to their power/ability to take the throne will undoubtedly try to kill said character.

Then you get to the problems of social acceptance. Because if the character is not accepted by the people, odds are she won't be taking the throne any time soon. And if she does, poeple are not going to like it. They might even revolt. Especially if stirred on by unscrupulous advisors. This is going to be an even bigger problem if the character is also from a race that the local populace has reason to despise. (Demons, for example.) And if your character is supposed to be taking the throne of demon-kind... well. This is just an opinion of mine, so take it how you like, but I think that the game Disgaea: Hour of Darkness had a good take on how politicts would work within a demonic society. For all of its cartooniness, it made some good points. One thing I can tell you: Most demons are not going to tolerate someone who is lovey-dovey and wants to bring peace and happiness to the universe. They are more likely to support someone who advocates going on a huge rampage, killing off or corrupting humanity, and taking heaven by force. If you feel that demons are not like this, you have probably been watching too much anime, and I would refer you vieve's thread on angels and demons without religion. The plus side, though, is that your character does not have to worry about acceptance as much as keeping his/her followers in line.

Another problem the character may have is getting either parent to accept them, especially if they were unwanted to begin with. And then the immediate family. Once again, titles can be a big problem here, especially if the other children the king has sees your character as a threat. Also, if your king was sleeping around town, then he probably has a LOT of illegitimate offspring. Your character is not the only one.

But my character has a special purpose: I've always disliked stories where the character is the chosen one meant to save the world. I suppose what it really comes down to is the saving the world part. I could go on all day about what is wrong with that, but I won't. I'll just say that stories tend to be more compelling when the characters have human problems. Unfortunately, it's another thing that mystic half-breeds are commonly associated with.

Or just a grand destiny in general, I suppose. People think that their character is special, so he must have a special destiny. I prefer to think of things differently. If the character is supposed to be fulfilling some grand destiny... well... why? What is the problem the character is supposed to solve? Who benefits from it? Who is pulling the strings and how? How will the character's success affect the world at large? How did the circumstances get to be such that the character was necessary? Who is opposed to the character fulfilling this destiny, and why?

It raises a lot of questions. But if you are claiming your character exists for a purpose, you do have to answer those kinds of questions. Otherwise the world will not make sense to the reader. Another big question you might want to ask yourself is what happens if the character fails or decides not to fulfill his/her destiny. (wouldn't that be a novel concept?)

Now, here's where the last few paragraphs become relevant to the topic. If you are intent upon using a half-breed character to fulfill a special purpose, then why was it necessary for the powers that be to arrange for the chosen one to be a half-breed? If there is no particular reason for it, you cannot justify your character being a half-breed by using this argument.

Okay, I feel a little better now that I've gotten all that out of my system. Hopefully this might even make a difference. Not holding my breath though.

Anyone who want to add anything to this, or (reasonably and civilly) argue over it is welcome to do so. I probably missed quite a few things and made a few errors, so its up to you to fix it.

Learned Gaian

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Save for the titles ones, all my halfies have passed the test (the religious nutcases don't really distinguish between full-blooded whatevers and halfies. That's like the KKK leaving half-blacks alone to me).

I have one question: if you can realistically give them a title and they have human problems, does that work?

Character A's mother was third in line for a throne and would have gotten the position if she hadn't decided to go off with a half-breed son of an unliked race. So she left and later bore Character A. Not only does Character A not really get any of the magic he would as a less racially mixed person, but later he finds himself pushed into being in charage of a new place and he's the closest to royalty the people can find. He suddenly finds himself having to listen to idiots all the time while wishing he could just have a cheeseburger and a television. But he has no television, no cheeseburger, and worst of all if he ditches, the people will most likely kill him or find some way to make him very, very miserable.

I want his struggle to be finding ways to solve people's problems so he doesn't have to listen to them anymore, not really to help them, and later his struggle is to give up the throne as a non-magic user, rather than keep it and hold the place together, like the magic-users.

I'm hoping at least some of that made sense.
Yami_no_Eyes
Save for the titles ones, all my halfies have passed the test (the religious nutcases don't really distinguish between full-blooded whatevers and halfies. That's like the KKK leaving half-blacks alone to me).

I have one question: if you can realistically give them a title and they have human problems, does that work?

Character A's mother was third in line for a throne and would have gotten the position if she hadn't decided to go off with a half-breed son of an unliked race. So she left and later bore Character A. Not only does Character A not really get any of the magic he would as a less racially mixed person, but later he finds himself pushed into being in charage of a new place and he's the closest to royalty the people can find. He suddenly finds himself having to listen to idiots all the time while wishing he could just have a cheeseburger and a television. But he has no television, no cheeseburger, and worst of all if he ditches, the people will most likely kill him or find some way to make him very, very miserable.

I want his struggle to be finding ways to solve people's problems so he doesn't have to listen to them anymore, not really to help them, and later his struggle is to give up the throne as a non-magic user, rather than keep it and hold the place together, like the magic-users.

I'm hoping at least some of that made sense.


Yeah, that actually works. Although I'm curious as to how all the other people in ine for the throne died (or were assassinated) and who was behind it.

See, what I'm objecting to is people not thinking things through. they make a character a princess 'just because' and a half-breed 'just because' and then act like it means nothing.

Learned Gaian

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Yami_no_Eyes
Save for the titles ones, all my halfies have passed the test (the religious nutcases don't really distinguish between full-blooded whatevers and halfies. That's like the KKK leaving half-blacks alone to me).

I have one question: if you can realistically give them a title and they have human problems, does that work?

Character A's mother was third in line for a throne and would have gotten the position if she hadn't decided to go off with a half-breed son of an unliked race. So she left and later bore Character A. Not only does Character A not really get any of the magic he would as a less racially mixed person, but later he finds himself pushed into being in charage of a new place and he's the closest to royalty the people can find. He suddenly finds himself having to listen to idiots all the time while wishing he could just have a cheeseburger and a television. But he has no television, no cheeseburger, and worst of all if he ditches, the people will most likely kill him or find some way to make him very, very miserable.

I want his struggle to be finding ways to solve people's problems so he doesn't have to listen to them anymore, not really to help them, and later his struggle is to give up the throne as a non-magic user, rather than keep it and hold the place together, like the magic-users.

I'm hoping at least some of that made sense.


Yeah, that actually works. Although I'm curious as to how all the other people in ine for the throne died (or were assassinated) and who was behind it.

See, what I'm objecting to is people not thinking things through. they make a character a princess 'just because' and a half-breed 'just because' and then act like it means nothing.


The full-blooded royals were too busy killing each other off to bother surviving, or they hid themselves from assassins too well.

And hte second part is why I enjoy your rant. Information and thought, no real specific confinements. Win.
Yami_no_Eyes


The full-blooded royals were too busy killing each other off to bother surviving, or they hid themselves from assassins too well.

And hte second part is why I enjoy your rant. Information and thought, no real specific confinements. Win.


redface Thanks. It really means a lot for you to have faith in me. I may yet prove myself as the voice of reason. Or at least, A voice of reason.

Learned Gaian

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Yami_no_Eyes


The full-blooded royals were too busy killing each other off to bother surviving, or they hid themselves from assassins too well.

And hte second part is why I enjoy your rant. Information and thought, no real specific confinements. Win.


redface Thanks. It really means a lot for you to have faith in me. I may yet prove myself as the voice of reason. Or at least, A voice of reason.


Oh, and your 'usually have power between the two extremes' and the 'if they have a purpose, why and who benefits, etc' are great. Again, not confining, but inserting a need for research and common sense (I hope I got enough for one half-breed I keep forgetting is actually a half-breed redface ).
I had a feeling you were going to make a post about this. I saw your reaction to someone's half-demon/half-elf idea earlier.

Your rant was very informative - concise without being rude. You mentioned everything I would've talked about specifically regarding half breeds.

The only thing I would have added is about the 'Character A is destined to save the world due to some form of prophecy' syndrome. It doesn't necessarily apply to half-breeds, but usually does (since everyone seems so fond of mixing magical races with prophecies).

Keep in mind that I say 'you' a lot in the following paragraphs. I don't mean anyone specifically, so much as whoever this advice happens to apply to.

Basically, if you're saying that a character must do something because it is destiny, you are simultaneously proving that their is some form of higher power in the world you're writing about. If there are prophets running around prophecising, there must be either a being or a force (presumably a sentient one, so I suppose it's just an entity) dictating what will and will not happen.

This is very important if your writing about angels and demons, because these races refer specifically to religion. If you have indirectly confirmed the existence of a higher power, you have no reason not to explain how that power fits into society and what the relationship is between said power and the angels and demons of your story.
Personally, I've never done a half-breed. However if I did then I have the same opinions as you. You also have the physical implications of making a half-breed. Is it possible with their different anatomies?

However I believe if a half-breed was to occur it would take place either in the slums or with royalty, both are in the situation to do whatever they want (to an extent).

I had more I was going to say but my mind just went blank. Early mornings... sweatdrop
XwonderX
I had a feeling you were going to make a post about this. I saw your reaction to someone's half-demon/half-elf idea earlier.

Your rant was very informative - concise without being rude. You mentioned everything I would've talked about specifically regarding half breeds.

The only thing I would have added is about the 'Character A is destined to save the world due to some form of prophecy' syndrome. It doesn't necessarily apply to half-breeds, but usually does (since everyone seems so fond of mixing magical races with prophecies).

Keep in mind that I say 'you' a lot in the following paragraphs. I don't mean anyone specifically, so much as whoever this advice happens to apply to.

Basically, if you're saying that a character must do something because it is destiny, you are simultaneously proving that their is some form of higher power in the world you're writing about. If there are prophets running around prophecising, there must be either a being or a force (presumably a sentient one, so I suppose it's just an entity) dictating what will and will not happen.

This is very important if your writing about angels and demons, because these races refer specifically to religion. If you have indirectly confirmed the existence of a higher power, you have no reason not to explain how that power fits into society and what the relationship is between said power and the angels and demons of your story.


Ah thank you. You make a very good point.

I suppose I could go into the destiny thing in more depth, but I didn't want to diverge too far from the main topic.

Edit: >> Banothen:

Actually, I didn't want to go too much into problems of conception since it would be largely subjective to the author.

I seem to recall form somewhere that angels and demons were supposed to be spiritual beings. And at any rate, a creature without a physical body could not mate with a human. Also if you've seen the movie Gospel, that is an entirely different take on the problem. (Let's just say they're ill-equipped for the job.)
Gummi-Arms
XwonderX
I had a feeling you were going to make a post about this. I saw your reaction to someone's half-demon/half-elf idea earlier.

Your rant was very informative - concise without being rude. You mentioned everything I would've talked about specifically regarding half breeds.

The only thing I would have added is about the 'Character A is destined to save the world due to some form of prophecy' syndrome. It doesn't necessarily apply to half-breeds, but usually does (since everyone seems so fond of mixing magical races with prophecies).

Keep in mind that I say 'you' a lot in the following paragraphs. I don't mean anyone specifically, so much as whoever this advice happens to apply to.

Basically, if you're saying that a character must do something because it is destiny, you are simultaneously proving that their is some form of higher power in the world you're writing about. If there are prophets running around prophecising, there must be either a being or a force (presumably a sentient one, so I suppose it's just an entity) dictating what will and will not happen.

This is very important if your writing about angels and demons, because these races refer specifically to religion. If you have indirectly confirmed the existence of a higher power, you have no reason not to explain how that power fits into society and what the relationship is between said power and the angels and demons of your story.


Ah thank you. You make a very good point.

I suppose I could go into the destiny thing in more depth, but I didn't want to diverge too far from the main topic.


Believe me, I understand. And you did a very good job. That bit of info was just something of a pet peeve of mine. I didn't want to create a whole rant just to argue about it, and it vaguely fit in with the rest of your topic so I stuck it here.
XwonderX

Believe me, I understand. And you did a very good job. That bit of info was just something of a pet peeve of mine. I didn't want to create a whole rant just to argue about it, and it vaguely fit in with the rest of your topic so I stuck it here.


You too huh? Maybe there does need to be a rant on the subject. I mean, its getting to be as over-used as vampires. What really gets me is where saving the world is played off to be routine.
As far as standard post RP's go, half-anythings can do what they want so long as they meet the criteria for the "DM" of the RP. As for "official" stories, you're absolutely right. Some discipline is needed on writing such characters.

I can say I've never had an official mystic half-breed in a serious storyline. Just goofing off or random projects with my friends, sure. The closest I've come to that is with Cale from my "Vive le Morte" project, but he's worked out entirely so I don't think there would be too many problems...well...wait a minute...I forgot about Deux....
Out of immense curiosity....


Deux is a character of mine, again from "Vive le Morte" who is the b*****d son of Satan and some random angel who is never really mentioned. Due to his mixed lineage and who his father is, he is quite powerful, yet he is only a child and a child who has been living in the "mortal realm." Now, as far as I'm concerned, Deux is nothing more than a human being with wings and divine/demonic powers this stemming from my belief of humans being both good and evil, it's just the path we follow that makes us one or the other. As he has been raised by a-more or less-good man named Mephilio he is, essentially, good and his powers haven't really manifested yet as he is so young. However he is the key to Mikaelis' plot to open the gates of Hell and challenge Satan to take over his dominion. So, I would like to know would this qualify him to be on your "rant list?" Again, just curious.
Like others have said, great topic and concise while hitting all the important points. I have to agree with you, all too often people don't think things through, or they mistake wangst for character growth (especially with half breeds because it's all too easy for them not to fit anywhere and be downtrodden upon). The royalty thing was great as well; if you look at history, it isn't always the one whose got the strongest legal right to a throne who gets it, but the one who has the biggest army and a legal right to the throne. Without the important people backing you, it's just not going to happen.
Good topic.

Hmm. I do have a half-breed character, but he's more mixed race than being a combination of two species. And most of the non-human genes are orc, which doesn't give him any OMG SUPER SPESHUL magic powers, just slightly grey-tinted skin and elongated lower canines. And there's no such thing as destiny in the setting anyway (even if there were, my character wouldn't believe in it, being extremely rationalist and scientific).

It's another one of those cliches of fantasy writing, a bit like the ubiquitous stylish modern vampire. Not inherently horrible, but badly done and overdone. There's things to think about if you're writing a halfbreed character. Like genetics. The very definition of a species is that it can't interbreed with other species. In my setting, humans, elves, orcs and dwarves are all just 'breeds' of the same basic hominid species, and can produce fertile offspring. Instead of racism based on skin-colour, it's based on height and the pointiness of one's ears.

A good rant, this one. Even without the halfbreed thing, I can't stand the whole 'prophecy' thing behind stories. It's a rather lazy storytelling device.

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