Abusive Fathers Win Custody Battles More Often Than Mothers

[I AM R U]

Meroko_Love

I guess I should add that fathers winning custody battles more often is not in itself a bad thing; in fact, it's a great thing! It means we're moving away from traditional gender roles. Unfortunately, the problem occurs when abusive men are able to manipulate authorities and the judge to allow them sole custody over their children.

I guess I'd add that men who are capable of getting a woman to stay with them long enough to have a kid while being beaten up, are most likely going to be fairly adept at manipulation. I'm sure the same could be said for women.

[Mister George Kapland]

Meroko_Love

Yeah... Unfortunately, abusers are extremely controlling and will come after the woman many times. Leaving an abuser, is easier said than done. It doesn't help that courts still award joint custody to an abusive father, because it forces the woman to come in contact with her batterer, and most likely he'll take that opportunity to assault her.

All we can really do, until such a time that the legal system in place addresses these concerns is, hope she pushes for supervised visitation.

Sure the Father can see the kids, but Officer Hard-a** over here has a tazer if you're feeling froggy.

Meroko_Love

Statistically, a woman is safer on the streets than in her own home. Women are killed by intimate partners more often than by another acquaintance or stranger.

Honestly, I'm not really surprised about that. I mean, if you're going to beat your wife, you're obviously not all that concerned about her physical wellbeing.

Although, on the flip side. I have a buddy who was married for a time, and when his wife was mad at him, she'd come at him. Now bear in mind, she's on the upward level of 300 pounds, and built like a Farm Boy. Get's in fights with girls and men and would beat the everlasting piss right out of anybody

Now, in his own words, he never struck his wife, but whenever he charged at her he would 'help her into' whatever was around. Be it, a dryer or a wall. Not that stopped her, she was akin to Lady Hulk. Of course, in his own words she was also harder to fight off than most men he's fought, twice his size. I guess that's why two scrappers should never date.

I'd say it's only okay to hit your spouse if you're scared they're going to inflict significant bodily harm.

Meroko_Love

And then men...
Outside the domestic realm, males are killed much more often than females; they
are killed most often in fights with other men.

More women need to start killing their husbands. Let the abusive males get a taste of the fear.

Certainly doesn't help when: Almost 1/3 of female homicide victims that are reported in police records are killed by an intimate partner. Campbell, et al. (2003). “Assessing Risk Factors for Intimate Partner Homicide Intimate Partner Homicide, NIJ Journal, 250, 14-19

Nor when: In 70-80% of intimate partner homicides, no matter which partner was killed, the man physically abused the woman before the murder. http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/nij/topics/crime/intimate-partner-violence/extent.htm
Well, at least there's some women out there who aren't ashamed to stab their husbands to death after he knocks a few teeth out.

Personally, I'd rather they did some creative maiming 'ala Lorena Bobbit, but to each their own. I suppose the abuser isn't abusing anybody anymore, so that's all that matters.

Quote:

And even: 1 in every 4 women will experience domestic violence in her lifetime. 85% of domestic violence victims are women. http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/nij/topics/crime/intimate-partner-violence/measuring.htm

Something wrong with the world if those statistics are so high. We should be teaching kids to recognize the signs of an abusive relationship.

[Plata Plomo y Sangre]

Quote:

Outside the domestic realm, males are killed much more often than females; they
are killed most often in fights with other men.

And this means ... what? So men are killing each other and that fact somehow downplays the fact that the majority of victims are males?

[Mister George Kapland]

el pibe tirofijo

Quote:

Outside the domestic realm, males are killed much more often than females; they
are killed most often in fights with other men.

And this means ... what? So men are killing each other and that fact somehow downplays the fact that the majority of victims are males?

She's stating as a whole, in society, men are killed more than women. Outside of the domestic arena. By Men.

[Omorose Panya]

Meroko_Love

Wellbutrin is ******** up; I was put on that for a little while and it's awful. Besides, there are so many factors involved that it's very reductionist to claim that antidepressants and antianxiety meds could make someone an unfit parent. That's just absurd. It's even worse if your a black or hispanic mother... They get judged even harsher in child custody cases than white mothers.

That's about 50% of Americans there who can't be parents then? That's how many have depression and anxiety- which is a mental illness. So I guess since I have anxiety, which is a mental illness, I can't be a mom then, huh?
Physically ill? So a person can't be a good parent if they have diabetes or MS? Rather oppressive don't you think?

What about a gruff or scruffy looking male motorcyclist? Should he be judged as incompetent because of the way he looks? He could be a wonderful father for all we know.

I'll respond to this since Lima responded quite well to your post to me.

I think you are ignoring reality at this point. I know you know how medication works, and how anti-depressants and anti-psychotics. They have been demonstrated to affect behavior and emotions; otherwise they would not be prescribed. ******** with how the body handles dopamine, serotonin, and (nor)epinephrine, among other things, DOES do things to the body. Some of these medications DO cause drastic changes to the body because of the different hormone and neurotransmitter distribution. There are other factors but let's not deny that medication CAN be a big factor.

Again, I'm not saying that all or most of them do that but I think you're being a little dishonest when you portray it as if the medication absolutely does not ever do that. (You are portraying it in that way.) If it is not affecting the person's behavior in a major way, then I agree that it should not be used against them in court. It just might be combing to the judy if they go in there without a means to make money, without a home, perhaps a scruffy experience, PLUS the fact that they are on medication because of how they were physically and/or emotionally abused. I understand the games abusers play and that they're ******** up and have real consequences, but to me it doesn't like like the victims under those circumstances are fit to take care of children right yet.

Meroko, you have taken something out of context in every reply in this quote tree thus far. Clearly Lima meant mental illness that affects ability to parent, and not mental illness in general. neutral Plus it was part of a list. Not just mentally ill, but simultaneously homeless, jobless, unskilled, and significantly ill in some way, be it mentally or physical.

You keep taking these issues so personally and blowing everything that is said out of proportion. You do that a lot in just about all of your threads -- even in the beginning of this one. They were not attacking you (well, macai was being an a** but he was not incorrect), they were trying to get better sources out of you. Just to give you an idea, I could compare you to Dan. neutral

I'm not trying to be mean here and I apologize if I come off that way. I understand that these issues are very personal and have profound significance to you, but you are letting that affect your ability to debate.

Please bump my thread if my tank is glowing! Direct tank link. Thanks!

[low iq 111]

kids need to spend more time in school, and be taught a lot about abuse and that it is wrong.

also, there should be daycares for kids under 5 that do the same thing.

then kids can tell teachers their problems or a school counselor and leave their homes.

[ID Namarra]

Makes sense, while he manipulates the mother looks like a shipwreck in court...

Though I'm surprised to have read posts from people that consider these facts as diametrically opposed to the myth of women being favored in custody battles. We're only taking abusive relationships into consideration.

[Volvo S60]

@Panya: Anti-depressants and anti-psychotics have different effects on every person. For me, I'm on an anti-depressant, an anti-psychotic, and a stimulant. I experience no altered mood except for moods that have a benefit to my life. A study that was done in 09, showed that people who are on anti-depressants, are more inclined to be outgoing. I mean that they want to hang out with friends, go to work, go on dates, go to the movies, etc. It showed that the drug improved their mood drastically. The reason why psychiatrists start out with a low dose of the medicine, is because it can have a negative impact on the patient if they start out with a high dose of it. Other studies show that people who are bipolar, don't take their meds because they like experiencing the manic phase of a bipolar crash. That is why they say their mood is affected, and believe that the medicine is making them act like zombies.

[Omorose Panya]

Lil Miss Raptor

@Panya: Anti-depressants and anti-psychotics have different effects on every person. For me, I'm on an anti-depressant, an anti-psychotic, and a stimulant. I experience no altered mood except for moods that have a benefit to my life. A study that was done in 09, showed that people who are on anti-depressants, are more inclined to be outgoing. I mean that they want to hang out with friends, go to work, go on dates, go to the movies, etc. It showed that the drug improved their mood drastically. The reason why psychiatrists start out with a low dose of the medicine, is because it can have a negative impact on the patient if they start out with a high dose of it. Other studies show that people who are bipolar, don't take their meds because they like experiencing the manic phase of a bipolar crash. That is why they say their mood is affected, and believe that the medicine is making them act like zombies.

stare Yes I know they affect people differently. Let's not forget that one of the main factors is the dosage and the problem to begin with. To clarify, they do the same thing to everybody. For example antidepressants generally mess with serotonin reuptake, among other things. If I am not clinically depressed but you are and severely so, then it will mess me up and make you more normal or worse, depending upon the dosage. Other factors are other medications, whether you follow the instructions on the bottle, diet (some foods interfere with medicine), sleep, etc.

I think you guys are missing the point: That sometimes medicine DOES negatively affect behavior and mood. I never said that they always do so you guys can quit with the irrelevant personal anecdotes. I mean, really, I could tell you that I have been on medication that significantly altered my behavior (I was taken off quickly) but it doesn't mean much because I am but one person.

As for the last bit: If that isn't jumping to conclusions then I don't know what is. >.>

Please bump my thread if my tank is glowing! Direct tank link. Thanks!

[Cendrillon LeFleur]

Meroko_Love

Rainier Chevalier

Meroko_Love

I didn't mean that you were operating under a stereotype, Omorose, but that the jury usually is. No, not antidepressants or antianxiety meds at all. I'm on 75 mgs of Zoloft and the only thing that changed was my depression and anxiety. No side effects at all. That would be like very extreme medication; probably like an antipsychotic or barbiturate that would actually cause a person to sleep a lot or something.

Many times when the father is abusive, he is abusing both mother and child. If we really want to protect children, then we need to be serious about listening to the children as well. In most cases, the child desperately wants to be with the mother and is terrified of the abusive father.
Abuse is really the only thing that should determine whether a parent is unfit or not. A parent who is non abusive should be able to have their children, whether a man or woman. Just because a persons looks poor and low-class, the public automatically assumes they can't be a good parent. It's extremely classist is what it is.

The children are able to stay with a relative if the mother is severely beat up and emaciated from the abuse and needs to get treated.

Iiiiiiiiif we're admitting anecdotal evidence, my mom has been on a slew of anti-depressants and anti-anxiety meds, and she went from a legitimate engineering genius (she almost worked for NASA engineering rockets) to a woman who can't focus on much of anything for too long, remember much of anything, or stay awake for too long. I love my mommy very much, but her meds totally changed who she was, and it made it rather hard for her to be a good parent. She takes Wellbutrin and... something that starts with a P that isn't Prozac or Prilosec and I forget the name. And if a mother is on anti-psychotics, well then she can very likely forget about getting custody. It's sad, but that's life.

I don't think that's what she really meant (as in to say I think you misunderstood, since she wasn't talking about physical appearance at all but rather actual competence, which is a necessary trait to be a good parent), and I'm going to have to disagree on this (bolded) point. Not to say that a child has to stay with the abusive father, but if the mother is as you described (homeless, jobless, unskilled, physically and/or mentally ill), then she shouldn't have custody of the child either. Her being the sweetest gosh-darn mama-bear in the whoooooooooole wide world won't change the fact that she'll very likely be incapable of taking care of her chirrens. This isn't about class or poverty, mind you. It's about fitness to raise a child. If you can't take care of yourself, then you have no business running a child through that, too.

Wellbutrin is ******** up; I was put on that for a little while and it's awful. 1. Besides, there are so many factors involved that it's very reductionist to claim that antidepressants and antianxiety meds could make someone an unfit parent. That's just absurd. 2. It's even worse if your a black or hispanic mother... They get judged even harsher in child custody cases than white mothers.

3. That's about 50% of Americans there who can't be parents then? That's how many have depression and anxiety- which is a mental illness. So I guess since I have anxiety, which is a mental illness, I can't be a mom then, huh?
4. Physically ill? So a person can't be a good parent if they have diabetes or MS? Rather oppressive don't you think?

5. What about a gruff or scruffy looking male motorcyclist? Should he be judged as incompetent because of the way he looks? He could be a wonderful father for all we know.

1. See the bold in your statement. Could. No issue with that. That's why things get looked into. If you're assuming I mean to blanket anyone with my claim, well that's just silly-talk.
2. Yes, but that has nothing to do with my post.
3. Never said that people with mental illnesses are guaranteed to be unfit parents. Not once.
4. Oooooh, I get it. You're going to take the grocery list I copied from you, and then attack it in pieces when you used it as an aggregate. Nice! And I never said that, no. If a person, male or female, is poor AND homeless AND jobless AND unskilled AND mentally AND physically ill, then I would, as a judge, be apprehensive about granting them custody. Don't even have to be all of those, but any combination could be bad.
5. Did I not just say it had nothing to do with outward appearance? Though, if I was a judge, and someone came into my courtroom smelling like taint, looking like a**, with a bandana on and in a leather jacket, I might be a little apprehensive about granting them custody, too, because that gives off a certain impression, and it's not one of #1 DAD.

[Meroko_Love]

Lil Miss Raptor

Meroko_Love

Wellbutrin is ******** up; I was put on that for a little while and it's awful.

Really? I'm on it and I'm fine. I'm also on Risperdal and Focalin. I'm still in school... So, yeah.

Well, I guess if it works for you that's fine.

[Meroko_Love]

I AM R U

Meroko_Love

I guess I should add that fathers winning custody battles more often is not in itself a bad thing; in fact, it's a great thing! It means we're moving away from traditional gender roles. Unfortunately, the problem occurs when abusive men are able to manipulate authorities and the judge to allow them sole custody over their children.

I guess I'd add that men who are capable of getting a woman to stay with them long enough to have a kid while being beaten up, are most likely going to be fairly adept at manipulation. I'm sure the same could be said for women.

Yeah, pretty much.

[Meroko_Love]

el pibe tirofijo

Quote:

Outside the domestic realm, males are killed much more often than females; they
are killed most often in fights with other men.

And this means ... what? So men are killing each other and that fact somehow downplays the fact that the majority of victims are males?

It's true that the majority of victims of violence are males. It's also true that the majority of perpetrators are also males.

Our culture is clearly doing something wrong.