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Southern Cross Nemesis

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 11:42 am
... Baptism to one's Christianity?

Last sunday, I went to a new church... the old one had too many memories of my mother tied to it, and it was those memories that keep me form going. For the past 7 months I haven't been to a church more than 3 times... that a side the message was one of baptism and the importance of being baptized. The preacher said that only though, being baptized one can take in the holy spirit and believing does nothing.

I was raised in a Baptist church, my father was a Free-will Baptist preacher, before I was born. Him and my mom, let it be my choice to be baptized or not. So, I never was. I believe full-heartily that God is the creator of all things, Humanity is the black sheep of his creations, Christ came down to earth to provide a way back to God's graces and all that...

Like most things, I only saw baptism and the cross, as symbols not much more. That the meaning behind them is the true lesson to take from them. And that lesson was as Christians we must die to live. Am I wrong, and there is something more to the whole thing?  
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 12:38 pm
Well, being a Christian is to "be like Christ" so I guess baptism is being like Christ. I got baptized because I felt it was right for me personally. It did feel good, but I probably didn't fully understand at the time now that I think about it. But oh well, I understand now, which gives it more meaning.

Anyway, Baptism isn't a thing you HAVE to do, in my opinion, like everything, it's a choice. Jesus just wants a thank you for being our Savior, and I think we can thank him any way we want as long as it is not sin... of course.  

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 12:56 pm
i was baptized when i was a baby but thats it. i dont really see much point in it personally. though im also of the belief that even if you dont believe in christ that as long as you're a good person you dont go to hell  
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:01 pm
Shanna66 Wrote:
i was baptized when i was a baby but thats it. i dont really see much point in it personally. though im also of the belief that even if you dont believe in christ that as long as you're a good person you dont go to hell

I do not believe baptism can be forced, that is normally a christening when a baby.  

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:09 pm
Qyp Wrote:
Shanna66 Wrote:
i was baptized when i was a baby but thats it. i dont really see much point in it personally. though im also of the belief that even if you dont believe in christ that as long as you're a good person you dont go to hell

I do not believe baptism can be forced, that is normally a christening when a baby.


im not even 100% sure if anything was done to me, my mother said i was baptised or whatever and my dad said he didnt think so  
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:53 pm
Depends on the sect of Christianity. To some sects its very important, to others it's optional. Catholics and other sects that are very big into ritual and the observance of sacraments will argue that it is essential to get baptized since it is the initiation into Christianity and the New Covenant. Other sects, usually liberal protestants will argue that it's symbolic. For the longest time in Church history it was believed that baptism was necessary for salvation, hence why infant baptism was common. Even Luther believed this from what I understand. You are going to hear arguments on both sides concerning this and it is something that is hotly debated.  

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 7:44 pm
Shanna66 Wrote:
Qyp Wrote:
Shanna66 Wrote:
i was baptized when i was a baby but thats it. i dont really see much point in it personally. though im also of the belief that even if you dont believe in christ that as long as you're a good person you dont go to hell

I do not believe baptism can be forced, that is normally a christening when a baby.


im not even 100% sure if anything was done to me, my mother said i was baptised or whatever and my dad said he didnt think so

Water on forehead, is seen as Christening by Catholics, and baptism is like the cleansing and rebirth of one's body and soul... though some take it a bit to far and say to girls "YOU'RE A VIRGIN AGAIN!" Which I think is a little stupid. I am not a girl by the way, just using that as an example of going to far with baptism.  
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:17 am
Qyp Wrote:
Shanna66 Wrote:
Qyp Wrote:
Shanna66 Wrote:
i was baptized when i was a baby but thats it. i dont really see much point in it personally. though im also of the belief that even if you dont believe in christ that as long as you're a good person you dont go to hell

I do not believe baptism can be forced, that is normally a christening when a baby.


im not even 100% sure if anything was done to me, my mother said i was baptised or whatever and my dad said he didnt think so

Water on forehead, is seen as Christening by Catholics, and baptism is like the cleansing and rebirth of one's body and soul... though some take it a bit to far and say to girls "YOU'RE A VIRGIN AGAIN!" Which I think is a little stupid. I am not a girl by the way, just using that as an example of going to far with baptism.


my parents werent catholic, im not really sure what they were though. i think they had their own open minded view of christianity.

i never understood the born again virgin thing  

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2012 5:40 am
Shanna66 Wrote:
Qyp Wrote:
Shanna66 Wrote:
Qyp Wrote:
Shanna66 Wrote:
i was baptized when i was a baby but thats it. i dont really see much point in it personally. though im also of the belief that even if you dont believe in christ that as long as you're a good person you dont go to hell

I do not believe baptism can be forced, that is normally a christening when a baby.


im not even 100% sure if anything was done to me, my mother said i was baptised or whatever and my dad said he didnt think so

Water on forehead, is seen as Christening by Catholics, and baptism is like the cleansing and rebirth of one's body and soul... though some take it a bit to far and say to girls "YOU'RE A VIRGIN AGAIN!" Which I think is a little stupid. I am not a girl by the way, just using that as an example of going to far with baptism.


my parents werent catholic, im not really sure what they were though. i think they had their own open minded view of christianity.

i never understood the born again virgin thing

Same here... Once you done it, you done it... Unless like... something heals up.  
PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:40 pm
My church strongly believes in baptism.

You can baptize after the age of 12, freely. After the age of 12 you become responsible for your actions, and therefore you become a full-time sinner almost. After you baptize, all yours sins go away. We have special baptism services etc..

If you don't baptize, you can't do certain things, like partake in the adult services at church; you can only ask hymns and play in the orchestra in the youth service.
Also you can never truly become a musician.
If you start going out with someone who's not baptized and you are, then you will lose certain privileges...

But I guess baptism is important because you basically have to devote yourself completely to God; complete devotion. You actually have to abide by his teachings and not do anything that you "harm" your "purity"  

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:44 am
RosithBelle Wrote:
My church strongly believes in baptism.
You can baptize after the age of 12, freely. After the age of 12 you become responsible for your actions, and therefore you become a full-time sinner almost. After you baptize, all yours sins go away. We have special baptism services etc..

If you don't baptize, you can't do certain things, like partake in the adult services at church; you can only ask hymns and play in the orchestra in the youth service.
Also you can never truly become a musician.
That's nice but do you believe in it? Also that sounds rather controlling and manipulative. If you don't baptize you can't be with the other adults?

Edit: You're an adult at 12? That's when your hormones start going nuts and you're starting figuring things out.

Quote:
If you start going out with someone who's not baptized and you are, then you will lose certain privileges...
Why? That sounds messed up. There's nothing against dating, or even marrying, non-believers.

Quote:
But I guess baptism is important because you basically have to devote yourself completely to God; complete devotion. You actually have to abide by his teachings and not do anything that you "harm" your "purity"
Baptism is an initiation into the Christian Mysteries but that's all it is, the outward sign of choosing to be a follower of Christ. About the purity thing, is it not said that what comes out your mouth is what defiles you? What makes one impure?  
PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 6:10 am
One of the descriptions I've heard about Baptism is that it is a symbolic "ego death". The "drowning" of oneself and what rises up is a new person who is in the body of Christ. Any thoughts, comments, or criticism on this?  

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:16 am
rmcdra Wrote:
One of the descriptions I've heard about Baptism is that it is a symbolic "ego death". The "drowning" of oneself and what rises up is a new person who is in the body of Christ. Any thoughts, comments, or criticism on this?

I thought, like Jesus, baptism was acceptance of the Holy Spirit... which is "God within us". So I guess the Holy Spirit "joins" within our own Spirit. And body of Christ... well... we "eat his flesh and drink his blood"... so I would have to say that is more about equality with Jesus... because we are his "spouse".

I would say Jesus is US... in a way... he represents us in Heaven, instead of us having to sacrifice a lamb to commune with God, Jesus is the lamb instead. I believe that is why people see God the Father as a Lion, majestic yet terrifying. Jesus as a Lamb, that is gentle, humble, loving, and in the old ways of the Jewish people, a sacrifice. The Dove is the Holy Spirit to some, which was used by Noah to seek land and a new beginning, which is was Baptism is... so maybe the Great Flood was real, it was the Baptism of the Earth itself...  
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 12:37 am
Qyp Wrote:
rmcdra Wrote:
One of the descriptions I've heard about Baptism is that it is a symbolic "ego death". The "drowning" of oneself and what rises up is a new person who is in the body of Christ. Any thoughts, comments, or criticism on this?

I thought, like Jesus, baptism was acceptance of the Holy Spirit... which is "God within us". So I guess the Holy Spirit "joins" within our own Spirit. And body of Christ... well... we "eat his flesh and drink his blood"... so I would have to say that is more about equality with Jesus... because we are his "spouse".

I would say Jesus is US... in a way... he represents us in Heaven, instead of us having to sacrifice a lamb to commune with God, Jesus is the lamb instead. I believe that is why people see God the Father as a Lion, majestic yet terrifying. Jesus as a Lamb, that is gentle, humble, loving, and in the old ways of the Jewish people, a sacrifice. The Dove is the Holy Spirit to some, which was used by Noah to seek land and a new beginning, which is was Baptism is... so maybe the Great Flood was real, it was the Baptism of the Earth itself...
that's some nice connections there. I mean that in all seriousness.

It might have been real but I personally doubt it. Still doesn't make the meaning of the connections any less significant though.  

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2012 1:01 am
rmcdra Wrote:
Qyp Wrote:
rmcdra Wrote:
One of the descriptions I've heard about Baptism is that it is a symbolic "ego death". The "drowning" of oneself and what rises up is a new person who is in the body of Christ. Any thoughts, comments, or criticism on this?

I thought, like Jesus, baptism was acceptance of the Holy Spirit... which is "God within us". So I guess the Holy Spirit "joins" within our own Spirit. And body of Christ... well... we "eat his flesh and drink his blood"... so I would have to say that is more about equality with Jesus... because we are his "spouse".

I would say Jesus is US... in a way... he represents us in Heaven, instead of us having to sacrifice a lamb to commune with God, Jesus is the lamb instead. I believe that is why people see God the Father as a Lion, majestic yet terrifying. Jesus as a Lamb, that is gentle, humble, loving, and in the old ways of the Jewish people, a sacrifice. The Dove is the Holy Spirit to some, which was used by Noah to seek land and a new beginning, which is was Baptism is... so maybe the Great Flood was real, it was the Baptism of the Earth itself...
that's some nice connections there. I mean that in all seriousness.

It might have been real but I personally doubt it. Still doesn't make the meaning of the connections any less significant though.

It might not of been water... The Flood could have been anything...

Though, Assassin's Creed, (yes a game) gave me an idea for an End of the World experience. In the game, there is an Advanced culture called "The Ones Who Came Before". They made mankind in their image (Bam Bible/Greek Mythology references) and the names of those who appear in the games (spoiler!) were actually of the Etruscan mythology, Tinia, Menrva and Uni. Anyway... Mankind rebelled, and they were to busy with this world wide civil war to notice that skies were the real threat. The Sun did a super solar flare that reached the Earth and caused a catastrophic world wide quake that would have been off the charts. Anyway, mankind was left in the hundreds, while Those Who Came Before were left with a population to small to really do anything. But they still had enough to build these special temples called Vaults. Not sure if it was before or after the great catastrophic event actually that they built them. But because of them, mankind survived...

They Ark and the Flood could have been anything. People interpret it the way they want. Personally, fire burning the earth and all evil, seems more like God to me. Considering fire has been used by him a few times. like that Fire Tornado against the Egyptians when Moses was freeing the Israelite people right?  
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