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Marriage is...
  the commitment
  the act of sex
  a ceremony with a pretty white dress!
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`apple dumpling

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2009 7:30 pm
My question to you all is what constitutes marriage in the eyes of God? Is the commitment from the two people enough, is it the act of sex which binds them, or is the marriage ceremony necessary?

Go. smilies/icon_arrow.gif
 
PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 10:12 pm
Marriage is not a piece of paper the Federal Government requires of you for tax purposes I can grant you that.

Marriage is binding contract between the couple and God. The Traditions of each culture govern the semantics which surround that contract.  

Vasilius Konstantinos

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Neferet -House of Night-

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 5:22 am
Vasilius Konstantinos Wrote:
Marriage is not a piece of paper the Federal Government requires of you for tax purposes I can grant you that.

Marriage is binding contract between the couple and God. The Traditions of each culture govern the semantics which surround that contract.
Marriage is not a Christian concept and it is a business contract.  
PostPosted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 8:24 pm
-xXLady RaiXx- Wrote:
Vasilius Konstantinos Wrote:
Marriage is not a piece of paper the Federal Government requires of you for tax purposes I can grant you that.

Marriage is binding contract between the couple and God. The Traditions of each culture govern the semantics which surround that contract.
Marriage is not a Christian concept and it is a business contract.

No, that would be a civil union.  

Mystery Contendor

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Neferet -House of Night-

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:27 am
A My Name Is Alix Wrote:
-xXLady RaiXx- Wrote:
Vasilius Konstantinos Wrote:
Marriage is not a piece of paper the Federal Government requires of you for tax purposes I can grant you that.

Marriage is binding contract between the couple and God. The Traditions of each culture govern the semantics which surround that contract.
Marriage is not a Christian concept and it is a business contract.

No, that would be a civil union.
No. It's marriage. There is no such thing as civil union. A marriage is between two people in love. Commonlaw is a marriage concept. Hell in ye olden days people would consider having sex as marriage. Handfasting is marriage. smilies/icon_neutral.gif  
PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 12:16 pm
Marriage is a business contract. It is a mutually beneficial state of being for two people who, in this day and age, are in love. Hundreds of years ago it was very much business as a way of uniting two families for money, land, and power purposes. Though marriage is not a Judeo-Christian concept, its been around long before those religions came into being. Again to the throwback of hundreds of years ago, if a couple was betrothed, then had sex, they had then essentially become wed. In this day and age, we all know that sex no longer holds that obligation, and can be done with no real thought to it and usually no fear of some sort of repercussion. And today many people see marriage as a joining of two hearts and minds and souls in love in front of God and also, it has to be on a piece of paper to make it legal and on the books.

Though in a more direct response to your inquiry, I believe that the commitment is what makes it a marriage, and that the ceremony is a way for others to come and celebrate the joining of the couple. The sex is just a sort of perk after. Sex itself, in this day and age, does not constitute a marriage as you can sleep with anyone and everyone with no commitment. Sex is now more of a strict love em and leave em practice with so many, it doesn't hold the intimacy that it used to.  

Ricette

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Crimson Raccoon

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2009 5:40 pm
She's not looking for the secular view on marriage, nor what sex in this day and age means in most people's minds (not that today's non-Christian view is really any different than it ever was), she asked what it is in God's eyes. Sex does hold the intimacy and commitment that it used to and always did, for Christians, and that's what she's asking about.

Marriage originates much farther back in human society than what history has been able to uncover, so none of us can make the claim of how marriage originated. Did it start as a business contract? Did it start as a religious ritual? Marriage, as far back as we can trace it, exhibits characteristics of both, and history has not discovered the original intention of it, so it can't say for sure.

According to the Bible, this first society was Adam and Eve and their offspring. And in these earliest chapters of Genesis, in the very description of the creations of Adam and Eve, we read about the concept of marriage, a union of a man and a woman. The fact that societies all over the world have some concept of marriage is, to me, evidence that they all got it from an original society very early in human history. So it seems to support this Biblical account.

The actual ceremonious kind of aspects of marriage are unknown in their origin, but the Bible does give it's stamp of approval on it, in several places of both the Old and New Testaments.

Marriage in ancient history was very similar to business-contracts and negotiations, as has been said already. But once Christianity came on the scene, these formerly pagan men were instructed to actually love their wives and respect them, and give up their lives to them, and to remain sexually faithful to them. (Ephesians 5) This was a radical concept at the time, when the Roman Empire was at it's peak. Marriage contracts became, in Christianity, not contracts between the families, but contracts with God. This is why, even to this day, most marriages are done in churches, and by a minister.

Of course, most people of this and recent generations only do this out of tradition and not really thinking about what it truly means. But nonetheless, marriage is not just a ceremony handed down from business and peace negotiations between families from ancient times; Christianity had a huge reforming impact on it, bringing it back to it's true purpose, described way back in Genesis Chapter 2, as a life-long commitment and union between a man and a woman.

But getting to your actual question, `apple dumpling. According to the Bible, the act of sex does unite people to become "one flesh," as it is worded in the Bible. Being united in this way, the two people involved are responsible before God to be committed to each other for life. If you wouldn't be unfaithful to your own flesh, you shouldn't be unfaithful to the person you've become one flesh with.

The institution of marriage also does have the "stamp of approval" as I said earlier. It is expected that two people get married if they want to be united in this way. At their wedding ceremony, Christians make their vows to God to be committed to each other. So this, just like any vow you make to God, is also a life-long commitment.

So basically, the act of sex and the ceremony of marriage are both ways that a husband and wife are bound to be committed to each other. The two shouldn't be separated, unless there is a good reason to have one without the other: Like, if you're stranded on a desert island with a guy you want to commit to, and there's no one around to perform the ceremony. This would be similar to becoming a Christian but there's no one around to baptize you - you're still a Christian even if you haven't been baptized, but if you can get baptized, then you should.

I should also mention that there are allowances for divorce in the Bible, for cases of you spouse not being faithful to you and to the vows they made. It's a very sad thing when that happens, it should be avoided at all costs, but sometimes it does need to happen. That's an aside though. I hope I've helped your question some. =)  
PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 4:49 am
According to history, marriage wasn't a Christian concept. It was started by them Sumerians I think. Me and Ricette didn't give the "secular" meaning of marriage, but the basic, true meaning of marriage without all the fluff.  

Neferet -House of Night-

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Crimson Raccoon

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:55 am
-xXLady RaiXx- Wrote:
According to history, marriage wasn't a Christian concept. It was started by them Sumerians I think. Me and Ricette didn't give the "secular" meaning of marriage, but the basic, true meaning of marriage without all the fluff.


No, the origin of marriage predates recorded history. That's a fact.

Besides, if it was started by the Sumerians, how the heck did distant societies like Native American tribes get it from them?

And, you did give the secular meaning of marriage. You didn't address anything in the religious meaning of it. That approach, by definition, is secular. Which is fine, you should just be aware of what it is. And you should also acknowledge that marriage is not completely secular but does have a religious side to it. Otherwise, why do it in a church, by a minister? Why do so many societies around the world and throughout history connect a religious ceremony with their weddings? It's possible to have a completely non-religious wedding, but historically that is extremely unusual; and anyway that doesn't take away the religious meaning from every one else's marriage.

sec⋅u⋅lar: –adjective; not pertaining to or connected with religion.  
PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 4:35 am
It's something called cultural diffusion. Didn't you learn anything in history? smilies/icon_neutral.gif  

Neferet -House of Night-

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Crimson Raccoon

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 6:49 am
Sure. I'll just let the other people who may read this thread decide which of us they want to believe. There's no point in a back-and-forth argument about something that predates recorded history. =P

I hope my post on the topic contributed to the discussion, that's all I aim to do. =)  
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 12:08 pm
marriage is a covenant. and not just any kind. its a blood covenant. when that term was used, all bodily fluid except saliva were considered "blood". It used to be the hardest covenant to break. now its entirely too easy. that is what it is.  

promised_child

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promised_child

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 12:09 pm
also, the idea of love being a requirement for marriage is new. only 500 years old.  
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 7:36 pm
promised_child Wrote:
also, the idea of love being a requirement for marriage is new. only 500 years old.


But what do you do with the command in the Bible, "Husbands, love your wives"? That's 2000 years old. =P I know what you're saying though. Again it's a question of whether we're talking about the secular view of marriage, or the Christian view. The Christian view has always been that a married couple should love each other. But you're right that in the secular view, love has never really been thought of as a necessary factor until relatively recently, maybe 500 years is right for that.  

Crimson Raccoon

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promised_child

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 9:21 am
Crimson Raccoon Wrote:
promised_child Wrote:
also, the idea of love being a requirement for marriage is new. only 500 years old.


But what do you do with the command in the Bible, "Husbands, love your wives"? That's 2000 years old. =P I know what you're saying though. Again it's a question of whether we're talking about the secular view of marriage, or the Christian view. The Christian view has always been that a married couple should love each other. But you're right that in the secular view, love has never really been thought of as a necessary factor until relatively recently, maybe 500 years is right for that.


you mean "Husband love your wives as Christ loved the church." it isn't talking about emotional love, which is what I was talking about. the love the Bible means transcends emotion, passed the soul and straight to the spirit.  
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