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mazuac

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 7:26 pm
Ricette Wrote:
Siren of Saturn Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
Siren of Saturn Wrote:
b-asinine Wrote:


Not everyone in this guild believes that. This guild is for Christians AND non-Christians. So therefore, you can surely expect debate to some extent. Besides, he [divineseraph] is not saying anything against any religion... He is merely trying to open your eyes about certain facts.




It's called radicalism. Not all Muslims follow nor believe what the Taliban and Al Queda preach. They do that as a way to control the people out of fear - and use religion as a tool to manipulate with.



Are you just talking because you don't have any other arguement?


This is supposed to be a place where christians can come and find rest, you wouldn't go into a church and start telling the preacher he is wrong while up at the pulpit would you? This is our church.


Jesus did.

Quote it in scripture.
But isn't that what Jesus did in pretty much all four Gospels?
Actually, no he did not~ He went into the temples and synagogues telling them what prophets had said, etc. Not telling them they were wrong. He, yes, debated with them, but he did not say "your beliefs are wrong."
 
PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 8:05 pm
mazuac Wrote:
Ricette Wrote:
Siren of Saturn Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
Siren of Saturn Wrote:
b-asinine Wrote:


Not everyone in this guild believes that. This guild is for Christians AND non-Christians. So therefore, you can surely expect debate to some extent. Besides, he [divineseraph] is not saying anything against any religion... He is merely trying to open your eyes about certain facts.




It's called radicalism. Not all Muslims follow nor believe what the Taliban and Al Queda preach. They do that as a way to control the people out of fear - and use religion as a tool to manipulate with.



Are you just talking because you don't have any other arguement?


This is supposed to be a place where christians can come and find rest, you wouldn't go into a church and start telling the preacher he is wrong while up at the pulpit would you? This is our church.


Jesus did.

Quote it in scripture.
But isn't that what Jesus did in pretty much all four Gospels?
Actually, no he did not~ He went into the temples and synagogues telling them what prophets had said, etc. Not telling them they were wrong. He, yes, debated with them, but he did not say "your beliefs are wrong."


Debating implies that the opponent is wrong, at least in some way. Or else he would have either agreed, and thus not debated, or he would have said nothing. While he never said "Your beliefs are wrong", he had a new idea about religion and argued against old traditions.  

divineseraph

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Seraph68

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:09 am
divineseraph Wrote:
I don't know what to search or where to find it, but it was when he was a child specifically. He ran off when Mary and Joseph took him to.. Bethlehem, was it? Anyway, when they went back to find him, he had gone into a church and he was debating with the priests and winning.


Luke 2:41-52

except he wasn't debating with them, he was studying with them.

divineseraph Wrote:

There was also the time he went into a church, saw how they were selling things in the church, and started arguing with them about that. If he saw something wrong in a church, he would say something about it.


Matt. 21:12-13
Mark 11:15-18
Luke 19:45-48
John 2:13-17

One thing to keep in mind is that this is talking about the Temple, not a church. without going too much into it, the Temple was THE place of worship to God and was not a place to do business (other then the Lord's business).  
PostPosted: Sun Aug 10, 2008 8:43 pm
Discussing, studying, debating. Whatever you want to call it, I've heard all three.

And who was Jesus to come in and tell the founded religion what to do? Keep in mind, this was just some joe off the street. The bible stresses that Jesus did not look fancy and was not what the jews expected. So to them, he seemed like some a*****e telling the already established religion that they just may be wrong about God.  

divineseraph

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mazuac

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PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 11:41 am
divineseraph Wrote:
Discussing, studying, debating. Whatever you want to call it, I've heard all three.

And who was Jesus to come in and tell the founded religion what to do? Keep in mind, this was just some joe off the street. The bible stresses that Jesus did not look fancy and was not what the jews expected. So to them, he seemed like some a*****e telling the already established religion that they just may be wrong about God.
And the Jews WERE wrong about God. Their hearts were not in the right places. They didn't look for a loving God or a relationship with Him, instead they just followed his laws mindlessly, not putting their hearts into the work. I forget where, but in Psalms is says that "God likes relationship better than sacrifice" or something like that.
 
PostPosted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:27 pm
mazuac Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
Discussing, studying, debating. Whatever you want to call it, I've heard all three.

And who was Jesus to come in and tell the founded religion what to do? Keep in mind, this was just some joe off the street. The bible stresses that Jesus did not look fancy and was not what the jews expected. So to them, he seemed like some a*****e telling the already established religion that they just may be wrong about God.
And the Jews WERE wrong about God. Their hearts were not in the right places. They didn't look for a loving God or a relationship with Him, instead they just followed his laws mindlessly, not putting their hearts into the work. I forget where, but in Psalms is says that "God likes relationship better than sacrifice" or something like that.


And Christians don't do the same? Just mindlessly following ancient exclusionary rules made by the church well after Jesus' time?

I argue they do. If the jews, the trendy monotheistic religion of the time could have been wrong, why not christians?  

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mazuac

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 10:07 am
divineseraph Wrote:
mazuac Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
Discussing, studying, debating. Whatever you want to call it, I've heard all three.

And who was Jesus to come in and tell the founded religion what to do? Keep in mind, this was just some joe off the street. The bible stresses that Jesus did not look fancy and was not what the jews expected. So to them, he seemed like some a*****e telling the already established religion that they just may be wrong about God.
And the Jews WERE wrong about God. Their hearts were not in the right places. They didn't look for a loving God or a relationship with Him, instead they just followed his laws mindlessly, not putting their hearts into the work. I forget where, but in Psalms is says that "God likes relationship better than sacrifice" or something like that.


And Christians don't do the same? Just mindlessly following ancient exclusionary rules made by the church well after Jesus' time?

I argue they do. If the jews, the trendy monotheistic religion of the time could have been wrong, why not christians?
Many Christians are wrong. Christianity is about setting the old laws of the covenant behind and becoming free in Christ. Our rules are what the New Testament really says, of course we follow what the OT says, but like... many of the laws no longer apply because of Jesus' death~

They weren't wrong. They just had their hearts set in the wrong place. God wants obedience, yes, but even more so, he wants our love towards Him, because he already loves us~
 
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:49 pm
mazuac Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
mazuac Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
Discussing, studying, debating. Whatever you want to call it, I've heard all three.

And who was Jesus to come in and tell the founded religion what to do? Keep in mind, this was just some joe off the street. The bible stresses that Jesus did not look fancy and was not what the jews expected. So to them, he seemed like some a*****e telling the already established religion that they just may be wrong about God.
And the Jews WERE wrong about God. Their hearts were not in the right places. They didn't look for a loving God or a relationship with Him, instead they just followed his laws mindlessly, not putting their hearts into the work. I forget where, but in Psalms is says that "God likes relationship better than sacrifice" or something like that.


And Christians don't do the same? Just mindlessly following ancient exclusionary rules made by the church well after Jesus' time?

I argue they do. If the jews, the trendy monotheistic religion of the time could have been wrong, why not christians?
Many Christians are wrong. Christianity is about setting the old laws of the covenant behind and becoming free in Christ. Our rules are what the New Testament really says, of course we follow what the OT says, but like... many of the laws no longer apply because of Jesus' death~

They weren't wrong. They just had their hearts set in the wrong place. God wants obedience, yes, but even more so, he wants our love towards Him, because he already loves us~


Hearts can be in the wrong place, I feel, only if they exclude others. Ever read Emerson?

"The exclusionist in religion does not see that he shuts the door of heaven on himself, in striving to shut out others."

He wants our love toward him? Then I ask you, why does he care wether we channel that love through Jesus, or through Him directly, or through any of his faces and facets?  

divineseraph

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brad175

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PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 8:58 pm
divineseraph Wrote:
I believe it should exist. Logically, all three monotheistic religions worship the same God anyway. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all the same thing. And even the polytheistic religions show connections to monotheism, since the gods usually are parts or aspects of the one true creator. I hope soon, more people will begin to realize this and stop squabbling over who has God's ear more.

I call blasphemy/idiocy on that. Monotheistic religions are only the same in that they are monotheistic.
There are only 2 religions in the world:
-works righteous
-faith based

Christianity falls into the second category, and everything else falls into the first.
Lest a man believe Christ to be God, he cannot know God at all.
(I didn't mention the thousands of important across-religion doctrinal contradictions that lead a logical person to say "dur, someones gotta be wrong")
Relativism has got to be the most illogical of beliefs.  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 1:44 am
brad175 Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
I believe it should exist. Logically, all three monotheistic religions worship the same God anyway. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all the same thing. And even the polytheistic religions show connections to monotheism, since the gods usually are parts or aspects of the one true creator. I hope soon, more people will begin to realize this and stop squabbling over who has God's ear more.

I call blasphemy/idiocy on that. Monotheistic religions are only the same in that they are monotheistic.
There are only 2 religions in the world:
-works righteous
-faith based

Christianity falls into the second category, and everything else falls into the first.
Lest a man believe Christ to be God, he cannot know God at all.
(I didn't mention the thousands of important across-religion doctrinal contradictions that lead a logical person to say "dur, someones gotta be wrong")
Relativism has got to be the most illogical of beliefs.
I call shenanigans. All three worship a single, all powerful God, Th only difference is the name and interpretation of what he supposedly said. Two spun off of one. Islam spun off Judaism through Ishmael who's father was Abraham of the Jewish religion, and Christianity is a spin off from Judaism through Jesus who as a Jew and supposedly died to cleanse the sin of the world. Its that simple. They worship a divine single creator, pray and love and believe in Him.  

Ricette

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divineseraph

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 9:49 am
brad175 Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
I believe it should exist. Logically, all three monotheistic religions worship the same God anyway. Judaism, Christianity and Islam are all the same thing. And even the polytheistic religions show connections to monotheism, since the gods usually are parts or aspects of the one true creator. I hope soon, more people will begin to realize this and stop squabbling over who has God's ear more.

I call blasphemy/idiocy on that. Monotheistic religions are only the same in that they are monotheistic.
There are only 2 religions in the world:
-works righteous
-faith based

Christianity falls into the second category, and everything else falls into the first.
Lest a man believe Christ to be God, he cannot know God at all.
(I didn't mention the thousands of important across-religion doctrinal contradictions that lead a logical person to say "dur, someones gotta be wrong")
Relativism has got to be the most illogical of beliefs.


Look up Islam. It branches off of christianity- They believe in Jesus and Moses. Jesus himself was a Jew, worshiping the Hebrew God YHWH.

They think God acts in different ways, there's no doubt about that. But there is also no doubt that they all worship the same God.  
PostPosted: Sun Feb 01, 2009 2:10 pm
a one world religion is an antichrist idea, and prayerfully that will not happen for a while, b/c when it does, it means the ultimate evil is now in charge of this world. islam, christianity, and judaism are not the same, and may say they worship the same god, but my bible says God is not a human being, and he will not lie.
He is not a human, and he does not change his mind.
(The Everyday Bible : New Century Version. Nashville, TN. : Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005, S. Nu 23:19)

yet, all three religions belief God says something different, and therefore, not all can be true. i believe that christianity is the one true religion, and i have many times seen it manifest in my life and the life of those around me. say what you want, believe what you may, but i will be taken up on the cloud when Jesus returns, and i pray that you will be there with me.  

Phantomboy411

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divineseraph

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 12:03 pm
Phantomboy411 Wrote:
a one world religion is an antichrist idea, and prayerfully that will not happen for a while, b/c when it does, it means the ultimate evil is now in charge of this world. islam, christianity, and judaism are not the same, and may say they worship the same god, but my bible says God is not a human being, and he will not lie.
He is not a human, and he does not change his mind.
(The Everyday Bible : New Century Version. Nashville, TN. : Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005, S. Nu 23:19)

yet, all three religions belief God says something different, and therefore, not all can be true. i believe that christianity is the one true religion, and i have many times seen it manifest in my life and the life of those around me. say what you want, believe what you may, but i will be taken up on the cloud when Jesus returns, and i pray that you will be there with me.


Antichrist? Wasn't CHRIST for peace and understanding? As such, wouldn't peace and understanding be a Christ idea?  
PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 1:48 pm
divineseraph Wrote:
Phantomboy411 Wrote:
a one world religion is an antichrist idea, and prayerfully that will not happen for a while, b/c when it does, it means the ultimate evil is now in charge of this world. islam, christianity, and judaism are not the same, and may say they worship the same god, but my bible says God is not a human being, and he will not lie.
He is not a human, and he does not change his mind.
(The Everyday Bible : New Century Version. Nashville, TN. : Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005, S. Nu 23:19)

yet, all three religions belief God says something different, and therefore, not all can be true. i believe that christianity is the one true religion, and i have many times seen it manifest in my life and the life of those around me. say what you want, believe what you may, but i will be taken up on the cloud when Jesus returns, and i pray that you will be there with me.


Antichrist? Wasn't CHRIST for peace and understanding? As such, wouldn't peace and understanding be a Christ idea?
Well it could be an Anti-Christ idea in the sense of you unite the world under one religion, and while it gives peace to a point it will still cause discontent and tear everything apart form the inside and if the Anti-Christ is real then he would want something like that. A general sens eof complacency and peace but also whoever founded it could be considered God themselves or something and start to try and rule and you have the defectors who fight the one world religiona nd htose hwo follow and BAM the End of the World. I hope y'all can follow that, I'm running offf nothing but red bull.  

Ricette

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divineseraph

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 8:40 am
Ricette Wrote:
divineseraph Wrote:
Phantomboy411 Wrote:
a one world religion is an antichrist idea, and prayerfully that will not happen for a while, b/c when it does, it means the ultimate evil is now in charge of this world. islam, christianity, and judaism are not the same, and may say they worship the same god, but my bible says God is not a human being, and he will not lie.
He is not a human, and he does not change his mind.
(The Everyday Bible : New Century Version. Nashville, TN. : Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005, S. Nu 23:19)

yet, all three religions belief God says something different, and therefore, not all can be true. i believe that christianity is the one true religion, and i have many times seen it manifest in my life and the life of those around me. say what you want, believe what you may, but i will be taken up on the cloud when Jesus returns, and i pray that you will be there with me.


Antichrist? Wasn't CHRIST for peace and understanding? As such, wouldn't peace and understanding be a Christ idea?
Well it could be an Anti-Christ idea in the sense of you unite the world under one religion, and while it gives peace to a point it will still cause discontent and tear everything apart form the inside and if the Anti-Christ is real then he would want something like that. A general sens eof complacency and peace but also whoever founded it could be considered God themselves or something and start to try and rule and you have the defectors who fight the one world religiona nd htose hwo follow and BAM the End of the World. I hope y'all can follow that, I'm running offf nothing but red bull.


That's quite the slippery slope. You would have to assume that not only would the religions unite, but if they did, one person would claim to do it, and then also claim to be God, and then also cause discourse through nefarious deeds.

Besides, the argument isn't "If the world unites because the antichrist is going to secretly cause chaos after the fact", it's just "If the world unites".  
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