Actual Passive Abilities: NOW WITH UPDATE!!!

[Valheita]

DeathWyrmNexus

Since I am not the one dictating stats, I can't make that call.

My best guess would be 50, 100, and then 200 for weak, average, and major. All things considered it isn't that hard of a decision. Hell, I wouldn't consider milling the orbs until Bassken anyway. Orbs are basically like candy at Halloween right now and these bonuses would be something to affect all your rings.

It adds complexity but it is complexity you can avoid. Those who just want to keep it simple can ignore it entirely or just spend on the little bonuses they want.

So about the same as levelling a full ring?

Hmm. I dunno. Something feels off about doing them equippable still. I know, my suggestion in part, but something doesn't feel right.

[DeathWyrmNexus]

Valheita

DeathWyrmNexus

Since I am not the one dictating stats, I can't make that call.

My best guess would be 50, 100, and then 200 for weak, average, and major. All things considered it isn't that hard of a decision. Hell, I wouldn't consider milling the orbs until Bassken anyway. Orbs are basically like candy at Halloween right now and these bonuses would be something to affect all your rings.

It adds complexity but it is complexity you can avoid. Those who just want to keep it simple can ignore it entirely or just spend on the little bonuses they want.

So about the same as levelling a full ring?

Hmm. I dunno. Something feels off about doing them equippable still. I know, my suggestion in part, but something doesn't feel right.

Well, think of it this way. You could buy the basic luck and then get more orbs to upgrade your rings and abilities. Or you could just use Angel. Essentially the idea is to you in control of your Ghi abilities and give you something else to shoot for on the side.

[Hell_Tutor]

Valheita

DeathWyrmNexus

Correction: Mad Oracle...

That is a good idea since it would need to be explained. I haven't done a new account in forever, is Ghi even explained now?

Not sure. I don't believe it's gone into in any great detail.

No they don't.
They focus mostly to intro the basic mechanics.

Also, I loled at your signature.

[Valheita]

I'd say that with the possible lone exception of Luck, that'd be a mainly post-endgame boost.

Oh, and I had an idea last night which I'd like to just throw out there. What if the Ghi abilities were fueled not with orbs, but with rings? Just a thought.

[DeathWyrmNexus]

Valheita

I'd say that with the possible lone exception of Luck, that'd be a mainly post-endgame boost.

Oh, and I had an idea last night which I'd like to just throw out there. What if the Ghi abilities were fueled not with orbs, but with rings? Just a thought.

No, it wouldn't be mainly a post game boost... There is plenty of value to getting extra hit points or accuracy or any other stat before you reach the end of the game.

And also no, feeding it rings would stifle new player ring choices. Feeding it rings would make it more of an endgame thing since endgamers are the ones with less use for spare rings.

[Valheita]

Really? I was under the impression you get heaps of duplicates right through the game, hence the flood of "Y CAN'T I UNSOULBOUND"

But sure. *shrugs*

[DeathWyrmNexus]

Valheita

Really? I was under the impression you get heaps of duplicates right through the game, hence the flood of "Y CAN'T I UNSOULBOUND"

But sure. *shrugs*

Ah but eating the rings would give you orbs to level up faster. Besides, those who are making those threads tend to be people looking for a quick buck when there isn't one and then making threads about how the game is too hard...

[Good as in Awesome]

I agree that right now Ghi is the weakest part of the game.

Players like to think about their skills and abilities, and to feel that they have a unique character.

To think about their Ghi, they have to 1) understand it, 2) be able to make decisions about it that impact their character design.

I disagree that orbs should be invested. New players should not have an option of retarding their growth by investing in orbs Ghi.

I feel that each level of each of the Ghi buffs should be constructed from items/ or awarded along with accomplishments. If they were constructed like items, then a player would be encouraged to farm certain enemies in each area depending on the buff they were working on. It would make drops more meaningful and would encourage players to play in all areas.

Alternatively they could be tied to achievements, such as badges. This would give a more tangible meaning to those achievements.

Either way, I think that 1) Players need to actively earn Ghi (not passively), 2) They need to be able to choose how to level it up (even if it ends up in the same place once capped), and 3) that it shouldn't be tied to investing orbs.

[DeathWyrmNexus]

1. Give my regards to the missus. She did some great art for me a while back.

2. This line has a problem.
"New players should not have an option of retarding their growth by investing in orbs Ghi."

Ghi is a form of growth, orbs are a currency that is infinite and gained through work/luck. Using orbs is the most intuitive way to grow in this game. My idea simply allows them more avenues of control over that growth.

The farming you speak of could just be as easily used to get more orbs. With Orb spills and scaling orb drops in the game, I don't see the problem with getting a constant and permanent boost from the orbs. If anything, it would slow down players but also provoke them to make decision to think ahead thus making better endgamers.

As it stands, there are a lot of endgamers with minor ghi buffs who are functioning just fine. If they don't want to invest in their ghi buffs, they don't have to. Using orbs allows for flexibility in farming as opposed to forcing players to mill specific enemies. While you could make the counter argument that using orbs would force the same milling, orbs are simply a function of drops so you can choose how you get them and you get them simply by playing as opposed to having to play a certain way.

Besides, badge farming can be done at CL 10 with no risk and while I oppose that being changed, I don't think it should have a reward besides a kill count. We already have enough forced suppression. Granted this is a stretch of what you are saying but it was the first counterargument I could think of so I wanted to address it before it came up.

[Valheita]

DeathWyrmNexus

Valheita

Really? I was under the impression you get heaps of duplicates right through the game, hence the flood of "Y CAN'T I UNSOULBOUND"

But sure. *shrugs*

Ah but eating the rings would give you orbs to level up faster. Besides, those who are making those threads tend to be people looking for a quick buck when there isn't one and then making threads about how the game is too hard...

*shrugs*

I don't see the issue myself. It just means that TCL will be more meaningful (since salvaging is less common) and that there'll be less problems with spare rings lying around should a certain journal post go through.

Did I mention you'd still be able to use orbs to level up your rings to in turn level up the Ghi? I figured it could be the C.L. of the ring that counts. :3

But anyway. Guess you don't like it.

[Good as in Awesome]

DeathWyrmNexus

Heavily Edited to get the points I wish to address:

1. Give my regards to the missus. She did some great art for me a while back.

2. This line has a problem.
"New players should not have an option of retarding their growth by investing in orbs Ghi."
...
The farming you speak of could just be as easily used to get more orbs.

...

1) She's not the missus yet, but we're working on it. <3 I'll tell her you said Hi!

One of the purposes of Ghi, as I understand is to give the player a game-effect reward for playing a million hours of zOMG. So, if they cost orbs, they would have to cost zillions of orbs. Take this account for instance, I still haven't earned a major Ghi buff, but I have thousands of orbs lying around like a big pile of radioactive grapes. Presumably, in your world, I would have spent all of those to have my current level of Ghi. So Ghi would be very, very, very expensive.

It would be so expensive (if it was going to take as long to charge up) that the 'correct' decision for leveling up would be to put all orbs into rings. It would always be a faster way to improve.

So the most logical way to play the game would be to wait of on buffs (at least the larger ones) until cl10, then start putting orbs into Ghi.

However, some of the new/poor players, (who need all the help that they can get,) may choose to invest their orbs in Ghi with the rational: "I don't know what rings I like, but Ghi will be useful no matter what I choose."

Those players wouldn't level up. What you'd create is a dead end in the game.

***The reason that using loot or another resource is different, is that it doesn't compete with ring-level up. It happens in parallel, just like Ghi right now.

I do agree with you that 1) Ghi earning needs to be an active thing with decision-making involved and 2) That it shouldn't be linked to kill badges. (I don't see why they couldn't be linked to new badges designed just for this, but kill badges are out.)

You make a very good point that badges are linked to CL and it is certainly silly to have to wait till CL 10 to start using Ghi. However, your orb-based system has the same problem essentially. Either the buffs are easy to get or they should be held off on until the player reaches CL10.

[DeathWyrmNexus]

Actually, it wouldn't be a dead end. It is simply a choice. It also wouldn't need to be millions of orbs either. You haven't gotten your Major Ghi buffs because you haven't played in crews with your Ghi meter full. That is a function of your style, not your time spent. I was gunning for Major Luck for a long time so I figured out how Ghi improved as soon as I could. I realized that you get Ghi by using Ghi in groups.

I don't have all my Majors but I only lack Dodge and Accuracy, having the rest. This is because I've all but stopped playing the game and when I do play, I play in crews with as much Ghi as possible.

My method would allow you and I control over the matter. Let alone the fact that I would intend for each stat to have its improvements, including weight and speed, as well as go with the whole special abilities for specialization.

So no, it isn't a dead end. It is a way for you to control your leveling.

[XPrincexVince]

what were the n00bs for?

[Good as in Awesome]

DeathWyrmNexus

Actually, it wouldn't be a dead end. It is simply a choice. It also wouldn't need to be millions of orbs either. You haven't gotten your Major Ghi buffs because you haven't played in crews with your Ghi meter full. That is a function of your style, not your time spent. I was gunning for Major Luck for a long time so I figured out how Ghi improved as soon as I could. I realized that you get Ghi by using Ghi in groups.

I don't have all my Majors but I only lack Dodge and Accuracy, having the rest. This is because I've all but stopped playing the game and when I do play, I play in crews with as much Ghi as possible.

My method would allow you and I control over the matter. Let alone the fact that I would intend for each stat to have its improvements, including weight and speed, as well as go with the whole special abilities for specialization.

So no, it isn't a dead end. It is a way for you to control your leveling.

If it had a high price it would be a dead end, if it had a low price obviously it wouldn't, but then it would be easy to get. It's one or the other, right?

But what I don't understand is what is the benefit of mixing ring level up with Ghi level up? How is that in any way superior to having a separate Ghi system?

[DeathWyrmNexus]

Good as in Awesome

DeathWyrmNexus

Actually, it wouldn't be a dead end. It is simply a choice. It also wouldn't need to be millions of orbs either. You haven't gotten your Major Ghi buffs because you haven't played in crews with your Ghi meter full. That is a function of your style, not your time spent. I was gunning for Major Luck for a long time so I figured out how Ghi improved as soon as I could. I realized that you get Ghi by using Ghi in groups.

I don't have all my Majors but I only lack Dodge and Accuracy, having the rest. This is because I've all but stopped playing the game and when I do play, I play in crews with as much Ghi as possible.

My method would allow you and I control over the matter. Let alone the fact that I would intend for each stat to have its improvements, including weight and speed, as well as go with the whole special abilities for specialization.

So no, it isn't a dead end. It is a way for you to control your leveling.

If it had a high price it would be a dead end, if it had a low price obviously it wouldn't, but then it would be easy to get. It's one or the other, right?

But what I don't understand is what is the benefit of mixing ring level up with Ghi level up? How is that in any way superior to having a separate Ghi system?

It takes a resource that is already abundant and soulbound and gives you more to do with them instead of having to create yet another soulbound and abundant resource simply for the sake of using this Ghi system.

And actually you can use the basic cost of leveling up a ring to level up Ghi. The point is that one is equipable and one is actually passive and constantly in use, special abilities aside. It is a bridge between rings and Ghi, using the same currency is the most intuitive way since orbs are the basic source of your power. It continues to be the source of your power and thus removes the need to code another power source on top of a new leveling system.

Why make a redundant currency when you already have an abundant and easily obtained one in hand? Why not simply use what works perfectly already and just allow the player more freedom and choice with it?

I don't see the point of a redundant currency.