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Rotsab M. Hyolf's avatar

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Walt was always angry that Peter came off as a d**k. It was only after Walt died that they made a sequel. I don't think it really fixed much, but at least he didn't think drowning someone was funny.


That's disappointing; Peter being a d**k was always the point, no? Same with Tinkerbell. He was a kid with no sense of consequence, which was what him doing mean things was meant to show. Tinkerbell they handwaved with 'she's so small she only has one emotion at any given time.'

I_Write_Ivre
Rotsab M. Hyolf
Also, to everyone arguing anime/manga use more sympathetic villains; Dio, Kira, and Herr Major. By all means, justify a monologue about the desire for an endless war where everyone dies horrible, brutal deaths.


Who are they? I'm curious.


Dio is a guy who gave up his humanity to become a vampire. He doesn't just kill people, he tortures them ruthlessly. He kills a small dog (puts it in a box, then in the furnace) just to get at its owner, chops another guy's legs off, and kills a number of innocent bystanders to get at an enemy. He's cruel and mean and you wouldn't want to run into him in an alleyway. (Wikipedia is trying to say he's 'reasonable,' but that is complete bull. He gets off on torturing people and does it constantly throughout the series.) The series is constantly hitting you over the head with 'this is a very mean, cruel guy.'

Kira is obsessed with ladies' hands. He goes around with a brown paper bag that he keeps the hands in, and then he'll molest sandwiches with it and lick the fingers and stuff. When the hand starts to rot he goes, seduces a nice lady, then kills her and chops off her hand to bring around with him. He also kills a young boy who catches on, and attempts to kill a few other kids as well.

Herr Major is... Herr Major. xD He's obsessed with initiating World War 3 so that he can see people die in horrible, agonizing ways. He gives a very long monologue about how it gets his rocks off to see tanks rolling over women and children, bombs dropping on boys screaming for their moms, so on. He's a very, very sick guy.
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I_Write_Ivre
Isn't a story supposed to be well told and the structure to depend on how best to tell it? It thought concision was a good thing.


My statement was general and inclusive.

I don't know exactly where this differs from my point in the statement you quoted since I said how you tell the story and how exciting (or how you structure it so it flows) is what is important.
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Space Uppercut
I_Write_Ivre
Isn't a story supposed to be well told and the structure to depend on how best to tell it? It thought concision was a good thing.


My statement was general and inclusive.

I don't know exactly where this differs from my point in the statement you quoted since I said how you tell the story and how exciting (or how you structure it so it flows) is what is important.


Ah, my bad. Sorry I misunderstood. Seemed like you were against this.

Rotsab M. Hyolf
[


At least the characters have 'want to have fun' as their motivations. gonk

There's good anime, but I doubt those are from it (how do those fetishes contribute to the story? Actually, don't answer that, I want to eat today.) They sound like they're from that anthology of 'best American short stories' I read where it was 'sex, death, sex, death, sex death, cannibalism and sex, ********'. Or examples of why I wanted to quit college.
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Ah, my bad. Sorry I misunderstood. Seemed like you were against this.



No worries, my bad. My wording was stupid. >.<
Rotsab M. Hyolf's avatar

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At least the characters have 'want to have fun' as their motivations. gonk

There's good anime, but I doubt those are from it (how do those fetishes contribute to the story? Actually, don't answer that, I want to eat today.) They sound like they're from that anthology of 'best American short stories' I read where it was 'sex, death, sex, death, sex death, cannibalism and sex, ********'. Or examples of why I wanted to quit college.


It's actually handled really well. As the conversation has indicated, it's less about your villains and more about your story and how you develop it. Dio is very loving of his followers, Kira is somehow sympathetic when he isn't killing everything (he really struggles with the need to kill women; it makes more sense in the manga, haha) and Herr Major... well, Herr Major doesn't have any redeeming qualities, but he's a lot like Joffery from Game of Thrones in that he initiates so much plotwise and is so funny that you 'love to hate him,' as it were.

My point being, I guess, that (most) Disney villains have certain aspects to their personality that make them more human, depending on how you look. The most obvious traits are hate/greed/revenge, just like with the three I've mentioned, but there are moments where it isn't as atrocious. Take Gaston's loyalty to that random guy who always follows him around; Captain Hook desperately wants a mother.

Actually, Captain Hook is an interesting one because the guy who wrote Peter Pan (Barrie?) liked Hook the most. He considered him a 'well-learned' and 'handsome' man, and often talked about him in a positive light.
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For many shows and other light material, and sometimes books, it is easier for the reader to like the book if everything is black and white, even if they root for the villain's side. Otherwise, they often feel lost and have nothing to grab on to. I'm too lazy to elaborate.

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