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Malevolent Shapeshifter

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Maltese_Falcon91
Tsuki Z
It's on wattpad, and so far, it seems to be going fine. No nasty pm's about it.

That seems promising. Do you know how many readers you've got so far?
80 reads emo

Tsuki Z
However, in this story, since I'm focussing more on magic and scholars, I did add on a bit; for example my friend was curious to know why I took the time to write that there are street lamps lit with candles.
I had to explain to her that in those times, there were no such thing. And even then, I got a funny look.

... Street lamps lit with candles? Um, yeah in Medieval times those were a thing. The concept of street lights dates back to the Greek and Roman civilizations.

The documentary I saw, wasn't the more advanced Greek or Roman empire. Rather, I think it was Britain back in the day.

Malevolent Shapeshifter

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Lazarus Larkin
lppurplegirl11
Dandelion Wine by Ray Bradbury had the most adorable chapter about a young man who fell in love with a very old woman crying A lot of the other kids in my class ( I was a freshman at the time) thought it was gross. But I thought it was lovely.

Anyway, I don't care about age gaps really. The only time I think an age gap is too much is if one of the people is younger than 16 and the other is much older, depending on the setting.


Oh my GOD that chapter. I re-read that book a couple of years ago (I'd read it in high school as well) and was just bawling my eyes out at it. Definitely a good example of a huge age gap romance done REALLY WELL. But the age difference was totally addressed in that story as well, which I think makes a big difference.

Personally, I don't necessarily mind age gaps as long as the gap is acknowledged, and both parties are adults. There are so many other issues that can come into play regarding imbalance in a relationships and age is just one of them.


That's it, I need to track down that book.

Salty Pirate

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Tsuki Z
Lazarus Larkin
lppurplegirl11
Dandelion Wine by Ray Bradbury had the most adorable chapter about a young man who fell in love with a very old woman crying A lot of the other kids in my class ( I was a freshman at the time) thought it was gross. But I thought it was lovely.

Anyway, I don't care about age gaps really. The only time I think an age gap is too much is if one of the people is younger than 16 and the other is much older, depending on the setting.


Oh my GOD that chapter. I re-read that book a couple of years ago (I'd read it in high school as well) and was just bawling my eyes out at it. Definitely a good example of a huge age gap romance done REALLY WELL. But the age difference was totally addressed in that story as well, which I think makes a big difference.

Personally, I don't necessarily mind age gaps as long as the gap is acknowledged, and both parties are adults. There are so many other issues that can come into play regarding imbalance in a relationships and age is just one of them.


That's it, I need to track down that book.


It's by Ray Bradbury and shouldn't be too hard to find; libraries generally have a decent selection of his books. It's really a wonderful book, beautiful writing. But kind of depressing XD

Malevolent Shapeshifter

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Lazarus Larkin
Tsuki Z
Lazarus Larkin
lppurplegirl11
Dandelion Wine by Ray Bradbury had the most adorable chapter about a young man who fell in love with a very old woman crying A lot of the other kids in my class ( I was a freshman at the time) thought it was gross. But I thought it was lovely.

Anyway, I don't care about age gaps really. The only time I think an age gap is too much is if one of the people is younger than 16 and the other is much older, depending on the setting.


Oh my GOD that chapter. I re-read that book a couple of years ago (I'd read it in high school as well) and was just bawling my eyes out at it. Definitely a good example of a huge age gap romance done REALLY WELL. But the age difference was totally addressed in that story as well, which I think makes a big difference.

Personally, I don't necessarily mind age gaps as long as the gap is acknowledged, and both parties are adults. There are so many other issues that can come into play regarding imbalance in a relationships and age is just one of them.


That's it, I need to track down that book.


It's by Ray Bradbury and shouldn't be too hard to find; libraries generally have a decent selection of his books. It's really a wonderful book, beautiful writing. But kind of depressing XD

Not my town library. My country is always pushing reading as a hobby, but they aren't very good on how they go around it. I can really confidently say, my house has more books than the town library since all of us are mad about reading.
Tsuki Z
The documentary I saw, wasn't the more advanced Greek or Roman empire. Rather, I think it was Britain back in the day.

Greece and Rome might have been more advanced than the relatively barbaric Britannia back in the day, but it's not like when those Empires collapsed the complex secret of putting a candle on a post was lost forever.
From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Street_lights
The earliest lamps were used by Greek and Roman civilizations, where light primarily served the purpose of security, both to protect the wanderer from tripping over something on the path as well as keeping the potential robbers at bay. At that time oil lamps were used predominantly as they provided a long-lasting and moderate flame. The Romans had a word 'laternarius', which was a term for a slave responsible for lighting up the oil lamps in front of their villas. This task continued to be kept for a special person as far as up to Middle Ages where the so-called 'link boys' escorted people from one place to another through the murky winding streets of medieval towns.

Malevolent Shapeshifter

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Maltese_Falcon91
Tsuki Z
The documentary I saw, wasn't the more advanced Greek or Roman empire. Rather, I think it was Britain back in the day.

Greece and Rome might have been more advanced than the relatively barbaric Britannia back in the day, but it's not like when those Empires collapsed the complex secret of putting a candle on a post was lost forever.
From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Street_lights
The earliest lamps were used by Greek and Roman civilizations, where light primarily served the purpose of security, both to protect the wanderer from tripping over something on the path as well as keeping the potential robbers at bay. At that time oil lamps were used predominantly as they provided a long-lasting and moderate flame. The Romans had a word 'laternarius', which was a term for a slave responsible for lighting up the oil lamps in front of their villas. This task continued to be kept for a special person as far as up to Middle Ages where the so-called 'link boys' escorted people from one place to another through the murky winding streets of medieval towns.

Thank you for the link!
And I know, but we're talking about people who cured insanity by drilling a hole into the patient's head to let out the 'demon' causing it.
Tsuki Z
Thank you for the link!

No problem. The page also mentions the Caliphate had developed "ignition devices that would automatically strike the flame when the gas supply was activated." That might be interesting, especially if you're focusing on medieval scholars.
Tsuki Z
And I know, but we're talking about people who cured insanity by drilling a hole into the patient's head to let out the 'demon' causing it.

What? It's the quickest way to cure it.

Malevolent Shapeshifter

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Maltese_Falcon91
Tsuki Z
Thank you for the link!

No problem. The page also mentions the Caliphate had developed "ignition devices that would automatically strike the flame when the gas supply was activated." That might be interesting, especially if you're focusing on medieval scholars.
Tsuki Z
And I know, but we're talking about people who cured insanity by drilling a hole into the patient's head to let out the 'demon' causing it.

What? It's the quickest way to cure it.

I can imagine. He's certainly quieter after the first session with the doctors. I never really did much research using wikipedia because their info can be edited by anyone and everyone. But still, it looks legit. blaugh

Shy Fatcat

In today's society, we see women who are in their twenties date a man in their sixties and to be honest, it does creep me out. However, in a book, whose setting I know is in medieval times, I find that acceptable. Don't ask me why, but I would find it...I can understand it, I guess. The way you have explained the relationship, it is as if, she is the same age as him, but has the body of a fourteen year old. If, however, she was an immature, innocent and childlike fourteen year old and he was a wise old man, it would then creep me out.

Long explanation short, I say go for it.

Unbeatable Friend

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Tsuki Z
Quite recently, I wrote a medieval fantasy story where the main character, who is a girl and a young genius, enters a romantic relationship with her mentor who is more than 20 years her senior.
The reason behind this was because after considering another couple of characters, he suited her the best, allowing me to add a bit more conflict in the story and also giving her someone who is mentally capable of keeping up with her. I also did some research and found it wasn't exactly out of the ordinary for that time period for a woman as young as fourteen to be matched with a man who is so much older.
However, my friends who are my critics, really, really hated it because they said it was "icky".
I'm planning to write a new story that is more modern focussing on the relationship between a young woman and an older man, but I'm wondering if it's really so unacceptable. Or if my friends are just being prigs.


I get kind of squicked by huge age gaps, too, to be honest. But less so when the younger person is above the age of consent (which, where I live, is sixteen). If it were a fifteen year old and a thirty five year old, it would freak me out a bit.

However, each to their own. I wouldn't put a book down based solely on an arbitrary age gap, provided that the younger of the pair is capable of making an informed choice to be in the relationship, and isn't somehow being manipulated or groomed.

I write age gap relationships sometimes, but usually the youngest is sixteen at least and the gap is less than ten years. Maybe I'm prudish, I dunno.

From what I can gather, I don't see any issue. Your friends really might just be a bit intolerant of age gaps, but it's your call in the end, so just do what you believe suits your plot best.

Shirtless Wench

el hombre luchadore
i would advise that the younger character be at least 18.

Don't do that, really don't do that.

Léon features a twelve-year-old falling in love with a forty-something assassin. And there's plenty other examples, too.

If the younger character must be a certain age (say 13 or 14) for the story to work, then they must be of that age.
What you're suggesting - a minimum age - is not only potentially detrimental to our OP's story, but it proves you're not that much better than her friends.

Keep the story in mind above all else - squeamishness has no place in writing or romance. Legality is out the window, too (except in real life romance - you kinda want it, then).

Malevolent Shapeshifter

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RADI0 Mouse
el hombre luchadore
i would advise that the younger character be at least 18.

Don't do that, really don't do that.

Léon features a twelve-year-old falling in love with a forty-something assassin. And there's plenty other examples, too.

If the younger character must be a certain age (say 13 or 14) for the story to work, then they must be of that age.
What you're suggesting - a minimum age - is not only potentially detrimental to our OP's story, but it proves you're not that much better than her friends.

Keep the story in mind above all else - squeamishness has no place in writing or romance. Legality is out the window, too (except in real life romance - you kinda want it, then).

If it's the medieval time period, I wouldn't mind working with someone as young as 13. But in the more modern setting, I'd rather not. I'd like the girl at least to be at the age where she could be expected to think in a more mature manner.

Angel_Shadows's Partner

Anxious Noob

It seems like there's some insinuation in this thread that if someone has a different opinion about age gaps in relationships, then that someone is a prig. But I disagree: what's wrong with having a differing opinion, as long as that opinion was subject to contemplation by the person who has it? If one isn't willing to accept and consider an opinion that is different than their own, then one is just as bad as a prig. Not everyone has the same thought process after all. We're human, and those of us who think about what we believe don't always think alike. If we want to be taken seriously, we need to learn how to respect and accept that reality.

Saying that, I've always thought of prigs as people who are zealous towards their own concept of propriety without questioning it. Perhaps they don't question it because they feel like it's too perfect to critique; maybe they don't because while they fight to express it so much, they rarely think about what it actually means to them and to others. Those kinds of people are prigs.

As for your friends, OP, they don't really sound like prigs to me. They just sound like they haven't had a real chance to question why they think your pairing is acceptable or not. Perhaps, in that case, you could write your pairing in a way that causes your readers to really consider how well they work together (emphasize more on their personalities and interactions maybe). Put your readers in a position that gives them the chance to contemplate and consider their own ideas of love and relationships.

I like large age gaps in relationships when reading a story, but only when it's realistic. I have this big issue where I see some writers not consider the flaws of two lovers with substantially different ages. There's going to be conflict, one way or another, where there's a big difference in age. It always happens at some level. So in my opinion, age is sometimes just a number, but most of the time, it really isn't.

Another thing: it's important to remember the kind of readers we have today. A lot of them have a different concept of childhood in comparison to people in the past. Most people's concepts of childhood now of days is that a child matures slower than they used to years and years ago. Our childhood lasts longer today, and as a result, a lot of people wouldn't find it appropriate for people under legal age (or even just around legal age) to be lovers to people who are much older. It doesn't fit into general concepts of what's acceptable in many modern societies. Not saying anything is wrong with the standards we have today, but I'm just making a point.

But that's how society works: ideas of values change over time. They even oscillate. But as writers, we have to learn how to be critical and objective so we don't allow ourselves to fall victim to propriety within our writing, be it fiction or non-fiction. If we do that, then we can encourage our readers to critically think outside of the box, too. It's not about trying to change people's minds; leave that decision to them. It's about inspiring people to think beyond what they've known, to help them create opinions. If you can do that, then I'd say you've accomplished what a lot of writers struggle with. So write about your pairing if it's what you want, but always keep in mind your potential readers. You don't always have to please them, but if you want readers, you have to be somewhat adaptable.

tl:dr
Don't judge your readers so hastily. Give them a chance to form their own opinion through your story, even if it still disagrees with your own; not everyone is going to agree with you, and as a writer, you'll have to get used to that a lot and accept it for what it is. Keep in mind modern concepts of childhood and maturity, and always work to inspire your readers to think outside of the box.

PS: have a link to your story? ♥ I don't know if you've posted or anything in this thread (I looked but couldn't find anything, though I could've missed it). I'd like to read it when I get the chance.

Malevolent Shapeshifter

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ca adam
It seems like there's some insinuation in this thread that if someone has a different opinion about age gaps in relationships, then that someone is a prig. But I disagree: what's wrong with having a differing opinion, as long as that opinion was subject to contemplation by the person who has it? If one isn't willing to accept and consider an opinion that is different than their own, then one is just as bad as a prig. Not everyone has the same thought process after all. We're human, and those of us who think about what we believe don't always think alike. If we want to be taken seriously, we need to learn how to respect and accept that reality.

Saying that, I've always thought of prigs as people who are zealous towards their own concept of propriety without questioning it. Perhaps they don't question it because they feel like it's too perfect to critique; maybe they don't because while they fight to express it so much, they rarely think about what it actually means to them and to others. Those kinds of people are prigs.

As for your friends, OP, they don't really sound like prigs to me. They just sound like they haven't had a real chance to question why they think your pairing is acceptable or not. Perhaps, in that case, you could write your pairing in a way that causes your readers to really consider how well they work together (emphasize more on their personalities and interactions maybe). Put your readers in a position that gives them the chance to contemplate and consider their own ideas of love and relationships.

I like large age gaps in relationships when reading a story, but only when it's realistic. I have this big issue where I see some writers not consider the flaws of two lovers with substantially different ages. There's going to be conflict, one way or another, where there's a big difference in age. It always happens at some level. So in my opinion, age is sometimes just a number, but most of the time, it really isn't.

Another thing: it's important to remember the kind of readers we have today. A lot of them have a different concept of childhood in comparison to people in the past. Most people's concepts of childhood now of days is that a child matures slower than they used to years and years ago. Our childhood lasts longer today, and as a result, a lot of people wouldn't find it appropriate for people under legal age (or even just around legal age) to be lovers to people who are much older. It doesn't fit into general concepts of what's acceptable in many modern societies. Not saying anything is wrong with the standards we have today, but I'm just making a point.

But that's how society works: ideas of values change over time. They even oscillate. But as writers, we have to learn how to be critical and objective so we don't allow ourselves to fall victim to propriety within our writing, be it fiction or non-fiction. If we do that, then we can encourage our readers to critically think outside of the box, too. It's not about trying to change people's minds; leave that decision to them. It's about inspiring people to think beyond what they've known, to help them create opinions. If you can do that, then I'd say you've accomplished what a lot of writers struggle with. So write about your pairing if it's what you want, but always keep in mind your potential readers. You don't always have to please them, but if you want readers, you have to be somewhat adaptable.

tl:dr
Don't judge your readers so hastily. Give them a chance to form their own opinion through your story, even if it still disagrees with your own; not everyone is going to agree with you, and as a writer, you'll have to get used to that a lot and accept it for what it is. Keep in mind modern concepts of childhood and maturity, and always work to inspire your readers to think outside of the box.

PS: have a link to your story? ♥ I don't know if you've posted or anything in this thread (I looked but couldn't find anything, though I could've missed it). I'd like to read it when I get the chance.


Took me awhile to read the whole comment. It's nearly midnight here and my brain and eyes are fried.

Having a different opinion is not a problem. It's how you go around it. They scream, "EW! GROSS! YUCK!" without even bothering to listen to my reasoning behind it, I mean it's not like I'm writing a story along the lines of "Lolita." and being a bit self righteous with the way they phrase their rants.
Most of the conflicts are in part two of the story since in the first part they were in honeymoon mode.
And yeah, there's definitely a lot of difference between present and past in view of whether a woman is mature enough for marriage or relationship or not. In the first story, her aunt is constantly trying to get her married because she's 17 and still unattached. But when I use present day settings, there's rarely any pressure for it unless the girl is desperate for a boyfriend.

And the link is in my siggie. Look for Esmeralda; Beginnings. It's not that great. Really. I put up this version on Wattpad but I'm doing an entire rewrite for the iBookstore.
....
Wow, I really do suck at self promotion.

Angel_Shadows's Partner

Anxious Noob

Tsuki Z


Took me awhile to read the whole comment. It's nearly midnight here and my brain and eyes are fried.

Having a different opinion is not a problem. It's how you go around it. They scream, "EW! GROSS! YUCK!" without even bothering to listen to my reasoning behind it, I mean it's not like I'm writing a story along the lines of "Lolita." and being a bit self righteous with the way they phrase their rants.
Most of the conflicts are in part two of the story since in the first part they were in honeymoon mode.
And yeah, there's definitely a lot of difference between present and past in view of whether a woman is mature enough for marriage or relationship or not. In the first story, her aunt is constantly trying to get her married because she's 17 and still unattached. But when I use present day settings, there's rarely any pressure for it unless the girl is desperate for a boyfriend.

And the link is in my siggie. Look for Esmeralda; Beginnings. It's not that great. Really. I put up this version on Wattpad but I'm doing an entire rewrite for the iBookstore.
....
Wow, I really do suck at self promotion.

I can agree with you on how one expresses an opinion. It's what separates the considerate person from the prig.

If they weren't willing to hear you out, then that's their loss. I think the wiser choice for you is just to roll it off your shoulders and move forward. You're going to run into people who'll react that way. It is what it is.

But I'm sure if they read Twilight, the age gap issue might not even cross their minds (but then again, Edward is extremely immature for being over a century old. Going to high school for that long was not healthy). xD Well, I can't make that judgment; your friends could hate Twilight for all I know.

And all right. I'll check it out. I know what it's like to try and promote your own work, especially when it's still in its development stages. It can be hard to back it up without having some doubts, but no worries; it's just a part of becoming a writer. ♥

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