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Slayer Seven
AKB0048
Slayer Seven
While many college students search for the next party to get drunk at or find themselves too preoccupied with their academics to care about world affairs, Washington has been busy crafting the most toxic piece of legislation since President Obama came into office – Obamacare. Even though it won’t “officially” be enacted until 2014, many of Obamacare’s provisions are in effect and are already wreaking havoc on our nation. Too bad most college students are trapped in their own protective bubbles to realize that their futures are already being torn apart by government bureaucrats.

Individual Mandate

First and foremost, the provision in Obamacare calling for an individual mandate should shock and terrify college students. Beginning in 2014, this provision will force all Americans to buy “government-approved health insurance,” which will cover products and services that not all Americans will want or need. Since we live in a society where we have the ability to buy products that we want and need, why on earth would any college student approve of “healthcare reform” that limits their freedom of choice? Looks like our president’s promise allowing us to keep our own health plans will not be fulfilled.


heres the link... http://thecollegeconservative.com/2012/07/18/obamacare-medical-misery-for-americas-college-students/

Um... a lot of students need healthcare. Buying it through school is extremely expensive in most cases (my school it was $500 for two month period, and that was the cheapest plan they had).

"Freedom of choice"? You mean the freedom to be in a state of risk where if you got seriously sick or in an accident that you'd have a good chance of going broke? People don't refuse to buy health insurance because they don't want to. People don't buy it because they can't afford it. Making healthcare more affordable is a step in the right direction.
so your ganna let government decide that instead of the doctors you choose? because then it becomes an industry, and you will be shuffled through a long line to be flipped like burgers with poorly educated doctors because their pay will be reduced to minimum wage along with standards.... you know its also mandatory to be chipped with an rfid tracking device too right? srsy read the bill


Actually it's nothing like that, Obamacare still lets you choose what doctor you want.
AngelicWings24's avatar

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                        Quite honestly, I won't be able to afford college with Obama in office either.
                        Tax cuts for the working class? Please...
                        At least with Romney, there's a chance.
                        Doing the same thing over and over again,
                        but expecting a different outcome is insanity.
Marrionetta's avatar

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Did you know that colleges make more money when you default on a student loan than when you meet your payments and pay out over time? That's because loan interest rates are subsidized and if you default, the collecting bodies actually split the profit with the college. Therefore, colleges have incentives to boost prices and see more students default.

D'oh. This is what happens when educational institutions get in bed in with big lenders. >_< This needs to be stopped, and I pray Obama is the guy to do it.

Romney won that debate, but only because he's an a*****e and trampled over the moderator. Also eff that guy for wanting to kill PBS. If you kill the programs that benefit the underprivileged and educate children for free, you create slaves by circumstance - impoverished masses that lack critical thinking and are dependent on others for their thoughts and opinions as well as literally dependent on freaking welfare. Education is power, PBS educates, and in the end, the upper echelons laugh all the way to the bank if they can make more sheepole to feed their hedge funds.
AKB0048's avatar

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Slayer Seven
so your ganna let government decide that instead of the doctors you choose? because then it becomes an industry, and you will be shuffled through a long line to be flipped like burgers with poorly educated doctors because their pay will be reduced to minimum wage along with standards.... you know its also mandatory to be chipped with an rfid tracking device too right? srsy read the bill

Health insurance is already an industry. In fact, one of the highest earning industries in the US and healthcare is 4x more costly than the rest of the Western world.

And no. You should read the bill. The microchip bit is a "creation of a registry to record the serial numbers of devices implanted with patients' consent, such as pacemakers, to assist in tracking their effectiveness and in finding patients when manufacturer recalls are required."
Slayer Seven's avatar

Ruthless Pirate

szechuan86
Slayer Seven
AKB0048
Slayer Seven
While many college students search for the next party to get drunk at or find themselves too preoccupied with their academics to care about world affairs, Washington has been busy crafting the most toxic piece of legislation since President Obama came into office – Obamacare. Even though it won’t “officially” be enacted until 2014, many of Obamacare’s provisions are in effect and are already wreaking havoc on our nation. Too bad most college students are trapped in their own protective bubbles to realize that their futures are already being torn apart by government bureaucrats.

Individual Mandate

First and foremost, the provision in Obamacare calling for an individual mandate should shock and terrify college students. Beginning in 2014, this provision will force all Americans to buy “government-approved health insurance,” which will cover products and services that not all Americans will want or need. Since we live in a society where we have the ability to buy products that we want and need, why on earth would any college student approve of “healthcare reform” that limits their freedom of choice? Looks like our president’s promise allowing us to keep our own health plans will not be fulfilled.


heres the link... http://thecollegeconservative.com/2012/07/18/obamacare-medical-misery-for-americas-college-students/
for how long?Adds more patients to Medicaid. Beginning in 2014, Obamacare dumps an additional 19.6 million Americans into Medicaid. On average, Medicaid physician payments are only 56 percent of what private insurance pays. Lower payment rates already discourage doctors from accepting Medicaid beneficiaries, which has lead to access issues and hospital emergency room overcrowding. As more patients enroll in this broken program, it will place even more financial strain on physicians who treat them. Doctors will be faced with the decision to either discontinue treating Medicaid patients or accept even more patients at the lower payment rate.
Um... a lot of students need healthcare. Buying it through school is extremely expensive in most cases (my school it was $500 for two month period, and that was the cheapest plan they had).

"Freedom of choice"? You mean the freedom to be in a state of risk where if you got seriously sick or in an accident that you'd have a good chance of going broke? People don't refuse to buy health insurance because they don't want to. People don't buy it because they can't afford it. Making healthcare more affordable is a step in the right direction.
so your ganna let government decide that instead of the doctors you choose? because then it becomes an industry, and you will be shuffled through a long line to be flipped like burgers with poorly educated doctors because their pay will be reduced to minimum wage along with standards.... you know its also mandatory to be chipped with an rfid tracking device too right? srsy read the bill


Actually it's nothing like that, Obamacare still lets you choose what doctor you want.
Slayer Seven's avatar

Ruthless Pirate

AKB0048
Slayer Seven
so your ganna let government decide that instead of the doctors you choose? because then it becomes an industry, and you will be shuffled through a long line to be flipped like burgers with poorly educated doctors because their pay will be reduced to minimum wage along with standards.... you know its also mandatory to be chipped with an rfid tracking device too right? srsy read the bill

Health insurance is already an industry. In fact, one of the highest earning industries in the US and healthcare is 4x more costly than the rest of the Western world.

And no. You should read the bill. The microchip bit is a "creation of a registry to record the serial numbers of devices implanted with patients' consent, such as pacemakers, to assist in tracking their effectiveness and in finding patients when manufacturer recalls are required."
and which category do you feel they will file you under...
class 1, 2 or 3?
ZaedKai
Squ33ze M3



Oh yeah, I completely forgot about that fact. I've learned this before in some history classes and political science, but I suppose it slipped my mind. Thanks for adding that in, I completely agree with you with the natural evolution of our economy.

Although, taxing the wealthy solution has been implied by many, I'm quite sure there are more solutions out there to consider. It seems whenever this solution is brought up, it just causes a much more heated argument and debate among many.


Honestly, this is where the more interesting political debates happen. It's such a complicated issue because if you tax wealthy americans, you risk taxing them too much. (Many wealthy americans are business owners, so they'd pay the personal taxes and the corporate taxes) and that could lead, depending on the extent of the taxing, to job loss, and that's not really something we could afford in our current economy.

The big problem is the super wealthy. No one in the world needs more than a billion dollars to live (I can probably subsist for the rest of my life off that amount), and yet, you can't say the people who are billionaires didn't earn it. It's not moral for governments to ask billionares to fork over half their money, and that directly contradicts the American dream. It's such a tricky issue to figure out.

The thing I take hope in is the pledge a bunch of extremely wealthy people have signed recently, promising half their fortunes to charity upon their deaths. It just shows that not all rich people are evil.



Yeah, taxation is a very interesting topic and it requires a lot of thought in my opinion. I mean, you can't pass a law or an act, without angering a few people along the way. If you tax someone too high, they let workers go and/or lower the wages to maintain a balance or a steady income for the business owners. [This has happened in the past during the development of our country, especially when it involved immigration. I've read so many primary source documents on these issues.] After all, many people think of their interests first, than of others'. So the candidates are placed in a very rough position on what they propose for their solutions, after all, most of the time they can only please one side while trying not anger so much the other. Topics like these have always been dangerous yet interesting to debate/speak about.

As for the super wealthy, I completely agree with you on this notion. You don't need so much money to live by, but most of these billionaires have earned their wealth. Unfortunately, there are those that didn't, who come from old wealthy families. Some just take advantage of their heritage passed down to them. It's seeing and hearing from these people that just makes me sad. Although, I am quite happy knowing that there is some wealthy people/families willing to donate some of their money to charity.
Malthusian Devil's avatar

Quotable Noob

Marrionetta
Did you know that colleges make more money when you default on a student loan than when you meet your payments and pay out over time? That's because loan interest rates are subsidized and if you default, the collecting bodies actually split the profit with the college. Therefore, colleges have incentives to boost prices and see more students default.

D'oh. This is what happens when educational institutions get in bed in with big lenders. >_< This needs to be stopped, and I pray Obama is the guy to do it.

Romney won that debate, but only because he's an a*****e and trampled over the moderator. Also eff that guy for wanting to kill PBS. If you kill the programs that benefit the underprivileged and educate children for free, you create slaves by circumstance - impoverished masses that lack critical thinking and are dependent on others for their thoughts and opinions as well as literally dependent on freaking welfare. Education is power, PBS educates, and in the end, the upper echelons laugh all the way to the bank if they can make more sheepole to feed their hedge funds.
I'm pretty sure you're getting Rebulican rationale all wrong. He doesn't want to kill PBS to do away with programs that educate, he just recognizes the successful ability for the private sector to have those programs. Government has no need to be giving money to TV broadcast or radio stations.

The appropriate argument would be, why cite cutting spending from PBS which is a pittance and wouldn't really affect our budget at all. But, of course, Republicans are assholes and evil.
AKB0048
MinnieMay
No one is paying for me to go I don't go right now. I am not talking about grade school or some public facilities. I am talking about the person that said yes I want to go for Art then find out they have no job for it at all. Some women's studies major that finds out the only job is teaching women's studies. Should I feel bad that you have to pay all of that back? Do I have to tell people to look for something that will get you a job in the end and not a pretty piece of paper that no one cares about.

But people did pay for you to go. And people are you still paying for you now. Do you like having clean water? Someone else paid for that. Do you like not having rats in your food? Someone else paid for that. Do you like public transportation or freeways? Someone else paid for that.

Also, technical fields are overly saturated anyway. It's easy to say "get a major that'll get you paid", but there's pretty much no major that will guarantee you a good job unless you have good networking. I know plenty of people who got Bio or Chem degrees that had to go back to school and major in something else because there's no jobs in those fields either.


What dose that have to do with the person that just spent 6 years in school and have nothing to show for it now? When it's you that walks in to the community college. When it's you sign all the paper work and you say this is what I want to take this class. Cool more power to you but in the end. When you get out and have to flip hamburgers at what point do I really have to feel sorry for you? When you can't pay back that 6 years. It's called being a gown up no one forced you to do it. People can go and be an apprentice yes you don't get paid for 2 years but in the end of the 2 years you can get paid.
Slayer Seven's avatar

Ruthless Pirate

AKB0048
Slayer Seven
While many college students search for the next party to get drunk at or find themselves too preoccupied with their academics to care about world affairs, Washington has been busy crafting the most toxic piece of legislation since President Obama came into office – Obamacare. Even though it won’t “officially” be enacted until 2014, many of Obamacare’s provisions are in effect and are already wreaking havoc on our nation. Too bad most college students are trapped in their own protective bubbles to realize that their futures are already being torn apart by government bureaucrats.

Individual Mandate

First and foremost, the provision in Obamacare calling for an individual mandate should shock and terrify college students. Beginning in 2014, this provision will force all Americans to buy “government-approved health insurance,” which will cover products and services that not all Americans will want or need. Since we live in a society where we have the ability to buy products that we want and need, why on earth would any college student approve of “healthcare reform” that limits their freedom of choice? Looks like our president’s promise allowing us to keep our own health plans will not be fulfilled.


heres the link... http://thecollegeconservative.com/2012/07/18/obamacare-medical-misery-for-americas-college-students/

Um... a lot of students need healthcare. Buying it through school is extremely expensive in most cases (my school it was $500 for two month period, and that was the cheapest plan they had).

"Freedom of choice"? You mean the freedom to be in a state of risk where if you got seriously sick or in an accident that you'd have a good chance of going broke? People don't refuse to buy health insurance because they don't want to. People don't buy it because they can't afford it. Making healthcare more affordable is a step in the right direction.

Most people get health insurance through employee benefits. But not all employers provide these benefits and some employers don't provide good enough benefits.
maybe we should stop placing bets with the insurance company's and figure out another way to provide health care instead of allowing one persons we vote for come up with some outrageous plan that forces us into regulated heath care...
Marrionetta's avatar

Dapper Darling

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ZaedKai
Marrionetta
Did you know that colleges make more money when you default on a student loan than when you meet your payments and pay out over time? That's because loan interest rates are subsidized and if you default, the collecting bodies actually split the profit with the college. Therefore, colleges have incentives to boost prices and see more students default.

D'oh. This is what happens when educational institutions get in bed in with big lenders. >_< This needs to be stopped, and I pray Obama is the guy to do it.

Romney won that debate, but only because he's an a*****e and trampled over the moderator. Also eff that guy for wanting to kill PBS. If you kill the programs that benefit the underprivileged and educate children for free, you create slaves by circumstance - impoverished masses that lack critical thinking and are dependent on others for their thoughts and opinions as well as literally dependent on freaking welfare. Education is power, PBS educates, and in the end, the upper echelons laugh all the way to the bank if they can make more sheepole to feed their hedge funds.
I'm pretty sure you're getting Rebulican rationale all wrong. He doesn't want to kill PBS to do away with programs that educate, he just recognizes the successful ability for the private sector to have those programs. Government has no need to be giving money to TV broadcast or radio stations.

The appropriate argument would be, why cite cutting spending from PBS which is a pittance and wouldn't really affect our budget at all. But, of course, Republicans are assholes and evil.

Plenty of democrats are assholes and evil, too, breh. Mitt Romney is an a*****e for being so abusive to poor Mr. Lehrer. XD

Mrrr, the thing is the private sector does weird things like Sprout, which is no where near as enriching as PBS for early childhood dev - and actually in a lot of cases sort of creepy. I mean BBC is to blame for the teletubbies and that's technically overseas public broadcasting, but have you watched cable kids networks lately? Cringe. Also why can't both public and private broadcasting exist? I like my TV graced with both. :B

I don't suppose we could, you know, re-appropriate some of that crazy 'defense' budget toward education, now, could we?
Spline Reticulator's avatar

Devoted Sex Symbol

I disagree. If you're a college student with half of a brain cell, you would vote for Gary Johnson.
Malthusian Devil's avatar

Quotable Noob

Squ33ze M3
ZaedKai
Squ33ze M3



Oh yeah, I completely forgot about that fact. I've learned this before in some history classes and political science, but I suppose it slipped my mind. Thanks for adding that in, I completely agree with you with the natural evolution of our economy.

Although, taxing the wealthy solution has been implied by many, I'm quite sure there are more solutions out there to consider. It seems whenever this solution is brought up, it just causes a much more heated argument and debate among many.


Honestly, this is where the more interesting political debates happen. It's such a complicated issue because if you tax wealthy americans, you risk taxing them too much. (Many wealthy americans are business owners, so they'd pay the personal taxes and the corporate taxes) and that could lead, depending on the extent of the taxing, to job loss, and that's not really something we could afford in our current economy.

The big problem is the super wealthy. No one in the world needs more than a billion dollars to live (I can probably subsist for the rest of my life off that amount), and yet, you can't say the people who are billionaires didn't earn it. It's not moral for governments to ask billionares to fork over half their money, and that directly contradicts the American dream. It's such a tricky issue to figure out.

The thing I take hope in is the pledge a bunch of extremely wealthy people have signed recently, promising half their fortunes to charity upon their deaths. It just shows that not all rich people are evil.



Yeah, taxation is a very interesting topic and it requires a lot of thought in my opinion. I mean, you can't pass a law or an act, without angering a few people along the way. If you tax someone too high, they let workers go and/or lower the wages to maintain a balance or a steady income for the business owners. [This has happened in the past during the development of our country, especially when it involved immigration. I've read so many primary source documents on these issues.] After all, many people think of their interests first, than of others'. So the candidates are placed in a very rough position on what they propose for their solutions, after all, most of the time they can only please one side while trying not anger so much the other. Topics like these have always been dangerous yet interesting to debate/speak about.

As for the super wealthy, I completely agree with you on this notion. You don't need so much money to live by, but most of these billionaires have earned their wealth. Unfortunately, there are those that didn't, who come from old wealthy families. Some just take advantage of their heritage passed down to them. It's seeing and hearing from these people that just makes me sad. Although, I am quite happy knowing that there is some wealthy people/families willing to donate some of their money to charity.

I agree with you so much. Dx
Also, it is heartening to hear of wealthy people donating their money.

One of the things that really worries me, as well as the growing inequality between the rich and the poor, is the fluidity of the economy (I'm not sure if that's the exact term). Apparently, as our economy evolves, it's getting more and more difficult for someone to jump classes, (say from lower class to middle class, or from middle class to upper class, or from poor to upper class etc etc etc). That means there will be less people who've earned their money, and, like you mentioned, more people who just come from wealthy families. It's unfair if you think about it, but the solutions aren't easy.
Malthusian Devil's avatar

Quotable Noob

Marrionetta
ZaedKai
Marrionetta
Did you know that colleges make more money when you default on a student loan than when you meet your payments and pay out over time? That's because loan interest rates are subsidized and if you default, the collecting bodies actually split the profit with the college. Therefore, colleges have incentives to boost prices and see more students default.

D'oh. This is what happens when educational institutions get in bed in with big lenders. >_< This needs to be stopped, and I pray Obama is the guy to do it.

Romney won that debate, but only because he's an a*****e and trampled over the moderator. Also eff that guy for wanting to kill PBS. If you kill the programs that benefit the underprivileged and educate children for free, you create slaves by circumstance - impoverished masses that lack critical thinking and are dependent on others for their thoughts and opinions as well as literally dependent on freaking welfare. Education is power, PBS educates, and in the end, the upper echelons laugh all the way to the bank if they can make more sheepole to feed their hedge funds.
I'm pretty sure you're getting Rebulican rationale all wrong. He doesn't want to kill PBS to do away with programs that educate, he just recognizes the successful ability for the private sector to have those programs. Government has no need to be giving money to TV broadcast or radio stations.

The appropriate argument would be, why cite cutting spending from PBS which is a pittance and wouldn't really affect our budget at all. But, of course, Republicans are assholes and evil.

Plenty of democrats are assholes and evil, too, breh. Mitt Romney is an a*****e for being so abusive to poor Mr. Lehrer. XD

Mrrr, the thing is the private sector does weird things like Sprout, which is no where near as enriching as PBS for early childhood dev - and actually in a lot of cases sort of creepy. I mean BBC is to blame for the teletubbies and that's technically overseas public broadcasting, but have you watched cable kids networks lately? Cringe. Also why can't both public and private broadcasting exist? I like my TV graced with both. :B

I don't suppose we could, you know, re-appropriate some of that crazy 'defense' budget toward education, now, could we?

Ugh, you've found one of my weaknesses. I suppose we could use some of that crazy 'defense' budget for other reasons, but it is important to maintain the strongest military so that we can remain the international hegemonic power. Also, I would argue, great innovations come from military spending (like the internet), and those innovations will help us in the long run.

As for your earlier comment, find a time machine and go back to the USSR if you want public broadcasting. It makes no sense. It just doesn't. Why should PBS be allowed to continue as a channel for the hell of it? The only argument you can make is that it's a public good, which it really isn't. It can be privatized and become efficient and competitive like other hardworking companies. As for the BBC, the US is not allowed to have a news channel broadcast within its borders. I think we might have one overseas, but that should be done away with too. However, I would be in favor of starting a publically funded news agency, because, I'd argue, journalism is a public good (and media are the 4th body of government)! Frankly, our current agencies aren't cutting it.

Final note: Education is where money goes to die. I'd argue figure out how to improve education first, then fund it. Throwing money at is SUCH a waste, but that's a complicated issue for only the best think tank thinkers out there. Some things are just not easily solved, and I don't really trust either side to take on education appropriately. Therefore, the less money wasted, the better.
Slayer Seven
AKB0048
Slayer Seven
While many college students search for the next party to get drunk at or find themselves too preoccupied with their academics to care about world affairs, Washington has been busy crafting the most toxic piece of legislation since President Obama came into office – Obamacare. Even though it won’t “officially” be enacted until 2014, many of Obamacare’s provisions are in effect and are already wreaking havoc on our nation. Too bad most college students are trapped in their own protective bubbles to realize that their futures are already being torn apart by government bureaucrats.

Individual Mandate

First and foremost, the provision in Obamacare calling for an individual mandate should shock and terrify college students. Beginning in 2014, this provision will force all Americans to buy “government-approved health insurance,” which will cover products and services that not all Americans will want or need. Since we live in a society where we have the ability to buy products that we want and need, why on earth would any college student approve of “healthcare reform” that limits their freedom of choice? Looks like our president’s promise allowing us to keep our own health plans will not be fulfilled.


heres the link... http://thecollegeconservative.com/2012/07/18/obamacare-medical-misery-for-americas-college-students/

Um... a lot of students need healthcare. Buying it through school is extremely expensive in most cases (my school it was $500 for two month period, and that was the cheapest plan they had).

"Freedom of choice"? You mean the freedom to be in a state of risk where if you got seriously sick or in an accident that you'd have a good chance of going broke? People don't refuse to buy health insurance because they don't want to. People don't buy it because they can't afford it. Making healthcare more affordable is a step in the right direction.

Most people get health insurance through employee benefits. But not all employers provide these benefits and some employers don't provide good enough benefits.
maybe we should stop placing bets with the insurance company's and figure out another way to provide health care instead of allowing one persons we vote for come up with some outrageous plan that forces us into regulated heath care...


Easiest way?

Expand Medi-care for all.

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