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lady blood orchid I was just asking... If I was personally playing that would matter to me 3nodding I'm not sure how often you come across immobilization effects though, I know warlocks can have them and I'm 99% sure wizards can have them too. |
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Two options I see, at least two I would consider if I was running that encounter.
1: An oasis in a desert are magnets for traveling convoys/caravans. One infested by a dragon would have plenty of junk scattered around, including like an earlier poster, weapons. 2: Sandstorm. If the oasis is as thick as it is, it'll provide cover from the sand, and the flying sand would make it difficult for the dragon to fly too high/far. Third idea just popped up. If this is a massively thick jungle-like oasis, simply remaining in the trees will provide plenty of cover and penalties for the dragon's attacks on the party. If the dragon wants to actually hit/damage the PC's, it'll have to go beneath the canopy. putting it into the woods, though as an adult, it may just bash down the trees. |
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You could have the PCs target the wings and you could give the dragon's wings about 10% of the dragon's total HP. When that 10% of HP (20% total - for both wings) is gone from each wing and deducted out of the dragon's total HP, the dragon could be forced to land. You could try something like that.
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Or: Don't have them face a dragon in an area where they do not stand a chance.
They cannot deal any meaningful damage to it, it has all the advantages, and it's a goddamn dragon. To make it possible for them to win without being completely beaten to a pulp you'd need to give them time to prepare and possibly invoke a bit of deus ex machinca, which might lessen the enjoyment of the players. Unless you have specifically hinted at a dragon I'd give them a huge minotaur or something to fight instead. |
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That idea is nice. Keep most the stats, strip out anything with flying, and make it a land only "Sand Drake"
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Pulls, Slides, Slows, Restrains, Immobilizes.
Several of the melee classes have a ranged pull or immobilize somewhere, and items of magnetism can give an extra out if they don't think to take those abilities. Since slow sets speed to 2 that makes it very hard for the dragon to use it's fly-by's and maintain altitude. |
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You know, back in the day, when highly melee only parties wanted to take on a fling creature they'd go get spells and items to make them able to fly. As I don't play 4e I can't tell you how the system handles that but back in 3e and earlier most Wizards could cast Fly on melee fighters. Or maybe they'd go out in search of a magical flying broom, carpet, or saucer (requiring a balance check for the small size).
The some of the old school big flying carpets could hold a party of 4 in fighting space, so you could load everyone on to the one carpet (one guys drives, the other three take swings on the fly by). Make sure people have tokens of Feather Fall (if its still in the game) other wise when that dragon starts knocking people off they are going to have a painful fall. |
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You could also give the reason a very compelling reason NOT to leave the arena and give the players a small multiple tiered place to battle it.
For example: Place it inside a old combat arena on a mountain side (i know... cliche), that would give it a large central area and multiple tiers to allow the players to get close or above the dragon during combat while restricting the dragon's movement. Then place either the dragons egg's or it's treasure hoard in the pathways below the arena with a entrance through a blocked central tunnel. That way the dragon can be explained as not just running off or using it's aerial benefit's if it is desperate to keep the players out of that central tunnel. |
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The dragon expert speaks:
(I have a dragon heavy campaign. I'm obsessed with the darn things, and have spent years using them and playing them.) Give it an injured wing that will only allow it to fly for short periods of time. (Good old RPing an excuse!) If anyone has the ride ability give them a temporary flying mount such as a dragonell. There are also various magic artefacts that grant flying that they can get temporarily or find with a spot check near the dragon's lair (some treasure it dropped) As well as spells the sorcerer can cast. Make sure the dragon does not have fly by attack, and does not have wing over, this will give the players a chance to make attacks of opportunity, since it's bite attack should only be a 5 ft range (The neck of a large Blue is only 7ft long, shorter than your average dragon) Also, in drawings and descriptions it appears even shorter than the necks of the other two dragons that share a neck of the same length. Absolam lady blood orchid My question with the flying dragon is what happens if you immobilize the dragon in mid-air? Is it going to be immune to immobilizing effects or if you immobilize it is it going to hover in spot or fall from the sky? Well in my opinion, it would fall. Because it can no longer maintain its movement the bare minimum of 2 squares forward, it would crash to the ground, at least according to the Core Rulebooks in 4.0. >3 I'd probably let it glide to a land when its wings are busted up, but if it gets effected by a spell power? Its crashing! First it was Zombies Then it was the Vampires Dragons are immune to magical paralysis and sleep effects! This is part of what makes them so scary. You cannot take them down with immobilizing effects. You can make sure they have something that lessens the electric breath attacks there is also "rod of dragon mastery" which you can give to them pre-used so it only has 1-5 minutes left- just enough to get the dragon down here for a few good blows. (since the spell would likely break if the dragon was attacked, rendering the rod unusable) (This is found in the Draconomicon, pg 119, if I remember correctly.) If you can borrow the Draconomicon from someone it'll have a lot of helpful things for your players. Then the Aliens Then the Dark Elves Whatever comes this year, I'm ready. |
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Jynxed Dragons are immune to magical paralysis and sleep effects! This is part of what makes them so scary. You cannot take them down with immobilizing effects The suggestions of having weapons around the oasis are good ones. If the oasis is supposed to be really lush, encouraging your players to take cover within and lure the beast closer is also a good one. Even if the dragon won't just drop to the ground as soon as they're past the treeline, encourage them to climb the things and hack at it while it buzzes the canopy. Additionally, if they're gonna be ambushed when they emerge from a lake, a good way to force the dragon down is to go down themselves. Blues aren't aquatic and if they can make it fight them under water or near the surface, it won't be much better off than they are. If they're still sopping wet when it hits them hard and fast, they might decide they were better off where they came from, then you just need to have the dragon follow them. |
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Just remember that blues have a somewhat impressive Wisdom score. If it starts to lose a fight, it's not going to stick around. It's going to use its flying to its advantage and if it loses operation of its wings, it can run faster than the party (probably). It just gets to me when DM's play dragons to be dumb as dirt, and for them to just hang out until the party kills it. Doesn't work that way. They're smart for a reason, dammit! gonk On a side note: Long time no see, Absolam! |
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As a player and a DM I would personally not recommend the "hiding in the trees idea". He could easily spray the area with his breath weapon from above.
Flying has always been an issue. It was an idea that was introduced but was never really fully taken into account when combat is considered. As soon as your primary caster gains access to the Fly spell, encounters become nothing. Then you can sit safely in the air from 300 ft above and drop fireballs on everything. This also goes for monsters. You can't just not have an encounter because they PCs would be at a "disadvantage". Otherwise you just find them slaughtering every land creature they come across. Put them in tough situations, it makes winning more rewarding. The land wyrm idea isn't bad. I'm currently playing in a dragon heavy campaign myself. Check out the Draconomicon and just tweak it for 4ed. They have a good selection of flightless dragons. |
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Brasten You know, back in the day, when highly melee only parties wanted to take on a fling creature they'd go get spells and items to make them able to fly. As I don't play 4e I can't tell you how the system handles that but back in 3e and earlier most Wizards could cast Fly on melee fighters. Or maybe they'd go out in search of a magical flying broom, carpet, or saucer (requiring a balance check for the small size). The some of the old school big flying carpets could hold a party of 4 in fighting space, so you could load everyone on to the one carpet (one guys drives, the other three take swings on the fly by). Make sure people have tokens of Feather Fall (if its still in the game) other wise when that dragon starts knocking people off they are going to have a painful fall. I've played a ton of 3.5 and I know exactly what you mean. But in 4th edition, flight has become a much higher level ability. |
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ecko-san Just remember that blues have a somewhat impressive Wisdom score. If it starts to lose a fight, it's not going to stick around. It's going to use its flying to its advantage and if it loses operation of its wings, it can run faster than the party (probably). It just gets to me when DM's play dragons to be dumb as dirt, and for them to just hang out until the party kills it. Doesn't work that way. They're smart for a reason, dammit! gonk On a side note: Long time no see, Absolam! Thanks man! I really like alot of the ideas. I don't think my party will be big on luring it into tree cover, but the idea of a trap that can be set isn't going to go unused. Maybe a cliff where they can get a shot with a hidden balista? Help to pin it down a little And yes, in case people are confused, this is for 4th edition, the suggestions of "Just have them use FLY!" doesn't really apply here. I might go with a land wyrm, it would certainly offer a challenge still, its just that we have yet to fight a dragon (not since a while ago) and I wanted to offer a big challenge. The point is to show that its flight is a clear advantage, and dangerous at that, but not to make it impossible to win the day. You've all been a really big help on this! mrgreen |
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^^ Also, perhaps it would serve well to get your players to realize the value of having some range in their arsenal. Maybe have some good magical ranged weapons in the dragon's hoarde, if he'll have one. Y'know, just a fun hint for 'em.
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