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Shirtless Consumer

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My roommates and I are building a block, and I'm in charge of the first set. I've got a lot of ideas floating around that probably need tweaking and balancing, so I'll probably be asking you guys for advice on balance or wording occasionally.

Next card up for balancing:

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How exactly would a sorcery work with morph? Would it act as an instant if flipped on your opponent's turn? o-o;;

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SirBaka
How exactly would a sorcery work with morph? Would it act as an instant if flipped on your opponent's turn? o-o;;
That's what I would expect, since you can morph at instant speed. So, basically, it would cost 3 additional mana to use its ability at instant speed, or 1 less if you wait a turn after playing it to morph it. But if you need the ability immediately, you would be more likely to hardcast the card.

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i'm pretty sure, as printed, that card doesn't work in the rules. if it does actually work, then yes, it would just shoot straight to the yard without doing anything once morphed.

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SporkMaster5000
i'm pretty sure, as printed, that card doesn't work in the rules. if it does actually work, then yes, it would just shoot straight to the yard without doing anything once morphed.
So would it be better if I added a line of text that says "When ~ is turned face up,...." actually, I'm not sure how I would word that. Have any ideas? "Place it onto the stack"
"Resolve ~ when it is turned face up"?

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The turned face up clause will solve the rules issue.

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Alright, here's the card after fixes. Hopefully the wording is fine. Are there any balance issues with it?

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Alright, here's the card after fixes. Hopefully the wording is fine. Are there any balance issues with it?

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you can't resolve a card that's in play.

if you really want this to work there's three ways i could see it working:
1) when ~ is turned face up, put ~ on the stack.
this has the problem of explicitly referring to the stack, and not actually saying that you're effectively playing it from play, making it hard for one to wrap one's head around if you don't know the rules pretty well anyway. this is the quick and dirty answer, but it's hard to grok, which is important if you want people to enjoy it.
2)Make it a creature with 0 power and toughness
if you want to encourage players to poke around with these, you could even make the power a positive number, then you make the ability a triggered ability that triggers on coming into play or flipping face up. as soon as the 0 toughness creature hits play, it'll die as a state-based effect, making it look a lot like a sorcery (also making it a lot like evoke, which has similar roots according to mark rosewater). this is kinda the lazy way to make it work. turning a creature into a creature that immediately dies is still easier than having a sorcery that's in play.
3) make a keyword
this is how they'd probably do it if they were crazy enough to print this in a real set. make a keyword that effectively lets a sorcery be played from in play. you can have it interact with morph explicitly, you could try getting other ways to pop sorceries from the in-play zone, but i don't know how far you'd get with that.

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SporkMaster5000
The Gift Horse
Alright, here's the card after fixes. Hopefully the wording is fine. Are there any balance issues with it?

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you can't resolve a card that's in play.

if you really want this to work there's three ways i could see it working:
1) when ~ is turned face up, put ~ on the stack.
this has the problem of explicitly referring to the stack, and not actually saying that you're effectively playing it from play, making it hard for one to wrap one's head around if you don't know the rules pretty well anyway. this is the quick and dirty answer, but it's hard to grok, which is important if you want people to enjoy it.
2)Make it a creature with 0 power and toughness
if you want to encourage players to poke around with these, you could even make the power a positive number, then you make the ability a triggered ability that triggers on coming into play or flipping face up. as soon as the 0 toughness creature hits play, it'll die as a state-based effect, making it look a lot like a sorcery (also making it a lot like evoke, which has similar roots according to mark rosewater). this is kinda the lazy way to make it work. turning a creature into a creature that immediately dies is still easier than having a sorcery that's in play.
3) make a keyword
this is how they'd probably do it if they were crazy enough to print this in a real set. make a keyword that effectively lets a sorcery be played from in play. you can have it interact with morph explicitly, you could try getting other ways to pop sorceries from the in-play zone, but i don't know how far you'd get with that.
I think I'll tinker with my options a bit then, and see what I come up with. Tomorrow, anyway. Gnight, and thanks.

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SporkMaster5000
The Gift Horse
Alright, here's the card after fixes. Hopefully the wording is fine. Are there any balance issues with it?

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you can't resolve a card that's in play.

if you really want this to work there's three ways i could see it working:
1) when ~ is turned face up, put ~ on the stack.
this has the problem of explicitly referring to the stack, and not actually saying that you're effectively playing it from play, making it hard for one to wrap one's head around if you don't know the rules pretty well anyway. this is the quick and dirty answer, but it's hard to grok, which is important if you want people to enjoy it.
2)Make it a creature with 0 power and toughness
if you want to encourage players to poke around with these, you could even make the power a positive number, then you make the ability a triggered ability that triggers on coming into play or flipping face up. as soon as the 0 toughness creature hits play, it'll die as a state-based effect, making it look a lot like a sorcery (also making it a lot like evoke, which has similar roots according to mark rosewater). this is kinda the lazy way to make it work. turning a creature into a creature that immediately dies is still easier than having a sorcery that's in play.
3) make a keyword
this is how they'd probably do it if they were crazy enough to print this in a real set. make a keyword that effectively lets a sorcery be played from in play. you can have it interact with morph explicitly, you could try getting other ways to pop sorceries from the in-play zone, but i don't know how far you'd get with that.
Only 1 problem with making it a 0 toughness creature...what about glorius anthem or something similiar? To me just simply having morph should...like the morph lands. Morph wouldn't count as playing but simply using the ability of the 2/2 creature. The only way I could see making it a creature type(similiar to the 0 toughness) is say "Sacfrice this creature at end of turn" or "sacrfice this creature when it comes into play". The latter would let the effect of it kick in and solve the creature problem...but then it's basically evoke just in a round about way.

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Only 1 problem with making it a 0 toughness creature...what about glorius anthem or something similiar? To me just simply having morph should...like the morph lands. Morph wouldn't count as playing but simply using the ability of the 2/2 creature. The only way I could see making it a creature type(similiar to the 0 toughness) is say "Sacfrice this creature at end of turn" or "sacrfice this creature when it comes into play". The latter would let the effect of it kick in and solve the creature problem...but then it's basically evoke just in a round about way.
any way of making it a creature would change the functionality, yes, and glorious anthem and co was what i had in mind when i suggested encouraging people to poke around and give it positive power.

the thing with the land and enchantment and artifact from future sight is that all of those are permanents, so if you flip it over it stops being a creature, but stays in play. i don't know if there's a rule regarding what happens to a sorcery that's in play, but if there is one i'm pretty sure it's something to the effect of "it's put into it's owner's graveyard." what he's trying to do is let you have a sorcery that you can play as a morph, and effectively have it "go off" when you flip the morph, the rules don't let that happen. so, he needs a way to have a morph turn into a spell on the stack (there isn't one) or a reasonable facsimile, which i tried to offer.

edit: man, now i can't help but think about this stupid idea. if you really want to keep it a sorcery, the new keyword idea could actually be sorta elegant. lets call it spellmorph because i'm a lazy namer. reminder text "you may play this face-down as a 2/2 creature for {3}. You may play this card without paying its mana cost for its spellmorph cost."

if you can play cards from every other zone in the game, why not from in play? and if you like you could have it interact with morph triggers in the same way landcycling and creaturecycling interact with cycling triggers.

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SporkMaster5000
hallis
Only 1 problem with making it a 0 toughness creature...what about glorius anthem or something similiar? To me just simply having morph should...like the morph lands. Morph wouldn't count as playing but simply using the ability of the 2/2 creature. The only way I could see making it a creature type(similiar to the 0 toughness) is say "Sacfrice this creature at end of turn" or "sacrfice this creature when it comes into play". The latter would let the effect of it kick in and solve the creature problem...but then it's basically evoke just in a round about way.
any way of making it a creature would change the functionality, yes, and glorious anthem and co was what i had in mind when i suggested encouraging people to poke around and give it positive power.

the thing with the land and enchantment and artifact from future sight is that all of those are permanents, so if you flip it over it stops being a creature, but stays in play. i don't know if there's a rule regarding what happens to a sorcery that's in play, but if there is one i'm pretty sure it's something to the effect of "it's put into it's owner's graveyard." what he's trying to do is let you have a sorcery that you can play as a morph, and effectively have it "go off" when you flip the morph, the rules don't let that happen. so, he needs a way to have a morph turn into a spell on the stack (there isn't one) or a reasonable facsimile, which i tried to offer.
I don't belive there is a way period to have it on the stack as a sorcery if its morphed but as an ability it's clear.
Just went over the morph rules againhttp://www.wizards.com/magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtgcom/feature/87
and from what I read it will work as is but if I understood it right instead of "Resolve Gluttony when it is turnd face up." have "when Gluttony is turned face up target player sacfrices two creatures at random."

Not to sure about it but I think that will work.

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hallis
I don't belive there is a way period to have it on the stack as a sorcery if its morphed but as an ability it's clear.
Just went over the morph rules againhttp://www.wizards.com/magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtgcom/feature/87
and from what I read it will work as is but if I understood it right instead of "Resolve Gluttony when it is turnd face up." have "when Gluttony is turned face up target player sacfrices two creatures at random."

Not to sure about it but I think that will work.
i'm more concerned with whether a sorcery in play can trigger and what happens when you have a sorcery in play (since it's not a permanent something has to be done, or else the card doesn't work in the rules at all).

it could work as a triggered ability, but sorceries and instants are different from permanents. they function differently, and the rules treat them differently.

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SporkMaster5000
hallis
I don't belive there is a way period to have it on the stack as a sorcery if its morphed but as an ability it's clear.
Just went over the morph rules againhttp://www.wizards.com/magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtgcom/feature/87
and from what I read it will work as is but if I understood it right instead of "Resolve Gluttony when it is turnd face up." have "when Gluttony is turned face up target player sacfrices two creatures at random."

Not to sure about it but I think that will work.
i'm more concerned with whether a sorcery in play can trigger and what happens when you have a sorcery in play (since it's not a permanent something has to be done, or else the card doesn't work in the rules at all).

it could work as a triggered ability, but sorceries and instants are different from permanents. they function differently, and the rules treat them differently.
Yea, I see where you are going with this.I don't think it can go on the stack as a sorcery at all. Since a sorcery or instant goes on the stack as is and an ability goes on the stack at instant speed. As far as this part(since there is no current explain for MtG) I think the card would trigger as an ability once it is flipped up and then go straight to the yard. Just my 2 cents though.

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Well, I didn't like the idea of making them into creatures anyway, because I feel that it detracts from the flavor I was aiming for. I added the text "When Gluttony is turned face up, place it on the stack as though it was just played." It seems to me like that should work. Thoughts?
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