The Official Mixed Martial Arts Thread - New Rankings

[baka_boy1221]

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Noir33

Ah... my eye's are sore with the BS the sherdog forum is spewing.

First things first, Shogun's performance were amazing. Fluid foot work, crisp punches and kicks, defense was superb, TD was setup perfectly with that right (and nearly locked that heel hook), and more importantly, he wasn't tentative that night. He kept going not showing sign of fatigue, even though it only took 1 round, and unleash a semblance of his old form. Now, if he keep this up for his next fight, I can see him challenging for the title by the time Rampage vs. Machida/Evans is over. Jardine is probably a logical choice for his next fight but we all know how UFC setup their fights....

Which brings me to my next point...

Anderson vs. Leites was a disaster the moment they announced the fight. Everyone was questioning why the ******** was Leites' name next to Anderson. UFC/Dana tried to justify it by saying Anderson's weakness is the ground game. So, are we to think that Leites is a legitimate threat? Hell no! Leites is definitely a skilled BJJ artist, but he is not a fighter in A.Silva's caliber. How highly was he ranked when this fight was announced? 7,8,9,10,11...15? Mind you, this was also the time Dana was spreading Anderson is #1 P4P s**t talk.

So the next question is, why didn't Anderson finish the fight early if Leites' not that skillful? This I have no answer for because simply, I am not Anderson Silva. It could be due to personal, physical, political, or even mental reasons but the fact is, he won. I don't agree with the method he used, but he won.

Would somebody with superior striking go to the ground willingly to finish the fight early? I firmly believe that yes, it is their duty to do so. It is probably a "fighter etiquette" to punish the person in front of you until he can no longer continue. It is normal in boxing, muay thai, and any competitive sport. It is also a sign of respect to your opponent believe it or not. Anderson made a fool out of Leites, and to me, rather than it made Leites looked bad it made Anderson look disrespectful.

"Anderson embodies the martial art spirit" - Joe Rogan. UFC commentator

Side note: Cheik Kongo should stop fighting opponents tailor made for him. It's time for top competition...

Thales is not even a ranked middleweight. He's someone the UFC threw in against Anderson because they are waiting for an actual competitor to come around, after the Bisping v. Henderson thing is all over, and Marquardt gets his shot. As for Anderson's fight against Leites, I have said it already, he is the champion, he only needs to do what is necessary to win, not go out and make himself susceptible to a lucky shot or go to the ground with Leites like everyone wanted. If you were Anderson and were facing a ground fighter, why go to the ground when you can outpoint your opponent standing up? The blame is on Joe Silva firstly for making the match up which should never have happened because he didn't even beat Marquardt and secondly Leites for not bringing it to Anderson.

Rumor has it that next in line for a title shot for Silva's middlewieght title is Yushin Okami. That's just a rumor though.

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I think the UFC has been ducking Okami for a while. He is scheduled to fight Jim Miller soon, I think the 98 or 99 card. Of course there is the whole issue of the Bisping v. Henderson match up and of course there is also Marquardt and Maia. I think Anderson should fight these guys in this order:

1. Yushin Okami
2. Michael Bisping (if he beats Henderson)
3. Demaian Maia
4. Nate Marquardt
5. Dan Henderson

Okami gets the go ahead nod because he's been around forever and wrecked four guys the UFC wanted to use for potential title shot match ups, lost a decision to Franklin, knocked out the former champ and is probably going to beat Miller.

Bisping if he beat Henderson should be next since he's someone that has marketability, if not Maia would be my choice as he's not tentative like Leites and will bring it to Silva, there is a ton of bad blood between those two and I am sure it'd be an interesting fight. Marquardt has been gunning for Anderson since he lost, I think he's the one guy who can stand up with Silva and do okay, notice I didn't say win, and take him down and do some GnP. Finally, Henderson, he's the only person to win a round against Anderson in the UFC, outside of the bullshit that was the second round by Leites, where he won off a take down he couldn't do anything with, at least Dan held him down. That should more than fulfil Anderson's contract at Middleweight. TBH, Silva should fight at LHW against Thiago Silva just so we can see a KO.

[baka_boy1221]

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I think the UFC has been ducking Okami for a while. He is scheduled to fight Jim Miller soon, I think the 98 or 99 card. Of course there is the whole issue of the Bisping v. Henderson match up and of course there is also Marquardt and Maia. I think Anderson should fight these guys in this order:

1. Yushin Okami
2. Michael Bisping (if he beats Henderson)
3. Demaian Maia
4. Nate Marquardt
5. Dan Henderson

Okami gets the go ahead nod because he's been around forever and wrecked four guys the UFC wanted to use for potential title shot match ups, lost a decision to Franklin, knocked out the former champ and is probably going to beat Miller.

Bisping if he beat Henderson should be next since he's someone that has marketability, if not Maia would be my choice as he's not tentative like Leites and will bring it to Silva, there is a ton of bad blood between those two and I am sure it'd be an interesting fight. Marquardt has been gunning for Anderson since he lost, I think he's the one guy who can stand up with Silva and do okay, notice I didn't say win, and take him down and do some GnP. Finally, Henderson, he's the only person to win a round against Anderson in the UFC, outside of the bullshit that was the second round by Leites, where he won off a take down he couldn't do anything with, at least Dan held him down. That should more than fulfil Anderson's contract at Middleweight. TBH, Silva should fight at LHW against Thiago Silva just so we can see a KO.

Actually Okami fighting his borther Dan. And contention position wise, I agree with these, though I would put Henderson as 3 and Maia at 4, and then Marquardt rounding it out at 5, but then again it is an opinion.

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I'd rather have Dan up higher as well because I seem him as the greatest threat to Silva, even though he lost, I just didn't do so because of casual fans coming in and going OMGWTFXDANHENDERSONLOSTALREADYLOLOLOLOLO!!!!!!111111!!!!

[Noir33]

I believe Okami was slated to fight Anderson but he got injured and replaced by Cote. I agree with the list, Okami is a fight loooong overdue. But it won't get high pay-per view buys by the fact that Anderson and Okami are not marketable names. They will probably wait for Henderson/Bisping for another title shot and main event headliner because seeing as to what happened at UFC 97, it's harder to promote an Anderson Silva main event fight anytime soon.

Chuck Liddel is officially retired. To be honest, as someone who watched Pride primarily in the early 2000 as compare to UFC, I find Chuck's skill as mediocre as best. He deserves the respect mind you as he should, but like a boxing champion with an irrelevant title, he wasn't facing the right opponents to compliment his hype. Hall of Famer for sure but he just cannot get that hand up to cover his face!

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You also have to look at how the sport has evolved and how the guys he was fighting then are considered legacy fighters, guys who are now mostly past their prime and were some of the best then. Yea sure he's not as good as some of the Pride LHWs, but you don't do what Chuck did if you're not a talented athlete. He has a whose-who list of guys he has KO'd and I don't think Chuck is by any stretch of the imagination mediocre. If he was mediocre, he'd be in KOTC, not a top organization.

[Fatum]

Anyone find it funny that Liddell never uses his wrestling offensively much?
I find it strange that he never roughs anyone up with gnp; would've helped in his match with Shogun me thinks.

[Tactical Leg Sweep]

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I kill giants

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The role of a champion is to defend his belt and do enough to retain his belt at the end of the day. Nowhere in Anderson's contract does it say:

"You must go out there and knockout everyone and put yourself in harms way to entertain the crowd."

That is simply the promotion of human cockfighting. Anderson did exactly what he has to do, win the fight, he didn't need to punish Leites to do that, just pitter patter shots which allowed him to win by points. Expect more of the same unless he gets put into the position where his belt is actually in danger, such as the match against Nate Marquardt or the winner of Henderson and Bisping, where he'll be in far greater danger fighting Dan.

So basically if Leites hit Anderson a few times and ran away from him, refusing to engage him where he thought he might be in trouble, and he won on points he deserved to win the title?

No, it doesn't. It promotes the idea that a champion should actually be fighting to defend his belt. Since you know, they are fighters.

What you are saying is that people are paid to entertain. That is not what their contract states and if Anderson wants to win by outpointing his opponents from now on then that is fine by me. He along with Machida are two of my favourite fighters and I am happy to see people engage in 'smart' fighting.

No, I'm not. You're using a strawman. What you're saying is that someone who plays at fighting but never actually engages his opponent, but throws these pseudo punches and kicks and runs away both in standing and ground should deserve to win on points.

Leites at least TRIED at SOME points to engage Anderson on the feet and TRIED (albeit weak attempts) at taking him down. Anderson silva did his little knee cap kick and flat out would stand up if it went to the ground. It has nothing to do with entertainment. It has A LOT to do with abusing the system. If he wants to fight that way, let him go fight in WTF TKD tournmanets where you get points for landing strikes and you never actually have to engage your opponent in actual combat.

[baka_boy1221]

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I'd rather have Dan up higher as well because I seem him as the greatest threat to Silva, even though he lost, I just didn't do so because of casual fans coming in and going OMGWTFXDANHENDERSONLOSTALREADYLOLOLOLOLO!!!!!!111111!!!!

True, true

[baka_boy1221]

Keyboard Warrior

Anyone hear this silly notion about Anderson Silva wanting to box Roy Jones Jr.? I mean, really? Silva is a great over-all fighter...but does he really think that his boxing skills are up to par with a pro such as Jones?

Rumor has it, Silva called out Roy Jone Jr. to show that MMA fighters are just as technical in boxing as well . . . boxers.

[baka_boy1221]

Noir33

I believe Okami was slated to fight Anderson but he got injured and replaced by Cote. I agree with the list, Okami is a fight loooong overdue. But it won't get high pay-per view buys by the fact that Anderson and Okami are not marketable names. They will probably wait for Henderson/Bisping for another title shot and main event headliner because seeing as to what happened at UFC 97, it's harder to promote an Anderson Silva main event fight anytime soon.

Chuck Liddel is officially retired. To be honest, as someone who watched Pride primarily in the early 2000 as compare to UFC, I find Chuck's skill as mediocre as best. He deserves the respect mind you as he should, but like a boxing champion with an irrelevant title, he wasn't facing the right opponents to compliment his hype. Hall of Famer for sure but he just cannot get that hand up to cover his face!

That's just Liddell's style of fighting. He goads people in and then throws a countpunch from hell. Liddell will be missed.

[baka_boy1221]

Trop.exe

You also have to look at how the sport has evolved and how the guys he was fighting then are considered legacy fighters, guys who are now mostly past their prime and were some of the best then. Yea sure he's not as good as some of the Pride LHWs, but you don't do what Chuck did if you're not a talented athlete. He has a whose-who list of guys he has KO'd and I don't think Chuck is by any stretch of the imagination mediocre. If he was mediocre, he'd be in KOTC, not a top organization.

True, true, what he said.

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I kill giants

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I kill giants

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The role of a champion is to defend his belt and do enough to retain his belt at the end of the day. Nowhere in Anderson's contract does it say:

"You must go out there and knockout everyone and put yourself in harms way to entertain the crowd."

That is simply the promotion of human cockfighting. Anderson did exactly what he has to do, win the fight, he didn't need to punish Leites to do that, just pitter patter shots which allowed him to win by points. Expect more of the same unless he gets put into the position where his belt is actually in danger, such as the match against Nate Marquardt or the winner of Henderson and Bisping, where he'll be in far greater danger fighting Dan.

So basically if Leites hit Anderson a few times and ran away from him, refusing to engage him where he thought he might be in trouble, and he won on points he deserved to win the title?

No, it doesn't. It promotes the idea that a champion should actually be fighting to defend his belt. Since you know, they are fighters.

What you are saying is that people are paid to entertain. That is not what their contract states and if Anderson wants to win by outpointing his opponents from now on then that is fine by me. He along with Machida are two of my favourite fighters and I am happy to see people engage in 'smart' fighting.

No, I'm not. You're using a strawman. What you're saying is that someone who plays at fighting but never actually engages his opponent, but throws these pseudo punches and kicks and runs away both in standing and ground should deserve to win on points.

Leites at least TRIED at SOME points to engage Anderson on the feet and TRIED (albeit weak attempts) at taking him down. Anderson silva did his little knee cap kick and flat out would stand up if it went to the ground. It has nothing to do with entertainment. It has A LOT to do with abusing the system. If he wants to fight that way, let him go fight in WTF TKD tournmanets where you get points for landing strikes and you never actually have to engage your opponent in actual combat.

If they do more to win the fight than by all means they deserve to win. If you don't do more than your opponent to convince the judges that you deserve to win then you deserve to lose. It's quite simple. Leites could have thrown 1,000,000 punches and if none of them landed on Anderson and Anderson kicked Leites six times and dodged punches all round then Anderson deserves to win. It's not his fault Leites could not land a finger on him, Anderson is the better striker and striking is not limited to dealing damage but avoiding it as well.

Fighting is not about stupid brawling that is so prevalent in up and coming promotions such as KotC and the defunct organizations such as EliteXC and Bodog, rather about engaging your opponent in an intelligent manner which sees you fight your opponent in way that limits the damage sustained and emulates the damage dealt. Machida is very successful at this, Anderson was as well, Rashad was against Liddell. Criticizing intelligent fighting only demonstrates to me that you lack any form of common sense or are simply a fan who wants to see KOs, quick one sided submissions and bloody TKOs. There are highlight reels for that.

[baka_boy1221]

Trop.exe

I kill giants

Trop.exe

I kill giants

Trop.exe

The role of a champion is to defend his belt and do enough to retain his belt at the end of the day. Nowhere in Anderson's contract does it say:

"You must go out there and knockout everyone and put yourself in harms way to entertain the crowd."

That is simply the promotion of human cockfighting. Anderson did exactly what he has to do, win the fight, he didn't need to punish Leites to do that, just pitter patter shots which allowed him to win by points. Expect more of the same unless he gets put into the position where his belt is actually in danger, such as the match against Nate Marquardt or the winner of Henderson and Bisping, where he'll be in far greater danger fighting Dan.

So basically if Leites hit Anderson a few times and ran away from him, refusing to engage him where he thought he might be in trouble, and he won on points he deserved to win the title?

No, it doesn't. It promotes the idea that a champion should actually be fighting to defend his belt. Since you know, they are fighters.

What you are saying is that people are paid to entertain. That is not what their contract states and if Anderson wants to win by outpointing his opponents from now on then that is fine by me. He along with Machida are two of my favourite fighters and I am happy to see people engage in 'smart' fighting.

No, I'm not. You're using a strawman. What you're saying is that someone who plays at fighting but never actually engages his opponent, but throws these pseudo punches and kicks and runs away both in standing and ground should deserve to win on points.

Leites at least TRIED at SOME points to engage Anderson on the feet and TRIED (albeit weak attempts) at taking him down. Anderson silva did his little knee cap kick and flat out would stand up if it went to the ground. It has nothing to do with entertainment. It has A LOT to do with abusing the system. If he wants to fight that way, let him go fight in WTF TKD tournmanets where you get points for landing strikes and you never actually have to engage your opponent in actual combat.

If they do more to win the fight than by all means they deserve to win. If you don't do more than your opponent to convince the judges that you deserve to win then you deserve to lose. It's quite simple. Leites could have thrown 1,000,000 punches and if none of them landed on Anderson and Anderson kicked Leites six times and dodged punches all round then Anderson deserves to win. It's not his fault Leites could not land a finger on him, Anderson is the better striker and striking is not limited to dealing damage but avoiding it as well.

Fighting is not about stupid brawling that is so prevalent in up and coming promotions such as KotC and the defunct organizations such as EliteXC and Bodog, rather about engaging your opponent in an intelligent manner which sees you fight your opponent in way that limits the damage sustained and emulates the damage dealt. Machida is very successful at this, Anderson was as well, Rashad was against Liddell. Criticizing intelligent fighting only demonstrates to me that you lack any form of common sense or are simply a fan who wants to see KOs, quick one sided submissions and bloody TKOs. There are highlight reels for that.

It's just that people like seeing a good striking match. But true fans of mixed martial arts look at everything. If you don't like it, too bad. That's how MMA is. Anything can happen. One day someone could be KOing someone, the next they only win by decisions. It happens. So stop complaining about Leites this or Silva that. Unless you could read minds of fighters then don't say what you think they were thinking. You can't tell what fighter is thinking during a match. For all we know Leites could have been thinking about his kid, and Silva was thinking about breakfast. So stop bitching about someone's performance. It starting to get annonying.

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I am going to assume that was toward Giants because I was impressed with what Silva accomplished Saturday night.